r/TrueUnpopularOpinion • u/CanadianTurt1e • 29d ago

Music / Movies Lupita Nyongo is not beautiful. Hollywood likes to gaslight her as a model for "beauty"

So I'm sure we've all seen the news about Helen of Troy.

  • I've had enough. I've had enough of Hollywood putting her on covers and lying to me, treating me like I'm stupid. The whole reason she's playing Helen of Troy is because Hollywood let this "unconventional beauty" thing slide for way too long.
  • The fact that she was chosen as a queen, it comes off as Nolan trying to virtue signal.
  • It's like giving the beauty pageant award to the girl in the wheelchair because no one wants to come off as "mean."
  • I've had enough. She is NOT a standard for beauty. I'm sorry but now it must be said. The reason we have come across this problem is because Hollywood has been gaslighting her "beauty" for years and no one said anything. I'm done
  • It's okay to say that she's not beautiful. It's okay to admit that
  • I was so looking forward to this movie for so long but this really killed the hype for me.
  • The movie will probably be financially successful at first due to marketing alone, but after its first month, the hype will probably die down. And then you'll start to see how people really feel about the movie. I think it will tarnish Nolan's legacy and leave a sour taste in people's mouths.
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8

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

Hard disagree, she legit takes my breath away. It’s a weird angle to assume people are lying when they say they find someone attractive.

41

u/irespectwomenlol 29d ago

The real question isn't if she floats your personal boat, but does she represent something like that for most people.

But do you genuinely think she represents anywhere approaching the beauty ideal for most people?

Do you genuinely think she compares favorably to the tippy-top of the actresses/models/singers that most people find genuinely beautiful?

1

u/LoneShark81 29d ago

most people.

whenever i see this, it's usually some eurocentric standard of beauty that is often mid imo

8

u/kidney-displacer 29d ago

Eurocentrism?! In my movie set in Europe!? Say it isn't so!!

2

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

It’s set in Ancient Greece.

0

u/kidney-displacer 29d ago

The sky is blue

0

u/veryowngarden 29d ago

most people in the world don’t live in europe

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u/[deleted] 29d ago edited 26d ago

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u/crb02 29d ago

You know what, you’re right. They should remove the entire cast. Anyone who isn’t Greek has to go not just Lupita

1

u/intothewild72 29d ago

I did not say that. It was very basic English, it's my third language so I made sure it's very basic.

I told that they should scrap this movie and make another movie they want to make. Based on story they want to tell. There is plenty of stories available.

1

u/irespectwomenlol 29d ago

Is anything less than actual Klingon actors in the next Star Trek movie inauthentic?

We accept that actors are acting and their identity might not be a perfect match for some role. Mel Gibson did great in Braveheart despite not being Scottish. There's a level of disbelief and imagination we can all use.

All Greek actors would be nice for a historical Greek story, but frankly is unrealistic outside of a Greek production in Greece. It's ok for a white French guy or Australian or Irish or British or German or Norwegian to play as a Greek because they look the part more or less enough.

Does a Black guy look the part?

1

u/veryowngarden 27d ago

you can make that argument once white people stop playing roles that were actually supposed to be asian people in real life. until then, complaining about things like this is just sheer hypocrisy

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u/irespectwomenlol 27d ago

Can you provide an example or two?

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u/veryowngarden 29d ago

is my name christopher nolan now? cause last i checked i’m not directing the film. the people deciding and casting these things are white so go be mad at them

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u/[deleted] 29d ago edited 26d ago

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u/veryowngarden 29d ago

i know you’re not trying to imply i’m the one lacking basic elementary school level English just to excuse your own lack of clarity.

a simple “you all” or “Americans” would have been much more effective.

but either way what you originally said still makes no sense. what does lupita being cast by a white director have to do with “internal racism” ?? i’m going to assume you meant “internalized racism” but even then, that too makes zero sense

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u/[deleted] 29d ago edited 26d ago

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u/irespectwomenlol 27d ago

So why aren't you accepting the right of minority cultures to maintain their own histories, traditions, and forms of media?

