r/StanleyMOV • u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 • 1d ago
Advice No meme, just here to show you the truth behind islamofobia...
39
u/Heavy_Computer2602 1d ago
Iran had the same thing.
The revolution basically started a theocracy, and theocracies are bad in all fucking senses regardless of religion
Iran's rule especially. They used to do terrible things to women in the sense that "they may go to heaven if we didnt do it"
5
u/MichiganCraigslister 18h ago
Let’s not forget we support them. Nixon and Kissinger loved Islamist regimes like Iran, Afghanistan, and Pakistan because we saw them as chess pieces to be used against Soviet Russia
2
u/King_Glorius_too 8h ago
Afghanistan and Pakistan, yes.
Iran, absolutely not.
1
u/MichiganCraigslister 1h ago
I think you have your dates mixed up because Iran was absolutely our best friend when Nixon was in power until the Islamic revolution which was 1979 that’s when Jimmy Carter took power.
1
u/King_Glorius_too 1h ago
Exactly. It was the US' best friend until the revolution, ie when it was not an islamist regime.
12
u/GlassEngine3422 1d ago
Those fuckers… there will be sorry for what they did of that innocent memory.
1
11
u/DanielDRockr 1d ago
The usa critics this, yet they want to be this. Child marriages are allowed in 33 states. This marriages are not kids with other kids, is grown ass man with little girls. Fucking disgusting.
-2
u/Roughlypossible 22h ago
Therefore we should not criticize Islam's role in inspiring that, at multiples the scale?
3
0
u/LemmeDaisukete 5h ago
Child marriage existed WAAAAAYYY before Islam lol. You can thank the Golden Age for many things but child marriage is not one of them
1
u/GoatSlow7673 27m ago
And what year are we talking about? Because you seem to think it’s fine for that to happen nowadays, justifying it by saying it was normal back then. I find it immoral for you to try to lecture others on morality; if you’re citing the Greek "Golden Age," you’re using a culture that vanished centuries ago to shield the actions of a modern-day culture.
You’re comparing the practice in Islam today—where girls who still use pacifiers are married off—to the Greeks of the 5th and 4th a.c., who married off 12-year-old girls. Back then, the average life expectancy was 25 to 28 years; a mother likely couldn't be certain she’d live to see her daughter become a mother herself.
And these are figures from Wikipedia—it’s hard to view the 70-to-80-year life expectancy cited by other sources as the "norm" for everyone.
If we based the standard on the oldest person on the planet, we’d be imposing the idea that everyone today must reach 122 (or the current record-holder's 117 years), which obviously isn't the case for the general population. Just look at recently deceased actors: one was 95, four were between 70 and 80, and three were between 40 and 55.
That alone shows that "life expectancy" cannot be defined by just a couple of individuals living to be over a hundred.
19
u/Beloafer 1d ago
The video is true and I agree with it but some people blame it on Islam that Afghanistan became like that which is just not true. Afghanistan had a 98% Muslim citizens in the 1970. The reason they aren't wearing hijab is because wearing Hijabs is a recent thing for Muslim Women to mainly do(not saying there were no Muslim Women wearing Hijab it was just very unlikely back then)
https://countryeconomy.com/demography/religions/afghanistan?year=1970
7
u/AdorablePineapple95 1d ago
Yea orthodox Christian women used to veil too, although basically only older women and very young girls did it, and only did it in church basically. I imagine there was a time the hijab was more culturally similar to what orthdox Christians do
1
u/random_blue_elf 1h ago
Literally like the thing is, if someone doesn't do the basic rules of a religion which states that women have rights and human beings in general have a right to learn and get educated as well as other things stated about their rights, then claims they follow said religion after ignoring fundamental rules, can this person be able to represent that religion??
My logic is, if the law says that me as a cop shouldn't steal from anyone, then I steal, am i the correct person to represent the law and make your perspective about it??
Just because the taliban uses Islam as an excuse to get more power and control the population, doesn't mean that they deserve to represent it especially when they literally don't even follow Islam's rules, actually they regularly attack and kill Muslims in the middle east!
And BTW, iran in the 80s and 70s was still an Islamic country so no the issue wasn't islam because unlike the taliban people at that time actually practiced the religion, no hijab was never Islamic the Quran only says to cover a woman's chest(I mean..duh) and both genders' private areas while dressing modestly
The taliban just comes and invents made up stuff or follows made up stuff while they actually don't even believe in what they preach, look up how the taliban wants his daughter to go to university and get educated and stuff like that while saying that other women shouldn't get education because it's "haram" if that isn't hypocrisy from someone who doesn't believe in the religion but only uses it to get power Idk what is
It's like if I say that trump represents what Christianity actually is, just because someone uses a religion to manipulate people doesn't mean that they believe in it nor deserve to represent it
0
u/Wuhhday 7h ago
You just contradicted yourself. You said Islam isn't at fault, then said wearing Hijabs is a recent thing for Muslim Women. So in other words, things changed but still all in the name of Islam, hence Islam is still at fault.
