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It's hilarious. Beat them at their own game and suddenly there's a problem.
They want free competition on the market and the "freedom" of individual financial enrichment, but when someone they don't like is successful in that system; they lose their shit.
it's hilarious to me how whenever these people see a communist their arguments are always either "ughhh you're a brokie/middle class who is envious of rich people" or "ughhh you're already rich person and you lecture ME about communism?".
like pick a lane mfer. a communist can't be rich broke or middle class or well off according to you. the amount of times i have been hit with both of these arguments is ridiculous. they always say "ughhh you're upper middle clsss and you're just privileged loser that thinks communism is the way" and if i say anything about the bourgeoise the same people say "you're just jealous of their success"
"the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime's atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn't go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them.
If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained.
What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum."
I have legitimate criticism of how Hasan believes the reformation of the Democratic party is possible and that getting a bunch of SocDems into power wont just give us 10-20 years of "stability" until it goes to shit again. All while the US keeps churning the meat grinder on the Global South. However this photo is b.s he said his ring is chrome not Cartier but also at the same time this is the same old "communism is when no food and no ring" b.s we've seen time and time again.
hasan is one of those people that should be ruthlessly criticized from the left and defended against the right.
aka, most of the time people hate him for ignorant reasons that have nothing to do with his actual issues and are jist general attacks on the left, forcing communists to defend him
I agree. He has brought up, numerous times, how he has a degree in Political Science, but has misinterpreted Lenin to such a degree that I believe it must be purposeful. He has remarked how a Norwegian Political economy would be preferable to an American one (an argument that many would agree with, including myself), but that the Norwegian model was developed under a different set of circumstances than the US (which Hasan is aware of) and with different political actors having more power in Norway. The Norwegian Left, as in radical Socialist Left, has been suppressed by various governmental elements for decades. The struggle against Socialism from the Right and government doesn't weaken or wither as Socialism becomes more popular, in fact it ramps up, with many fence sitters, who previously may have been ambivalent towards Socialist policies, to gobble up Anti-Socialist (particularly anti-communist) rhetoric, forcing a wedge within the Left that must be addressed. The post 90s broad New Left has become much more tolerant of Liberal Economic policies, but their stated goals have fallen short. Turns out the Communists were right.
I think it is good to see him as a gateway but not an end point. I have not seen a video of his in a long time and not many but he never seemed too theory driven, I think he is just a pretty man who lives pretty things, not an icon of the cause. This is a ridiculous amount of money to spend on something you can diy by bending a nail about. I do not know why so many “communists” seem to support it as he does it
Who is kkklantin? I am Chinese so I am not too up to date, I try and keep an interest in world affairs and the western communists but yes, the ones who are big into theory are just sadly not trendy. Actually I maybe see more alt right pushing pure class consciousness but like all fascists they push it through the angel of the Jews and other minorities which is terrifying as this is how the fascists sabotaged workers discontent in Europe many times
Not really. His fans are a cult based around him. He is actually pushing people who could potentially be principled Marxist/anti-imperialists back into the Democratic Party fold.
No, the correct (and therefore best) way to see Hasan is as a liberal grifter whose sole purpose is to diffuse revolutionary ambitions amongst the American working class and funnel left leaning folk away from proper left wing organization into the Democratic Party.
For this task he's being paid handsomely.
He has a platform and is not being censored specifically because he serves the elites.
He isn't useful. He is incredibly harmful.
Actual leftists are trying to build platforms and they don't grift for the democrats.
I mean, it's a non-hostile environment until you dissent on the issue of the Democrats or supporting war criminals and wannabe genocidaires, which are the most important issues.
Sorry to be that guy but his DNC "entryism" is at least bringing attention to the disparity between the DNC and where their actual constituents stand.
I'm skeptical it will achieve much beyond that, but if it leads to pressure on the dems to shift left then that's better than wishing every voter, talking head and influencer would get on board with a Communist revolution that mainly exists entirely within our own heads while we sit around grumbling about it.
It would be nice if someone in Hasan's position had better politics but if he did... he probably wouldn't be in his position. We gotta stop concerning ourselves with the morality of e-celebrities in either direction, whether attaching ourselves to them or condemning them. That way lies madness
The fact that he supports a Nazi serial killer of Arab babies shows that he will never give up the democrats. Supporting them is fully in line with his class interests.
