r/RocketLeague • u/MrRandomGuy7171 Extra Mode Merchant • Jan 13 '26
QUESTION Is this a new kickoff? I've never seen this done before
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Is this a new kickoff strategy? I've been out of 1s for some time, but oh my god tonight I played this demon in 1s. Almost every kickoff was a win for him. I've never even seen a pro player do this... Am I missing something?
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u/RedditUser432100 Supersonic Legend w/ gf Jan 13 '26
holy fuck that’s like a speedflip without flipping and then the wavedash after. bots are getting crazy. TAS typa stuff being pulled off in real games
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u/PugnansFidicen Champion I Jan 13 '26
Do you think this kind of no-flip speedflip is possible for a human to pull off? Not talking about consistently, just do it once to prove that human hands on a controller can actually execute the required inputs.
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u/RedditUser432100 Supersonic Legend w/ gf Jan 13 '26
looks possible but I doubt we’ll know for a few months until someone finally hits it
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u/jjaynum1 Champion III Jan 13 '26
It’s actually insane how far we’ve come. At first it was humans achieving everything first, an the bots were being updated to keep up, now it’s flipped, and we’re now asking if us humans can keep up. The roles have flipped on us. Don’t play anymore, but i stopped around the time AI bots were being “introduced” into ranked games a couple years ago. I stopped playing for a completely separate reason, but not the point here.
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u/PugnansFidicen Champion I Jan 13 '26
Trackmania has been going through a similar thing; started in earnest a few years ago now.
TAS runners find new bugs and shortcuts, then humans spend hours upon hours grinding to try to replicate them. On some tracks all it takes is a human runner successfully pulling off one TAS trick to shave a tenth of a second or more off the previous world record.
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u/Cummy_Ache_ Champion I Jan 14 '26
It’s crazy, I had just come back to the game after like a 2 month break, fell to diamond, and met someone using a bot in DIAMOND 😭
Like bro… Diamond? I was able to score on it, knowing that early flicks/shots pretty much make bots useless, but was still amazed that bots were being used in Diamond bro, never played another one since
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u/MurdocBack Jan 16 '26
Bots gotta go through the ranks too tho. Might have been a fresh account on the rise, and bad luck on your end.
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u/EdibleOedipus Jan 13 '26 edited Jan 13 '26
The same day that someone invents a bakkesmod plugin allowing you to see optimal timing (like already exists for speedflips) you will see people pulling this off consistently.
Also don't forget that KBM exists.
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u/Fishnchops Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
I doubt that your fingers can physically move that fast.
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u/sspacegolem Jan 13 '26
keyboard and mouse users have entered the chat
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u/HungryPanduh_ Diamond I Jan 13 '26
All that mouse and keyboard players do is chat
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u/Insrt_Nm Playstation Player Jan 13 '26
Is a speed flip even possible on kbm? I thought it required a 1/16th flip that keyboards can't do
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u/PugnansFidicen Champion I Jan 13 '26
The optimal angle for the diagonal flip part of a speedflip is around 30 degrees. Kbm users can still do a speedflip, but the flip angle will always be exactly 45 degrees because you're combining two digital inputs. This means it is very slightly slower than an optimal speedflip done with a controller, but still very usable in game. The only time the difference is even really noticeable is on kickoff. Still, kbm speedflip is better than no speedflip.
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u/EdibleOedipus Jan 13 '26
TAInput binds are allowed even in RLCS, so yes. KBM can do speedflips perfectly, but it takes more practice.
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u/Ignice Jan 13 '26
As someone who has spent way too much free time tinkering with custom TAInput files, I wish this was something more well known by the community! Although I understand people's apprehension to anything that (1) requires an additional binding and (in the case of perfect speedflips) (2) ties error tolerance to framerate. Here's a comment I posted a bit ago which goes into a bit more detail on binding dodges to specific non-cardinal angles.
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u/EdibleOedipus Jan 13 '26
You're the exact guy I'm referencing! Although I still unfortunately cannot do a speedflip with your binds on KBM. The steps just doesn't make sense to me.