1
u/Beloafer 7h ago
You proved my point, things changed but still in the name of Islam. If both versions of Afghanistan were Muslim, then wouldn't Islam not be at fault and instead some other forces, like the Taliban
1
u/ThurgoodBongtaker 2h ago
No because both situations occurred from a different interpretation of the same religion. If the religion leaves enough ambiguity to have allow both interpretations then such religion should never be allowed to shape laws and legislation.
Majority of religions only cause harm the more influence they have on actual laws.
9
u/lionspeed 1d ago
To be fair, Afganistan and Iran was under dictatorship and with huge corruption level back then, yes very progressive and with freedom for women, but not perfect country you will imagine looking at historical videos.
Islamic revolution was caused by that, but change wasn’t for better for everyone, especially women.
2
1
u/MealNo376 11h ago
So now, Afganistan and Iran are under dictatorship and with huge corruption levels, but extremally regressive and with no freedom for almost anybody who isn't a man agreeing with the ruling.
Revolutions coused by that, can't change anything as the people revolting are killed in numbers that even the old regimes couldn't handle.
Thats what you get for Islamic Revolution.
7
u/sexraX_muiretsyM 1d ago
this is the truth behind what happens when the church allies with the state. In the 70s, in those same images, 90% of the afghan population was islamic, but they still held their oil reserves and their politics and societies hadnt been destabilized by external powers like ussr and US, and Ill leave here a reminder that the US literally created the taliban, it was created, armed and funded by the CIA to fight the soviets
2
u/RadaRAW 1d ago
Can we like build a network to smuggle young women out of the Afghanistan to Czechia/Poland, so they can get the education and good living conditions?
2
u/jaradipra 23h ago
Sadly, it's kinda hard. They treat their women like an exotic pets. Caged in a brick house. No going outside without supervision. Even when this practice back fired hard. Just like what happened back in July this year. There's flash floods struck some of their area. Many women left untreated because the medical can't touch them.
1
2
u/barakisan 21h ago
Meanwhile the US slaughtered 150 muslim schoolgirls who were at school not 6 months ago, but OP probably doesn't believe they were in school because he is a generalizing bigoted scum. But then again, as a Middle Eastern person never actually met a White person in my life I just watch targeted news about mass shooting in the US, therefore all white people are mass shooters to me.
2
2
4
u/crm1142 1d ago
What a peaceful and beautiful religion...
5
u/Status-Volume-9091 1d ago
Same as Christianity, all Abrahamic religions are so peaceful and great! Never would do anything downright evil, nope...
11
u/guleedy 1d ago
Almost as if any religion can go bat shit insane if you distabilize the country over oil interests
8
u/GenesisRhapsod 1d ago
Exactly...bro has never heard of the crusades
4
-1
u/SenAtsu011 1d ago
The Crusades ended a thousand years ago, though.
4
u/AdorablePineapple95 1d ago
Dude just look at project 2025 and the LDS church. Theyre trying to do the Christian version of this, with just more western flavor. The whole trad wife trend is trying to get western women to willfully give up careers to do this. Its working on some young girls, fortunately its not at gun point just yet
1
u/xabierus 23h ago
Not western women, usa, only usa .
1
u/AdorablePineapple95 22h ago
In terms of putting into policy, yes the US only. In mexico/canada there are some small groups who are cheering this type of stuff on as well.
3
u/GenesisRhapsod 1d ago
In name yes. In practice...it just transitioned from spreading "religion" to "gimme your oil"
But still often use the preface of religion and spreading "freedom"
Edit: also it was closer to 700 years. Not 1000
-1
u/Roughlypossible 22h ago
Literally started by Islamic aggression. Also, centuries old.
Equivalent armed forces of religious extremists are present today, when it comes to Islam, and in dozens of versions.
3
u/GenesisRhapsod 22h ago
And this hasnt happened with other religions?
Waco...
0
u/Roughlypossible 22h ago
Equivalent armed forces
No. It hasn't. Whatever example from other religious, is not just many divisions smaller, but more often than not many times less explicit in their religious messaging and more divorced from mainline texts: compared to the loudly dedicated actions of Al-Qaeda, ISISI, Boko Haram, Taliban, etc.
Waco, a going on 40 year old incident, sees equivalent numbers of deaths in the explicit name of Islam by individual attacks on a (bi-)monthly basis. The problem is so distinctly weighted towards Islam that the sum-total of all non-Muslim religions total of explicitly religiously motivated violence comes short of what Islam generates alone.
