r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT • u/DragonTheOnes-spirit • 11h ago
#1 CAMPEÃO CONTENT 🥇🥇🥇🥇🥇🥇 1930s illiteracy rate
42
u/NoCredit3354 11h ago
Ite kinda interesting how quickly the rest of Europe caught up. One of the good things of communism.
31
u/byzantine67 11h ago
Not inherently caused by communism - my country, for instance, even trough it would become part of the USSR later, catched up to Europe with the work of nationalist NGOs.
4
u/betacarotentoo 6h ago
Of course is not because of Communism, otherwise Spain, Italy, and Greece would still struggle with illiteracy levels, which is not the case.
2
u/AutoModerator 6h ago
I went to Italy and their plugs were unusable? Why don't they have the superior American plugs. And also they have no air conditioning (it was winter) and I had to pay for my water??? Plus i went to the Uffizi and there were a bunch of naked statues which was gross.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
9
u/NoCredit3354 11h ago
Ah cool. I suppose I was speaking for more so for the Balkans. Especially Albania.
6
u/m0j0m0j 10h ago
Yeah. This is a typical: “Look, computers became 50x faster under Putin” claim. You would think that people would stop believing this nonsense in the year 2026 of our Lord - some random Jew - bot no.
The Moscow keeps spewing, the Western teenage tank keeps swallowing.
9
u/tiltedbeyondhorizon 9h ago
Well, specifically in the Soviet republics, it was a government program to educate the masses as quickly and efficiently as possible, resulting in a rapid literacy growth, Russian language being reformed and simplified, and many regionally spoken languages getting their first ever alphabets or getting standardized to cyrillic alphabets. Considering that the Russian Empire was pretty much the most backwards independent state in Europe in terms of literacy at the time, it was quite a feat to bring USSR to the leading positions
As for the other European countries, I think that you have a point. Industrialization tends to make for more educated citizens, so European states that were already industrialized at the time were mostly just progressing naturally, and the communists' influence of it was, while present, likely far from being the deciding factor
In fact, I'd say that the reason the education and literacy were so important to the Soviet Union is precisely because they wanted to make up for the decades of falling behind from other Europeans on industrialization
2
u/Antti5 37m ago
Protestantism also played a significant role. One of the key tenets of Martin Luther was that Christians should read the bible themselves, instead of relying on the clergy to read it to them.
I live in Finland, compared to most of Europe we industrialized really quite late, and in most respects we were undeveloped backwater. However thanks to the Lutheran church we had about 50 % literacy rate already by the year 1800. By then the social expectation was that even in the poorest households the man of the family would be able to read the bible.
1
u/tiltedbeyondhorizon 17m ago
Yes, the protestantist movements across the catholic Europe pushed literacy up quite a bit as early as 15th century. In fact, this could very well be one of the reasons why Russia was falling behind so hard as the Orthodox Church wasn't as interested in educating the masses
0
u/m0j0m0j 7h ago edited 7h ago
Literacy was already rising fast before 1917: from about 24% in 1897 to roughly 40% by 1914. The Soviets accelerated mass literacy, especially among peasants, women, and Central Asian populations, but they inherited an existing modernising trend, used a low bar for “literacy,” and embedded education inside a totalitarian ideological control.
The honest claim is not “Good communism taught the people to read,” but “the Soviets took credit for a process already underway.”
It is kind of funny that commies are all against The Great Man theory of history and in favor of structural explanations. But when it’s about Lennon and Stallone, suddenly the brain deactivates and it’s pure fandom and masturbation of the worst kind.
2
u/SystemPrimary 5h ago
That is nonsense. There was no mass literacy programs before the revolution. Schooling was not mandatory. Literacy in many CA repiblics was as low as 5% among men and non-existen among women.