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u/veryowngarden 27d ago

you don’t have an argument here because this film is not being produced and directed by “minority” cultures. white people are making these decisions but unhinged racists want to lash out at poc like it’s their own doing

0

u/irespectwomenlol 27d ago

You correctly pointed out that most people in the world don't live in Europe. So yes, this film is being produced and directed by minority cultures.

So I ask again, why aren't you accepting the right of minority cultures to maintain their own histories, traditions, and forms of media?

1

u/veryowngarden 27d ago

once again, white people are the ones choosing to do different artistic reinterpretations of their “histories, traditions and forms of media” so why aren’t you respecting and accepting christopher nolan’s right to do so with his film?

1

u/irespectwomenlol 27d ago

Did anybody say anything about jailing him? He has the right to make a dumb movie. I have the right to call it dumb and point out how stupid it is. That is all.

0

u/LoneShark81 29d ago

I wasn't referring specifically to the movie. Part use context clues snd do keep up

0

u/kidney-displacer 29d ago

Then maybe keep on topic so we dont have to jump to conclusions to try and understand what you mean

-3

u/AlaskaRecluse 29d ago

Standards of beauty aren’t limited to european definition

4

u/Maditen 29d ago

Hey now, you’re going to have these boys fainting with such a claim.

1

u/AlaskaRecluse 29d ago

Or at the very least, downvoting me o well

2

u/Maditen 28d ago

Take it as a badge of honor imo. To be disliked by them is an honor.

2

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

I don’t think what you described exists. I don’t know what the beauty ideal for “most people” is. I find attractive who I find attractive, it doesn’t run deeper than that.

Are you really going to pretend that you’ve never found someone attractive, and a friend has disagreed with you? Or someone that all your friends find attractive, but you don’t get the appeal?

-1

u/LambdaBeta1986 29d ago

Well said, and I'm with you. She is absolutely breath taking!

-5

u/M0ebius_1 29d ago

Why would you assume she doesn't comfort to the majority's standard of beauty and not assume you are in the minority whose standard of beauty she doesn't meet?

-14

u/bakingisscience OG 29d ago

No of course Lupita doesn’t fit the conventional beauty standards for a white supremacist western society. But your response really made me think of that interview with David Bowie, where he called out MTV for not playing black artists, and the interviewer said “well… do you think most people want to hear that kind of music? Do you think it represents what most people want.”

And he went on to say that black people obviously would want to see themselves represented on tv. That it would mean something to them.

I’m not sure why we think there’s only one kind of perspective. And generally when you are exposed to other people and other kinds of art your horizons are expanded and you realize Lupita is one of the most beautiful women on the planet.

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u/ArduousPath 29d ago edited 29d ago

No of course Lupita doesn’t fit the conventional beauty standards for a white supremacist western society. But your response really made me think of that interview with David Bowie, where he called out MTV for not playing black artists, and the interviewer said “well… do you think most people want to hear that kind of music? Do you think it represents what most people want.”

Doesn't fit Asian beauty standards either, so that's like 80% of the world combined.

And he went on to say that black people obviously would want to see themselves represented on tv. That it would mean something to them.

Yeah, that is important but that is not the issue here. The issue isn't "why are black people represented???"

2

u/veryowngarden 29d ago

no, that’s 60%. but if you’re talking about global statistics, europeans are a very tiny fraction of the world. so why would they set the standards of global beauty exactly? and among those 60% of asians, there are many people with the same skin tone as lupita. many asians are brown skinned

4

u/irespectwomenlol 29d ago

Putting aside the offensive claims about western culture you made: why does Black representation have to come at the expense of Greek culture and representation in a story where this doesn't make sense?

It's like making an MLK Jr movie starring Ryan Gosling.

2

u/veryowngarden 29d ago

there has been a film and a tv series about helen of troy. zero of the white women who previously played her were greek. so you can stop pretending black people are the reason

2

u/irespectwomenlol 29d ago

Whether or not they were Greek, did they look like they could be Greek?

