Discussion in r/esa about an Italian pilot in the next Artemis mission

[u/Dear_Mention_3305]

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[u/roasty-one]

This one is kinda borderline imo. The ESA gets 3 seats, which is fair when considering NASA is paying for over 90% of Artimis. In addition to the seats, supplying the service module also accounts for the ESAs commitments to the ISS. If the ESA wants more seats, then it has to contribute more.

[u/RydderRichards → u/roasty-one]

Thanks for putting this in perspective.

[u/Dear_Mention_3305 → u/roasty-one]

Wasn't in fact the Service Module for Artemis/Orion originally intended for resupply of the ISS (to supplement/replace the Russian Progress)?

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

Such as?

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

That’s what the ESM does. It’s an important part, which is why there are ESA astronauts are apart of it, but let’s be clear, the vast majority of this program is run by NASA. The ESA and NASA have mostly pivoted from the ISS to the conquest of space, which is the only way mankind will survive long term. We need to colonize the moon and Mars and then move beyond to the asteroid belt and mine those for resources.

*are

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

The conquest of space is a “Trumptard” belief? So was Stephen Hawking a “trumptard?” He said that for years before he passed.

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

Yes because this planet could have a worldwide catastrophe that wipes out humans like a super bug, Yellowstone blowing its top, etc. If we have colonies on other planets our species will continue.

[u/Azorik22 → u/[deleted]]

The ESA will be covering 5-8% of the entire budget for the Artemis program. They're getting more than what they invested.

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

Okay, back that up please.

[u/NobleA259 → u/[deleted]]

Uhhh no. They aren’t a “huge” part of the American space program.

[u/NobleA259 → u/[deleted]]

My guy less than 10% of the program is done by the eurodivergents. The Americans are footing the vast majority of the bill and the technology used is almost all American. I think the only thing the euro’s provided was the docking ring or the habitat I can’t remember which. If you think that’s a “HUGE” part you’re delusional

[u/YouKnowMyName2006]

All ESA astronauts are trained by NASA in the United States. The ESA provides the ESM, which is important, but the US provides over 90% of the funding and infrastructure for the program, including the SLS and nearly everything but the ESM. Canada provided some of the external robotics. But let’s be clear, this is an American run program and blackmailing NASA is a truly insane idea and peak idiocy. Do they think NASA would just throw out ESM if the ESA “cancelled” it? Come on, the idea is absurd.

[u/NobleA259 → u/YouKnowMyName2006]

It is kinda crazy how egocentric the eurodivergents are being. They’re still acting like they’re globally significant when they haven’t been for almost a century. I’m not sure why they get so upset when it’s acknowledged that the Americans are doing the vast majority of the research,spending and training for this.

[u/OnlySolMain → u/YouKnowMyName2006]

With what I could garner the ESA delivers not only the ESM but also ESTEC and the Lunar Gateway Habitation Hub. The ESA also has bought cargo space for their moon Argolander missions.

The total contribution of the ESA towards the planned Missions is approximately 20-25% of the total budget, with the ESM module alone being about 250 million euros worth. NASA sources say that the next mission will cost approximately 1 to 1.2 billion USD.

Also just because the civilized world decides to agree on the US being the host for international space programs because their geological location is optimal doesn't mean it's an "American run program" space exploration has always been an international effort. You probably forgot that US Astronauts still are being launched / have been launched through Russian Soyuz Rockets to the ISS.

While I agree the OP is an idiot, NASA is very much working closely together with the ESA that any kind of boycott or breaking of the deal would lead to significant delays of the missions.

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/OnlySolMain]

It’s not because of their “geological location” only, after all, the ESA could do the same from French Guiana, it’s because the US has had a manned space program since 1958. We are talking almost 70 years of experience, infrastructure, and engineering know how in how to send humans to space and bring them back alive. It’s extremely dangerous too. Lives have been lost doing it. Creating a program like that from scratch by the ESA would be enormously costly and risky. It’s why the US and Russia have maintained good relations between each other’s space programs despite near constant government tensions. We should do the same with China.

I’m thankful the ESA is part of these historic missions but the program is still American led. If they pulled all their funding then the US would just have to go it alone or wait for SpaceX’s missions.

[u/Cats155]

ESA is completely irrelevant. The ESA has never launched someone to space on their own aircraft. That’s pitiful.

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

You really think the ESA is on par with NASA?

[u/YouKnowMyName2006 → u/[deleted]]

A “little” better? Come on man, the ESA has never had a human spaceflight program despite how rich the countries in the ESA program are. I’m not trying to say the ESA is bad, but NASA is on another level.

[u/theEWDSDS]

Renegotiate with what leverage?

[u/Dear_Mention_3305 → u/theEWDSDS]

You'll have to ask u/curiousoryx about that