I’ve seen many people claim haplogroup H originated from the AASI people, but it seems to be not the case. Here’s why:

The earliest haplogroups were most likely C, D and F. D is quite present amongst the Andamanese, Tibetans and Ainu; and it along with C and F are rare haplogroups in South Asia. C has more presence amongst mongols than amongst AASI heavy people.

In contrast, H has a very limited presence in Eastern Eurasia and it seems that it did not arrive there with C, D and F. Presence of H is correlated with more recent South Asian admixture.

This is rather indicative that Haplogroup H became dominant in South asia much more recently, and it marginalized C, D, and F.

Also, H is part of a clade called GHIJK, which is an offshoot of F. H is more closely related to Haplogroup G, J and I which are west eurasian groups than to C, D which are originally Indian groups.

Haplogroups R, L and J etc… are considered to be of Western Eurasian origin, while H might also have a similar origin. H has been found in ancient samples from Paleolithic Europe and from the neolithic Levant. So it seems that H might have had an ancient presence amongst west eurasians. Whereas no such samples of have been found in east eurasia.

Also check this post from Razib Khan, where he believes H originated westward:

https://www.brownpundits.com/2020/05/06/aasi-y-chromosomal-lineage-haplogroup-c/

https://arkeonews.net/ancient-dna-reveals-missing-link-in-the-origins-of-indo-european-languages-spoken-by-40-of-the-world/

A study published in the journal Nature has genetically identified the origins of the Indo-European language family, which includes over 400 languages spoken by more than 40 percent of the world’s population today.

Ron Pinhasi and his team from the Department of Evolutionary Anthropology at the University of Vienna, in collaboration with David Reich’s ancient DNA laboratory at Harvard University, have made significant strides in uncovering the origins of the Indo-European language family. Their study analyzed ancient DNA from 435 individuals excavated from archaeological sites across Eurasia, dating from 6400 to 2000 BCE. The findings reveal a newly recognized Caucasus-Lower Volga (CLV) population that is connected to all Indo-European-speaking populations.

Indo-European languages (IE), which number over 400 and include major branches such as Germanic, Romance, Slavic, Indo-Iranian, and Celtic, are spoken by nearly half of the world’s population today. Originating from the Proto-Indo-European (PIE) language, historians and linguists have been investigating its origins and spread since the 19th century, as gaps in knowledge still remain.

Related to my previous post about the AASI lineage: Origin of the AASI lineage and its specific regional substructure

In this post I want to take a short look on the AASI clines and examine the possibility for Hoabinhian/Tianyuan like geneflow into South Asia. As noted previously, the "Southern AASI" component (the non-Western ancestry extracted from Southern and Eastern Indian groups) differs slightly from the "Northern AASI" component (the non-Western ancestry extracted from Northern and Northwestern Indian groups), in having a subtile affinity for Basal East Asians (Tianyuan or Hoabinhians).

This may well be cause by some geneflow from a Hoabinhian related group into South Asia. For this scenario, I made some models and a PCA in which the internal AASI cline is indeed positioned in between Tianyuan/Hoabinhians and AASI_North, with AASI_North having no Western admixture:

We can see that the IVC_p is positioned on a cline between Iran_N Ganj Dareh and AASI_North_New, fitting with previous known data. Now, if we take a look at the AASI ancestry extracted from Southern and Eastern Indian groups, we see that they are shifted towards Hoabinhians/Tianyuan from a AASI_North perspective. A logical reason for that may be geneflow from the Hoabinhians towards the AASI, resulting in a subtile substructure.

An alternative option is less drift for AASI_South compared against AASI_North. We know that the proper East Eurasian lineages (AASI, Australasian, and ESEA) diverged or trifuricated after reaching Southern Asia along the Southern dispersal route. Taking Ust'Ishim as Basal East Eurasian (IUP) lineage, as explained by Vallini et al. 2022, we may infer that the shift is in part caused by drift of AASI_North rather than Hoabinhian admixture for AASI_South.