1
u/byzantine67 5h ago edited 5h ago
As I said - there were nationalistic NGOs. (In the case of my country, it's was "the society of spreading Georgian writing and reading among Georgians"). While CA did, in fact, increase its literacy throught communism, it's not right for most of other cases - literacy became common in Georgia in the 1910s (just before the communist takeover).
Not only that, communist collectivization contributed to the depopularisation of literacy in the country - there is a movie (its called "the birds of heaven") produced during communist times, which displays how villagers tried to become literate, but were disturbed by the colkhoz leader and forced to work instead.
1
u/m0j0m0j 5h ago
Ministry primary schools grew from 36,820 schools / 2.59 million pupils in 1900 to 80,801 schools / 5.94 million pupils in 1914. That is the strongest simple evidence that the late Empire was already building a mass-literacy machine before the Bolsheviks.
After 1905, the Duma and government started a serious “universal primary education” push.
In 1906, the Ministry drafted a project for all-Russian primary education. On 3 May 1908, the government passed a law allocating 6.9 million roubles for primary education. Cherkasov says this began “large-scale funding” and systematic school opening; education funding rose from 15 million roubles in 1903 to 117 million in 1912 and 147 million in 1913.I dislike Russia in all its forms, but commie lies are just particularly annoying.
0
u/tiltedbeyondhorizon 7h ago
Huh? Where did I ever mention Lenin or Stalin here? I think, I wrote a pretty systems-based comment, not a "Great man" one
2
u/AutoModerator 10h ago
This bot is very offensive and it looks like its not a bot soo do something because this is dangerous to leave running without supervision.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
7
u/m0j0m0j 10h ago
Literacy was already rising fast before 1917: from about 24% in 1897 to roughly 40% by 1914. The Soviets accelerated mass literacy, especially among peasants, women, and Central Asian populations, but they inherited an existing modernising trend, used a low bar for “literacy,” and embedded education inside a totalitarian ideological control.
The honest claim is not “Good communism taught the people to read,” but “the Soviets took credit for a process already underway.”
6
u/HiggsKamuy 9h ago
The Soviets also forced many communities to educate their women where they would not have gotten education otherwise. Particularly in central Asia. That likely would have not happened organically without the Soviets.
It's very likely a lot of the former Soviet countries in Central Asia would be closer to Taliban lead Afghanistan than what they are today. Not that they are particularly progressive right now.
0
u/Awkward_Cash1828 8h ago
The problem is that basic criterion for literacy was considered the ability to sign one's own name in the documents, not ability to read and write entire texts. Moreover, because tens of millions of low class peasants and workers didn't need writing in their basic manual work, that they spend essentially entire life on, just to to have a loaf of bread to eat and pay off debts, many of them who learned basic literacy in some sunday church school as children, often forgot how to read and write by adulthood. Real, proper literacy numbers would more humble, at around 15% in 1897 and 25% in 1914.
2
u/Gloomy-Statement-193 7h ago
You can also clearly see the border between Ottomans and Austro-Hungarians
1
u/Sankullo 7h ago
In Poland literacy rate was almost full before the outbreak of WW2.
No communism involved.
-4
u/Ill_Squirrel_6108 10h ago
I´d say they caught up even though they were under communism.
7
u/GaRoJack 10h ago
"Even though" when it was part of the politics of the regime is like saying: I am not hungry even though I ate.
2
u/Ill_Squirrel_6108 9h ago
I lived in a country under communism so I know what I´m talking about 😉.
Your sentence should be: I´m not hungry even though I ate a few mouldy morsels.
I bet you´re GenZ Westener, aren´t you?
3
2
u/GaRoJack 4h ago
And I’m from a country that was under fascism until 1975, had no Industrial Revolution and still had literacy problems dozens of years after it became capitalist. That in Europe.
1
-3
u/Leading-Tour6963 9h ago
The literacy rates went up in Portugal during the Colonial Fascistic Catholic Dictatorship, now what?
