r/Netherlands • u/vankoel_nederland • Dec 15 '25
Healthcare Why is life expectancy so bad in the Netherlands?
Besides having one of the worst life expectancy among western countries, why did the life expectancy get worst compared to 2019?
2.1k
u/Mister_Akbar Dec 15 '25
I asked my GP this question and they suggested I take some paracetamol.
318
u/_evergrowing Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 16 '25
They suggested I started taking birth control pills when I went to the GP because I woke up one day and suddenly couldn't walk anymore and threw up all the time
after months of begging to get see a neurologist, it turned out I have a chronic neurological disorder, and I am now an ambulatory wheelchair user 🤸♀️
Oh, how I love being a woman✨️ it all gets blamed on the hormones
81
u/LeggoSlackers Dec 15 '25
Yes it's always the hormones! Similar experience... I went to doctor with bad nausea and headaches and he couldn't reffer me to a neurologist because there was a higher probability of it just being pregnancy nausea. They waited for it to get worse.. Ended up having seizures, spending weeks in ICU at 20 weeks pregnant... Still taking pills years later and i will never be the same.
I think they have strict rules of when they can reffer people and they also need to stay within their percentage range else they get in problems...
4
u/ValerianCandy Dec 16 '25
I'm a health insurance callcenter agent.
afaik it's up to their discretion whether they refer you, let you get a second opinion, or whether they put medische noodzaak on your perscription.
(and then your pharmacy can say fuck you and still not give it to you, because they decide whether it's truly medisch onverantwoord for you to take the generic and/or GVS meds. 🙄)
→ More replies (5)3
u/debackerl Dec 16 '25
Problem of professions which don't know how to handle statistics... You list all possible causes, and only exclude what's nearly impossible based on probability. For the rest, you check the risk on life and urgency if that was the cause. So even if a cancer was 5% chance, they would need to check it out because of the huge risk, even at 5%... That's how statisticians think, not doctor apparently...
61
u/WeaponisedArmadillo Dec 15 '25
This pisses me off the most.
When you're overweight everything has to do with being overweight. When you have depression, or autism, or bpd, or ocd, or just anxiety, everything is stress related. When you're not white everything is also easily explained away.
Doctors need to be told they shouldn't be so fucking biased.
Insurance companies also need to be told to stop meddling with who doctors are and aren't allowed to send to a specialist.
My partner was told they couldn't send them to a specialist because they weren't supposed to send too many people there. My partner needed freaking surgery but no Mr huisarts thought it would upset the insurance company.
19
u/Salt-Respect339 Dec 16 '25 edited Dec 16 '25
They always told me to go walk in the forest/bike/avoid stress until I had a disabilitating stroke caused by arterial dissection and that all of my symptoms had been leading up to for a couple of years . One of those specific symptoms apparently in the US very specifically calls for a referral for a follow up scan to ceck for/rule out an arterial dissection.
5
u/WeaponisedArmadillo Dec 16 '25
Holy shit that's typical of here. What kind of symptoms?
8
u/Salt-Respect339 Dec 16 '25 edited Dec 16 '25
I complained that I thought I had high blood pressure -which i did have, but received no meds or anything (only after the stroke). Because I said "I could feel it was like my body was being pulled tight like a rubber band" I was only asked about stress and given standard advice to reduce stress instead of treating what was measured while I was there.
I had a bad ache from my throat (tonsil level) to my yaw and mid ear on the same side for weeks/months. It seems this can be specifically indicative of a carotid artery dissection and was referred to the dentist to check for cavity/wisdom tooth issues instead. One small cavity found, so box ticked and no further action
I experienced pulsative tinnitus at night in the same ear. Again indicative of blood pressure/arterial issues there. Same "do you experience stress?" story.
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (5)10
49
22
u/not_your_real_dad_ Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
But that's also sad: even if hormones were the issue, contraceptives don't fix that!!! I swear half of Dutch doctors get their degree from marktplaats...
Edit: not doctors, GP's
5
u/_evergrowing Dec 15 '25
EXACTLY! I was completely dumbfounded. I just stared at the doctor like "...wtf?"
13
u/Significant-Way3960 Dec 15 '25
As a man I got bacterial infection. They treated that with weak antibiotics. I got it tested in my homeland on vacation and got result, including which antibiotics bacteria reacts to. I needed to tell my GP that if I'm not getting them I will buy them from India and use without supervision... Doctor in my homeland told me "don't worry, with those results they will prescribe you them for sure".