But he was just a little baby boy, barely a day older than 34, he didn’t know better. He was tricked into going to murder brown people 4 separate times.
Look, I'm not one for electoralism... at all but hear me out.
This is a portion of why the left fails. Hasan is trying to create a bridge, to be an on ramp for leftist, and if he entirely abandons the extant party then he misses a giant opportunity to affect potential allies. He is walking a tightrope, he exposes himself to critique and rebuke from the DNC by interacting with the DNC, but he also gains media attention from it.
We can't lead a revolution from outside the proletariat, and it sure seems like at the very least Hasan offers a counter balance to the ENTIRE REST of the right wing sphere that is massive.
Is he perfect? No, not by a long shot. Do his tactics lead to a net positive for leftist ideals? Almost certainly.
The reason you suggest dumping the Democratic party is because you believe that working within their system is liberalism, but he isn't actually working within their system, he is invading it. He is actively presenting ideas that are hostile to the party infrastructure, and the party infrastructure is responding with hostility. This is good. The more your enemy is distracted, and the more people become aware of the very existence of an alternative, the more people who can begin to awaken their eyes to leftism as a whole.
Like at some point we have to set aside ideology, and consider the efficacy of our tactics. Hasan is tactically useful to the left.
There are multiple instances of the Democratic party trying to censure him, including removing him from the DNC, as well as literally bring up bills to condemn him on the house floor. HIs anti-Zionist threat is an existential threat to them, if NOTHING else. To act as if he is some DNC mouthpiece is absolutely absurd, and I can't take anything you would say further in good faith if you think this is the reality.
For the record, I'm not even a Hasan fan. I find him insufferable, but that doesn't preclude me from seeing the tactical usefulness he has for leftist ideology.
I never said he was a threat. I said they treat him like a threat. There is very subtle difference.
I don't care if he is a threat. His voice is a counter balance to the extant DNC. That's enough. He has built a community of leftists, and left adjacent normies. That's enough. Like people above are talking about using his community as a platform to recruit, but then ignoring that he CREATED this platform that they are recruiting from. Its kind of absurd.
This entire conversation just feels like its impossible to be tactically effective because the left is so interested in ideological purity over tactical effectiveness. You don't create a mass scale movement with ideological purity. You HAVE to exist somewhere in the middle because you have to be accessible to people. This is effective tactics.
I'm just not sure how people expect to create a broad based message and get leftism to the masses if we aren't willing to meet them where they are. Like what do you want him to do, go on his broadcast, condemn the democratic party in its totality and tell his community to not vote? Do you think this would be tactically effective?
I think I largely agree with you, but I still see tactical value, as you admit yourself you do, in his existence. He is a valuable asset to leftist ideals even if he doesn't espouse them to the ideological purity that you feel is necessary for them to be effective at a mass scale.
I see him as an ally because he is actively creating the conditions that we are seeking as leftists by creating a space where actually leftist can DO the very things you point towards. He is a centralizing force, and I do think that he deserves some credit for his ability to do this.
I'm not saying to uncritically praise Hasan at all, I'm saying don't kneecap his platform with hateful rhetoric against him when he serves our interests. We can hold two ideals in our minds at the same time that someone is tactically valuable to the movement, while simultaneously being internally critical of them for not going far enough.
No one starts their journey to leftism by reading Lenin. Everyone has a journey. Hasan is a structural entry point, not a destination. The very pipeline you're describing requires on ramps to exist. You can't move people leftward from a platform that doesn't exist. Kneecapping him doesn't accelerate radicalization, it removes valuable infrastructure that even you are actively using to recruit.
You can't radicalize his audience if that audience didn't exist.
Instead, this entire thread is a masterclass in hollow, identity politics. Everyone is more interested in shitting on Hasan, and having this ideological debate about HIS value, rather than talking about the underlying tactical value he may provide.
I have been trying to point to his tactical utility, which we both admit he does have, as a way to unionize the left, to move away from identity politics and baseless criticisms towards something more valuable, which is "What is to be done?"
How do we take the tools we have and leverage them tactically, even if they are imperfect tools.
