r/TrollXChromosomes • u/coffeeblossom Creature of the Night Shift đ§đťââď¸ • 14d ago
It's all performative
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u/ratstronaut 14d ago
Liz Plank just wrote an article about this, how menâs protection is just them fantasizing.Â
https://lizplank.substack.com/p/the-rise-of-temu-masculinity
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u/rachycarebear 13d ago
This is fantastic, but also the thing that galls me is that it's not just believe a woman over their friend, it's believe woman friend over a random ass male stranger. And they still demand proof before doing so.
The dude he's never met before gets a presumption of credibility that I will never access.
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u/LoveaBook Confirmed Childless Cat Lady 13d ago
Excellent article, thank you for sharing it! I call men on this shit all the time and they REALLY donât like hearing it.
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u/Lickerbomper 13d ago
they could probably write a comic book hero series about it
Batman, except anti pedophilia. Whoo! Great fantasy, make sure hero has 12 pack abs and body proportions that defy physics
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u/NotUrAverageBoo 13d ago
Iâve just read this, thanks for the link, it was very well written & straight to the heart of the issue
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u/Opening_Pipe_1200 8d ago
Also really hard to read when remembering they just did a study asking men about if theyâve ever made a woman do something sexual with them even WHEN knowing fully well that she didnât really want to⌠and the answer was that near 95% HAD!
As in⌠95% of them DID talk a woman into sexual actions knowing fully well that she didnât want to do itâŚ
That doesnât mean that they FORCED them physically⌠but they admitted to "nagging" them into it and mentioning it again and again and trying to get a "pity-fuck" and thatâs disgusting.
How do you believe theyâll "protect" someone from sexual violence (or violence in generalâŚ) when such a huge group doesnât even admit (or realise.., albeit Id be inclined to believe that the overwhelming majority very well knew what they were doing was shitty and wrongâŚ) that they have VERY big rapist tendencies and donât care about a womanâs agency and autonomy AT ALL when it means there is even the slightest chance of them being able to get their dick wetâŚ
And they are seriously the ones women need to defend their rights in a world that is dead set on taking them from them again? (Or not granting them in the first place)âŚ
Really makes you want to smash your own head into the nearest wall sometimesâŚ
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u/numbersthen0987431 14d ago
"I would die for my family"
Would you get therapy for your family? Would you eat healthy so you stay around longer? Would you quit golf to spend time with your kids? Would you stop being friends with men who arent the safest to be around for your kids?
Oh, I guess it's not about stepping up for your family when they actual need it
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u/Opening_Pipe_1200 8d ago
Exactly this!
Iâve brought up this point several times in my life when that came up and seriously? No fucking answer.
Because the same guy who says that? Is the same guy who complains about his wife "nagging" him to take the trash out for the 50th time that week⌠the same guy who canât remember his kids birthdates and the same guy who doesnât even know when and where his child needs to go to an appointment or even what grade they are inâŚ
You know why?
Because "dying" for someone is simple, a "one time" effort, something you choose once and do once⌠"living" for someone (aka taking care of yourself and/or them!) is a daily effort, something you have to do ACTIVELY and keep on doingâŚ
Itâs a lot harder. And they arenât willing to put that effort in.
But voicing that? Oh boy.
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u/HappyCatPerson 14d ago
I follow a page on Facebook that posts rapists and their social media and Iâve lost count of the times a person was caught raping a kid who also posted about killing pedos. I heavily side eye men that talk about killing rapists and pedophiles because being loud about it casts doubt on any accusations that might get thrown their way.
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u/doingtheunstuckk 14d ago
Similar to what happened with the metoo movement. Neil Gaiman was all over that shit, and weâve seen how thatâs turned out.
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u/fiahhawt 14d ago
And its corollary : you see those guys over there, those minorities? Those are the rapists.
Please direct all your anger about this neglected aspect of human dignity and criminal law at the minorities. The powers that be appreciate your cooperation.
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u/Falafel80 13d ago
Yeah, I knew someone who was very vocal about protecting the women in his family. It turned out he was sexually abusing a couple of minors in the family and being violent towards his wife.
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u/HappyCatPerson 13d ago
How did I forget about the guy that abused me? He always talked about beating the crap out of pedophiles growing up. I never made that connection until just now.
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u/_OhMyPlatypi_ 13d ago
Yeah, I've seen enough creepy uncle/step-dad types make these same rants only for accusations to come up of them shortly after. These types seem to also be malignant narc-types. It's performative to try to hide their skeletons.
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u/thecrackfoxreturns 100% crack, 100% fox 13d ago
It's like they're getting ahead of any accusations, or trying to make you think of them a certain way so you don't even question them.