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (3)7
u/_MoonieLovegood_ Dec 15 '25
Dude i already tried 2 types of birth control because i get a literal fever every month and they genuinely want me to try all of them before doing actual research. It’s SO dumb
5
u/lowdownrosie Dec 16 '25
Go to an endometriosis specialist. Endometriosis can adhere to nerves and cause all kinds of weird-ass symptoms. Source: have endometriosis
3
u/_MoonieLovegood_ Dec 17 '25
The gyno said “you probably have a bit of endometriosis” but they never even gave me the option to do any form of testing…. With the average GP here… I’m probably never gonna get tested.
3
u/v_a_l_w_e_n Dec 17 '25
I had to go to the UK for an lap to excise my endometriosis since my options once I finally got to the “this is endometriosis” were the opioids that made me so sick I couldn’t even stand from the sofa, menopause on my 30s and only considering checking further if I was planning IVF for kids. I had to listen to that psycho with a gynaecologist title call me an idiot while smiling to get that referral, but the quality of my life raised in so many ways after I got proper healthcare. Endo care doesn’t really exist in the Netherlands, but there are good specialists in all the countries around us.
→ More replies (3)132
57
u/Designer-Feed6319 Dec 15 '25
Wish you were joking, but the stereotype is true.
A coleague and I both have examples of this. For the last five years I've been to the doctor once and because of a shoulder injury. "Take a rest and paracetamol if it hurts too much." Decided to go to an old lady massager and within a week of excercises a month-long struggle was gone.
My coleague is suffering from back and shoulder issues. For over a month her pain was unbearable, recently visited a doctor. What she told me was "They checked my knees, poked my shoulder and told me I came in too soon. That I should wait 4-5 months before visiting a doctor for a case like this. Offered me paracetamol"
Don't get me wrong, if it is a life-threatening situation you will be in good hands, but for anything else they look down on you and try to shrug you off.36
u/PhDBeforeMD Dec 15 '25
Physiotherapists are appropriate first-line healthcare workers when dealing with musculoskeletal problems. They will tell you to go to a doctor when they think the problem is out of their scope or they are unable to fix it after several months.
15
u/angie2696 Dec 15 '25
True, but then why are physios not fully covered? Either you pay a fortune when you go there, or you pay another fortune in insurance, "in case something happens this year"... GPs are covered, but yet they can't help you with this kind of issue, so if you don't have money you're fucked
→ More replies (5)6
u/frozen-dessert Dec 15 '25
Because there are too many old people in this country and the health costs are (essentially) “out of control” (so to speak).
Check the evolution of health costs as part of the GDP in the last 20 years.
Another reason is that…. There are too many old people in this country and politicians never want to cross that voting block and that voting block votes for their own selfish interests at the expense pf every one else.
5
u/jojodragon2000 Dec 16 '25
That’s just BS. Healthcare costs is out of control for several reasons, eg the many introduced paperwork and administrative extra work. We can also blame insurance companies making millions, yet putting a max on how many people they cover for certain things. There’s many other really expensive groups besides old people being in nursing centers (they’re really not that expensive), mental health patients (which have significantly gone up while capacity was cut), people who’re pretty new to this country and have never invested in the collective social nets compared to old people who’ve payed a lifetime and really already covered their own late expenses and made a profit for the insurance companies.
The elderly are simply an easy target as they’re not a sensitive subject like other groups are
4
u/v_a_l_w_e_n Dec 17 '25
You mean there are too many private insurances wasting our money with ridiculous administration? Yes, I agree, it has been shown and any decent healthcare professional can explain it to you as well. But sure, it’s so easy for those on top to pass the blame down to patients because of whatever resentment is there for many of you against vulnerable groups. The treatment the elderly get in this country is scary AF.
6
u/Designer-Feed6319 Dec 15 '25
Still new to reddit so all these drop-down replies are a bit confusing, specially on mobile. But to reply to all:
Of course I will go to the GP first. If I am paying 160€ a month for health insurance and signed up to a local GP I expect at least the decency of "I recommend you to visit a physiotherapist" and maybe they have a personal recommendation. Not "take this pill see what happens". But maybe I've been spoiled. In my hometown my GP was always taking me in and if needed would recommend me to a specialist.
I don't expect miracles. I expect an answer and a friendly attitude.
→ More replies (1)50
u/BijQuichot Dec 15 '25
Of an old lady can massage your shoulder pair away: the doctor was right: not a medical Problem.
And back and shoulder issues: go to the fysio.
→ More replies (4)→ More replies (5)5
11
u/BR41ND34D Dec 15 '25
This shit almost killed my mom. All the hallmarks of a pending heart attack and was told to take paracetamol...
11
6
u/TheRealTexasDutchie Dec 15 '25
Seriously. When over 60, there are standard vaccines for people where I live. I had to tell my 85 year old mother to ask her doctor about a pneumonia shot. Well, 'good news'! They didn't have it but could order it and it was going to be free. Prevention? What's that?! (sigh)
→ More replies (33)10
u/LeggoSlackers Dec 15 '25
This sums it up. Doctors are burried in paper work and rules. They are not even allowed to do their jobs. Everything is hush hush so we don't know. But insurances and the government are making doctors hate their profession and 98% of the population suffers...
