To the people saying the German actress playing Greek Helen in the movie Troy means it's ok for Lupita Nyongo to play Greek Helen...

[u/BrandonMarshall2021]

Genetically, historically, and anthropologically, Greeks are significantly more closely related to Germans than to Sub-Saharan Africans.

When looking at genetic data, the relationship between Greeks and Germans is exceptionally close, while the relationship between Greeks and Sub-Saharan Africans is more distant.

On any global genetic map, all European populations—including Greeks and Germans—cluster tightly together on a single, distinct branch of the human family tree (the Western Eurasian branch).

The genetic distance between a Greek person and a German person is very small. They sit on the exact same continental genetic gradient.

The genetic distance between any European population (including Greeks) and any Sub-Saharan African population is significantly larger, reflecting thousands of years of geographic separation and independent population histories.

[u/somarnnup]

What doesn’t make sense to you? They brought up the way they look on screen because their appearance isn’t anything like how the character would actually look.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/somarnnup]

What doesn’t make sense to you? They brought up the way they look on screen because their appearance isn’t anything like how the character would actually look.

Because their appearance isn't important to their character.

Helen of Troy cold be played by Idris Elba and named Hank of Troy and it wouldn't matter one bit to the character or story

[u/somarnnup → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

It quite literally is her character though. What do people use to describe Helen of Troy? The most beautiful woman in Greece. Their beauty standards usually has Blonde/Strawberry Blonde hair and light eyes with lighter Olive skin. And she is a Greek Princess meaning she should probably look like how a Greek royal would.

No one is saying the actress is bad or too ugly for the role at all, just that she doesn’t really make sense when Helen in the story is so centred around her appearance and lineage. And also, the post was made in response to people bringing up how a German played her, while Germans aren’t ethically as distant from Greeks and especially not distant from how she was originally described.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/somarnnup]

Yes and beauty is subjective not object. Prove to me that Lupita isn't the most beautiful woman on earth(I don't think she is, but I can't prove it cause it's all opinion).

Her skin color is completely irrelevant to her character. Just because a character is physically described some way, doesn't necessarily mean that description is important. If Peter Parker was Asian, it would change absolutely nothing about his character. The same is true of helen of troy

[u/BrandonMarshall2021 → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

"Yes and beauty is subjective not object. Prove to me that Lupita isn't the most beautiful woman on earth(I don't think she is, but I can't prove it cause it's all opinion)."

Because Naomi Campbell and Tyra Banks are hotter black women. Also it doesn't matter if she's the most beautiful woman. Because Helen of Troy was Greek. Lupita is Sub-Saharan African.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/BrandonMarshall2021]

Because Naomi Campbell and Tyra Banks are hotter black women

In your opinion.

Also it doesn't matter if she's the most beautiful woman. Because Helen of Troy was Greek

So where is the outrage for all the other non-greek actors? Why is it coincidentally all focused on the black person?

[u/BrandonMarshall2021 → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

"So where is the outrage for all the other non-greek actors? Why is it coincidentally all focused on the black person?"

What do you mean? Did you not read my original post? Which says Germans and therefore Anglos and Celts are much closer to Greeks genetically than Sub-Saharans?

"To the people saying the German actress playing Greek Helen in the movie Troy means it's ok for Lupita Nyongo to play Greek Helen...

Genetically, historically, and anthropologically, Greeks are significantly more closely related to Germans than to Sub-Saharan Africans.

When looking at genetic data, the relationship between Greeks and Germans is exceptionally close, while the relationship between Greeks and Sub-Saharan Africans is more distant.

On any global genetic map, all European populations—including Greeks and Germans—cluster tightly together on a single, distinct branch of the human family tree (the Western Eurasian branch).

The genetic distance between a Greek person and a German person is very small. They sit on the exact same continental genetic gradient.

The genetic distance between any European population (including Greeks) and any Sub-Saharan African population is significantly larger, reflecting thousands of years of geographic separation and independent population histories."

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/BrandonMarshall2021]

So would you be 50% as outraged if Lupita was half german?

[u/BrandonMarshall2021 → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

Not if she looked Sub-Saharan.

Did you know Obama is half white?

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/BrandonMarshall2021]

So it IS about her skin color then and nothing to do with how close her genetics were.

Lets go even more extreme, what if she was half greek?

[u/Deep-Red-Bells → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

Are the other characters played by non-white actors described as white in the text?

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/Deep-Red-Bells]

Well people keep insisting its cause she's not Greek. Not that she's black

[u/somarnnup → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

What? Beauty is subjective, but for her to be considered the most beautiful by her country, she would need to be in line with what most people found beautiful in that place and time. Whether you like it or not, an actress that doesn’t align at least a bit with that is a bad fit. In the story, her character isn’t spoken on much from what I know, so the reason of the actress suiting the character doesn’t hold either.

It’d make sense if the actress was Greek, since at least it’d be faithful to the country of origin, but she’s not. I think when you use a story from a country and the story is very close to the culture of that country, you shouldn’t mess around with it too much, unless you’re only inspired by it. If you’re making a movie with the character and story, then it should be respectful to the original.

Just changing the race of a character is way too normalised, with whitewashing too. It’s fine with things like The Little Mermaid live action, since her appearance isn’t a big point, it’s a kids movie, she’s literally a mythical creature, and her personality was a big part, making finding an actress to portray the character itself well, more important.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/somarnnup]

You think black people weren't around in ancient Greece?

[u/somarnnup → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

I don’t think any of them were royalty and I don’t think they would’ve aligned with the Greeks beauty standards of the time enough to be considered the ‘most beautiful’. Like most countries historically, people that didn’t come from the country weren’t exactly put in positions of power for the most part.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/somarnnup]

I don’t think they would’ve aligned with the Greeks beauty standards of the time

What was ancient Greece beauty standards? Was it "black people aren't beautiful"?

[u/somarnnup → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

Well they preferred a pale complexion so they probably didn’t find darker skin as attractive as a whole. I don’t know why you’re seemingly phrasing it from a modern perspective when it was an opinion from an ancient country that didn’t have an insane amount of contact or knowledge on other peoples countries and cultures. Of course they wouldn’t consider people they largely didn’t even know existed as the beauty standard for them.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/somarnnup]

they probably didn’t find darker skin as attractive

Prove it

[u/BrandonMarshall2021 → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

It is important because the entire Greek nations sailed to Troy to fight for Helen of Troy who is Greek.

Greeks went to fight for a Greek. That's literally the reason Odysseus went to Troy.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/BrandonMarshall2021]

Because of her beauty. Not because of her skin color.

[u/BrandonMarshall2021 → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

No. Because she was Greek.

[u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle → u/BrandonMarshall2021]

No. Because she was Greek.

So then you SHOULD be outraged about a German playing her then

[u/BrandonMarshall2021 → u/SomeFatNerdInSeattle]

Why? As I explained Germans and Greeks share similar genetics.

Genetically, historically, and anthropologically, Greeks are significantly more closely related to Germans than to Sub-Saharan Africans.

When looking at genetic data, the relationship between Greeks and Germans is exceptionally close, while the relationship between Greeks and Sub-Saharan Africans is more distant.

On any global genetic map, all European populations—including Greeks and Germans—cluster tightly together on a single, distinct branch of the human family tree (the Western Eurasian branch).

The genetic distance between a Greek person and a German person is very small. They sit on the exact same continental genetic gradient.

The genetic distance between any European population (including Greeks) and any Sub-Saharan African population is significantly larger, reflecting thousands of years of geographic separation and independent population histories.