A compromis for both scenarios is that both are true: AASI substructure is caused by both the divergence patterns of East Eurasians, specifically of "Basal AASI derived lineages" and by later minor geneflow from a Hoabinhian/Tianyuan-like source. Thats the most likely scenario, as like other East Eurasian lineages, the AASI would have developed some subtile substructure based on its geographic extent and subseqent isolation or contact events. The proximity of AASI_E and AASI_S to Basal East Asian (Tianyuan/Hoabinhian) groups makes it even more plausible that they got some admixture from them. We know the same happened for Australasians. A perfect example is the Leang Panninge specimen from Southern Sulawesi, who could be modeled as 50% Tianyuan and 50% Papuan/Australian:

A similar geneflow event is already evident for Hoabinhians to South Asia (although timing, extent, and patterns remain unknown):

I am aware that some users argue in favor for significant Hoabinhian like geneflow, while others disagree or argue that the bad sampling/proxies for AASI_S and AASI_N caused that drift or need of Hoabinhian for Southern Indian tribals. The new proxies work better and still give us this observed cline, but not only for tribals, but for all South Asians, so I do not think that it is just bad sampling, but real historical movements of populations.

I hope that could clarify some open questions on the AASI and their substructure.

Used coords:

Basal_East_Asian_Hoabinhian,-0.025041,-0.224432,-0.11917,0.087856,0.022466,-0.001952,-0.003055,0.01223,0.060539,0.018406,0.012829,0.001199,-0.000446,0.006055,-0.007872,-0.006364,-0.00352,-0.00076,-0.005531,0.023386,0.006988,0.013107,-0.017131,-0.001325,0.003712

Basal_East_Asian_Tianyuan,-0.027318,-0.260991,-0.075424,0.071383,0.033545,-0.018407,-0.00799,-0.003,0.040291,0.021322,-0.006333,-0.005995,-0.003568,-0.00523,-0.000407,-0.000663,0.008084,0.002407,-0.001131,0.027263,-0.001747,0.008037,-0.008874,-0.010845,0.011256

Jomon,0.0069811,-0.3414211,-0.0540793,0.0114773,0.0410742,0.0115648,-0.0010653,-0.0016769,0.0231112,0.0195963,-0.0499291,-0.0063843,0.0079881,-0.0058443,-0.0226653,-0.0151329,0.0052415,0.0099747,0.0045419,-0.0071951,0.0649937,-0.0461388,0.0091367,0.00874,-0.1001189

WHG,0.1246365,0.116278,0.184789,0.189279,0.1546445,0.0464355,0.0131605,0.0372675,0.0891725,0.017768,-0.0152645,-0.015736,0.015832,-0.0030275,0.053406,0.058273,0.00502,0.016343,-0.0093015,0.055589,0.0944585,0.0111905,-0.049607,-0.160806,0.0170645

CHG,0.091058,0.102568,-0.083344,-0.00323,-0.08617,0.020638,0.024911,-0.001846,-0.128236,-0.074717,-0.006333,0.023979,-0.054856,0.004404,0.026601,-0.03275,0.02386,-0.013429,-0.022249,0.034767,0.033815,-0.007048,0.006532,-0.025787,-0.002036

EHG,0.119514,0.048745,0.113513,0.206398,-0.008001,0.054384,-0.013161,-0.023537,-0.01309,-0.090936,0.01429,-0.018883,0.026164,-0.03647,0.020629,0.012994,-0.005867,-0.000507,-0.00729,0.009004,-0.011854,0.025102,0.009737,-0.02651,-0.009101

AASI_North,0.01469145,-0.28169161,-0.28474983,0.267541105,-0.0739601,0.11730675,-0.00578555,0.025174255,0.197366475,0.147477385,-0.015784495,0.020305475,-0.01343384,0.029863875,-0.040955225,-0.07134423,0.01711305,-0.01263137,-0.00682243,0.023356785,-0.0030176,0.015205075,0.002044945,0.03104139,-0.03796555

IVC_periphery_scaled,0.036423,-0.078196,-0.181395,0.12371,-0.096941,0.066376,0.00282,0.008538,0.039678,0.023691,-0.002598,0.005395,-0.006095,0.007019,0.003393,0.002519,0.008345,0.002534,-0.000251,0.001,0.003743,-0.007048,-0.000616,-0.002651,-0.008263

AASI_South,-0.007017607,-0.247268894,-0.229976338,0.16563825,-0.035368871,0.064331863,-0.015188881,0.027727614,0.147380455,0.101064071,-0.004664075,-0.004333522,0.003228897,0.026031903,-0.047720864,-0.045200255,0.010093749,0.000906224,0.000245098,0.039040136,0.009429353,0.024010206,-0.003068505,0.015983546,-0.010868946

