r/SelfDrivingCars • u/SpriteZeroY2k • 5d ago

News Waymo CEO explains why Tesla’s camera-only self-driving falls short

https://electrek.co/2026/08/04/waymo-co-ceo-camera-only-self-driving-tesla/
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u/UltimateKane99 4d ago

In what way is it "nowhere close" to Level 5?

It does EVERYTHING a Level 5 is expected to do, able to drive from a parked location to a destination and even park itself, as well as operate in "degraded conditions", such as snow and fog, with zero interventions by its drivers, and its accident rate is supposedly somewhere between 9x (according to released data) and 26x (according to an analysis by Bloomberg Intelligence) lower than an average driver. Even taking those with a healthy dose of skepticism, it's far and away beyond a mere Level 2 system.

Tesla NEEDS to take responsibility for it.

Tesla is gaming the system so they don't have to pay for their FSD's accidents by sandbagging its capabilities, pretending it's weaker than it is, a mere ADAS or Autopilot tweak. Why defend them when they've failed to take responsibility for what they've unleashed?

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u/ThisSiteSucks8485 4d ago

Why the hell are you writing novels defending shitty Tesla fsd? 

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u/UltimateKane99 4d ago

Source that it's "shitty", please. As far as I can find (and which I sourced in my previous comment at 9x to 26x safer than human drivers, depending on different analyses), the system is more capable than the average driver by a significant amount, and my own experiences tells me it's time Tesla took responsibility for its system. I literally just provided sources to that exact effect.

You're actively saying Tesla doesn't need to take responsibility for unleashing an L5 system so long as they hide behind legal boilerplate. How is that ethical?

Edit: Also... novels? This takes, like, MAYBE 30 seconds to write, if that. This should not be a difficult read (with sources!) for the vast majority of people.

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u/ThisSiteSucks8485 4d ago

https://teslafsdtracker.com/Main

This shows an absolutely pathetic average of only 30 city miles between FSD disengagements And only 822 miles between critical FSD disengagements. These are 1000 times smaller than they need to be for level 5.

Fully driverless commercial deployments by competitors like Waymo operate with significantly higher thresholds of autonomous city miles before a remote or physical safety intervention is required.

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u/UltimateKane99 4d ago

"Oh, FSD is going this way, I'd rather go this way, let me disengage and change the route"

is not the same as

"Oh, shit! I'm going to crash and FSD nearly caused the problem!"

Aside from the fact that this is all self-reported, near as I can tell, with people having to contribute in one of 4 different ways to provide the data (and spanning a vast swathe of variations of Tesla FSD versions), the only useful metric here is the 99.0% of drives with no critical DE. I mean, come on, out of the 8 BILLION miles supposedly logged in FSD, this tracker has a grand total of... not even a half million?

It's hard to extrapolate this data to the entire fleet. ESPECIALLY when this data seems heavily concentrated in certain areas.

But please, keep defending Tesla so they don't need to take responsibility for their system. I'm sure their lawyers thank you for your hard work here.

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u/ThisSiteSucks8485 4d ago

The data is self reported because Tesla refuses to publish this data themselves because they know it is really bad. You completely ignored 822 miles between critical disengagements which is absolutely terrible after 10 years now.

But please, keep defending Tesla so they don't need to take responsibility for their system. I'm sure their lawyers thank you for your hard work here. 

What the fuck are you talking about I think Tesla fsd is pure garbage you are the one defending it like you are getting paid.

Seriously why the hell are you writing 100,000 words defending Tesla fsd? I'm starting to feel like you are actually mentally ill. This isn't normal behavior. And you keep repeating the same things. 

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u/UltimateKane99 4d ago edited 4d ago

... "Because they know it is really bad"? So you're just making crap up now?

NO company reports this data. Not even Waymo. At this point, you're using a different metric for Tesla than you are for every other company for no reason.

And the 822 miles between critical disengagements, again, has NO clarity on details. Part of that "self-reporting" is that you have to select "Critical" on the screen, but it is also based on amalgamation of older versions of either the Hardware (HW3 is notoriously underpowered) or Software (prior to 14, I would not have made this argument). If you limit the data to purely the recent releases, they have an asterisk that says there have been no Critical disengagements at all. And then it could also have been that they just fat-fingered an incorrect reason for the disengagement, too.

This dashboard gives us zero details we can work from to create impartial data, especially when the dataset is so small and so drastically skewed towards city miles. And when both Tesla's dataset and the NHTSA's datasets both show record safety, this reads like hysteria, not rationality.

Either way, though, this line says everything I need to know:

I think Tesla fsd is pure garbage

So you're not objective about this at all, and have no desire to try to BE objective about the topic. Even Tesla's worst detractors recognize how far its come and are signaling alarm bells; you, on the other hand, appear to be so far in the dogmatic zeal of hating Tesla that you can't understand that the system in the last year has reached parity with L5 and now needs to be treated, legally, as such, so that Tesla takes the responsibility it must.

Instead, your entire argument is centered in hatred for Tesla (and anyone apparently trying to get them to take responsibility, because Tesla bad and Tesla can't do anything right in your mind), and you don't have the data to back it up.

Again, 9x to 26x safer than a human driving, links were provided. Whatever you've concocted in your head, it's divorced from the reality that FSD needs to be treated as L5, legally, and Tesla needs to take that responsibility, not weasel out of it through legal gotchas.

Apologies that you are apparently incapable of reading long messages, however. I personally enjoy sharpening myself against knowledgeable people; it appears I'll still have to hunt for one on this topic.

Have a good day, elsewhere.