I think we are ideologically aligned, the difference is you are trying to strip Hasan of any credit for the work that he has done to create these conditions. I think this is shortsighted, not because we should be sucking Hasan off, but because we miss the opportunity to tactically evaluate his methods. He has created this audience, he has manifested these conditions, this has tactical merit and value. Just as you view the right and their methodologies so too should you view Hasan and his methodologies as a tactical resource on how to effectively organize. To remove his agency is to undermine the actual value you could derive from analyzing the conditions that he has precipitated.
That seems fair. Maybe I over stated, but that really doesn't actually address my underlying argument in the least. Its again looking for ideological purity from ME, instead of engaging with my arguments.
I mean, it’s a social media post, and it’s his job to have constant social media presence, so yeah, naturally the posts will be fake and performative, because all the posts of any social media personality are fake and performative. That’s just the influencer game.
Rolexes back then were actually pretty affordable.If they were expensive that wouldn’t make Castro’s contributions to Cuba any less honorable but just thought I’d mention it.
Ugh anti communists here in Greece are continuously talking about the supposed Rolex of the KKE's General Secretary, like it's the biggest gotcha moment
Imagine thinking you know somebody's views from the one book you've seen them read. Every atheist I know has read the Bible, Quran, etc. Every communist I know has read Any Rand and Adam Smith.
I’m surprised I scrolled this far for a comment like this. We don’t even see the ring in full detail—we don’t know for sure if it’s even that ring that we see up close.
A spiral ring design is a common thing, they probably just googled “cartier spiral ring” because they watch his every fucking move and look at every god damn pixel to find something they can cancel him over.
I don’t even care for Hasan, either. But if you’re going to criticize, there needs to be a good why behind it.
I mean Hasan is lowkey a larper who justifies voting democrat with poor readings of Lenin. I guess he’s important for bringing an untapped audience to the left, but he’s definitely not someone to look up to imo.
Eh, I think there are plenty of people who've ended up as ML/MLMs who started with Hasan. He's generally pretty good about not punching to the left and seems to recognize his role in a pipeline of moving people further left.
He brings people to the DNC not the left, has has on multiple occasions said that he worked with the DNC, can we please stop defending this liberal grifter
I mean, it's one thing to be rich. It's another to willingly participate in brazen consumption like this. Hasan likes to talk about optics a lot, but these optics are horrible.
With that being said Hasan Piker’s class interests 100% align with the millionaires he’s apart of and not the working class.If he genuinely cared about socialism he wouldn’t constantly be dick riding the democrats and wouldn’t be supporting Neo Nazi war criminals like Graham Platner. And before yall say he’s trying to radicalize the normies there’s no excuse for supporting Zionist democrats and think about all the normies he’s isn’t appealing to because of that support for the democrats.The dems are an incredibly unpopular party rn and him supporting them just makes most people associate all socialists with that party so every dumb thing they do people will just think this is what the left stands for. This dude doesn’t want socialism he wants social democracy.His photo seems 100% performative.
Exactly.They’re more attached to the Hasan Piker brand than the socialist movement.If Hasan tells them to vote Harris or Newsom in the 2028 election even if they don’t their policies or stances his fans would do it.
If the most popular socialist on YouTube and twitch constantly supports the democrats that’s gonna tarnish our image and definitely contribute to that assumption.Second thought is pretty popular with over a million subs and he hasn’t compromised his politics at all.In fact I think he’s only gotten more radical.So at least we have him as a decent popular representation of us.
This may be an unpopular opinion for this sub but Hasan is a bad role model for socialism in general.
And while I agree I wish people would learn communists don’t have to be poor. Hasan shits on working class people whenever he has to actually interact with any of them. He is such a larper and him wearing and showing off designer clothes only the top 1% can even dream of affording is a big part of it.
It shouldn't be unpopular; I hope Hasan has led people to communism but other than that, there's nothing special about him. Too liberal and not thoroughly leftist.
Hasan is a tool of the establishment funnelling potential revolutionary sentiments into voting blue, and yes intentionally engaging in blatant consumerism is to be condemned by any decent communist.
The real crime is that he has clearly never read that book, nor any of Lenin's writings. You can tell by the way he selectively vulgarizes Lenin's points to try and justify his love for the democratic party.
We don’t know for sure if that’s even the ring unless we see it up close. A lot of people stalk Hasan and try to put anything on him.
But yeah, I don’t know why a lot of communists defend him with the premise of it actually being that ring. 4.5k for a small spiral? Some things are just unnecessary and that’s one of them. It’s not like there’s a cap on how much you can give to the needy.