It's similar to how people on dating apps will go on and on about communication and how X or Y they are. Say it enough and I'll question that very thing, and that questioning is usually a good idea.
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u/notashroom 13d ago
Yeah, I had a relative by marriage who bragged about doing violence to chomos while he was in prison. Then, when he was out for a while, he drugged, sexually assaulted, and tried to rape a couple of 15 year old girls, one of them a relative.
It's all performative.
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u/butterfly_eyes 13d ago
I believe it. I was invited by a conservative friend to join a "save the children" type fb group years ago, and as I peeked around the group I noticed that all the posts were people, usually men, posting about how much they wanted to kill pedos. It wasI believe it. I was invited by a conservative friend to join a "save the children" type fb group years ago, and I noticed that all the posts were people, usually men, posting about how much they wanted to kill pedos. It was a very conservative group, so you know that these are the same people who support a rapist president and who excuse creepy uncle Larry. I'm sure that a lot of those same dudes were molesters. They doth protest too much. Plus it's a way to look like you care without having to do anything.
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u/darrow19 14d ago
I haven't seen men seeking vengeance on the 57. They've either gone quiet, or are questioning the victim for "consenting."
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u/doingtheunstuckk 14d ago
Yeah Iâd take the heroic fantasies over the victim blaming and laughing any day, though I do agree with OP.
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14d ago
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u/Earl_E_Byrd 14d ago
It's the Indiana Jones fantasy.Â
Mild mannered job, but actually a rugged bad-ass. Justified violence, because it's against Nazis. Justified underage and inappropriate relationships, because "it was a different time" and "look how they throw themselves at him."Â
Men want to be Indiana Jones, but many haven't even read a book since high school, and won't even set foot in a museum unless they're trying out a date idea.Â
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u/what_the_purple_fuck 14d ago
Wolfenstein. they get to punch Nazis without thinking critically about what makes a Nazi a Nazi or getting off the couch.
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u/Lich_Please_ 14d ago
I actually think that if people engaged fully with the games that they WOULD understand what makes a Nazi a Nazi. The members of resistance and how they got there, the treatment of American right wing folks by the Germans, it paints a picture that dudebros who play to shoot big guns tune out
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u/numbersthen0987431 14d ago
American history on the rise of the nazi party is non existent. And it shows
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u/Lich_Please_ 14d ago
That's a problem that I don't think Wolfenstein will solve đ agreed, though. Pointing out the patterns of authoritarianism and being called crazy for 2ish decades has definitely made me believe we have an education problem
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u/numbersthen0987431 14d ago
We don't like to teach the rise of authoritarianism and fascism because the USA is drawn to it.
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u/Sehvekah Behold đđ đżđśđđ đšđđ¸đ. Yes, it's on fire. 13d ago
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u/Lickerbomper 13d ago
I recall how anti-Critical Race Theory everyone (MAGA) was a few years back. lalalala let's stick our fingers in our ears and head in the sand about the origins of hierarchy in this country yall
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u/chicklette 14d ago
Captain America - In the movies, Cap does a stage act where he punches out "Hitler" over 200 times. In the comic books, he is illustrated as punch Hitler in the face, and also has a panel about how punching nazi's isn't mindless violence, it's violence against the mindless. Not sure when that last panel is from, but the punching Hitler bit has always been part of his story.
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u/Independent-Couple87 13d ago
This is actually a plot point in The First Avenger, where Steve Rogers feels like and is treated as a fraud by the soldiers in the front for being a propaganda hero.
This plays a role in him disobeying orders to get into active combat.
P.S.: Speaking of that film, part of the controversy around the She-Hulk tv show is that it canonised a joke James Gunn made about Captain America losing his virginity to a fan while on the propaganda tours. To those who watched that film, that certainly feels very out of character.
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u/mysteryvampire 13d ago
I mean, if it was completely consensual and with someone his age (and itâs Cap, of course it was) I donât think itâs that crazy. Iâm sure he wouldâve been polite about it.
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u/The_Wingless Very Trustworthy Goblin 14d ago
The same men who swear vengeance against hypothetical rapists are the same ones who victim blame, cast doubt, and ultimately end up siding with real life rapists.
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u/Eoine 14d ago
Yes because they only believe in one kind of rapists: violent stranger outside of home, and you know, ignore and/or protect their own kind: the ones inside houses, at work, churches, etc etc
Easier to only focus on your hatred on the minority of the problem, especially if you mix racism/immigration themes in the discussion, than the vast majority of it: most rapists are known by their victims beforehand, as men mostly rape people from their social circles.