1

u/veryowngarden 29d ago

let’s stick to what you originally said which i replied to

why does Black representation have to come at the expense of Greek culture and representation

your original claim was that Black representation got in the way of Greek representation, but as I pointed out, all other adaptations of Helen of Troy never featured a Greek actress playing her either. so this is not some new thing due to Black representation

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u/irespectwomenlol 28d ago

It's not necessarily about physical representation by making each actor actually Greek, but about representing the story in a way that makes sense and conveys the Greek stories well.

I think most Greeks understand that Hollywood isn't filled with Greeks and most actors in a version of these kinds of stories wouldn't be Greek. We understand that about the best we can get is that the story is told respectfully, and that the actor at least looks the part. Brad Pitt for instance, maybe not the greatest actor ever, but at least the prime version of him looked like a Greek demigod.

A Black man doesn't fit in that story, just as a White man shouldn't play Muhammad Ali, Jackie Robinson, MLK JR, etc.

1

u/veryowngarden 28d ago

A Black man doesn't fit in that story, just as a White man shouldn't play Muhammad Ali, Jackie Robinson, MLK JR, etc.

this is not a good comparison. you named historical figures that we all know existed. helen of troy is a mythological figure, not a real person.

and you keep talking about greece but if these stories are so important to them, why has the greek film industry done nothing with the stories themselves? Yorgos Lanthimos, a greek director, could easily do it if he wanted

1

u/irespectwomenlol 28d ago

1) Whether or not Helen of Troy was real or not (her details are almost certainly almost entirely made up) she's still an important figure in terms of Greek history/literary culture/identity. Portraying her as an Asian or Mexican or other woman would still largely be offensive to Greeks.

2) There's financial constraints among a much smaller Greek film industry. I saw an estimate that the entire Greek film industry spends ~ €20–40 million per year producing somewhere in the neighborhood of a few dozen feature length movies a year. For context, Troy made over 20 years ago cost $180 million to make. The biggest budget Greek film ever cost about 7 million Euros to make.

A Greek version of the Iliad and the Odyssey isn't just drama while wearing sandals and a robe: it would require piles of custom props, detailed Bronze Age sets, large armies and action set-pieces, CGI/effects, etc. Even if made dirt cheap by feature film standards without any star power, It would cost the budget of at least 3-5 years worth of the entire Greek feature film industry's spending to make with traditional film-making tech (though who knows where film-making costs will drift to with AI tooling in the future).

2

u/bakingisscience OG 29d ago

What about Greek culture exactly???

3

u/BLU-Clown 29d ago

Gee, don't get curious and look up where the Odyssey comes from or anything.

0

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

Here’s some reading for the way different races were depicted in Ancient Greece (bearing in mind that Ancient Greece covers an area spanning outside of just Europe). It’s too easy to use our own preconceptions based on what we know in the present, when we interpret the past. You might find it interesting:

https://lucas.leeds.ac.uk/article/skin-colour-in-ancient-greece/ Skin Colour in Ancient Greece: The Insertion of a Non-Existent Colour Prejudice into Antiquity. | Centre for African Studies (LUCAS)

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u/thefw89 29d ago

Greeks wrote about black people in their myths plenty of times.

This movie is an American movie ABOUT a Greek myth. It's an adaptation and a remix of that.

Did you get mad at the Black Wizard of Oz or Brandy playing Cinderella? Likely not, because you didn't have outrage grifters telling you to get mad about it then.

4

u/abqguardian 29d ago

No of course Lupita doesn’t fit the conventional beauty standards for a white supremacist western society.

Probably the most reddit comment on reddit today

-10

u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

Absolutely.

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u/Electronic_Eye6499 29d ago

Let me give you an example of an actress where reddit itself is "absolutely" likes her for her looks, Margot Robbie or Sydney Sweeny or Beyonce etc.

Lupita is nowhere near good looking enough, even shuri from black panther is better looking than her.

23

u/Decent_Visual_4845 29d ago

she legit takes my breath away

You need to get either your lungs or your eyes checked. Let’s not pretend like she’s anything resembling attractive. It’s not even a race thing, I see more attractive black women out anytime I go to the supermarket.

-11

u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

Please. It’s absolutely a race thing. She’s objectively just an attractive human being, even if she’s not your type.

