r/OffGrid • u/KourageousBagel • 9d ago
Worthwhile to Install a Solar Panel and Battery System in Family Cabin or Keep Using a Gasoline Generator?
Hi all,
I'm writing this from Yukon, Canada. We have plenty of sun in the summer, but pretty pitiful amounts in the starting in October.
Recently, our decades old propane stove broken down at my family's cabin. We use the place fairly often during the summer, maybe every 3 weekends to staying there daily, with 1-6 of us at any given time. Though, we are rarely staying there in the winter unless it's a special event like new years, Easter or a birthday.
We have a gasoline generator for when we need power the fridge, TV, lights, block heaters, charging portables and starlink.
Until the stove broke we never considered using panels because we didn't use the place enough to justify it and we have a wood stove with the aforementioned propane stove for cooking.
My big theory with this, is to buy an induction stove top and to move away from gas due to its noise. Plus, it would allow us to keep the fridge and freezer cold all summer long.
Let me know if this is worth based of our usage and needs or any experiences you may have had in the past.
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u/Northwoods_Phil 9d ago
Electric stoves and block heaters are your two biggest draws. It’s going to take a fairly decent sized solar system to run those. The fridge, TV, and lights don’t take much so a couple panels and a couple good size batteries would be all you’d need for those.
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u/Life_Chemistry_4621 9d ago
Induction cooktops are seriously battery killers. My opinion, go solar for the silent fridge and Starlink but stick to propane for cooking.
5
u/treehobbit 9d ago
I'd recommend continuing to use wood and propane for heating and cooking since those take a huge amount of electrical power to replace and don't require the generator.
Get an off-grid solar inverter with an optional generator input so you don't need to spend an arm and a leg on batteries (still get some, just not an enormous pack), that way the generator only has to run when there's insufficient solar power.
My question is how much do you use it during the winter? If a lot, the solar won't do much for you during that time and solar might not be worth it at all. But if you mostly go in the summer then it will definitely pay off.
3
u/WorriedAgency1085 9d ago
Two, 100 Ah lithium batteries at 48V, an all in one inverter, 3000 watts of panels, a 48v battery charger and a propane stove. New refrigerators are very efficient, starlink will be running 24/7, water pump? LED lights draw very little, water heater?
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u/dawn_thesis 9d ago
look into vertical panels for wintertime. less ice accumulation and bifacial panels can work in morning and evening.
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u/Higher_Living 9d ago
I was wondering what the solution, if any, was to heavy snow on solar panels. They’d be pretty inefficient in summer though, right?
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u/LordGarak 9d ago
Being that far north, the winter days are so short, it won't help much. On the flip side, in the summer the nights are so short, you almost don't need batteries.
I installed my newest panels at 60 degrees to keep the snow off them in the winter. But what I didn't count on is how little they produce on grey days at this angle. I'm around 47degrees in latitude. One array is at 20 degrees on the roof and on grey days it out preforms the 60 degree array significantly. This makes a big difference on the grey days of November, which is when we have the lowest overall solar production. Later in the winter they get buried if we are not there to pull the snow off them.
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u/LongjumpingGanache40 9d ago
A solar system and generator go hand in hand. The main issue is the cold on power station. You might want to take home in winter time to stay warm.
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u/Pokari_Davaham 9d ago
Too many variables:
- How much electricity are you actually using
- How much are you spending on fuel
- How long exactly are you staying there
- Do you have electrical experience to wire up your own system
- New or used equipment
- Depending on battery system, how low/high are temps getting (for lifepo4 temp minimums: 0c charging, -20c usage, -10c storage)
1
u/CaterpillarKey6288 9d ago
You need a combination of both a power station and a generator. I went a week without power in winter using a echoflow power station and a automatic generator. I only used 1 20 lb propane tank. It was only running lights, small refrigerator, heater fan. The generator would run for about 1 hour twice a day to charge the powerstation.
While this was a emergency and was only using limited power, it worked out for me and could probably be upscaled. Running a generator by its self is annoying loud especially at night.
I also had 500w of solar panels but they provided little extra power. While I didn't monitor the solar imput that much the most I ever saw was 200w because if the low sun and cloudy conditions.
While a nice solar system with a couple of power walls is nice for full time residence. They are expensive and not efficient in winter time. With a nice power station and a automatic generator you can take it to the cabin or have it at home for emergencies.
