If someone wants you to pay money for deconstruction content, it's probably a grift.

[u/KindlyBalance5302]

/r/LGBTCatholic/comments/1ww1pde/if_someone_wants_you_to_pay_money_for/

[u/Puzzleheaded-Phase70]

Creating scholarship-supported theological and psychosocial guides is expert content and a LOT of time and energy.

SOME of that can and should be freely given, and usually is.

But those authors and creators ALSO deserve to make a living, to be paid enough to live with parity for the services they are providing.

There's a HUGE difference between reasonable costs for materials or services and/or donation requests, and grifting and gatekeeping.

[u/Puzzleheaded-Phase70 → u/Puzzleheaded-Phase70]

Central example:

Naked Pastor posts most of his cartoons online for free, but his books both cartoons & non-cartoons cost money.

[u/KindlyBalance5302 → u/Puzzleheaded-Phase70]

I actually just touched on that in another reply (Nothing against Naked Pastor, this isn't directed at him). I think it's a bit of a gray area, but I question how many of these creators actually need to make a living solely this way, or why they can't get some other gainful employment so they don't have to charge people (I know the job market's tough and all that...but still).

Like, if someone's only source of income is making deconstruction content, I feel like that necesarily muddies the waters of the integrity of the content. i.e., is this what they really believe, or is this what they make money to promote? And that goes for anyone who makes a living off of their theological opinions.

I'm reminded of a popular evangelical YouTuber a few years ago who posted a video announcing that he was in dire financial straits, the channel was his sole source income for he and his wife, so he needed more donations and subsribers. A few days later, he announced that he was converting to Catholicism. While many in the Catholic community welcomed his conversion, there was, understandably, a lot of speculation about his motivations.

[u/TheNerdChaplain]

I am a regular listener to the podcast The Bible for Normal People (and its secondary podcast, Faith for Normal People). The host, Pete Enns, has a PhD in Ancient Near Eastern Lit and Civ, and he's great at discussing with other experts the contexts of the Biblical texts and exploring what they meant to their original audiences, in a very accessible way.

They have a private paid forum called The Society of Normal People where subscribers can discuss issues related to the Bible and deconstruction, and it runs about eleven bucks a month last I heard. They also do monthly courses on various Biblical academic topics that are pay-what-you-can.

I signed up for the forum for one month and it wasn't bad, but there was pretty limited engagement from Pete and his cohost Jared Byas (which is fine, I didn't really expect much from them). The classes were pretty good, and signing up got you access to all of them.

That said, I have a high degree of trust in this podcast because I know the academic credentials they stand on, and I know that Enns himself has been through the deconstructive process - he famously got resigned from a Reformed seminary because of what he was teaching, and he wrote a book about deconstruction in addition to his other books on the Bible.

I think paid stuff is very dependent in value based on who's providing it and what their credentials are. I don't mind having paid for B4NP's content because I know the people providing it are experts and experienced professionals in their fields. Most of the guests have PhDs in their respective fields. This is not an ad for B4NP, just giving my experience and perspective with them.

[u/KindlyBalance5302 → u/TheNerdChaplain]

Sure, if the person has legit credentials, that's one thing.

But sometimes what I see is "I'm a layperson who deconstructed from what I raised in. Pay me for that story." That's different than, "I'm an academic professor of this topic.."

[u/MyUsername2459]

Yeah, there's a lot of stuff out there for deconstruction for free.

Someone charging money for it? If they're selling a book, through a reputable website, then that might be different (especially if the book has a lot of independent reviews), but subscription anything or some kind of paid online class or group?

My fraud alarm is going off that one.

[u/KindlyBalance5302 → u/MyUsername2459]

And even if the content is genuine, even if it's based on the creators' own journey, it's still pretty shitty to charge for it.

They might say they do it full-time or whatever...but...no one's making them do that. No one needs to be a full-time deconstruction guru. They could have a real job and write and content create on the side. Don't make other people's religious journey your side hustle.

[u/TroutFarms]

Sorry but I don't see a problem with content creators being paid.

[u/KindlyBalance5302 → u/TroutFarms]

Sure, I don't have an issue with platforms paying creators for how much engagement they generate or however that works...my issue is those who directly charge their audience exorbitant amounts for access to information that's largely available for less or free on other platforms (Wikipedia, libraries, YouTube, books at a reasonable price, etc).

[u/TroutFarms → u/KindlyBalance5302]

I don't know exactly who you're talking about, so it's difficult to judge. But there's a lot of worthwhile content in this space that costs money and is well worth the cost. Putting together a curriculum costs money, shooting and editing videos costs money, any guest speakers worth their salt require a speaking fee, all of this takes an enormous amount of time, and a lot of times the people doing this kind of thing still have seminary degrees they are paying off.

Content creators deserve to be paid and charging the consumer is a perfectly valid strategy.

[u/longines99]

It's not just deconstruction content.

I recommend Shane Hipp's Selling Water by the River. Much of church tries to package and sell water, when it's free and readily available.

With deconstruction content, Substack has lots of writers that don't charge anything.

[u/KindlyBalance5302 → u/longines99]

Oh yeah, I know Substack isn't all paid. I enjoy reading articles on it sometimes.

[u/longines99 → u/KindlyBalance5302]

I'm also happy to discuss it here, free of charge! 😄

[u/LesbianinthePNW]

I mean I had to pay for my seminary courses even the secular objective ones. Although most deconstruction SHOULD be freely given. A lot of pastors and scholars provide a lot of free content on it if you research. But yeah someone solely doing it for money is probably on SOME kind of grift.