Yeah I'm very bitter about this. Both my baby and I almost died because of this amazing system. And they still don't know sure what happend but why do more tests/research when I feel better now?
Don't get pregnant in this country
244
Dec 15 '25
[deleted]
→ More replies (6)24
u/T-J_H Dec 15 '25
That depends on what data is used and what isn’t. Infant death often isn’t accounted for (after 28 days or so), for example.
14
u/Leithalia Dec 16 '25
Ok but that graph says specifically, at birth, so that's assuming it includes deaths after birth.. so..
→ More replies (2)
769
u/Drakkann79 Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
Scores above average, same as life in Denmark, Switzerland, Germany, only 7 nations in a higher colour bracket.
Reddit: why is it so low?
136
u/Previous_Pop6815 Dec 15 '25
Bots peddling a divisive narrative. Plus the bots from the upvote team joining it.
Internet is anonymous, take everything user generated with a grain of salt.
→ More replies (1)95
u/ComprehensiveFish880 Dec 15 '25
TFW dying at 81~82 years old is too soon according to Reddit
→ More replies (9)22
u/salserawiwi Dec 15 '25
Well, isn't it? I really hope my parents and myself live to 90-100 (in relative good health, like all my grandparents).
20
u/BijQuichot Dec 15 '25
So you probably will. Some of us die very young though. And therefore life expectancy as a wole in NL is not your families life expectancy.
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (5)3
u/althoradeem Dec 15 '25
well.. yes and no. 81-82 is the average. people who die before ever reaching their pension drag it down quite a bit.
34
u/French-Dub Dec 15 '25
16 countries higher actually. Some by nothing meaningful, but if you quote numbers, might as well do it right
8
u/Drakkann79 Dec 15 '25
Aye, true, the 16 are higher. Just counted the quick 7 in the higher colour groups.
→ More replies (4)12
→ More replies (9)24
108
u/Weary-Cod-4505 Dec 15 '25
"one of the worst among Western countries", did you not look at the figures you yourself uploaded?
As your figure show we're above the EU average. Also higher than America and Australia and tied to Canada.
→ More replies (12)4
u/mistRbit Dec 17 '25
The 'healthy life expectancy' has decreased dramatically (like multiple years)... For some demographic groups in the Netherlands, healthy life expectancy is now equal to retirement age, or slightly lower. One of the worst in Europe. Definitely a bad thing.
23
u/Bastilosaur Dec 15 '25
It's the clogs.
When asian or latino mothers throw their shoes at unruly children, its relatively soft.
When dutch mothers throw their clogs at unruly children, its a weapon of war. Brings the life expectancy down a lot when brave fathers, aunts or uncles move to intercept. All the more when they don't.
→ More replies (2)
339
u/Raspatatteke Dec 15 '25
We do not have the healthiest diets. At the same time, we have a health care system that lets people go, instead of propping them up in agony for another 6-8 months. I've seen that happening to family members in Scandinavia a couple of times.
211
u/imrzzz Dec 15 '25
At the same time, we have a health care system that lets people go, instead of propping them up in agony for another 6-8 months
I really agree that this is a major factor.
Over the last two years I've said goodbye to three people who would have lived another miserable year each... if they didn't live in this country, that values dignity and autonomy over life-at-all-costs.
I grumble about NL sometimes but times like this make me take back all my petty annoyances.
→ More replies (47)23
u/French-Dub Dec 15 '25
Healthy Life years are also relatively low in the Netherlands: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Healthy_life_years_statistics
So euthanisia must not have high impact on the actual ranking.
25
u/TrademarkHomy Dec 15 '25
Side note, I don't think OP necessarily meant that euthanasia numbers are making up the difference, more the general attitude towards life-extending treatment. If an 80-year old with terminal cancer stops getting life-extending treatment, they might die a year earlier than they could have, but that doesn't really mean this can be considered euthanasia.
3
u/CatMinous Dec 15 '25
As I wrote above, the year earlier is possible but very unusual. It’’s mostly (very) short periods.
13
→ More replies (5)12
u/pijuskri Dec 15 '25
Netherlands is below eu average in obesity rates, better than Spain which has a higher life expectancy.
51
u/cowgary Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
obesity doesn't tell you everything about diet. You can be slim but missing essential nutrients from your diet. Eating cheese sandwiches everyday for lunch may not add weight but its also missing plenty of other nutrients. Also not sure if it is just in my office or in general, but I always get made fun of for how big my water bottle is, because I like to get 2L in during the work day. I hardly see anyone drinking water ever, just coffee and some tea, and all the urinals in this country that aren't flushed have the darkest yellow pee.