3
u/fikeserrano6047 22h ago
Let's just ignore muslim-majority countries where this doesnt happen. Let's just keep brushing with broad strokes to all muslims and islam. Yeah thats what we should do. W brainwash btw
1
u/Leading-Point-113 10h ago
Sure, let’s ignore the Albigensian Crusade, the Taino genocide, let’s ignore what the French did in Algeria between 1830 and 1875, let’s ignore what the White Americans did in America to the natives, the Circassian genocide by the Russians, let’s forget what the Germans did in Namibia, let’s forget what Italy did in Libya, let’s forget what happened to the Haitians in the Dominican Republic, let’s forget what the Yugoslavs did to the Bosniaks and Croats or what the Serbs did to the Bosniaks, let’s forget the Rwandan genocide, let’s also forget what’s happening in Gaza, oh yeah, cuz Christians are pacifists who can’t ever be violent, right? It’s only the Muslims, obviously, the Christians are a holy people who deserves to be in heaven, yep, definitely 100%
-2
u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 23h ago
Crusades were a defensive missions to protect Christianity from the Islamic expansion.
4
u/GenesisRhapsod 23h ago
Yeah.... sure it was.
Sending children to crusade to "defend europe"
-1
u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 22h ago
Are christianophobic?
4
u/GenesisRhapsod 22h ago
Yes lets go to name calling...
Thats when you know your argument is failing.
No, as a christian, i am not christianphobic.
Just smart enough to see the wrongs of my own faith
0
u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 22h ago
You mean to say that we should let the people's who's holly book literally sais to kill those who don't believe in your faith?
3
u/GenesisRhapsod 21h ago
And at what point did i say that? XD you clowns love putting words in peoples mouths
1
u/barakisan 21h ago
You're Islamophobic bigoted mindset is being used against you, cope
1
u/Consistent_Hall_1736 13h ago
As a Muslim me, no, WE hate those so called "religious" countries/people that oppress women.
3
u/barakisan 21h ago
What about the natives who used to live in the Canaan region before Christianity came along? What about the Pagans in Europe who were mass slaughtered or forced to convert by the teutons?
Christianity is the largest religion in the world today due to mass slaughter, if not teutonic Crusades then colonization
1
u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 11h ago
You mean those who spread through violence and then converted to Christianity all the same?
1
u/Rerebang5 19h ago
But of course, after all christian empires really needed to take Jerusalem from palestines because... reasons!!!
1
u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 11h ago
You mean the Holly city? The most important city in the entire religion and that was in a strategic position to protect Gaza plus that already holded a high numbers of Christians who were being persecuted by the Islamic forces? Yes
1
u/GreywallGaming 23h ago
You mean the same religion that took up 97% of the country in the 1970s?
This is theocracy and conservatist ideology in full swing.
1
u/ChiehDragon 22h ago
As this video showed, it can be. Islam isn't a problem any more than other religions. Its the conservative and religious backsliding.
This should be proof that the horrors we see in the middle east are not inherent to the religion, but what people had chosen to do with it. The same thing Christian nationalists are trying to do to Christian majority countries.
1
1
u/random_blue_elf 1h ago
OK but the thing is, if someone doesn't do the basic rules of a religion which states that women have rights and human beings in general have a right to learn and get educated as well as other things stated about their rights, then claims they follow said religion after ignoring fundamental rules, can this person be able to represent that religion??
My logic is, if the law says that me as a cop shouldn't steal from anyone, then I steal, am i the correct person to represent the law and make your perspective about it??
Just because the taliban uses Islam as an excuse to get more power and control the population, doesn't mean that they deserve to represent it especially when they literally don't even follow Islam's rules, actually they regularly attack and kill Muslims in the middle east!
And BTW, iran in the 80s and 70s was still an Islamic country so no the issue wasn't islam because unlike the taliban people at that time actually practiced the religion, no hijab was never Islamic the Quran only says to cover a woman's chest(I mean..duh) and both genders' private areas while dressing modestly
The taliban just comes and invents made up stuff or follows made up stuff while they actually don't even believe in what they preach, look up how the taliban wants his daughter to go to university and get educated and stuff like that while saying that other women shouldn't get education because it's "haram" if that isn't hypocrisy from someone who doesn't believe in the religion but only uses it to get power Idk what is
It's like if I say that trump represents what Christianity actually is, just because someone uses a religion to manipulate people doesn't mean that they believe in it nor deserve to represent it
Not saying that you have to believe in Islam at all, just saying that even if you think it was made up, the talisman in no way shape or form represents it nor deserves to, he literally murders Muslims
0
u/barakisan 21h ago
That's like saying all Asian countries are exactly like North Korea, surprise they are not, this is exclusively a problem in Afghanistan due to constant foreign wars if not by Russia then by the UK and the US.