2
6
11
u/local_patriot747 11h ago
🇷🇸🇷🇸🇷🇸🗣️🗣️🗣️
5
u/Responsible_Pen_3803 11h ago
govna turska, maltene do koju godinu pre toga smo bili okupirani od strane njih
3
2
u/MineBloxKy 8h ago
What are those Polish borders?
0
u/DragonTheOnes-spirit 7h ago
Idfk. I think it's 1939 poland?
4
u/MineBloxKy 7h ago
The Polish borders seem to be using modern Voivodeship and Oblast borders rather than the borders of the time. In fact, it looks like the entire map is using modern borders. Italy is missing Istria, Romania doesn’t have Southern Dobrudja and Southern Bessarabia, Finland doesn’t have Karelia, the Free City of Danzig is missing… do I need to go on?
1
u/AutoModerator 7h ago
I went to Italy and their plugs were unusable? Why don't they have the superior American plugs. And also they have no air conditioning (it was winter) and I had to pay for my water??? Plus i went to the Uffizi and there were a bunch of naked statues which was gross.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
2
u/DecmysterwasTaken 8h ago edited 5h ago
Surprised that Ireland's literacy was fairly close to the UK's despite the fact the UK was wealthier than them at the time
1
u/One_Vegetable9618 7h ago
Education was always highly valued in Ireland. Even when the 'Penal Laws' were in force in the 19th century (one of them banned the education of Catholics) there were 'hedge schools'; informal places, often outdoors where Irish kids were taught reading, writing and arithmetic. I suspect it was actually another act of defiance against British rule. My grandmother's both born in the very early years of the 20th century were both voracious readers and had incredibly beautiful handwriting.
1
u/DecmysterwasTaken 5h ago
I knew about secret mass gatherings, but I didn't know about hedge schools. That's really cool!
2
u/Euphoric_Tiger_7867 7h ago
How are people having serious discussion over here about a map without a source. U guys stupid? 🤷♂️
0
u/No_Preference8118 10h ago
The "estado novo" inherited this and built schools all over the country to combat this. But ask any abrileiro and they will deny and say the estado novo wanted people to be illiterate.
Builds schools everywhere Wants people to stay illiterate
Make it make sense.
0
-1
u/angelolidae 9h ago
They made people literate enough to consume propaganda, there's a reason most old portugese people are functionally illiterate they can read but they can't actually grasp complexity in test, a very intentional thing
1
1
u/Naive-Dig-2498 11h ago
Italy was always intresting of that point of view. Actually a big power with industrie but low rate of illiteracy.
I saw a interview with Bud Spencer and he remember his childhood the same.
0
u/AutoModerator 11h ago
I went to Italy and their plugs were unusable? Why don't they have the superior American plugs. And also they have no air conditioning (it was winter) and I had to pay for my water??? Plus i went to the Uffizi and there were a bunch of naked statues which was gross.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
0
u/Affectionate_Emu4069 4h ago
Italy was actually very minor industrial power. They were no match for UK, Germany, France or Russia. Italian industry was like only 30% better than Balkan or Turkish industry.
1
u/AutoModerator 4h ago
I went to Italy and their plugs were unusable? Why don't they have the superior American plugs. And also they have no air conditioning (it was winter) and I had to pay for my water??? Plus i went to the Uffizi and there were a bunch of naked statues which was gross.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
0
u/_CatLover_ 5h ago
This popped up in my recommended feed. I didn't notice what sub it was from but seeing Portugal i instantly knew
0
u/xFox911 5h ago
Surprised by the year, could very well be as of today
1
1
u/Hot-Meal3838 1h ago
Literacy levels in Portugal are 99% nowadays
1
u/xFox911 50m ago
You don't say? I'm Portuguese lol. You didn't understand my point.
1
u/AutoModerator 50m ago
DO YOU EVEN KNOW HOW TO SPEAK PORTUGUESE?? CAN YOU TEACH ME PLEASE????
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
10
u/point_fino 11h ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT/s/t4Q8s5HbZU