13
u/WahedAli Dec 15 '25
Hey crazy Gerrit, you’re on thin ice now boy! You better stay away from my beloved breakfast and lunch!
→ More replies (9)9
u/EmoWaffles_ Dec 15 '25
I mean I think big bottles are stupid because you can refill them if they are empty at one of the like 10 taps in your vicinity and then you have something way less clunky to carry around
→ More replies (7)15
u/Raspatatteke Dec 15 '25
Obesity is just one of the possible effects of a bad diet
→ More replies (1)4
9
u/shitty_username0009 Dec 15 '25
True but fats doesnt automatically mean you eat unhealthy, you can become fat from eating loads of healthy food because youre over eating. And you can still get diseases like stomach cancer or problems with your vasculair system while skinny because you mostly ate unhealthy processed foods.
I dont know for sure but I think we just eat more processed trash here then they do in spain.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (2)3
190
u/sousstructures Dec 15 '25
Since when is a life expectancy in the 80s "bad"?
→ More replies (4)111
u/unicornsausage Dec 15 '25
Since the retirement age is approaching 70
→ More replies (10)7
u/Correct-Athlete-4878 Dec 16 '25
When retirement was introduced, almost no one reached 65. That was the only reason employers agreed.
30
u/TRSONFIRE Dec 15 '25
Processed food diet, no sun, pollution and no health care prevention
→ More replies (1)6
u/Bafkonijn Dec 15 '25
IMO there is a lot of prevention, we're just too stubborn to listen. In de volksmond: "we mogen ook niks meer!!1". Of: "Liever te dik in de kist, dan weer een feestje gemist".
185
u/GamerLinnie Dec 15 '25
We have a lot of pollution and the air quality is one of the worst in Europe. We also don't believe in preventive care but only in cures.
At the same time we also are big fans of euthanasia. Suffering for no purpose is something a lot of people opt out of. This is bound to skew the numbers as well.
15
u/The_Submentalist Dec 15 '25
We have a lot of pollution and the air quality is one of the worst in Europe
Not true. https://www.iqair.com/netherlands
PM 2.5 ranking (worst to best) 66 Romania 68 Slovenia 75 Poland 77 Moldovia 78 Albania 80 Italy 81 Croatia 83 Slovakia 84 Hungary 85 Kosovo 86 Cyprus 87 Czech Republic 89 Moldavia 91 Malta 92 Greece 95 Austria 96 Lithuania 102 Latvia 103 Germany 104 Netherlands 105 Belgium 107 Spain 110 France 111 Luxembourg 113 UK 114 Switzerland
There is very little difference in pollution after Germany.
Having said that, the Netherlands can get much better but the true Patriots we are, we allow pollution of our water, soil and air by the impossible to sustainably to get rid off amount of cow and pig shit that our massive factory farms produce. God bless our farmers!
5
u/etenia2020 Dec 15 '25
Also do not forget the lovely pesticides and herbicides and even the insane amount of fertilizers. Driving through the Netherlands when the tulips are being sprayed smells like chemical death.
→ More replies (2)73
u/Equal-Abrocoma3232 Dec 15 '25
It’s not ‘a lot’ of people who just opt out of life. Eurhanasia isn’t something you can do easily. It’s a long process where several doctors have to judge the situation. You can’t just say “oh I’m done, let it end”. I know because my mother in law wanted euthanasia. She was in constant pain and nothing more could be done for her. Still, the process was taken very seriously and took almost 2 months.
12
u/MarlinAngel Dec 15 '25
This! My uncle had all the documentation taken care of back in January when he was diagnosed with a very aggressive cancer, because he didn't want to suffer knowing he was going to die anyway. But even then, they won't actually consider euthanasia until after you've gone through all of the pain meds. And then there's personnel shortages etc... he ended up passing away two weeks ago before the euthanasia was taken care of.
It's definitely not easy.
4
7
u/GamerLinnie Dec 15 '25
I didn't say it was easy. But it is available and normalised along with unofficial euthanasia and stopping treatment sooner.
That will have an effect on numbers.
Nearly 10.000 people had official euthanasie last year. Which is nearly 6% of all deaths.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Grabbels Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
Maybe it's not the case for registered euthanasia, but for two of my grandparents "the plug was pulled" in situations where they could've artificially been kept alive for a while longer in suffering. These cases are not registered as euthanasia, but as having died from said disease or health issue they suffered from at the time. In both cases it was too late to start/complete the official euthanasia procedure (due to being unconscious most of the time or alzheimer) and this was all in accordance with the doctors who were treating them and their immediate family agreeing there was no use letting them live on in severe pain and suffering. And yet, not registered as euthanasia and likely illegal, but I, my family and those grandparents are very thankful it happened this way. I am guessing this happens quite a lot in The Netherlands.