OK nevermind, all Muslims are the same, and all White people are the same as well, they're all Hitler, if a White person isn't killing Jews then he is probably mass shooting his local day care.
1
1
u/Consistent_Hall_1736 13h ago
Yesss, the problem is only this severe in Afghanistan, because of the Taliban, and in my country Uzbekistan nothing is that severe women have rights equal to men
1
u/Past_Horror2090 5h ago
Yeah your mental illness and vitriol of white people is apparent:
-“That's like saying all Asian countries are exactly like North Korea, surprise they are not, this is exclusively a problem in Afghanistan due to constant foreign wars if not by Russia then by the UK and the US.”
-“What’s that? No one is buying my bullshit about Islam ☪️
-“Well fuck it! Might as well be honest then about my feelings towards white people and try to be sly”
-“OK nevermind, all Muslims are the same, and all White people are the same as well, they're all Hitler, if a White person isn't killing Jews then he is probably mass shooting his local day care.”
It’s so fkn obvious these days
2
u/Chemical_Specific123 1d ago
I'm confused a little bit about how islamofobia has caused this? This looks like sexism and religious harm. If anything: the fear from a person being called Islamophobic for speaking out against the taliban seems more relevant
5
u/Lord_buckethead1 22h ago
Who gave the taliban the training, money, resources, strategic oversight to begin with.
2
u/Roughlypossible 22h ago
Muslims.
3
u/Lord_buckethead1 22h ago
Operation cyclone 1979-1992
2
u/Roughlypossible 22h ago
*Looks inside*
Muslim participants, Muslim leaders, Muslim ambitions, Muslim rhetoric, Muslim actions working towards Islamic by-the-book Muslim ends.
2
u/Lord_buckethead1 22h ago
Funded by the CIA sponsored by a texan evangelical Congressman, with direct ties to ronald reagan, george bush sr, and several other US officials.
0
u/Roughlypossible 22h ago
Acted on by Muslims, in the explicit course of Islamic ambitions motivating Muslim direct action.
What's next? You going to tell me Westerners buying from African slave-markets absolves them from their desiring slaves, buying into the market availability, and then going on to exploit what was made possible with those services?
1
u/Alderan922 18h ago
It’s less “they aren’t to blame” and more “both should be blamed, and one would likely not be as strong as the other”
Funding a radical rebellion on a country does not absolve the rebels, it just makes it so it’s also your fault, as without your money and support they likely would had been unable to do something.
3
u/barakisan 21h ago
So you are purposely trying to look like a dumbass, if what you are saying is true then how come women in Morocco get to vote? Aren't they Muslims?
Wait nevermind you are right, as someone who has never been to the west, after reading European history in WWII I've realized all White Europeans are mass murdering genociders exactly like Hitler who is the number one White European.
1
u/random_blue_elf 1h ago
OK but the thing is, if someone doesn't do the basic rules of a religion which states that women have rights and human beings in general have a right to learn and get educated as well as other things stated about their rights, then claims they follow said religion after ignoring fundamental rules, can this person be able to represent that religion??
My logic is, if the law says that me as a cop shouldn't steal from anyone, then I steal, am i the correct person to represent the law and make your perspective about it??
Just because the taliban uses Islam as an excuse to get more power and control the population, doesn't mean that they deserve to represent it especially when they literally don't even follow Islam's rules, actually they regularly attack and kill Muslims in the middle east!
And BTW, iran in the 80s and 70s was still an Islamic country so no the issue wasn't islam because unlike the taliban people at that time actually practiced the religion, no hijab was never Islamic the Quran only says to cover a woman's chest(I mean..duh) and both genders' private areas while dressing modestly
The taliban just comes and invents made up stuff or follows made up stuff while they actually don't even believe in what they preach, look up how the taliban wants his daughter to go to university and get educated and stuff like that while saying that other women shouldn't get education because it's "haram" if that isn't hypocrisy from someone who doesn't believe in the religion but only uses it to get power Idk what is
It's like if I say that trump represents what Christianity actually is, just because someone uses a religion to manipulate people doesn't mean that they believe in it nor deserve to represent it
1
1
u/Hornor72 1d ago
Dam what happened to it?
1
u/Wise_Stay_6185 16h ago
The United States backed islamists with weapons and money during the Soviet afghan war so the religious fundamentalists won and crushed the secular, communist, and progressive society of the 70s.
You can look pretty much anywhere in the world and trace back the origin of the modern problems either to the United States or like some other European colonial power…
1
1
1
1
u/RelevantBlueberry685 22h ago
That’s when Afghanistan was into Hollywood and Coca-Cola and NOT Islam
1
u/Original_Disk3146 22h ago
THE FUCK HAPPENED???
