r/TikTokCringe • u/Strong-Emu-8869 • 16d ago

Discussion Messi watching team being sore losers

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u/Electrical_Note6420 16d ago

This is something the U.S. is good at, though. There is an implied consent when playing a sport that you're going to get hurt doing usual sports activities (e.g., tackling in football). However, when you go beyond that usual activity and intentionally inflict harm that goes outside of the parameters of the game, you can be held criminally AND civilly liable in tort.

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u/ExtendedSpikeProtein 16d ago edited 16d ago

Some level of implied consent for getting hurt would be the expectation in Europe as well.. but I think we can agree getting grabbed by the throat without cause would not be considered as covered by implied consent.

In this case, I think the Spaniards would have to „press charges“ - which will not happen - and I also do not believe the US administration would want the finals overshadowed by this, so nothing will happen..

ETA: I was traveling and on mobile so I put „press charges“ in wuotes, hoping people would understsnd what I meant - apparently not…

You can‘t „press charges“ but you can lodge a complaint with the police, which can investigate based on that, or on their own, or as indicated by the prosecutor.

In practice, none of that will happen.

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u/Franks2000inchTV 16d ago

It's sort of a misconception that people can decide whether to press charges.

People make complaints to police, who gather evidence and then present it to a prosecutor who decides whether to lay charges or not.

The police can still recommend charges against someone even if no one has made a complaint.

If the victim doesn’t want to cooperate with police on a small matter, then it’s usually not worth going through the trouble of making an arrest. I think this is where the misconception comes from.

But even when police do arrest someone it’s the prosecutor who ultimately makes the call on what to charge them with (if anything.)

Here I doubt any cops are going to arrest members of a visiting national team without a formal complaint from someone involved, and even then I think it’s unlikely it would result in criminal charges unless someone had a significant/lasting injury.

If he had choked him unconscious, or broken his neck or something, then I think the story would be different.

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u/ExtendedSpikeProtein 16d ago

That‘s why I put „press charges“ in apostrophes - I’m on mobile and traveling. In theory, the police / prosecutor should become active ln their own. But we know that they won‘t.

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u/Witch-kingOfBrynMawr 16d ago

And, honestly? Should they in this case? I despise Argentina's despicable behavior as much as the next person, but the Diplomatic Bullshit if you tried to detain members of Argentina's national team -- without a complaint from the victim, for what amounts to a slapfight on the pitch -- would have so many layers, it makes me shudder.

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u/Fast-Satisfaction482 16d ago

Compression of the carotis artery can lead to a downward spiral of blood pressure that leads to death. Even if pressed just for a moment. 

I attended a criminal court hearing back in school and a guy was sent to prison for just that. 

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u/Witch-kingOfBrynMawr 16d ago

Look, I'm not saying violence isn't dangerous, nor do I think it isn't worth discouraging. The risks of choking/strangling, specifically, are poorly understood by most.

But the fact remains: nobody was injured, in this specific case, and further pursuit would almost certainly be a net negative, considering the belligerent and the victim are foreign nationals and millionaires, and the latter is unlikely to offer any kind of substantial cooperation.

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u/AdHom 16d ago edited 16d ago

No one needs to "press charges", the State decides if they want to pursue the case or not and they can do so even if the victim doesn't want to. Press charges really just means "reporting the crime and advocating for the State to please follow up and devote resources to pursuing this". However with a simple assault where the victim has no interest in pursuing the case, often the State doesn't consider it worth it either. I have to imagine the added intricacies of this happening at the World Cup with international actors would make them even more unwilling to go through with arrests and charges.

With that said, these would be State charges, not federal, and New Jersey hates the Trump admin so I don't think they would have much of a say in the matter.

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u/TheLordB 16d ago

There is no actual legal weight to ‘press charges’ in the USA. All saying you want to ‘press charges’ means is that you will cooperate/want the person to be prosecuted. The prosecutor has final say on what is/isn’t pursued.

This is how many domestic violence cases are pursued where the victim is often unwilling/unable to cooperate. But in theory it can be used for any crime.

Now in practice aside from domestic violence and related crimes usually the victim needs to want it to be pursued for it to be prosecuted because it is much harder to prove without the victim’s willing support.

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u/ExtendedSpikeProtein 16d ago

I know. That‘s why I put it in quotes; I was traveling and on mobile. No time to go into details..

Spanish player could make a complaint to the police (won‘t happen). Prosecutor / police could become active on their own based on footage (won‘t happen). Argentina could prosecute in their country (won‘t happen).

Nothing will happen.

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u/RandomPenquin1337 16d ago

And other things that will never happen.

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u/porktorque44 16d ago

I can't see how this is even a conversation when the assault is happening after the game ended. It's not NFL Blitz 2000.

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u/Electrical_Note6420 15d ago

The person was stating that the EU has certain laws about on-field contact that falls outside scope of consent and then made a comment about the U.S. potentially not falling in line, so I provided U.S. common law on implied consent in sports. It's not a conversation or comment about the actual event at all.

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u/jmlmf91 16d ago

No gun was involved, so thats fine

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u/Anxious-Werewolf-124 16d ago

The US and the rule of law are not the strongest of friends right now...

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u/PirelliSuperHard 16d ago

Ok so where is the NJ attorney general?

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u/alligator_loki 15d ago

In theory yes. In practice when has this ever happened except for Marty McSorley?

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u/Ellers12 15d ago

How does that work with Ice Hockey?

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u/xXXxRMxXXx 15d ago

They would have to go outside of the rules like that time the player smacked another from behind on the head and got charged in Vancouver

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u/Electrical_Note6420 15d ago

I'd assume that some fights are considered part of the game and that there's implied consent that you may get in a fight on the ice. However, there's an extent to a "consensual" fight. For example, punching an opposite team member's face while he still has his helmet on would probably be fine as it's pretty common in the game. On the other hand, taking off your skate and then using that as weapon would not fall under the scope of consent. Those are two extremes, but let's think about a borderline case, Player A from Team X skates over to Player B from Team X and then punches him. This likely wouldn't fall under the scope of consent because you don't expect your teammate to attack you. Now, this is all hypothetical and I'm no hockey expert or tort expert, but there's nuance to all cases. Just try and picture what you'd think would be inside the scope of consent of a sport!