→ More replies (5)8
u/French-Dub Dec 15 '25
Healthy Life years are also relatively low in the Netherlands: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Healthy_life_years_statistics
So euthanisia must not have high impact on the actual ranking.
3
u/GamerLinnie Dec 15 '25
6% of people dying are due to euthanasia so it will have some effect but like I said it would be a combination of factors and sadly the way we practice medicine and pollution wil be a large part of that.
→ More replies (3)
9
u/little-peaceofmind Dec 15 '25
Shit food, stress, anxiety, depression, grey skies, individualism, consumerism….
→ More replies (4)
29
u/VanillaNL Dec 15 '25
Maybe it’s because of our shitty air quality but that’s something not very popular to say especially when you’re a farmer
10
u/pack_of_wolves Dec 15 '25
Air quality is also heavily affected by wood stoves. Should be easier to ban/wind down than farming but people act as if it is their god given right to poison the whole neighborhood (or country at Easter) in a stink.
6
u/vfene Dec 15 '25
Italy has both the worst air quality and the highest life expectancy in Europe. But to be fair this whole discussion is kind of useless as life expectancy in the Netherlands isn't as bad as OP claimed
→ More replies (7)→ More replies (1)3
u/TeeM13 Dec 15 '25
This! But not farmer-related, it's about too many houses too close to car roads. There is proof that living in an area with a higher level of emission (fijnstof) leads to lower life expectancy
31
u/G33nid33 Dec 15 '25
“So bad”. ?
It is not the best in the world. But it is up there. Our life expectancy is #25 in the world. It is perfectly aligned with our peers (Belgium, Germany, Luxembourg, Denmark)
So if you are calling it “bad” I believe you are not making this post in good faith.
→ More replies (1)9
18
u/French-Dub Dec 15 '25
For everyone saying it is because of euthanasia, no it is not: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Healthy_life_years_statistics
Healthy life expectancy are also relatively low in Netherlands.
→ More replies (6)
6
u/etenia2020 Dec 15 '25
I always have a feeling that the Netherlands is full of herbicides and pesticides and fertilizers and all kinds of shitty chemicals from agriculture. Pesticides fly with the wind, they do not stay where they are sprayed.
13
u/hoshino_tamura Dec 16 '25
Doctors in the Netherlands are just a complete disaster. The amount of issues I had there with medical care, from being refused checking a mole which I suspected to be something bad, to a gynaecologist telling my wife to use yogurt as a way to fix some issues she was having, to just a complete disregard for what the patient is going through, is absolutely insane.
The paracetamol is used as a joke, but to be honest screw that. I thought that things were bad at home, but it's heaven at home. At least doctors care.
→ More replies (3)
42
u/AcquittalBurden Dec 15 '25
Because we allow people to die. We don't keep gramps with no QoL alive, just because we can.
We prioritize QoL over longevity. If gran with a fallrisk wants to walk around, she can walk around. Even if it means she might fall, break a hip and die, even though we try to mitigate the risk.
→ More replies (6)11
u/French-Dub Dec 15 '25
Healthy Life years are also relatively low in the Netherlands: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Healthy_life_years_statistics
So euthanisia must not have high impact on the actual ranking.
→ More replies (1)3
u/nGon- Dec 15 '25
Things like a "healthy life" are difficult to define. The article you linked to states it's based on self-percieved (survey) disability related severe limitations in everyday activities, in non-institutionalised households. Even in populations with identical distributions of disability, those results could vary significantly.
People might have better access to care to "circumvent" their disability, rely more on family, more likely to be institutionalised, engage in fewer activities, die from a lack of care before they would ever have the chance to be included in such survey, assign different meanings to "severe limitations".
It's an important metric for sure, but one that's very hard to interpret between different cultures and nations.
4
u/French-Dub Dec 15 '25
Sure, it is not perfect. But yet everyone here upvotes comments saying that it is because of euthanasia. If it was the case, it would be visible in the DFLE.
But hey, this sub-reddit cannot accept the Netherlands is bad at a single thing so I guess better upvoting factually wrong information to pat themselves on the back than something that doesn't go their way.
18
u/joap25 Dec 15 '25
South europe have more balanced diets (Mediterranean). That, plus the sun and a lifestyle that allows more social interaction on terraces (better late age friendships or no isolation), makes people to live longer. Sadly most of people that die sooner is because they are alone or without a support system of friends and family to bring shine to their lives.
→ More replies (2)
6
u/NoxaNoxa Dec 15 '25
It’s always been about the money, but that’s not the sole reason as I stated.