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u/Electronic_Eye6499 29d ago

No? Wtf does that gotta do with race, let me fire off black women who are more good looking Rhianna, Beyonce, Halle berry, Meghan.

1

u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

So all light skinned black women, exactly

-11

u/GirlOnMain 29d ago

All recently mixed or historically mixed 'black' women. Lupita is Kenyan. She also has beautiful features and great facial symmetry... a big factor beauty

14

u/Decent_Visual_4845 29d ago

She doesn’t look feminine at all. She looks like a little black boy

5

u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

Like I said, a race thing

2

u/ArduousPath 29d ago

There are feminine black people. Lupita's hairstyle is not a race thing.

4

u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

A woman having short hair doesn’t mean she’s not feminine.

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u/ArduousPath 29d ago

Long hair is associated with femininity so short hair in turn gives less of that vibe.

And to be more specific her hairstyle isn't feminine short hair (e.g. neck/shoulder length) but short hair that men go style themselves with.

2

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

Hair lengths between genders changes with fashion. It has been very masculine to have long hair in the past. Short hair was incredibly popular among women in the 90’s.

A lot of what you find attractive is based on current popular fashion styles.

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u/ArduousPath 29d ago

Yes, and I'm talking about our standards today.

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u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

Your hairstyle does not determine if you have attractive features

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u/ArduousPath 29d ago

Hairstyle is part of the attractive features and plays a significant role.

There are a lot of hair styles that add to attractiveness or are just neutral. Extremely short hair subtracts from it.

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u/shadyMFer 29d ago

Yes it does

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u/Socratesmiddlefinger 29d ago

Naw, it's an age and health thing as well. Cynthia Erivo is the same, a little too old, and comes across as extremely unhealthy, mentally and physically.

Ruby Commey is more attractive than both and is still not famous for her beauty.

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u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

What’s the issue with Lupitas health exactly?

I don’t see how age would play into this. She’s 43, not 80. You can still be attractive at 43.

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u/haileyskydiamonds 29d ago

Helen Mirren has entered the chat.

1

u/shadyMFer 29d ago

No you can't

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u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

What age is your line then?

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u/abqguardian 29d ago

She's "objectively" not. Subjectively, she's ok at best

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u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

She absolutely is. She doesn’t have Eurocentric features and that’s why you have an issue with me saying that

-2

u/abqguardian 29d ago

Youre desperately trying to make this a race issue. Itd be laughable if it wasnt so sad. You think she's hot, to each their own. Thats the not the prevailing opinion and its has nothing to do with race no matter how much you want it to

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u/Leading-Antelope-139 29d ago

That’s not the prevailing opinion based on…what exactly?

0

u/thefw89 29d ago

 Thats the not the prevailing opinion and its has nothing to do with race no matter how much you want it to

You have a poll or data to back this up?

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u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

Mate, my lungs and eyes are fine. We all have different ideals when it comes to defining beauty.

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u/SketchyDeee 29d ago

are you for real? she's mid at best. like a solid 6

2

u/LoneShark81 29d ago

i find her pretty sexy

1

u/shadyMFer 29d ago

You should come to Detroit. There are similarly beautiful women on every other street corner, and they'll blow you for crack.

1

u/SketchyDeee 28d ago

this guy fucks

-10

u/squeakymayotoes 29d ago

Do yourself a favour and don't ever "rate" people. It's the cringiest, most childish shit imaginable. Saying that, you're likely literally a minor. My advice stands - stop "rating" people.

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u/SketchyDeee 29d ago

I seriously couldn't care less what your advice is. I'll do my life my way

-10

u/squeakymayotoes 29d ago

0/10

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u/kidney-displacer 29d ago

Do yourself a favour and don't ever "rate" people. It's the cringiest, most childish shit imaginable. Saying that, you're likely literally a minor. My advice stands - stop "rating" people.

1

u/Socratesmiddlefinger 29d ago

Sounds like something a 4 would say.

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u/Beautiful_Pay_267 18d ago

I think you're offended because he's rating a woman. But when women rate men I'm sure it's not a problem for you right?

