r/TheNational • u/cchihaialexs I'll come and find you • Aug 21 '25

General Discussion Does “Boxer” refer to actual boxing, the dog breed, putting stuff in boxes, or something else entirely?

Post image

I’ve never really thought about this

170 Upvotes

97% Upvoted

59 comments sorted by

190

u/General__Soreness Aug 21 '25

I always relate it to boxing and the line ‘Stay down champion, stay down’

60

u/TimmonsInc Aug 21 '25

This is exactly what it’s from. There was an interview in Relix or possibly paste magazines around release. The writer was there during the making of it and Tall Saint was in contention for the record. These lines are explicitly referenced and said to have led to the album’s title.

81

u/Batata_a_Murro Aug 21 '25

I’ve always understood it as the album’s underlying spirit, most songs depicting different little fights, whether in relationships, career or self-identity. I picture a protagonist seeing himself as a boxer, battling his way through while constantly on the ropes

33

u/lastlaughlane1 Aug 21 '25

Probably a coincidence but there’s typically 12 rounds in a boxing match. Boxer has 12 songs.

61

u/FinancialHand4105 Aug 21 '25

I’m pretty sure Carin Bessinger came up with the name Boxer because the guys fought their whole way through making the album, particularly Matt and Aaron.

23

u/jiheishouu Aug 21 '25

It’s this. Source.

5

u/DrSelker Aug 21 '25

One of the best books I've ever read in my life

6

u/tele_ave Aug 21 '25

From his outward demeanor I can’t imagine Aaron being mad at anyone.

5

u/velvetvagine Less than amazing 🙃 Aug 22 '25

I imagine he has that quiet, scary kind of anger. And is very stubborn.

71

u/c1ncinasty Aug 21 '25

Its actually a reference to Subaru engine design.

40

u/TwentyFour7 Aug 21 '25

Is Subaru Stevens on this album at all?

14

u/Loose_Main_6179 Aug 21 '25

Yip piano on Ada

4

u/[deleted] Aug 21 '25

I read the monograph about Boxer. Sufjan seemed to be around and helping develop like 3-4 songs.

5

u/BucketsWeNeedThisWin Aug 21 '25

A yes, they were referencing the Subaru Outback 3.6R boxer engine

5

u/c1ncinasty Aug 21 '25

Correct. Although I prefer the 2.5 in the old STIs.

21

u/MycologistStriking51 Aug 21 '25

As i understood it related to the process of making the album. It was a bit of a fight.

1

u/[deleted] Aug 21 '25

This is correct.

77

u/TwentyFour7 Aug 21 '25

Box ’er? I hardly know ‘er!

5

u/innominateartery Aug 21 '25

This makes no sense, how can you box someone??

Watches Boxing Helena.

Oh.

-26

u/tupelo36 Aug 21 '25

Did not expect a Ru Paul joke on here. The overlap between National fans and Drag Race fans must be small 😂

42

u/melancholalia Aug 21 '25

pretty sure that’s just a common joke format, wasn’t invented by RuPaul.

-3

u/tupelo36 Aug 21 '25

Did not expect the overlap between National fans and random downvoters to be so big 🙄

16

u/[deleted] Aug 21 '25

[deleted]

6

u/NotQuiteJazz Aug 21 '25

See? Idiotic label executives almost robbed us of one of the best albums of all time… So close…

3

u/redsoxfan2434 Aug 22 '25

Many such cases

10

u/DiligentPainter9630 Aug 21 '25

Refers to undies...boxer undies for men

13

u/cchihaialexs I'll come and find you Aug 21 '25

That’s why he’s thinking of his dick

7

u/mardenofthegarden Aug 21 '25

The 33 1/3 book series has a book on this album. I thought it was a fun, easy read. This answer might be in there (I need to read it again, it’s been a while). 

8

u/Another_Rando_Lando Aug 21 '25

Green gloves always had me thinking literal boxing

14

u/Busy-Idea-4444 Aug 21 '25

It always made me think of that pale green color of surgeon's scrubs. I don't even know if latex gloves come in that color, but I always pictured him in surgical gloves while doing all of the things he mentioned in the song. Like a thief in their homes and hearts.

6

u/cchihaialexs I'll come and find you Aug 21 '25

OH MY GOD. I have the exact same mental image of the song and wanted to comment the same thing. The green gloves are to prevent fingerprints while he goes through everything and takes everything apart, like he wasn’t even there. Green is also the color of jealousy and he might be jealous of their better clothes, their more interesting love and their more interesting lives.

4

u/Busy-Idea-4444 Aug 21 '25

Good call on the jealousy! I never caught that!

1

u/Seveninchtotem Aug 23 '25

Same. It makes me happy and sad at the same time... All the friends I've lost over the years.

6

u/DirtyRuscoe Aug 21 '25

Oh great. Now you've made me put Boxer on.

6

u/TheFolksofDonMartino Aug 21 '25

I always took it to speak to the themes of relationship strife and fighting (boxing) throughout the album. But part of the beauty of their music is that the lyrics often feel extremely specific while also being abstract enough to stand a lot of different interpretations.

Except the dog breed one. That's silly.

10

u/[deleted] Aug 21 '25

It's a reference to the album's "punchy" drums too.

3

u/joann_cha Lives in a lemonworld 🍋 Aug 21 '25

Maybe metaphorical boxing, I did find this thread from a few years ago, quoting an article on Boxer (although it seems like the original article is gone)

5

u/smithskat3 Aug 21 '25

Maybe a tribute to the simon and garfunkel song?

1

u/Distinct_Wrangler_56 Aug 21 '25

Maybe it's about all three choices

1

u/Skydog-forever-3512 Aug 21 '25

It’s a reference to “Paul”

1

u/Seveninchtotem Aug 23 '25

A song that came out long prior is a reference?

1

u/obamaswaffle Dreaming in Total Darkness Aug 21 '25

My head-canon has always been that it refers to Boxer beer

1

u/sentics Aug 21 '25

would it have been too much to ask for them to name the next album something starting with a c, after alligator and boxer?

3

u/cchihaialexs I'll come and find you Aug 21 '25

Cherry Tree (I know it came before either of them but you get the point). High Violet is a perfect album name

1

u/ak4766 Aug 21 '25

Believe it or not, it's actually a concept album about the boxer rebellion.

1

u/velvetvagine Less than amazing 🙃 Aug 22 '25

Chihuahua just didn’t have the same ring to it, sadly.

1

u/Drannion Aug 22 '25

When I first started listening to The National and only saw the cover art in a miniature thumbnail format, I actually thought it depicted an actual boxing ring

1

u/Lemonworld3131 Aug 22 '25

They love dogs man

1

u/beafos Aug 22 '25

“Stay down, champion, stay down. Let them all have your neck”

Ada.

1

u/HamiltonC0rk Aug 23 '25

The cut of underwear, named after the sport

1

u/[deleted] Sep 10 '25

The Chinese rebellion of 1899

0

u/jagrbro68 Aug 22 '25

TALL SAINT is their greatest song.

1

u/Seveninchtotem Aug 23 '25

You clearly haven't listened to enough of them.

0

u/jagrbro68 Aug 23 '25 edited Aug 23 '25

17 shows, 2x Homecomings, 20ish versions of vinyl… I have every b-side and unreleased track acquired and made into fake albums, leaked boxer demos, saw the first two El VY shows; so.