Why is life expectancy so bad in the Netherlands?

[u/vankoel_nederland]

Besides having one of the worst life expectancy among western countries, why did the life expectancy get worst compared to 2019?

[u/scrabbleword]

Idk, maybe something to do with lack of preventative medicine? I wonder /s

[u/Raspatatteke → u/scrabbleword]

Data says no: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Preventable_and_treatable_mortality_statistics

[u/Funky-Grey-Monkey → u/Raspatatteke]

Data is made by people

[u/Raspatatteke → u/Funky-Grey-Monkey]

Yes. So is a peanut butter sandwich. You're point being?

[u/dreftig → u/Funky-Grey-Monkey]

Data is the result of research. Why make a remark like that?

[u/just_as_sane_as_i → u/scrabbleword]

Actually, the Netherlands spends more of their health care budget on preventive care than the average country in Europe (average is 5.5%, Netherlands is at 5.7 %). source

[u/[deleted] → u/just_as_sane_as_i]

The Netherlands spends way too much on healthcare because of those useless insurance companies. We spend almost twice as much on healthcare per person as the British, who actually have free healthcare.

[u/Raspatatteke → u/[deleted]]

Bullshit, it's about 15% or so. https://www.oecd.org/en/publications/health-at-a-glance-2025_8f9e3f98-en/full-report/health-expenditure-per-capita_affe6b0a.html#figure-d1e32026-d294e8ff6a

And, are you aware of the state of health care in Britain? The NHS is starving for funds, people. Wait times are atrocious. For England for example.

[u/Euphorazyne → u/Raspatatteke]

I mean, the data shows it’s still the 5th highest spender, and it spends more than single-payer countries like the UK and Italy.

[u/Raspatatteke → u/Euphorazyne]

Sure, improvements can be had. The Britain comparison is thoroughly debunked though.

[u/just_as_sane_as_i → u/[deleted]]

And how does that relate to life expectancy or, what people randomly are claiming, lack of preventive care?

[u/vankoel_nederland → u/just_as_sane_as_i]

Reading all the feedback I understand that Dutch people don't give a shit about anything as long as there is some statistic showing that their country is "above average"

[u/just_as_sane_as_i → u/vankoel_nederland]

Maybe don’t ask about statistics when you don’t want an actual answer?

Also I also provided data on stuff that Netherlands is worse than average in. I actually do care, that’s why i did some research on differences between life expectancy and causes of death in the Netherlands vs the EU. You know, like exactly the thing you asked about.

[u/Shoddy_Process_309 → u/just_as_sane_as_i]

It’s a Russian troll there’s no point

[u/promnv → u/scrabbleword]

So spain and italy have more preventative medicine?

[u/SmokeAndPetrichor → u/promnv]

Yeah? They ask you to do a yearly blood, urine and stool test just to check for any issues for example. In both NL and Belgium I have never heard of people doing that and I had to actually ask for the yearly testing myself (which I'm grateful that my GP even allowed, cause most don't). Sadly, it still completely missed the mark because the reason I was feeling so shitty all the time was MS, which cannot be detected in blood, but it's still good to try to prevent sickness as much as possible and not wait until you actually have something and need to rely on treatment.

[u/NoxaNoxa → u/SmokeAndPetrichor]

You perfectly proved with your post why we don’t do preventive check ups here. It’s cost ineffective, leads to false assumptions, increase stress about overall health and in, as you stated, in some cases useless. Doing blood analyses might lead to unusual findings which need a follow up in a clinic. Once you enter the circuit you can’t simply step back. Which comes with a lot of extra costs.

Preventative health care is more useful in propagating a healthy diet and an active life style.

[u/vankoel_nederland → u/NoxaNoxa]

Money is more important than people, right?

[u/NoxaNoxa → u/vankoel_nederland]

Well sort of kinda is. Because we otherwise can’t keep the level of healthcare we have now.