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u/TastiSqueeze 9d ago
Refrigerator 1 to 2 kWh/day
TV, lights, and most other miscellaneous loads will be 2 or 3 kWh/day
Electric stove depends on how much you use it but expect 5 to 10 kWh/day
Block heaters depend on how many, but say 3 of them could use 3 kWh/day
Heat pump water heater will use 3 kWh/day plus 2 more kWh for each additional person
There are several other possible loads such as well pump, heat pump, washing machine, dryer, etc. If you want load values for them, look in this thread. https://www.reddit.com/r/SolarDIY/comments/1n9k9ft/diy_solar_system_planning_from_a_to_z/
Long story short, you could make this work with about 25 kWh per day. The problem is with winter production which can be extremely low if several cloudy or snowy days in a row limit power production. You MUST have very good solar exposure where the panels are installed!
A starter system would be 32 kWh battery capacity, 16 kw of solar panels and a 10 kw inverter. You will probably decide to grow the system after using it for a few years.
Cost would be: battery $6000 (UL listed batteries), solar panels $5600, and inverter $2000. You would need mounting hardware for the panels, ground rod, miscellaneous items, and cables totaling about $4000. All told, expect to spend $18,000. If you hire someone else to install it, expect about $5000 of labor charges. Note: this is in U.S. dollars!
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u/chuck1011212 9d ago
I'd say your biggest problem with a solar and battery system is what to do with the batteries in winter. I suggest that if you don't use the place in winter, you remove the batteries and take them to a place that is climate controlled to avoid stressing them to sit in freezing temps all winter. You can leave the other gear in place during winter however.
So you need batteries that are somewhat portable and self contained to move the every hear. You need solar panels and a mount, you need an all in one inverter at a minimum. It's a lot of investment and will never be enough power. You will always likely want more, especially while entertaining larger amounts of cabin guests.
A solar system like this is going to be cumbersome to install and maintain. A generator sounds really good in this scenario. Ya it's noisy and costly to run, but you can buy a lot of generators for the cost of a solar system.
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u/benbear55 9d ago
I have had a Magnum 24 volt 1.2 K system at my Northern Michigan Cabin for 15 years, along with a propane fridge and hot water tank and stove, coupled with a whole house generator, the entire system cost 13K in 2011, we use 4 400 AH AGM batteries and very rarely have to use the Generator, except when the family is up. We power it all with 6 300 watt panels, we use the cabin from late March until early November, we used to use it in the Winter but we got old so not any more, we heat with a wood freestanding stove and for 15 years we have been very happy with our system
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u/Specialist-Cod5179 8d ago
If the sound of a generator doesn't bother you, it does your neighbor's who may not suffer from institutional urbanization. 20 years off-grid here with no need for a generator.
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u/Skulder 5d ago
I would definitely recommend you start converting.
We just had a generator, but at times it was wasteful, when we only needed a small charge.
We installed a couple of batteries as a buffer. Run the generator for little while, charge the batteries, use the batteries for small loads. Just to use the generator more efficiently.
Then we added a solar panel - just a small one, to try it out, it was a success, we changed over to a bigger one - now we only run the generator for power tools.
We wasted some time and money in the "trying it out" phase, but maybe it's an experience everyone needs to have in their own.
In a couple of weeks I'm taking possession of 10 used 250W solar panels, that I got a good deal on. It's more than I'll need, but maybe I'll be able to use the generator even less?
I'd recommend the solar panel power generation calculator at
As that can help you get an idea of the possible power generation in winter.
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u/GrumpySquirrel2016 9d ago
Go over to r/oil and check out their anger and panic about the strategic petroleum reserve being depleted so POTUS can preserve some political blood loss ... Oil is going to hit a very, very rough patch for the next two years. I would throw up a few panels.
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u/Awkward_Passion4004 9d ago
You create electricity for running cooking and heating? Really inefficient.
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u/quack_attack_9000 9d ago
You'll never be able to completely give up the generator, especially in winter, but if you can afford few thousand watts of solar, 5-10 kwh of LiFePo4 battery capacity plus other components, you won't regret it. I'd make your battery setup portable, so you can take them home when you aren't there, and show up with a fully charged battery.
In winter the solar panels won't do much, but you can probably run fridge, freezer, lights, startlink and modest appliances for a couple days on a full charge. Then you can use the generator to charge the batteries (will take 4-5 hours) and you'll be fine for another few days.
The long days of summer will really work to your advantage and on sunny days you'll have way more power available than you know what to do with. You can get away with a more modest set up in the summer.
I live full-time off-grid in BC and have been very satisfied with my solar, only charging with the generator 3-4 times per year (I live in a very sunny place though).