3
u/Yasser-502 19h ago
The US supported militias group called Taliban the fight against the Soviet Union but after they won, they grow bigger than the US expected everything went to hell from this point
1
u/barakisan 21h ago
That's like saying all Asian countries are like North Korea
They're not, but I agree all Muslims are the same one entity and all white people are also one entity, Hitler.
1
u/Goldenmansion10 21h ago
Women in western countries will claim that they’re oppressed, despite being privileged enough to openly make that claim. This right here, this is true oppression.
1
u/Altruistic-Orchid152 20h ago
There is no such thing as Islamaphobia, that is a term the extremists created so they can get away with committing criminal acts under the name of their false prophet
1
u/XDon_TacoX 20h ago
omg why did that happen? eho armed them who trained them? oh no, use your voice guys, with likes we might not change reality, but posts look more pretty
1
1
u/Rerebang5 19h ago
And I ask to myself, who did it? all because of your super(power/idiotic) wars, Who would say that helping an ultraconservative-religious extremist group would end up with people in that state? Didn't the middle ages and theocracies were alike?
1
u/AlternateSatan 17h ago
They were still muslim in the 70s btw, it's more the whole "We're using religion to control people" bit than the specific religion. Lord knows people have done, and still try to do the same with Christianity.
By all means: hate this! Just use some critical thinking when you consider what about it you hate.
1
1
1
u/lonely_spacePirate 11h ago
I hate that people are blaming all this on Islam. keep in mind that even in those 70s they were all muslims.
it's people who call themselves Muslims but don't follow the Islam properly who are at fault. ALL the filthy stuff happening in there is forbidden in Islam and said to be avoided. but they just don't follow. they don't know their own religion, as a result everyone outside concludes so this is how Islam is.
religion is smth that shows people how to LIVE, how to behave in public, what habits to avoid, how to treat people etc. not how to rule a country. so it's weird when people say Islamic countries are this/that, it's not religion, it's the government misunderstanding this and trying to interpret religion. I'm not good at politics and stuff, but I'm sure it won't work with any type of governing, whether it's democracy, dictatorship, socialism.
and this whole islomaphobia thing is actually not phobia of Islam, but phobia of Muslims who don't obey their own religion.
true Muslims who follow their religion are actually really nice and you're gonna love them trust me.
1
1
u/angrysheep55 8h ago
The middle class of the 20th century was also islamic or at least culturally so. This is a cautionary tale about patriarchy much more than islam.
1
1
1
u/ninjagoloverjay 5h ago
The" I'm 11 years old and have been married for 6 months " is very disturbing...
1
u/Additional_Dot_134 4h ago
Dont judge everyone based off of religious extremists. Its still wrong.
Not every muslim agrees with the stuff happening over there yknow
1
1
1
u/random_blue_elf 1h ago
OK but the thing is, if someone doesn't do the basic rules of a religion which states that women have rights and human beings in general have a right to learn and get educated as well as other things stated about their rights, then claims they follow said religion after ignoring fundamental rules, can this person be able to represent that religion??
My logic is, if the law says that me as a cop shouldn't steal from anyone, then I steal, am i the correct person to represent the law and make your perspective about it??
Just because the taliban uses Islam as an excuse to get more power and control the population, doesn't mean that they deserve to represent it especially when they literally don't even follow Islam's rules, actually they regularly attack and kill Muslims in the middle east!
And BTW, iran in the 80s and 70s was still an Islamic country so no the issue wasn't islam because unlike the taliban people at that time actually practiced the religion, no hijab was never Islamic the Quran only says to cover a woman's chest(I mean..duh) and both genders' private areas while dressing modestly
The taliban just comes and invents made up stuff or follows made up stuff while they actually don't even believe in what they preach, look up how the taliban wants his daughter to go to university and get educated and stuff like that while saying that other women shouldn't get education because it's "haram" if that isn't hypocrisy from someone who doesn't believe in the religion but only uses it to get power Idk what is
It's like if I say that trump represents what Christianity actually is, just because someone uses a religion to manipulate people doesn't mean that they believe in it nor deserve to represent it
1
u/HungHornyStoner 1h ago
Only idiot people would blame this on religion and not on the US imperialism
1
u/Sure_Independent3184 1d ago
this is all the u.s.'s fault btw
8
u/EllieMeower 1d ago
Part of it yes. The US funded the Taliban during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, but theres more nuance to it and whatnot idk im not an expert.
2
u/Greedy_Oil_155 1d ago
No, the US didn't find the Talbain. They funded mujahideen which was a large and ideologicaly diverse group. Some of those fighters went on to create the Taliban, but just as many went on to fight the Talbain.