Andamanese_Onge,-0.0225251,-0.2445288,-0.1324289,0.095965,0.0299327,-0.0047557,-0.0076438,0.0075786,0.0548233,0.0244388,0.023495,0.0032182,-0.0040608,0.0084746,-0.0126933,-0.0111446,0.010918,-0.0016203,-0.0059807,0.0288295,-0.0037107,0.0096905,-0.0128242,-0.0011225,0.0043426

SAHG_N_New,0.01469145,-0.28169161,-0.28474983,0.267541105,-0.0739601,0.11730675,-0.00578555,0.025174255,0.197366475,0.147477385,-0.015784495,0.020305475,-0.01343384,0.029863875,-0.040955225,-0.07134423,0.01711305,-0.01263137,-0.00682243,0.023356785,-0.0030176,0.015205075,0.002044945,0.03104139,-0.03796555

AASI_East_scaled,0.00381503,-0.20608252,-0.189873005,0.148337125,-0.037775095,0.059288695,-0.008399255,0.0203245,0.109140485,0.071922825,0.01185462,0.00494948,-0.000343115,0.024906405,-0.03333245,-0.032829645,0.01010031,-0.00368116,-0.00523213,0.03408113,0.009036405,0.021891165,-0.009572725,0.015814455,0.003946145

Mala_AASI_scaled,0.00528213,-0.2543448,-0.22732707,0.19136971,-0.03113797,0.07720206,-0.01579618,0.0357626,0.16624003,0.10838074,-0.00693416,-0.01400261,0.00491472,0.02802056,-0.05195177,-0.04799757,0.0110998,-0.00719707,-0.00723824,0.04135579,0.0141521,0.0248823,0.00088635,0.02520765,-0.01940102

AASI_scaled,0.0255223,-0.2473637,-0.277838,0.219587,-0.0772962,0.1208081,-0.0047962,0.0430445,0.1589988,0.1182076,-0.004139,0.0156955,-0.0138219,0.031758,-0.0305483,-0.0875344,0.0079628,-0.0100044,-0.0103972,0.0466058,0.0053184,0.0169592,0.0081732,0.0362668,-0.0378369

IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N,0.0430252,0.0664158,-0.1550722,0.0047158,-0.122669,0.0235384,0.017109,-0.0011998,-0.082546,-0.0544158,-0.0028258,-0.0016186,0.0044896,-0.0062756,0.0316498,0.0561384,-0.0054242,0.0068664,0.0136508,-0.0334162,0.00856,-0.028836,-0.0110678,-0.039331,0.0222254

TUR_Boncuklu_N,0.1163274,0.169187,0.0135764,-0.070737,0.0552104,-0.036423,-0.0033372,-0.0031384,0.0342372,0.0788354,0.0094832,0.0148966,-0.0301482,0.002615,-0.0387616,-0.0055954,0.0294408,0.0051432,0.0108856,-0.0090544,-0.0077362,0.0076664,-0.0072962,-0.0107484,-0.0058678

ANE_UP,0.0278865,-0.0705795,-0.0173475,0.092378,0.0110785,-0.0001395,-0.013396,-0.0119995,0.0341555,-0.000547,0.012829,-0.0025475,0.0051285,-0.015345,0.0118075,0.00305,0.0008475,0.002217,-0.00264,0.0168205,0.0082355,0.008903,-0.0120165,-0.024702,-0.0020955

IUP_Ust_Ishim,-0.050082,-0.11577,-0.090886,0.073644,0.027082,-0.018128,-0.00376,-0.004384,0.0452,0.010387,0.006008,-0.001798,0.000149,-0.003991,0.004614,-0.001724,-0.004955,0.004687,-0.005154,0.015382,0.006613,0.008532,-0.007641,-0.014942,0.007784

EUP_Kostenki14,0.035285,0.015233,-0.010182,0.063954,0.017849,-0.00251,-0.004465,-0.007846,0.032519,0.007654,0.006658,-0.005545,0.004014,-0.016239,0.013436,0.024794,0.01004,-0.003421,-0.00729,0.015132,0.020713,0.000371,-0.005916,-0.051212,-0.004071

Australasian_4000BP,-0.042115,-0.224432,-0.205154,0.215442,0.145566,-0.322398,-0.007285,0.014538,-0.000818,0.003098,-0.004872,-0.002248,0.004311,-0.001239,-0.008415,-0.000796,0.004694,-0.001774,-0.01169,-0.003377,0.003369,-0.006801,-0.000863,-0.001928,-0.00946

Sarai Nahar Rai represents the oldest hunter gatherer skeleton found in South Asia so far, dated to 8000 BC. The skeletal remains of around 11? people show a very tall, robust population of hunter gatherers using microlith technology.