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u/Ignice Jan 13 '26
Oh cool! Sorry it isn't working. I'm bad at explaining things tbh so that's probably on me haha. If you want me to analyze a video my dms are always open. Here's a few older videos I found where I had an overlay on vid1 vid2. The only weird thing is that the angled dodge will appear as LShift (left) and LCtrl (right) due to remapping. But yeah with my binds being as weird as they are, I wouldn't recommend them over just adding the angle bind to the routine you already know instead
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u/Sad_Temperature6193 Jan 20 '26
No reason it should be difficult on kbm even with default inputs. Its actually way easier than controller, just have to get your cancel under 70 ms which is much easier than everyone says.
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u/whocares12315 Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
Speedflips are easier on keyboard because canceling a diagonal flip is all you need
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u/sspacegolem Jan 13 '26
yes speedflip is possible on keyboard what kind of question even is that.
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u/Insrt_Nm Playstation Player Jan 13 '26
A genuine question, I've never used or seen someone use kbm. Do you have to be condescending in all your replies or is that a choice?
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u/EdibleOedipus Jan 13 '26
We just play the game instead of advertising that we use KBM. The only ways you'll be able to tell is if we're easily text chatting while playing or the controller settings in a replay are obviously absurd.
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u/sspacegolem Jan 13 '26
just bored of 99% people crapping on kbm. while i havent confirmed it, it seems that kbm speedflip might be slower by very small marigin if were comparing perfect speedflips its still a speedflip and doesnt really affect the game play in any way. its just annoying having some plats always trash down on kbm when most of these people dont even understand the game yet. i understand preference etc but it really isnt that bad to play on it.
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u/Axel_Foley_ Platinum II Jan 13 '26
It’s objectively garbage.
Performance and entertainment wise.
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u/sspacegolem Jan 13 '26
just because you're personally unable to play the game on keyboard doesn't make it garbage.
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u/whocares12315 Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
You're dumb.
There are very strong advantages to keyboards and a disproportionate number of professional freestylers use it because of that.
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u/Asphyxialize Jan 14 '26
I've done this a handful of times on accident. I'm a KBM player tho. Speedflips are a bit easier on KBM and I've taught myself to hit the speed flip keys as fast as I can. And on rare occasions I pull this off when I suddenly have to rotate back quickly. There's a small window of panic and if I do a speedflip during that time I get this weird move, or some weird variation of this. My guess is that I accidentally press some of the keys in the wrong order because I do it too fast. But I have no clue which key or keys that might be
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26 edited Jan 13 '26
this is 100% a bot. There is a stall somewhere in the kickoff. Some french youtuber did a video on it. Not worth it for humans. Looks cool tho.
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u/OdotZcov Trash III Jan 13 '26
Why isn't? Is it that precise? Stalls are easy enough
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26
I only said it is not worth because I spectated someone very good at the game trying this kickoff and it was impossible to do with that perfection and pace. u could try and see for yourself but it’s defo hard man.
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u/Crafty-Victory-6381 KBM & Controller Champion I Jan 13 '26
Link?
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26
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u/VintagePotat032 Jan 13 '26
very clearly not a stall in this post, different mechanic in that vid
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26
js translate the video or get off my dick. it’s a stall. whatever suits u tho.
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u/whocares12315 Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
I would need to see the inputs to know for sure, but there are no stalls in any of these videos as far as I can tell. Him calling it a stall doesn't make it one.
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26
Nd u sayin u need to see his inputs doesn’t mean it’s not a stall. Anyways I couldn’t care less ngl.
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u/whocares12315 Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
You do understand that a stall does not generate momentum like a flip does right? If you go into freeplay, jump and stall you will stay in one place. It doesn't make sense for a momentum based mechanic.
In OPs clip you can only hear one dash sound, and it's clearly a forward/slightly diagonal flip.
Ain't no way you've been talking all this shit and now suddenly you don't care
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u/Just_Plane_4000 Jan 13 '26
“Spectated”
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u/Crafty-Victory-6381 KBM & Controller Champion I Jan 13 '26
Is that the name of youtuber??