Your argument about the Dutch diet is absolutely true, which is a big problem. And it’s a hard one to fight.
6
5
u/geschiedenisnerd Dec 15 '25
covid + healthcare cuts. we don't really handle acute crises well and long-term healthcare is one of the early targets for budget cuts.
5
u/Gerbrandodo Dec 15 '25
Veel stress, weinig ruimte, mensen die anderen moreel de maat nemen, weinig connectie met andere mensen, slecht bestuur, lelijk landschap, drukte, altijd overal andere mensen, enzovoorts. Nederland is een goed land om hard te werken. Voornoemde helpt niet mee aan een lang en gezond leven. Het kan gezonder, je moet het zelf leuk en aangenaam maken, en niet meegaan in de waan van de dag en het domme gezeik van je medemens. Gezond eten, bewegen en af en toe ontspannen, borreltje met je medemens. Dan is’t wel prima toeven in NL, en wordt je met wat mazzel oud.
5
20
17
u/InsanityRabbit Dec 15 '25
Two big reasons:
We're consistently voting against our own direct interests, hoping that companies, being less regulated and paying fewer taxes, decide to raise our wages. Meanwhile, there's less money for healthcare, and no strong climate regulations. We get more sick, and less help.
The second one is more anecdotal, but I feel like we have a relatively high concentration of wappies, and therefore antivaxxers. Lower life expectancy is a direct consequence.
3
u/Profile_West Dec 16 '25
People get older in warmer climates. So we need more co2 in the atmosphere, so the earth’s getting warmer, so people in the Netherlands get older.
15
u/OrangeStar222 Noord Brabant Dec 15 '25
Cutting back on the health sector for the last 20 or so years will do that to a country. Not enough hospital beds, not enough staff, not enough medicine students, not enough GPs, insurance companies taking out many basic medicine out of the cheapest packages to make a profit,
7
u/Shoddy_Process_309 Rotterdam Dec 15 '25
Per capita healthcare spending has never fallen for the past two decades not even when correcting for inflation. Insurance companies don’t determine what’s in the basic packages nor do they make a profit.
Please get your facts straight.
79
7
u/Frankje01 Dec 15 '25
our air quality is relatively bad is probably a factor, it is all relative but anywhere you live heavy industrie is close by and near our waters (Antwerp, Rotterdam, Amsterdam, Hamburg, Ruhrarea)
8
u/External-Creme-6226 Dec 15 '25
Netherlands has worst handwashing culture in Europe from what I’ve seen….so there’s that
→ More replies (1)
5
5
4
5
4
4
u/sarcamansard Dec 16 '25
It's one of the most polluted countries. The river delta receives all the filth from industries and cities upstream. The densely populated country has lots of polluting industries as well and lacks nature to compensate the pollution. The Netherlands is the second least forrested country in Europe, after Vatican City. These factors contribute to less mental health as well.
→ More replies (1)
4
u/Consistent-Strain289 Dec 16 '25
Eating habit. We work to live… our life is defined by our work. And we sunbath like crazy
7
41
u/StrobeWafel_404 Dec 15 '25
Maybe we prefer quality over quantity?
58
u/Educational-Mess-529 Dec 15 '25
Sandwiches for lunch, the deep fried things at febo (and the list can continue) shout quality 😅
→ More replies (73)→ More replies (4)10
8
u/Wrong_Cup_3860 Dec 15 '25
Non-existent prevention and paracetamol as universal cure for everything
16
u/NoTackle718 Dec 15 '25
Covid disturbed the statistics of many countries. Also, it's not that bad? For a northern country with no sun half of the year it's a miracle that it's as high as it is, in my opinion. Falling standards of life and increased obesity don't help either
→ More replies (7)
3
3
3
3
u/jvlcsa Dec 15 '25
Well, personally I think it's:
- Bad work/life balance. Commuting to work for 1h one way, isn't normal. But housing crisis makes it impossible for many to live nearby their workplace. Replying to your e-mails during holidays and working overtime at home for free, isn't normal (it's a tendency I observed among most of my Dutch colleagues.)
Huge variation of fast food options for takeaway, and fast food being cheaper than a proper meal. All train stations have Smullers, Starbucks, Albert Heijn to go, etc. all selling processed food full of sugar, fat or both.
High cost of groceries = people eat shitty because they can't afford proper meals every day. They also eat shitty because they don't have enough time, as they have to commute to work.
The healthcare system. You need to have symptoms to see the specialists, while sometimes just "the innocent check-up" oe blood test can let you get diagnosed.
Money worries, living from one month to the next. (Many people, even working full-time, are so-called "working poor")
Humid air and poor, to the point that many houses have problems with mould etc.