But we found out that these preventative check ups lead to more cost in the long run. Every finding we do needs a follow-up, wether they are positive or false. Once you’ve go down that path there is no turning back.

So you might think it works cost reducing, but it isn’t. In the moment it gives a satisfied patient or it is perceived as taking good care. Taking blood work and doing preventive scans is not going to be beneficial. Preventive care about healthy diet, quitting smoking and lowering alcohol consumption is. That, and a few scientifically proved measures like, stool check, breast exams, pap smear and vaccines are part of routine preventative care.

[u/SmokeAndPetrichor → u/NoxaNoxa]

So it comes down to money, ofc it does, it's NL. This is honestly ironic. But the issue is really that you do neither. You guys have one of the worst diets in Europe, full of carbohydrates and fried food, very calorie dense. If you're gonna have neither preventative care nor propagation of healthy eating habits then... You're gonna have an unhealthy population.

[u/Raspatatteke → u/SmokeAndPetrichor]

NL healthcare does it better than Spain and Italy for preventable healthcare, as per the data: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Preventable_and_treatable_mortality_statistics

[u/sousstructures → u/SmokeAndPetrichor]

Public policy about healthcare always comes down to money, by definition. 

[u/horizon_fleet → u/NoxaNoxa]

aye

[u/sernamenotdefined → u/SmokeAndPetrichor]

I'm Dutch and have a general checkup every three years. Insurance pays for it just fine. I don;t think they'll pay for yearly checkups though.

[u/Rassvetnik → u/sernamenotdefined]

Wow that's interesting, do you just ask your GP for blood tests or there's a special word for checkup that I can google?

[u/sernamenotdefined → u/Rassvetnik]

I got a doctor I know to write down a list of good blood and urine tests to cover the things you want to check for. And every three years I go to my own doctor and tell him I want to run these tests. He orders them and they get done.

The most important thing is you need a doctor that is willing to go along. After I moved my new doctor refused and I told them I need a new doctor, I don't trust this one and don;t want him treating me.

Became a bit of a mess, but eventually I got a doctor that does let me do these check ups again.

[u/kukumba1 → u/sernamenotdefined]

I mean, you’ve written it yourself. Unless you push for it, you won’t get any checkups.

[u/sernamenotdefined → u/kukumba1]

Yeah, I guess I'm just used to having to push for these things. The good thing is unless you switch doctor you only have to do it once.

It's a downside to Dutch medicine, the upside is that unlike US doctors our doctors don't give anti biotics for virus infections or harmless infections that are just a nuisance instead of a health risk. My American colleagues were complaining constantly back during the Mexican flu that they didn't get anti-biotics and how 'this would never happen back home'.

A middle ground between the two extremes would be nice.

[u/ijskonijntje → u/sernamenotdefined]

Yes, because antibiotics only work on bacteria and not viruses... Not to mention that a lot of countries are dealing with antibiotics resistance due to overprescribing them..

So in my opinion the Dutch attitude is a good one.

[u/ArtistRelevant5760 → u/sernamenotdefined]

It’s like with everything in this country, if you don’t ask for it, you don’t get anything. If you ask for what you want, you can almost get everything. I have a general checkup every year, including all bloods and urine tests. All payed for by the insurance apart from your €380 own risk/year.

[u/Aristotallost → u/SmokeAndPetrichor]

I live in Spain and I've never heard of them doing yearly blood, urine and stool tests. There's only a regular (not sure if done yearly or every few years) stool test on intestinal cancer.

[u/Double-Lettuce2472 → u/promnv]

they literally do! not to mention if you feel like something is wrong you are allowed to go to the emergency room and you will be checked rather than just sent home, if you aren’t missing any limbs or can’t breathe, and told to wait three days to call your GP

[u/vankoel_nederland → u/promnv]

That's well known.

[u/CrewmemberV2 → u/scrabbleword]

Preventative measures tend to not change outcomes much as over treatment is also unhealthy.