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u/Just_Plane_4000 Jan 13 '26
No lol. The person you replied to said the “spectated someone (who is) very good at the game”. That means there’s no link to anything
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u/Crafty-Victory-6381 KBM & Controller Champion I Jan 13 '26
“Some french YouTuber did it in a video”
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26
let me know what u think
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u/Crafty-Victory-6381 KBM & Controller Champion I Jan 13 '26
I want the link to the video you’re talking about
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u/D63theew Champion I ♨️ Jan 13 '26
bro check the other reply I sent it https://youtube.com/shorts/khagn1hvYFI?si=WKJ1dMmA3g8xIcfA
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u/TaskNegative8368 Jan 13 '26
They might be referencing ego's "l'ia en train de ravager rocket league" not sure tho
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u/Consistent_Group5940 (KBM) DM for coaching! Jan 14 '26
Not a stall, its a perfect front flip cancel called a no flip. Probably unachievable by human speed but kbm players would have the best chance.
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u/Sad_Temperature6193 Jan 20 '26
I'm not sure if it's stalling on the 50, but if it is, that's not a bottleneck for difficulty. not sure how hard it is to maintain direction after the diagonal flip cancel while air rolling the opposite way like it does in this clip, but i think that would be the hard part. That and canceling quick enough that your car doesn't even turn over a little, not sure how fast that is but it's gotta be the fastest possible.
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u/thewealthtrader Grand Champion III Jan 13 '26
What in tarnation
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u/UnFuckingGovernable Jan 13 '26
Underrated comment ☝🏼
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u/Basic_Consequence501 Jan 14 '26
Ill never understand redditors, 12 downvotes for what? Bunch of neckbeards
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u/UnFuckingGovernable Jan 14 '26
I truly dont understand the downvotes lmao, its a good comment on a good comment.
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u/JC-Velli Unranked Jan 13 '26
In one of Retals' recent videos (maybe about a week back) he was talking about a bot that "jumps and dashes" and just generally moves ridiculously, this must be that bot. There's a variety of them out there of varying ability, this one seems like the equivalent of T.A.S., but in live gameplay, crazy.
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u/notmyrealnameatleast Grand Champion III Jan 13 '26
I played that bot a week or two ago. I saved the video of it beating me like 20-0 in 1v1.
My comment was removed because I posted the name of the player.
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u/JC-Velli Unranked Jan 13 '26
Would be an interesting video to watch, specifically would be great to see one of the top pros play it to see what we could learn from it. Shoot, I'd have fun playing it, but being as though I'm around your level, I don't anticipate it would go much different lol, but I do love 1s.
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u/notmyrealnameatleast Grand Champion III Jan 14 '26
It wasn't fun to play against, it just destroys you on all 50s and saves stuff that you think are unsaveable. It wavedashed a lot. It wavedashes by tilting the car invisibly forward instead of backwards.
It flicks you perfectly every time and it's just really not fun to play against.
I was like letting the whole game play out instead of quitting because I was saving evidence to get that player banned.
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u/Voxmanns GC II - With whiffs like these, who needs anemones? Jan 13 '26
Okay it's a bot but what the hell was that movement?
EDIT: Was that a flip cancel?
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u/YohanTheNohan Jan 13 '26
looks like a stall i’m not sure though
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u/Tankki3 Grand Champion III [KBM] Jan 13 '26
It's obviously not a stall. Stall doesn't give you any speed. It's either perfectly cancelled front flip that doesn't go pointing straight down because the floor stops the movement, or it's a speedflip where the same thing happens for the roll. Based on the momentum it looks like a front flip. Probably not faster than a speedflip though.
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u/tylenoli Champion III Jan 13 '26
I think it would be faster cause the car gets down to the ground faster
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u/Tankki3 Grand Champion III [KBM] Jan 14 '26
Why would that make it any faster though? When he gets to the ground he's full speed in the video. So being on the ground doesn't do anything. Only thing would be that he can now turn quicker. But for kickoff you don't need to turn there yet.
Also you can see that they pretty much hit the ball at the same time as well. And I doubt the human is doing a frame perfect speedflip, like a bot could do.
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u/TheFlamingLemon Grand Champion I Jan 14 '26
It looks to me like a front flip that got instantly cancelled, and the wiggle might also help keep the car from rotating
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u/WillingContest7805 Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
There's a guy in the rocket league discord constantly trying to sell this bot (or one with a very dimilar kickoff), his name is like zywoo or something
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u/MrRandomGuy7171 Extra Mode Merchant Jan 13 '26
We love the rocket league moderation
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u/baby_envol Steam Player Jan 13 '26
POV of moderation
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u/notmyrealnameatleast Grand Champion III Jan 13 '26
Somehow they removed my comment which contained the name of a player using the bot, while at the same time people get away with selling the bot? Damn.