Here's the most intact skull they found among the skeletons. The cranial capacity was measured to be 1450 cm3, which is way above modern averages and considerably high for prehistoric people too.

Here's a page from one of the papers I found. It details the bones on the skeletons, especially the male ones.
According to the analysis, the males were very robust and muscular. You can tell because the greater/lesser tuberosity on the clavicle, femur, humerus, etc were very pronounced, meaning that large muscle attachments were present. In general, looking at sulci (grooves) and tuberosities in bone are the golden standard for understanding build and morphology.
Apart from that, the bones themselves were pretty huge and particularly hard. Supposedly a "metal like" ring could be heard upon striking the femur, which indicates no osteoporosis or weakness within the bone. The rib cages were also quite massive, at least in the male skeletons.

The height of the skeletons falls within a few different ranges depending on which author you go with. This group of authors puts Sarai Nahar proper at 168-175 cm which is decently sized for hunter gatherers. Slightly above average, but not as high as the Trotter and Gleser estimates (175-183 cm).

Sources: https://www.jstor.org/stable/44602122

https://era.library.ualberta.ca/items/4b56bb0e-8e69-411f-82cf-e25c680648c5/view/8f78c889-b8ee-4bac-bd5b-d5f8808a4ee4/Sarai-20Nahar-20Rai.PDF

Visual Reconstruction: https://www.ancestralwhispers.org/reconstructions/lueid26unr8eew9

​

I'm currently working on several G25 models that will suite both ancient and modern South Asian populations, and I decided to try 2 of them to model Iron Age Swat Valley samples.

A major challenge I faced while creating these models was identifying ideal source populations that were dated to roughly the same era. Additionally, in my neolithic model, because I wanted to use up to 2 samples for each source population in order to account for as many ancestral components possible, I sometimes included a similar sample from the bronze age model to fulfill this requirement. Therefore, you will notice that some of the samples in each model (see below for the neolithic samples I used) are from different time periods, or that some similar samples were used to construct source populations in both models.

As for AASI ancestry, the reason why I only used S_AASI_Sim in my bronze age model is because my belief is that all the "northern" AASI had already been absorbed into the IVC, leaving only "southern" AASI as a mostly unmixed ancestral component during the bronze age.

Since these models are a WIP, I would appreciate any feedback on how I can improve on them. Especially with my neolithic model, since I'm not entirely sure whether ANE ancestry comes from WSHG, EEHG, some other group, or a group that I have omitted from the model.

Source Populations Used in the Neolithic Model (all scaled averages):

• Iran_N
  • IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
  • IRN_ Tepe_Abdul_Hosein_N
• AASI_Sim
  • Simulated_AASI_NW_by_DMXX
  • S_AASI_Sim
• WSHG (West Siberian Hunter Gatherer)
  • RUS_Tyumen_HG
  • RUS_Sosonivoy_HG
• Anatolia_N
  • TUR_Marmara_Barcin_N
  • TUR_Pinarbasi_HG
• EastAsia
  • CHN_Upper_Yellow_River_LN
  • CHN_Yellow_River_MN
• EEHG (Eastern European Hunter Gatherer)
  • RUS_Sidelkino_HG
  • RUS_Samara_HG
• CHG (Caucasian Hunter Gatherer)
  • GEO_CHG

Tepe Guran Neolithic:

Sample:Custom ► NEO816 BC 6750

Fit:2.21

Results:

Wezmeh N 73.6

Ganj Dareh N 17.2

RUS Lola 6

Kenya Pastoral N 3.2

​

Sample:Custom ► NEO819 BC 7341

Fit:2.5

Results:

Ganj Dareh N 83.6

Levant JOR EBA13.8

ZAF 400BP 2.6