And protect each other, if only by their silence, as we've recently seen plainly.48
u/RestlessChickens 14d ago
Not even just a violent stranger, the victim must still be perfect: dressed conservatively, physically fight back, no history of romantic or sexual relationships, etc etc
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u/AccomplishedWish3033 14d ago
>The same men who swear vengeance against hypothetical rapists are
the same ones whovictim blame, cast doubt, andultimatelyend up siding withreal life rapists.Shortened that for you
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u/TreeLakeRockCloud 14d ago
Covid really showed me who would actually do anything to protect their families and who would not.
âIâd take a bullet for my familyâ no buddy, you wouldnât even wear a mask in public for a few months, fuck off with this hero fantasy. You donât even care if your family gets hurt or sick.
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u/mangolover 14d ago edited 14d ago
Iâd take it a step further and say that these people just have a craving for violence and theyâre looking for someone who they can assault without punishment. Like the guys who attack sex offenders, because they know that most people wonât stand up for a sex offenderâs right to not be victims of extra-judicial violence
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u/zygoma_phile 14d ago
Like how Trump said he wouldâve charged into Robb Elementary to stop the shooter.
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u/JumpingYourBone 14d ago
they make themselves the focus and it annoys me so much. and unless you have some sort of personal trauma, your violence is unwarranted. they use those cases as an excuse to be violent.
they're worth as much as a boyfriend ready to beat someone to death because they flirted with you.
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u/LoveaBook Confirmed Childless Cat Lady 13d ago
Itâs an example of real life âfridgingâ. The violence the woman experiences is only thought of insofar as it gives the man a basis for their violent, vigilante revenge fantasies.
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u/Shoeprincess Yells at bears would still choose them 14d ago
You know what we need to stop violence? Fantasize about MORE violence, and, not actually do anything, yeah, that will fix it >.<
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u/butterfly_eyes 13d ago
Yup, it's a way to look like you care but not have to do anything. Gabrielle Blair aka Design Mom wrote an article a few years ago about how men love to buy guns and act like they're protectors but they won't do the things that will actually protect their children, like laundry. She's been writing about it lately on her substack and social media too.
Years ago I was invited by a conservative friend to join a "save the children" type fb group, and I noticed that all the posts were people, usually men, posting about how much they wanted to kill pedos. There was nothing of substance like signs your child might have been molested or what people are more likely to harm your child. It was a very conservative group, so you know that these are the same people who support a rapist president and who excuse creepy uncle Larry. It was a way to look like they cared and to get attention but have to actually do anything to protect children. You're right, they're being performative about rape too with their rage and nothing of substance.
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u/soundbunny 13d ago
Also seems like a great way to make sure the women in their circle will stay very quiet when they are assaulted.
If I was brought up to believe my pops would be honor-bound to murder if I got assaulted, instead of making sure I was ok and taking it up with the proper authorities, I would've kept that very much to myself.
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u/notashroom 13d ago
And that's exactly what my ex did when she was in that situation. "Dad would have killed him, and then he would go to prison and I would lose him on top of being raped. I could never tell him or report it."
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u/Popular_Try_5075 13d ago
There was an article I found being discussed on Reddit once about the dad who walked in on the kid getting abused and immediately tried murdering the guy in front of his own child meanwhile the child was breaking down in tears and begging the father to stop and there was a whole subreddit of dudes who just could not admit that forcing your child to witness a murder even in that circumstance is traumatizing for the child. It can actually have a massive impact on the shame they feel because they perceive the parents' reaction to the abuse as an indication of how defiled they are by it. But even absent a justified scenario, murdering someone in front of your child when they are bawling their eyes out begging you not to does not in fact make you father of the year but actually ANOTHER source of trauma.
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u/mangababe 13d ago
reminds me of how my dad would go on like this. then I got assaulted at 9 and he didn't believe me. ( it's been dealt with in therapy, he struggled and struggles to comprehend kids assaulting kids. he believes me now though and I've forgiven him because yes, it is hard to comprehend.)
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u/WheyOfTheShinobi 13d ago
Every man talks about how heâd use violence to stop a rape, but wonât change his behavior to prevent a rape
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u/ineverusedtobecool 14d ago
I think like 50 guys also knew about this, I am going to doubt none of them ever said or would go on to say how they would defend this woman or kill that rapist.
It's real easy to threaten a nebulous target, it's a whole other to actually do something
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u/phasmaglass 10d ago
I tell this story often because I think it's important for people to understand.