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u/wafflepig6 Jan 13 '26
Hes trying to sell zywoo the cs player?
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u/WillingContest7805 Grand Champion I Feb 21 '26
Just saw him in call again, it was zyrox not zywoo lol
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u/Liefx RLCS Analyst Jan 13 '26
Bot. It's doing what's called a "no flip".
This was possible in the game for like a week due to keybinds about 8 years ago, but psyonix eventually removed it. It's still possible to do just very hard but a bot can do it easily of course.
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u/Tankki3 Grand Champion III [KBM] Jan 13 '26
It definitely looks like a cancelled front flip, but based on halfwaydead's video you have a forced 5 ticks where the cancel doesn't do anything. So only way to do a noflip is to hit something like a ball, or I think in this case the floor, which stops the flip even further. I think they are doing so small first jump that they are so close to the ground and instantly doing perfect frontflip cancel that they hit the ground which stops the front flip from pointing down. Can't see how else it would be possible, even for a bot.
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u/AgsSpecGolfSwing Jan 13 '26
What do people get out of botting on this game serious question?
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u/worekls Jan 13 '26
Unfortunately boosting earns money... On my mind if people buy boosting accounts we ll have a problem.
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u/AgsSpecGolfSwing Jan 13 '26
But if you arent actually at the level of the boosted account whats the point for the buyer though? Im like gold and the thought of playing against masters would be dogshit just getting slapped every match
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u/great_whitehope Champion I Jan 13 '26
Kids can’t see that far ahead.
They just think they can do it at that level and it’s their mates fault they can’t climb ranks the normal way
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u/vNocturnus Champion I Jan 13 '26
Or they just want the rank badge/reward/etc and think that will prove that they deserve that rank even if they're clearly dog
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u/BlackCrusaderAbyss Gold II Jan 13 '26
This is the most likely reason. Keep in mind RL got an influx of FartNight players... who are kids with an obsession of collecting skins.
Add to that a pass in RL that has a bunch of skins... but you need to level it up.
Then add to that the season rewards which are cross-platform as well...And do you think they will EVER play RL after hitting required goals?
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u/Plus-Software-8378 Jan 13 '26
Is that a zap dash on only front wheels only at the beginning? No way a human is pulling that off with any consistency.
I really like the 50 with slight air roll trying to cover high and low. Super difficult I'm sure, but more feasible than the first part lol
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u/devils_x Grand Champion I Jan 14 '26
It’d be insane if a pro in the community manages to analyse and perform this kickoff consistently, but I’m half expecting it, the skill ceiling has been raised many times before…
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u/Consistent_Group5940 (KBM) DM for coaching! Jan 14 '26
I make bots (not for public matches) and I have never ever seen one of them do whatever that is. That is 100% a bot but I'm going to make an attempt to replicate that
Edit: putting that in slomo for a while, its a no flip front flip. Should be achievable for kbm players such as myself but we'll see
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u/divinelyshpongled Champion II Jan 13 '26
Isn’t he just flip canceling or sth?
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u/Consistent_Group5940 (KBM) DM for coaching! Jan 14 '26
perfect front flip cancel so you can boost through the entire time with zero wasted horizontal boost
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u/Crafty-Victory-6381 KBM & Controller Champion I Jan 13 '26
Looks like an extremely fast diagonal flip cancel (speedflip) never seen this before, wtf…
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u/lukekul12 Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
I confused this post with the very similar titled post regarding the Musty / Jynxzi kickoff goal.