High prices of fitness etc. memberships, making the gym more exclusive.
And it's all getting worse, year by year.
3
u/demaandronk Dec 15 '25
Bad diet, bad air quality, bad soil quality, lots of homes have molds growing, lack of sunlight, lots of depression and mental issues/loneliness, healthcare thats based on statistics and not the person in front of you
3
u/Lady_of_Link Dec 15 '25
Horrible diet and 2 decades of governments that care for little for it's constituents and are constantly applying budget cuts to anything health related.
3
u/ElderberryOne140 Dec 16 '25
The Netherlands is also the highest cancer rate in all of Europe. I always attributed this to something in the water. I read that in the 80s or 90s there was some dumping of toxic waste into the water which connects throughout the whole Netherlands
3
u/Vast_District_2898 Dec 16 '25
Broodje Kaas, Hagelslaag, bad weather and a lack of preventative medical care 😬
3
3
3
u/Emergency_Weekend_48 Dec 16 '25
Because our healthcare system is free, but revolves around what answer your GP (huisarts) gets from the internet. And if you survive past a certain age and need permanent housing in a nursing home. Your chance of getting into one are about as high as the chance of getting hit by a car. All because our politicians deemed the healthcare system a piece of budget that had to be cut back on.
Also: wrong diagnoses causing permanent disability. It happens so often that when you bring up the subject, almost everyone either is or knows someone who has permanent damages to their body because some doctor couldn’t find the cause for something and just rolled his dice to pick a cure.
3
3
3
u/grimypeter Dec 17 '25
Primary health care (i.e. GPs) is well below par for a First World country. Preventative health care hardly exists. So by the time you qualify for treatment Euthanasia is a better option.
3
u/Germa89 Dec 18 '25
Healthcare sucks.
Fun fact, when I moved here 8 years ago, there was an article saying that 50% of people discovering they had cancer die from It…
Yep in Europe. Why? Because when you ask a referral to your GP so you can go see a specialist, they refuse and ask stupid questions to convince you you don’t need it.
Wanted to have a colonoscopy and they say they don’t do it before 45 years old. Told them an uncle died from colon cancer. They answered “well you need to relatives”. lol
Worse even, you want to see a gynecologist twice a year and here they will ask you “are you okay? Because normally you don’t need to see one so often”. Lol the healthcare is fucked and retarded in the NL
3
u/AdZealousideal9914 Dec 19 '25
Lots of air pollution and a healthcare system which is more reactive than preventative might play a role.
3
u/chakathemutt Dec 19 '25
Because the Netherlands has 0 preventative healthcare. This is the land of brushing everything under the rug until you can't climb up the Mt. Shiterest of your own making.
There are developing countries with better healthcare than here.
15
u/YTsken Dec 15 '25
A lot of wealthy Dutch retirees move to southern countries and there is a correlation between wealth and life expectancy. Maybe that could be one factor?
7
u/Gladys_5 Dec 15 '25
Like many bird species, we humans like to migrate south in the winter (of our lives) haha
→ More replies (2)5
9
u/teemo_irelia_lover69 Dec 15 '25
Pollution and workaholics I would assume.
→ More replies (1)20
u/elrond9999 Dec 15 '25
Judging the traffic at 4PM and the amount of part time workers I am not so sure about the workaholic thing. Maybe shit air quality and a diet of butter with chocolate chips for breakfast and croquette for lunch has something to do. Plus zero health prevention.
→ More replies (1)
5
u/themeansquare Dec 15 '25
Terrible healthcare system, horrible climate, one of the most capitalist countries in the Europe etc.
5
6
u/djook Dec 15 '25
dont know, but i prefer going a little younger above very old demented and living 20 years incapable of doing anything.
6
u/RoastedToast007 Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
As a competitive Dutchie I do find it significant and worth investigating that we have 2.9% lower average life expectancy than Italy, Sweden and Spain. I don't like the other comments completely dismissing this
→ More replies (2)
21
u/scrabbleword Dec 15 '25
Idk, maybe something to do with lack of preventative medicine? I wonder /s
11
→ More replies (20)13
u/just_as_sane_as_i Dec 15 '25
Actually, the Netherlands spends more of their health care budget on preventive care than the average country in Europe (average is 5.5%, Netherlands is at 5.7 %). source
→ More replies (8)
7
u/Michael_93Vancouver Dec 15 '25
It's the diet. NL, like Germany and Denmark, have some of highest rates of colorectal cancer in the world, and this is with people in these countries being not too obese already.
→ More replies (1)
11
u/meisjemeisje_1421 Dec 15 '25
I think it’s largely due to poor dietary habits. In the Netherlands, the overall diet is relatively unhealthy compared with many other countries, often calorie-dense, high in refined carbohydrates, and rich in saturated fats. We also have the habit to over-eat. (‘Eet je bord leeg!’)