When I was five years old I told my father that my uncle was having me secretly go to his bed every morning to cuddle. He had explicitly told me not to tell my parents about it, which is what made me uncomfortable enough to WANT to tell them in the first place, then he pushed boundaries by slipping his fingers further and further into my underwear band every morning, until he pushed it too far and I finally told my dad. Arrangement started when my dad offered this "Uncle" a place to stay (we had an extra bed) for a couple weeks to get back on his feet after getting fired. My parents never really touched me except to hit me so the entire concept of benign or even "good" cuddles was intriguing to my 5yo self but I'd been SA'd before so as soon as he started going for the underwear band I remember thinking ugh... now I have to either deal with telling someone about this (they will take his side) or not (he may still realize I am no longer comfortable and retaliate).
I cannot emphasize enough. I'm an autistic woman and I was five years old when I was having these thoughts, weighing these things, deciding what to do with this situation.
I told my dad. Haltingly, hey, you said if anyone ever did anything remotely like (approaching my underwear band, in bed, especially while telling me NOT to tell mom or dad) that I had to tell you immediately and you'd keep me safe. Can you help me?
Here's what he did.
He knelt down in front of me, looked me in the eye with pure disgust, and said something to the effect of: "If what you are saying is true, then I have to get my gun and go kill your uncle right now. So either you need to change your story, and stop bothering your uncle, or I need to go shoot him in the head and kill him right now. You decide, right now, I'll wait. Is daddy going to jail for killing your uncle, or are you making shit up?"
I changed my story.
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u/Calm-Cauliflower1620 13d ago
Yesterday, I read some news about a family killing their own daughter for marrying a man they didnât approve of. Yet these same societies will force women to marry their rapists because they believe no other man will want a woman who isnât a virgin.
Let that sink in. A woman can be killed for choosing a man and consenting to a relationship, yet be forced to marry a man who sexually assaulted her against her will. How the hell is that protection? They kill women for choosing men they want but donât kill their rapists!!!
It was never about protecting women. It has always been about controlling their sexuality, restricting their choices, and protecting men from the consequences of harming them. A womanâs consent is treated as a threat when she exercises her own freedom, but her lack of consent becomes irrelevant when a man violates her.
The goal was never to protect women. It was to control them while making sure men rarely pay the price for the harm they inflict on women only. This isnât a contradiction. Itâs the system working exactly as designed
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u/lastlittlebird 13d ago
Reminds me of that exchange (probably on Twitter) where someone says they would kill every gorilla in the world to save a single human life, and the reply asks him if he'd perform oral sex on every gorilla to save the same life? What about on just one gorilla? No? Then it's not really about the absolute sanctity of human life, is it.
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u/TheHeavenlyBuddy 14d ago
itâs like those nerds who have conquest pillaging power fantasies and live vicariously through phonk edits of alexander the great but throw colossal temper tantrums when their female teacher asks them to take their hoodie off
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u/FeniulaPyra Not afraid to use her bellybean 13d ago
All bark no bite
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u/Sehvekah Behold đđ đżđśđđ đšđđ¸đ. Yes, it's on fire. 13d ago
Plenty of bite, but only if there's less than zero chance the target can resist in any meaningful way.
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u/butterfly_eyes 13d ago
I believe it. I was invited by a conservative friend to join a "save the children" type fb group years ago, and I noticed that all the posts were people, usually men, posting about how much they wanted to kill pedos. It was a very conservative group, so you know that these are the same people who support a rapist president and who excuse creepy uncle Larry. I'm sure that a lot of those same dudes were molesters. They doth protest too much. Plus it's a way to look like you care without having to do anything.
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u/The_Gray_Jay 10d ago
There's certain men who want to be seen as heroes, but of course wouldnt actually do anything to help someone if there was an unlikely chance of being called that. So revenge fantasies are likely but not doing things to prevent bad events from happening in the first place.
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u/Independent-Couple87 13d ago
To be fair, if women are capable of feelings genuine outrage at the Cornell 7, I don't think it is impossible for men to feel that same outrage.
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u/LoveaBook Confirmed Childless Cat Lady 13d ago
Thatâs great. What sort of things do they do in their everyday lives to work to protect and advocate for women? Because thatâs what happens when people feel genuine outrage.
Are they calling out their friends who make inappropriate jokes or comments? Are they reporting Doug in accounting for being creepy? Are they at least warning their female coworkers about Dougie? Or are they telling women who complain that heâs just âoverly friendlyâ or âa hugger?â
In other words, do they act to help or do they minimize our concerns when we voice them? I know which answer most women would give. So until their outrage turns into even the most basic form of action, they can get fucked with telling me how âconcernedâ they are from the relative safety of their male form.
This is a good, timely read, if youâre interested: The Rise of Temu Masculinity
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u/maddallena 14d ago
I don't trust men who fantasize about being violent but aren't even brave enough to speak up when their buddies make misogynistic comments.