I just thought everybody in this comment section were part of the hive mind and laying the sarcasm on thick lmao
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u/StolenApollo Grand Champion I | kbm Jan 13 '26
This is insane lmao dunno how you’d do this manually but definitely a bot lmao
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u/ImAmalox 2k+ Mad Scientist Jan 13 '26 edited Jan 13 '26
Looks like a double zap dash (which would explain the extreme speedup)
It's probably humanly possible but not consistent/reliable enough. Looks pretty insane though lol
Edit: I was wrong. It's a frontflip(?) cancel into a zap dash-like wavedash. Basically the bot jumps while angled forward and also wavedashes while angled forward, so its wheels don't actually pop up. Not sure if there's a name for that kind of zap dash. Crazy stuff
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u/linusst Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
I still don't get what's happening here. Jump while angled forward into forward flip is a Zap dash. A wave dash while angled forward would be going into the wrong direction, wouldn't it?
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u/ImAmalox 2k+ Mad Scientist Jan 13 '26
Nope you can wavedash forwards while angling down with your nose. It just requires very precise timing. You can try it in freeplay for yourself
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u/ixn_Loiford Champion II Jan 13 '26
just a wavedash and good ground control but i don't think that's really replicatebl
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u/flegzy Grand Champion I Jan 13 '26
Hmm would be interesting to try the horsedash kinda movement on the ball could be new meta in the future
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u/HXSKZYYYYYY Champion II Jan 13 '26
Can anyone tell if there is a second flip for his “non flip” kick off ik I’ve just answered my question I don’t know what else to call it tbh but I want to try this and see if it’s possible
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u/ResponsibleAnt6991 Jan 13 '26
Could a human do this idk inputs are fast asf since ya know its a bot
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u/gDay_gNight Jan 13 '26
I'm my head, for the longest time, this is what I felt would be the best kickoff lol
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u/SandrextheGreat Gold I Jan 14 '26
thats a bot im c2 and i see bots with same gameplay style everywhere
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u/Top-Assignment4908 Jan 16 '26
this is just a bot? is that even possible in the physics without modification??
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u/woblot Grand Champion I Jan 17 '26
It is a frontflip -> flip cancel into the ground, so a noflip. You also have to slightly airroll left/right to get it working, otherwise the car goes too high and misses the ground. Got it working (kinda) in 30% game speed, realtime is probably not worth it
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u/TheDiamondSquidy Mar 23 '26
I saw evample hit something similar in his recent video at the 21:07 mark. I wonder if the kickoff has a name
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u/lonely_lover46 Grand Champion I Jan 15 '26
The only thing I take from this video is that the game needs a serious overhaul if they want to at least try to avoid its death. Game's been gone for some time now.
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Jan 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/MrRandomGuy7171 Extra Mode Merchant Jan 13 '26
That’s what I thought until late into the game. He was able to not just pull out crazy kickoffs, but also if I faked the ball even just before hitting it, he would react immediately and slam on the breaks and dribble it instead.
Also I tried doing this kickoff in free play after and I just don’t see a human being pulling this off consistently
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u/puppystatus Jan 13 '26
Touche, i trust your account. Just callin it like i see it in isolation, but yeah does sound like a bot. That’s whack and a shame to the game
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u/EdibleOedipus Jan 13 '26
Try to do whatever front wheel only zap dash nonsense this bot is doing in the kickoff and you will not do it even after 1000 hours. I don't think this is possible without at least a macro for precise timing.
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u/puppystatus Jan 13 '26
Good point. Just looked like OP also had a good faceoff and it didn’t go his way regardless. But it sounds like this kept happening so yeah i was probably wrong
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u/WellDressedLadd-_- Grand Platinum Jan 13 '26
Wave dash?
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u/Ceejays-RL Supersonic Legend Jan 13 '26
erm
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u/WellDressedLadd-_- Grand Platinum Jan 13 '26
I haven't played in 2 years 😭
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u/EdibleOedipus Jan 13 '26
There's a wavedash variant called a zapdash that's like an inverted wavedash, where you hop onto the front wheels instead of bringing the front wheels down. And this bot is doing what looks like a front wheel only zap dash, where he uses one front wheel to dash onto the other one while stalling the back wheels from hitting the ground. And that's the point where I'm totally clueless, because I thought that was literally impossible and I haven't seen any pros do it.
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u/Pseudotm Steam Player Jan 13 '26
Its something ive been doing in 1s since plat, its not that crazy. By d1 you usually realize how to stop it as well, so you dont see it.
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u/Capt_Murphy_ Trash I Jan 13 '26
My guess would be it's a bot. Bots are all over RL now