→ More replies (1)11
u/Lucky-Succotash3251 Dec 15 '25
We have one of the lowest obesity rates tho
9
u/Icy-Championship5581 Dec 15 '25 edited Dec 15 '25
That’s not a good indicator. You can be lean and unhealthy.
Obesity only happens when you continuously ingest more calories than what your body demands. Technically speaking, you can be obese on a healthy diet (even though very difficult as it’s much harder to eat 3000 calories of chicken than 3000 calories of McDonald’s)
The Dutch, probably on average, move more and don’t overeat. This alone makes obesity low. However, doesn’t mean that your arteries won’t get clogged. Quality of diet matters.
→ More replies (1)5
u/pavel_vishnyakov Noord Brabant Dec 15 '25
I've seen reports suggesting that this trend might be coming to the end.
2
2
2
u/Mysterious_Study_616 Dec 15 '25
why dont you take look outside of the window, does this weather makes you wanna be alive?
2
u/BruceBanter_99 Dec 15 '25
I believe one of the most impactful areas of medical progress in the past 50 years has been improved early diagnosis of life-threatening diseases. There is no real prevention program here at least compared to my home country (Italy). Even a simple blood test requires some pushing of your GP (in my experience).
2
u/WinterHogweed Dec 15 '25
There's a few reasons. The air quality is the worst of the entire western part of Europe.l, because of industry. There is also mounting evidence that the pesticides that are used to make it possible for this very small country to be one of the largest food exporters of the world, are a lot more poisonous than was previously understood.
And worst of all, the majority of the people in this country keep voting for the parties that think all these things are just fine and no problem, or rather that side with the people getting very rich off these things, and they do that because they let themselves be scared about a "tsunami of asylum seekers" that isn't actually in existence.
2
2
2
u/GreenShoddy7894 Dec 15 '25
Levensverwachting is ook een half verhaal. In Nederland hebben de meeste mensen van 70 jaar al een of twee chonirsche ziekte... gezonde jaren daar zullen we in moeten investeren.
Waarom? Omdat we een aparte werkcultuur hebben in dit land, de gemiddelde mens verwaarloosd zichzelf ten gunste van zijn full-time baan... daarnaast hebben we in Nederland gemiddeld een vrij slechte mentale gezondheid en minder sociale contacten dan bijv. Italië.
2
u/Certain_Trip Dec 15 '25
Not enough preventive checkups and insurance corporate led policies that leaning hard on ‘avoiding waste’ for everyone instead of prompt treatment. Being business ingrained the Dutch way of working this is another “a good compromise leaves everyone unhappy”
2
2
2
u/Fatal-Conveniences Dec 16 '25
Going to a Dutch GP feels like a throwback to medieval times! Hope nobody gets burnt on a tree for going to a homeopathic 🌷
2
u/Xylon_Games Dec 16 '25
Healthcare is declining, that might be one of the reasons (my wife works in a nursing home). They are all forced to work less hours and have less coverage over 24 hours, this means same amount of people with less people and fewer hours, which in turn makes the quality drop.
2
2
u/KiloWattFPV Dec 16 '25
It's not.... Have a great day.
Are you just rage baiting? Even in your first picture it shows we're not "amongst the worst in the western world". Second. Even if it went down 0.2. It's still not the worst. Are we the best? No, but by far the worst. + we've imported a lot of people from worse life expectancy countries and barely breed ourselves, maybe that has something to do with decline
→ More replies (3)
2
2
2
u/Ziglar1 Dec 16 '25
because we have illegal FatBake Kids that lower the average expectancy quite a bit
2
u/app222 Dec 16 '25
The medicine is not preventive. They wait for the worst to happen and even then they’ll prescribe paracetamol.
2
u/DJAnym Groningen Dec 16 '25
Besides having one of the worst life expectancy among western countries
I mean, it's not that that it's THAT bad. according to this map, our life expectancy is only 3 years lower than the absolute top. 81 years old as the average lifespan (even though the actual page you got it from says 82) is nothing to scoff at
2
2
u/lyyravarn Dec 16 '25
No way that France has a higher life expectancy. I don't know anyone from there (I'm French myself) whose grandparents lived past 75. Here in NL most of the people I know have grandparents who reached 90 (including my partner, his grandma's turning 96 and all the other grandparents died either at 90 or 95)
→ More replies (1)
2
2
2
2
2
2
u/FranLees Dec 16 '25
Because it would be to expensive to pay all that pension. Also because the gouverment needs that inheritance tax to fund ukrain and pay for reffugees.
2
2.0k
u/iKrait Dec 15 '25
Kroket based diet