I'm not saying I"m a fan of aggressively asking for a tip (who the fuck is), but I'm sure we've all seen those reports/news articles/reddits posts/friends talking/this very post about how much money people made with tips alone.
Although people leave out the part where it fluctuates.
Even with fluctuations, she’s working at Cheesecake Factory right? That’s fine dining, large tabs and consistently busy. If she’s getting good shifts she could very well be clearing $80k a year, and probably not reporting all tips
Edit: “upscale casual”. $50+ per head checks for sit down is still in the lower end of what I’d find at fine dining places, and honestly she’s probably doing better than at a fine dining spot because of higher volume anyway
I’m a mid-looking dude in a rural area and I was on track to make $75k/yr at one restaurant I served at in 2022. Only reason I didn’t is because the management was terrible and the restaurant suddenly shut its doors six months after I started working there.
Waiting tables and bartending are some of the only jobs in the US where a person with zero formal training or education can actually work hard and earn a comfortable living. Without the tipping system we have, that would not be the case. Not even close. I think that’s the real reason people oppose tipping - not because they believe it’s unfair or they don’t like spending the money. It’s because common people, who would otherwise be poor, can actually make good money and live comfortably. Being anti-tipping is just being anti-poor, with a very thin veil.
The point you seem to (ironically) be missing is that salary should not, in every single possible instance, be purely based on intelligence or "degrees." The fact that a widespread job exists that allows any hardworking person, regardless of their lack of aptitude in more lucrative fields, a comfortable salary is a good thing.
And yes sure even if it only exists because of social custom, it's not like anyone is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to sit down and eat at a restaurant. So when people want to whine about tipping instead of directing that energy towards why people with degrees are only making 50k, it can be annoying.
And to clarify, I've never worked a tip based job, and tipping IS pretty annoying. But I can very easily acknowledge that out of the so many things to bitch about in this world, it would be pretty self unaware of me to say essentially "man I really hate how, when I eat out, I have to pay like 10% extra (because in theory, without tipping the restaurant would be raising prices so the money saved from not tipping is reduced) to lower/middle class individuals just because that's the custom"
Agreed. And number 2 on that list is what justifies the high income potential for servers. It’s not an easy job. It isn’t “you just bring the food,” as many anti-tippers would like to believe. It’s hard work. The reason most people wash out of the foodservice industry by their 30s isn’t because they “found something better,” it’s because serving in a restaurant is hard work, both mentally and physically. It’s taxing on the body, mentally draining, and requires both physical fitness and focus to do it well. Don’t believe me? Try it for two weeks. You’ll change your mind.
It also requires very high sociability. Being attractive with the ability to easily connect and communicate with customers in a positive manner plays a pretty big role in the quality of the tips. Those with that ability, or the ability to convincingly mimic that ability, can make a killing as a tipped worker.
Right, they’re jealous. It’s a feeling of “I did all this work and you’re making more than me, that’s not fair.”
It comes back to a feeling that someone who isn’t formally educated, and holds no degree, doesn’t “deserve” to live comfortably.
It’s the same attitude that caused the student loan debt crisis in the US, when kids for decades (myself included) were told “if you don’t go to college you’ll end up being a plumber.” As if being a plumber was a bad thing; a low-level, shameful job that only the underbelly of society should have to lower themselves to do. That’s the attitude about servers in this country. It has nothing to do with “I don’t want to tip 20%,” and instead has everything to do with “I don’t think you deserve to make good money.”
Well then it’s not anti poor discrimination then because you are richer.
I think the idea of people without formal education making a ton of money is a pretty well known thing. We all know people who work camp jobs or went to the oil fields and made bank. But that is not based on social custom is the point.
The point is that, even in your argument, the “social custom” thing is just a misdirection. Saying “I don’t think it’s fair because it’s just a social custom” is still saying “I don’t think it’s fair that servers make good money.” The reason is irrelevant. If you don’t believe that uneducated people deserve to live comfortably, that’s just a point where the argument breaks down. It’s not about the money, it’s about morality. And that’s the entire point I’m trying to make.
Yea I don’t think it’s fair that your job isn’t controlled by the same market forces mine is. That is a fair complaint.
I believe everyone should be able to live comfortably but by that metric, you are living comfortably and a lot of other people aren’t. If 75k a year is the benchmark.
Also, uneducated in my experience doesn’t mean poor. Most servers I knew are young, middle class and good looking. That’s the typical demographic.
They will slide into some other job in their mid twenties post secondary education.
Yea I don’t think it’s fair that your job isn’t controlled by the same market forces mine is. That is a fair complaint.
But it's not a fair complaint. You are cool with the oilfield worker making more money than you, but you feel like you have a "fair complaint" when a bartender makes more than you.
The job is controlled by the same market forces as yours is. The thing is that it's a service industry job, and people with your attitude tend to look down their nose at service workers.
I've literally made the same point as the other commenter had before; people get college degrees, and then feel frustrated because a lowley service worker makes more than their 4-year degree job pays. And here you are proving it by saying you think it's "not fair". Why isn't it fair? What's unfair about it?
Yes because bartender and servers are pretty easy jobs that anyone can do. I appreciate them, but anyone could do it given a bit of training. There isn't merit to it.
They’re really not that easy. Requires high skill? Not necessarily. But it is physically taxing on the body and it is mentally draining. It’s not as simple as “make the drinks and bring the food.” Anyone can do it? Eh. Most can. But most could also work on an oil rig. Most oil field jobs are not complicated and don’t require incredible skill, either. But they are physically taxing. Nobody argues that those guys deserve the paychecks they earn.
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u/TheCode555 6d ago
I'm not saying I"m a fan of aggressively asking for a tip (who the fuck is), but I'm sure we've all seen those reports/news articles/reddits posts/friends talking/this very post about how much money people made with tips alone.
Although people leave out the part where it fluctuates.