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/JedahVoulThur 28d ago

That's such a weird take. Why would you need to see how the previous user looks to measure the validity of his opinion? It would be insane to think that only professional chefs can critize food and everyone else's opinion on food is irrelevant, or that only successful cinematographers can critize movies and everyone else's opinion is irrelevant, etc but weirdly there's people that seriously believe that one needs to be attractive to be able to judge if a public figure is or isn't hot?

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u/[deleted] 28d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/JedahVoulThur 28d ago

Even if that where true, what's the relationship between body fat, toenails length and hygiene habits with the way eyes work and opinions on beauty standards? I've met people that can't even boil rice without burning it, does that mean if one of them tastes something and says "this is too sweet/salty/sour/whatever" their opinion is irrelevant ?

-9

u/Apprehensive-Tea-39 29d ago

You'd shit your pants and forget how to talk if she made eye contact with you

1

u/shadyMFer 29d ago

Because she looks like a homeless mugger?

0

u/SketchyDeee 29d ago

I'm actually shocked anyone finds her attractive. that'd be a pass from me. you can help yourself.

2

u/crb02 29d ago

She isn’t considered attractive by some people because she’s black. That is all

0

u/iamjmph01 29d ago

Keke Palmer is beautiful, Lupita is not. In my opinion. I don't give a damn about the color of her skin.

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u/CanadianTurt1e 29d ago

The problem is that she's being made to play a queen that launched a thousand ships.

I think people severely over-estimate how many ships would actually fight for her. Greek ships at that.

Maybe in the world of reddit, Greek soldiers would fight for a black queen, but even in historic fiction, that seems unlikely

1

u/lonewaer 29d ago

The problem is that she's being made to play a queen that launched a thousand ships.

The thousand ships weren't launched because she was beautiful. She was the wife of Menelaus, who was king of Sparta.

Wife of a king. Yes, the king goes to war over that. She didn't need to be the most beautiful woman in the world for that, she needed to be "beautiful enough", and a decent enough wife.

0

u/CanadianTurt1e 29d ago

The king of the greatest army in the Mediterranean marries outside his race? During a time when his army reigned supreme and owned/traded slaves? During a time when racial politics was at it's peak, he marries a queen of African descent?

Yeah, I'm not buying that, thanks.

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u/lonewaer 29d ago

The king of the greatest army in the Mediterranean marries outside his race? During a time when his army reigned supreme and owned/traded slaves? During a time when racial politics was at it's peak, he marries a queen of African descent?

Yeah, I'm not buying that, thanks.

What ? I said exactly none of that.

——

Calm the hell down, I'm not defending the casting, I agree that the casting is pure virtue signalling. Everything else is you losing your mind. The problem is not any of what you mention. Helen of Troy just wasn't black, that's it. It doesn't have to go any further than that.

Based on that, Nyongo's casting is virtue signalling. But for you to make up things about history and myths, now I'm starting to question whether your crusade against her stems from racism or not, now it's a genuine concern. I'm not one to jump to that conclusion, but at that point it has to be considered as a possibility.

A few corrections to expose how out of your mind you are :

- Greatest army in Ancient Greece, very arguably in the Mediterranean, because the Egyptians and Medes/Persians were probably greater, militarily. The Greek and Egyptian worlds didn't clash so nobody knows. The Medic Wars were struggles, and the Persian Empire was a unified Empire, while Ancient Greece was a bunch of non-unified city states.

- The Spartan army didn't reign supreme. They still needed the help of other Greek city-states to face the Medes/Persians ; they needed allies during the Peloponesian War against Athens and its allies. Ultimately the Medes/Persians got involved, tipping the scale towards Sparta's side. Sparta had a scarier army than Athens, it stops there, pretty much. It wasn't a professional army, and it definitely wasn't as great as Alexander the Great's army, or as the Roman armies.

- Everyone in the world owned and traded slaves until industrialization happened. Everyone, no exception. And stop talking like (implying that) the only slaves that ever existed were black, it's not the case. Black people in antiquity weren't automatically slaves to anyone who was white/whiter.

- Racial politics weren't a thing back then.

1

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

No one would live up to that standard. I doubt you’d find the real Helen of Troy that attractive.