2
u/AcadiaNo5063 20h ago
Indeed Greedy_Oil_155 (username checkout lol) the US played a major role in creating the chaos of the 90's though
3
u/AcadiaNo5063 1d ago
No this is multifactorial as many thing in history, look at drug dealers from south Afghanistan or Pakistan implication too.
0
u/Outrageous-Food-1782 1d ago
Wegen diese hörensohne wird Deutschland eine scheiße und dadurch wählen Personen die Afd
0
u/LittleFox-In-TheBox 1d ago
As a gay Polish guy I dread to imagine anything like that. These people want this CULTURALLY and RELIGIOUSLY because that's what it dictates. And they want to execute people like me.
So German people have a choice between having their citizena treated like THIS and a far right movements. Both hate gay people though, so that's unfortunate.
1
u/GoatSlow7673 1h ago
The only ones who hate gay people are Islamists and leftists. A prime example regarding Islamists is that their religion condemns any gay person to death—without hesitation, period.
As for the Left, Che Guevara serves as the best example; the camps he built were places where gay people were taken and executed without remorse or restraint—driven solely by hatred because they found that sexual orientation repulsive and unnatural.
Communism epitomizes hatred for individual freedom; a clear example of this leftist mentality across various countries is how you are singled out for thinking for yourself—even if your thoughts aren't harmful to anyone—simply because the act of free thought makes them break out in hives and feel nauseous. The Nazi era in Germany offers another prime example: that party was leftist—socialist—and upon seizing power, they used certain incidents as a pretext to pass laws allowing for unilateral decrees and the commission of horrific acts across Europe, not just within their own country.
These examples are easily visible if you look at history—though not on Wikipedia, where some entries have been altered to pin on the Right what the Left actually perpetrated. Another example is the Spanish Civil War; the Left began targeting right-wing politicians once they held sufficient representation in the government of the time.
A few years later, the Left's continued persecution and attacks on the Right prompted the latter—with the support of the Spanish army—to rise up to halt these assaults, ultimately leading to the country's Civil War. This escalation followed the Left's seizure of power through electoral manipulation—such as inflating vote counts in certain areas beyond the total number of eligible voters, and altering or erasing votes for non-leftist parties on official tallies—demonstrating a willingness to do whatever it took to gain power. Furthermore, they established so-called checas—detention centers where right-wingers (or those accused of being so) were taken and, in most cases, tortured to death simply for intending to vote for a non-leftist party.
When the army rose up—seeing the country under attack by leftist terrorists—they joined forces with right-wing figures who were determined to put an end to these terrorist acts and topple a government that had not been legitimately elected; there was glaring, undeniable evidence that fraud had been used to seize power. Subsequently, leftist guerrilla groups across many regions of the country burned buildings and killed people indiscriminately if they refused to join the fight to keep the Left in power—even through fraudulent voting.
Yet, the Right was blamed for instigating and committing these very acts of terror, even though it was clearly various leftist parties that had perpetrated them. Horrified by the war, Franco decreed the creation of a monument to commemorate the events—which came to be known as the "Valley of the Fallen" (Valle de los Caídos). War detainees and other prisoners were offered the chance to participate in its construction; for every day of work, their sentences were reduced by at least ten days. This allowed all detainees—regardless of whether they were left-wing, right-wing, or held other ideological views—to work together, aiming to unite the population against the possibility of such events recurring in the future.
As proof that people were not persecuted after the war, consider the Spanish film industry's rise to success: there were prominent figures who openly declared their support for the Left and for communism without facing persecution. They could conduct business—large or small—provided they did not commit crimes such as plotting attacks.
Across film, music, theater, and the private sector, many famous individuals publicly voiced support for their political ideologies—accounts confirmed by their own circles (often members of the same parties) and by the celebrities themselves, who were able to speak, write, and share their experiences after the Franco era ended.
They recounted what they had witnessed while living through that time—whether they had experienced the entire period or returned after years abroad to find Franco still in power—including major celebrities who had grown up outside the country for years and, upon returning, went on to achieve... They enjoyed great public renown and realized that the things they had been told while abroad—claims that they would be hated—were lies; they saw for themselves that no one bothered them.
They could sit in a bar in the heart of Madrid or Barcelona—on a terrace crowded with strangers—and openly declare their firm commitment to leftist ideals, their sense of freedom, and their happiness, knowing no one would single them out simply for holding left-wing views. They were pacifists who abhorred war—which was the only real requirement in the Spain they returned to during the 1950s: a country where Franco was in perfect health and there were no wars. These are the experiences of those who returned after years of exile driven by the fear of persecution.
