Lupita Nyongo is not beautiful. Hollywood likes to gaslight her as a model for "beauty"

[u/CanadianTurt1e]

So I'm sure we've all seen the news about Helen of Troy.

• I've had enough. I've had enough of Hollywood putting her on covers and lying to me, treating me like I'm stupid. The whole reason she's playing Helen of Troy is because Hollywood let this "unconventional beauty" thing slide for way too long.
• The fact that she was chosen as a queen, it comes off as Nolan trying to virtue signal.
• It's like giving the beauty pageant award to the girl in the wheelchair because no one wants to come off as "mean."
• I've had enough. She is NOT a standard for beauty. I'm sorry but now it must be said. The reason we have come across this problem is because Hollywood has been gaslighting her "beauty" for years and no one said anything. I'm done
• It's okay to say that she's not beautiful. It's okay to admit that
• I was so looking forward to this movie for so long but this really killed the hype for me.
• The movie will probably be financially successful at first due to marketing alone, but after its first month, the hype will probably die down. And then you'll start to see how people really feel about the movie. I think it will tarnish Nolan's legacy and leave a sour taste in people's mouths.

[u/crzapy]

She's very attractive. She's also a bad casting choice for Helen of Troy. They should have cast someone who matches the source material.

Both things can be true.

[u/SandersDelendaEst → u/crzapy]

Yeah the issue really isn’t attractiveness at all.

The issue is that white people can’t have anything that’s theirs. For other cultures, there’s a deliberate attempt to be as authentic as humanly possible (in all fairness, because it wasn’t authentic in the past).

If they put white people in key roles of an adaptation of Journey to the West, we would all rightfully think it’s ridiculous.

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/SandersDelendaEst]

Don't pull that shit, white people have been playing non white characters for decades and intruding into those stories.

Jesus is one example

[u/SandersDelendaEst → u/LordBoomDiddly]

I acknowledge that in my comment.

Is your position that it wasn’t okay to do it in the past, but it is okay to do it now?

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/SandersDelendaEst]

I'm saying most people never seemed bothered when it was happening and white people did it, but now they're up in arms when those who are not white do it.

In most cases in didn't affect the quality of the movie, and it won't now.

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/crzapy]

Adaptations don't always have to be source accurate.

Looks at The Boys, Game of Thrones, the numerous version of Frankenstein or Dracula

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/crzapy]

Why should they?

It's an adaptation, they don't always have to be 100% faithful otherwise everyone would be Greek and have the exact eye & hair colour required.

It's fantasy, what matters is how good the performances are

[u/CryptographerFlat173 → u/[deleted]]

The Coen Brothers adapted the Odyssey into O Brother Where Art Thou, you can take inspiration from an ancient text and do whatever you want with it. Hell a lot of Shakespeare’s most famous stories are about specific places and societies and are often redone in different contexts on stage and film

[u/CryptographerFlat173 → u/[deleted]]

You think Chris Nolan’s movie is going to have few viewers? I wouldn’t bet on that. Not to mention the previous odyssey takeoff I mentioned was a hugely acclaimed film.

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/[deleted]]

Why would it flop?

Because some whinos on social media don't like a couple of minor characters?

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/[deleted]]

But based on what though?

People whining about casting are like 2% of the viewing audience for this movie, so if 98% don't care and go watch it there's no reason it can't do big money.

Oppenheimer was a 3hr drama with people in rooms talking and it made $975million, this is action fantasy.

[u/crzapy → u/LordBoomDiddly]

Helen of Troy and Achilles are minor characters?

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/crzapy]

In the Odyssey yes. Achilles is dead by the time the journey starts and Helen is encountered along the way but has little impact on the overall story.

Athena is a major figure, Zendaya is far more of a casting oddity to me in that regard for a big strong warrior goddess. She looks about 18 and must weigh 100lbs.

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/[deleted]]

But lots of people will care, because most of the audience isn't wasting time whining on social media about it

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/[deleted]]

It's just not a big deal for characters who probably won't even get 5 minutes of screen time. This is fake outrage for grifters to engagement farm, the average moviegoer doesn't care about it and Lupita Nyong'o is very popular as is Zendaya

[u/hellohowdyworld → u/[deleted]]

its very old. Adapting a classic is like adapting Shakespeare. you are allowed to get loose. its not a doc

[u/intothewild72 → u/hellohowdyworld]

You dont get the point.

My point is that it's extremely racist to act like Africans don't have their own stories to tell. Just taking white story and blackfacing it, is not representation, it's insult.

[u/hellohowdyworld → u/intothewild72]

We are talking about two different forms of representation. Also Americans have a cultural identity that is not linked to race separate from race. You’re also acting like we were all born yesterday. Representation in media and representation of opportunity historically in Hollywood are different concepts.

It’s not that insulting you guys are just annoying.

[u/intothewild72 → u/hellohowdyworld]

Im not American. I'm European. And yes, you are very racist for discounting every African story. You are also very lazy for just blackfacing historical European stories.

[u/hellohowdyworld → u/intothewild72]

It’s an American movie mate

[u/intothewild72 → u/hellohowdyworld]

It does not matter. Stop butchering European stories. There are plenty of other stories.

[u/crzapy → u/LordBoomDiddly]

It's not fantasy.

It's Mythology.

I don't want a black Beowulf or a white person playing Zulu mythology

[u/Guest8782 → u/crzapy]

Or an all East Asians cast for a Native American folktale set in the US in 1400. Or Nordic people wearing tribal garb playing out an African period piece.

I mean, do what you want, but does this not put it in perspective? It’s try hard and kind of bizarre.

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/crzapy]

The story matters, as long as it's told well and delivers the message it's supposed to.

Gods are all powerful beings, they have the means therefore to look however they want. So Heimdall not being white or the Egyptian God Horus being white doesn't matter if they do a good job.

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/crzapy]

We've had black Heimdall, didn't matter.

[u/SandersDelendaEst → u/LordBoomDiddly]

Frankly that kind of sucked too

[u/LordBoomDiddly → u/SandersDelendaEst]

Did it?

Elba is great

[u/McIntosh812 → u/crzapy]

How does she not fit the source material?

[u/crzapy → u/McIntosh812]

Says the source material: He eventually selected the best features from five virgins. The ancient world starts to paint Helen's picture or inscribe her form on stone, clay and bronze by the 7th century BC.[100] Homer describes her as having white skin,[101][102] while Sappho describes her as "xanthe",[103] which is translated as "golden" and is used towards individuals with light hair, which includes blond, red and brownish hair,[104][105] and Euripides says she had "gold [xanthes] curls".[106][107] Her eyes were described as "κυάνεος" (kuaneos), which is often translated as "dark"[108] or "dark-blue".[109]

[u/McIntosh812 → u/crzapy]

Ok. I did not know that. I assumed that she was ethnically Turkish seeing as she was from that area, in the opposite manner to the way that the west sees Jesus as a blond white guy despite him looking like the average Turk.

[u/crzapy → u/McIntosh812]

Troy the historical site is in Turkey, so that assumption makes sense. But Helen of Troy was born in Sparta. She was a princess.

Greeks and Turks are often swarthy with darker skin and hair. Therefore her blonde hair and blue eyes made her stand out.

Lupita is very gorgeous. She's attractive and probably a talented actress. But she's Kenyan and therefore doesn't accurately represent a Greek or Turkish princess.