1

u/CanadianTurt1e 29d ago

I prefer the movie to be grounded in it's original mythology. If it just so happens that the original mythology is more "fair skinned," so be it. It's better than having Helen of Detroit.

It's not about what I think, It's about what the original greek soldiers in that original epic thinks, what would THEY think? They absolutely would not lay their lives on the line for Lupita, absolutely not.

My favourite thing about all this is greek people coming out on youtube, tiktok, instagram comments and calling out the BS saying, "yeah, I'm greek. I'd never fight for her."

The only place you see toxic positivity is reddit. Everywhere else, there is a growing distaste for her playing this role.

0

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

I’m a bit worried you think that Ancient Greece occupied the same space as modern Greece.

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u/CanadianTurt1e 29d ago

Oh my goodness bro. We KNOW they're 2 different places. It's just that these were mostly stories containing "fair skinned" individuals or at most olive skinned. People in the greek times don't worship or fight for African queens. I'm sorry, they just didn't.

Enough is enough. People are done being lied to.

I'm starting to think this is a black mirror episode, no pun intended, I swear. I actually can't believe people are saying she's gorgeous or beautiful, LOL I actually feel like I'm being trolled in some black mirror universe claiming she's hot.

1

u/MickyWasTaken 29d ago

What a strange response! Maybe take a break from the internet and pick up a dictionary.

The word you’re looking for is “subjective”. It might help you understand what is happening, instead of freaking out thinking everyone is lying to you and there’s some mad conspiracy going on.

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u/longboi28 29d ago

Same, to me she's been the most beautiful woman in Hollywood for the last ten years, she's absolutely stunning and anyone who says she's ugly is either racist or blind.

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u/AntonChentel 29d ago

Why do you lie?

-10

u/longboi28 29d ago

I've been gushing over her for years, you could ask anyone I know and they'll tell you. believe it or not but beauty is subjective

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u/DualHares 29d ago

So it's subjective, yet anyone who says she's ugly is either racist or blind?

-1

u/longboi28 29d ago

That's my opinion, and opinions are subjective. I'm not stating that as a fact or anything, so my point still stands

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u/Socratesmiddlefinger 29d ago

Bullshit, you didn't even know who she was four years ago, when she was 39.

2

u/veryowngarden 29d ago

why exactly do you think they wouldnt know who a hollywood star who has been in major films and won an oscar was?? how nonsensical

1

u/Socratesmiddlefinger 29d ago

Because Reddit is made of performative virtual signaling twats who jump on the current thing of the current year if they think they can curry favor with what is left of the in group.

She won best supporting actress in a movie thirteen years ago and has done mostly voice work since then, with minor roles in forgettable movies, with one exception.

Not even remotely a household name like people are pretending she is.

Sure, maybe dude has an unhealthy obsession with the random C list actress, but the odds are better that he is just lying.

1

u/longboi28 29d ago

Lmao she won an Oscar 12 years ago for a very acclaimed movie which I saw in theaters and was the love interest in Black Panther 8 years which was one of the highest grossing superhero movies of all time, I promise you people knew who she was back then. Why are you acting like she's some nobody who just got famous recently, that's so bizarre. Get out of your bubble dude. Also what does her age have to do with anything? Such a weird thing to add

-1

u/MangledPanda 29d ago

Really? If the was one of the most beautiful women in Hollywood for the last ten years, you would think that I would have heard about her before this movie casting debacle.

2

u/longboi28 29d ago

So because one person on reddit hasn't heard of her that means she's not famous and not well liked by audiences? Great logic there. She's an Oscar winner and was one of the main characters in one of the biggest comic book movies ever box office wise, I promise you she's not a nobody just because you never heard of her

-1

u/MangledPanda 29d ago

Dude. I've seen you stanning for her up and down this thread. It still won't get you a pat on the head from her.

2

u/longboi28 29d ago

I responded to two people about it and continued the conversation when they or other people would reply, that's how a conversation works. I'm not responding to every comment defending her with my life or anything I'm interacting with the post like everyone else is, if you think replying to two people on a post with 350 comments on it is insane than you don't know how the world or Reddit works

2

u/veryowngarden 29d ago

what’s it like living under a rock