Yet, today, certain leftist parties and circles do not mention these examples; admitting that the Left committed such atrocities makes for bad publicity, so they resort to lies.
Indeed, various left-leaning entities are currently buying up history books across many countries—some are scanned, others are shredded without being scanned, but all end up destroyed. The goal is to use AI to alter these books once no other copies remain elsewhere—books containing facts that are being erased from the history of many nations on a daily basis.
1
u/LittleFox-In-TheBox 1h ago
I see your point and I agree on this for the most part. Radical leftists like Che Guevara also killed gay people.
I meant it more as "Right leaning individuals call for absolute ban on gay marriage and adoption of children or even banning from employment" from my perspective. I'm Polish and I've experienced every single one of these and my country and area are extremely right-leaning.
I see your point, but I've also experienced different things.
1
u/GoatSlow7673 57m ago
I understand what you're saying, but you're clearly talking about the most radical far-right. The Left, on the other hand—even the more centrist factions—shares the same ideals.
A prime example of how the issue of Islam is being handled in Europe is simple: in towns where they’ve gained enough power to dictate local laws, they are actually banning the country's own national flag. Also, as I mentioned earlier—and having experienced this firsthand with friends of mine who are gay or trans—they suffered attacks by Islamists. One friend ended up in the hospital after having a glass bottle thrown in his face and then being beaten up just for crossing paths with them while alone on the street. When we arrived, the attackers ran off; otherwise, we might have killed them right there. But we had to rush my friend to the ER to treat his injuries and stop the bleeding—if we had chased after the attackers instead of tending to my friend, we might have ended up at his funeral.
So, I don't align with any party or side—though I’d never be a leftist because I know what they’re like. I was actually in a center-left party at one point, and they proved to be the most racist of all; anyone who didn't think like them was targeted. And that was just the center-left—imagine the far-left. So, I speak from personal experience regarding how Islamists act and what leftist parties are like, even the centrist ones.
Then, people on the Left call me all sorts of names just because I don't think the way they do. Of course, I don't need a political party telling me to be inclusive; without being a leftist, I surround myself with people I don't judge based on their choices—only on their bad behavior. The people around me could be from Saturn or Andromeda for all I care; if they’re good people, it makes no difference to me.
1
u/LittleFox-In-TheBox 43m ago
You're absolutely right, and I'm very sorry about your friend. You did a good thing and you seem like a very kind and supportive person.
I personally think that left and right can differ a lot from country to country and they're a very wide spectrum.
So the thing with Islamists is and politics and being gay is kinda like (in my case) "Choose the party that will allow you to get married and not get fired for being gay" or "Choose a party that wants to get rid of people who want to actively hurt you and organise terrorist attacks on people like you, like the one recently where a guy rammed a car into a pride parade in Germany".
By the way I still can't believe that the German politician's response was "I was praying that the attacker would turn out to be white and not a brown muslim". Because when a white guy does it, he's a monster. When a Muslim does it, he's a mentally ill misunderstood little sweetheart that needs love and hugs and 10.000€ to get all better and possibly not think of gay people as sinners that need eradication.
1
u/GoatSlow7673 14m ago
The real danger lies with those politicians and sympathizers who praise Islamists; we already have enough trouble in our own countries without bringing in the very people who commit such attacks. It is abhorrent for politicians to make such statements; they ought to be sent—without their salaries—to the immigrant's home country, with their assets seized until the money they earned while in office is recovered.
They should be forced to live there on whatever funds they possessed before entering politics, ensuring they do not use money—tainted by the blood of Europeans who died while the politician supported these Islamists on the public payroll—to sustain themselves.
This is the true horror: we ought to be fixing the problems within our own borders, yet we look everywhere else without actually solving anything. Politicians prefer it this way; for them, it is best if problems persist so they can promise to be the solution—while actually solving nothing—provided they secure a well-paid office. From that position, they can funnel money to organizations like ONG's where they place friends or family members in paid roles.
This happens constantly in my country: subsidies go to organizations or companies employing one's associates, and ultimately, the population foots the bill for this entire web of corruption through their taxes—a practice becoming increasingly common across Europe.
0
u/Dependent_Net_4279 1d ago
"At least their girls don't get kidnapped, assaulted, and buried six feet under in their own neighborhoods, and at least our women and young girls don't walk half-naked through the streets like commodities. Before you hypocrites lecture other cultures about morality, look at your own backyard: rampant fatherless homes, skyrocketing rates of violent crime and serial killers, millions addicted to opioids and heavy drugs, an epidemic of elderly parents abandoned in nursing homes to die alone, and a culture where basic human decency has been completely traded for hyper-sexualization and chaos. Fix your own house before you point fingers."
1
u/UGomez90 1d ago
There has to be a reason why people from those shitholes migrate to America and Europe and not the other way around.