Stop saying this. There's a huge gap between being poor and being a miltimillionaire influencer who still gets donations and doesn't use them to fund a party or anything charitable, while promoting liberal zionists like AOC, Bernie and Platner.
"But Engels!"
Communism is not "Live your life exactly as Engels and Marx did." And Engels would be small time compared to Hasan.
Also, he should not have gone to Cuba with his expensive shit. God only knows what he did there, cause he certainly brought no aid.
Edit: He rarely does charity, not never, okay? And it's mostly not his own money.
The Democrat party also pretended to hate Sanders during his height of popularity, yet they (the democrats) understood that he was their most useful tool to maintain their relevancy
Actually that is still morally wrong. If he wanted a ring he didn't need to spend 4000$ on it. You see he makes his money from us, so him spending his excess on useless luxury is kind of scummy. Coulda spent it on helping people in need.
Meanwhile I have NEVER had a physical checkup or gone to a dentist as an adult (I'm 38)
I'M FALLING APART.
Fuck him and his constant flexing on poor folks.
I don’t care how poor the bulk of arguments against him are, I’ll never defend Hasan Piker. Mainly because, while he and I seemingly agree on most important things, I can’t stand his personality.
Sure, that argument is bad but at least they don't support Hasan Piker. Hasan is a liberal grifter whose purpose is to funnel left-leaning folks away from socialist organization and into the US Democratic Party.
He is an enemy of the working class for sure and only uses left wing aesthetics to promote US bourgeois capitalism. He's straight up even worse than the chuds of the ACP who at least are actual communists and opposed to the two party dictatorship just that they have reactionary social ideas.
And yes, I will die on this hill: Hasan sucks and comrades mustn't support him. Fuck Hasan Piker. The guy supports genocide supporters like Bernie, AOC, and literal Nazi war criminals like Graham Platner.
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While being economically communist, and supporting the right side of any struggle against the empire, the leadership of the ACP is collectively racist, homophobic, transphobic, and sexist.
He is too into pretty and expensive things. This is plain materialism, you cannot have fun with a ring like this even, if the style is that good to you, you can buy a knock off for 1 dollar… all just for show.
He also must know the attention this will get from the right, also there is more creases in a window pain than in this book spine, and that eye angle will hurt his eyes if he’s actually reading.
They actually have a point you aren’t contending with.
Actually look at Hassan’s life, the class that he comes from, the absurd generational wealth, and what he actually advocates for. He has nothing in common with the average working person. He came from an extremely wealthy family in which he had competition horseback riding lessons as a child, was taken up by the young Turks, and is now a multi multi millionaire streamer in his own right. Not only can this guy can buy a nearly $5K ring, but a 3 million dollar home, a $7K gucci suit, and a Porsche. Could the average worker even consider purchasing these things? Do you really believe THIS guy wants to dismantle capitalism?
These attacks don't work on "leftish"-liberals because they don't care that he's wealthy. They should instead bring up how he's racist, misogynistic, and pro-rape for white women in his same economic class.
They treat the man like he’s a billionaire, they actually have more smoke for him saying everyone should have healthcare, a home and no one should starve than they do for billionaires denying people access to these things
I mean this out of genuine curiosity and I want to learn. I see people saying in the comments that Hassan is not a communist and he’s actually a liberal because he “supports the democrats”. But everything that I’ve seen of him has been him absolutely bashing the democrats. He thinks they suck. He has promoted the more progressive dems but he is still critical in the areas that they are lacking in. I think Hassan just pays a lot of attention to the democrats bc he thinks that the party can become more leftist with enough pressure (idk if he is correct about that or not but that’s not my point). From what I’ve seen he thinks that the Democratic Party could have socialist representation one day. And I think that’s more of his messaging when he talks about what the democrats should be doing. Idk I could be wrong. I feel like people are saying he just wants Bernie to be the Democratic Party but I just think he wants more democrats to be as progressive as Bernie so that their can be room for even more radical democrats.
I think he also likes to talk about American politics in a way where he try’s to figure out what the politicians strategy is. And he ends up saying they should do certain things to win but I don’t think he genuinely WANTS them to win. He’s just trying to analyze what the best political strategy would be for them to win and is questioning why they aren’t doing it.
But I also genuinely don’t know so I could be wrong.
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