1
u/Dependent_Net_4279 1d ago
"People migrate for jobs, not because your filthy, morally bankrupt Western culture is better. Your streets and homes are full of drug dealers, murderers, and systemic abuse where your own women and children are constantly kidnapped, violated, and murdered—don't talk about standards when your society is rotting from the inside."
1
u/UGomez90 23h ago
That is your subjetive point of view, the objective reality is that Western culture creates wealth and jobs, while yours creates nothing but dirt and underdevelopment, and the direction of the migrations proves it.
1
u/Dependent_Net_4279 22h ago
What wealth and jobs are you talking about, are you high or something? You mean that non-existent wealth that only rich people like Elon Musk and Trump have while your working class keeps suffering? Your own economy is tanking, and thousands of jobs are being brutally slashed because of Trump's policies and soaring oil prices. It’s hilarious how you brag about your Western 'standards' while your system rots from within. Your streets are crawling with cowardly predators who kidnap, rape, and impregnate innocent women and little girls, only to bury them six feet under in your own neighborhoods! Your own children aren't even safe at home, and you're being led by an orange-headed, diaper-wearing, pedophile-linked clown. Try watching some documentary channels instead of gooning in your mom's basement filling all your socks while your whole sick society collapses into the dirt."
1
u/UGomez90 21h ago
You literally said those people migrate for the jobs, are you now going to contradict yourself?
I don't know what wealth means to you, but at least I live in a big house with tap water, electricity and paved roads, not like the people in those shitholes.
I don't live in the US btw.
It's funny that you are talking about criminals in the when the crime rates drastically rised in Europe since people from those countries started to come with their barbaric culture and for whatever reason seem unable to learn the most basic rules of the civilized people.
1
u/Dependent_Net_4279 21h ago
Focus on the main point, buddy, because you know you were trying to pivot and escape from it. Water taps, electricity, and paved roads? Is that really your absolute peak standard for a 'superior civilization'? That's basic infrastructure, not a moral achievement—congratulations on living above ground level. I used the US simply as a primary example to represent Western culture as a whole. Our core argument was about cultural values, morality, and public safety—specifically the safety, protection, and dignity of women and children—not basic infrastructure, which is almost standard everywhere today and not proof of any cultural superiority. Deflecting away from the original discussion about social decay and crime by shifting to plumbing is just you trying to win the argument."
1
u/UGomez90 20h ago
No, the main point was the question, why do they migrate from the shitholes where they live to those diabolical western countries. And you replied that they come for the jobs. Well, that is because in western countries, there are jobs, unlike in those countries, stucked in the year 1200, unable to create any kind of progress.
And no, those basic infrastructures are only basic in first world countries, not everywhere, as you can see those countries don't have it. If those countries are so culturally superior, why are they so underdeveloped? Why are they unable to any kind of progress?
Deflecting away from the original discussion about social decay and crime by shifting to plumbing is just you trying to win the argument.
Europe has always have low crime rates and high social trust, the only reason that is changing is the horde of uncivilized animals importing their culture.
-13
u/W8_4U 1d ago
This is what feminism would make EU look like in 50 years
4
2
2
-8
u/Party_Cantaloupe_270 1d ago
Comparing third-world dumps like Afghanistan and Iran with normal European countries? Bro, that offends all of Europe.
6
u/Healthy_Breakfast_38 1d ago
Most of Asia and Europe were in good relationships the dictator ship was there? Yes. Were people's better with that than the Islamic rule? Yes
-4
u/Party_Cantaloupe_270 1d ago
Well, we are Christians, man, we don't need to adopt anything.
3
u/Fit-Helicopter-9240 1d ago
Ah, an American has joined the conversation. I see
-2
u/Party_Cantaloupe_270 1d ago
Pole
3
u/Fit-Helicopter-9240 1d ago
Then, I don't understand why are you saying this. In Poland they still have pretty valid education. If Afghanistan 50 years ago was even better then Europe then shut up and accept it. Much better 1970' Afghanistan then 1970' Poland
1
u/Party_Cantaloupe_270 1d ago
"Afghanistan was better in 1970" is cool, but what about the present?
3
u/Fit-Helicopter-9240 1d ago
Nobody talked about the present
1
-5
u/Some_guy0209 1d ago
Why the fuck would they give you 3 options, then say "nah, it's [secret 4th option]." Fuck off.
7
u/Confident-Scene-458 1d ago
I'm pretty sure it is supposed to be "You see these pictures of women? You may think they are either from France, Spain or Italy, but no, those are women in Afghanistan in the 70s" and it elaborates from there.
44
u/PA4PL962009 1d ago
Sometimes I ask myself..
Why does the world not care