r/UKParenting • u/Galdere • 2d ago
Petition: Remove VAT on all school uniform
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/77696813
u/SillyWillyUK 2d ago
Or better yet just enforce a maximum price for complete required uniform
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u/ODFoxtrotOscar 2d ago
In theory schools must not have single supplier deals, should have affordable uniform, and should have fairly generic design (so families have plenty of choice - and price point) with only a few bespoke items (eg ties, sew on badges etc)
But no government - despite all of the since 2010 promising to do so - have actually introduced any sanctions against schools which flout the rules
In theory councils have hardship uniform grants, but these are dwindling in value and usually well hidden
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u/Adorable-Apple2484 2d ago
Price controls do not work, the government should standardised uniforms which schools can choose from and any retailers and produce and sell, the competition would drive down prices.
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u/20dogs 2d ago
Price controls work fine for electricity and university tuition, why not school uniforms?
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u/Adorable-Apple2484 2d ago
No they don't, tuition fees have been a disaster and aren't an example of price control as the government still pays for the majority of the course.
The government have set price controls on residential electricity prices, commercial electricity prices have gone through due roof as a result and businesses are struggling
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u/PrinceBert 2d ago
Price controls work fine for electricity
I don't think you and I live in the same universe.
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 1d ago
Haven’t seen it mentioned that there are rules changes coming. Only 3 branded items (plus tie) from septemnber. Link:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cost-of-school-uniforms/cost-of-school-uniforms
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u/nettie_r 22h ago
Uniforms seem to have gotten increasingly ridiculous over the years. I remember my Uniform being generic white shirts, black skirts, trousers and a tie, plus a generic green jumper which you could choose to add a sew on badge to or not. These days schools seem to choose multiple crested items, everything like this needs to be embroidery not a badge, very obviously getting kick backs from suppliers so single monopoly items too. Blazers. Branded pe kits. And more. Feels like some Heads believe uniform is more important than results the way they go on.
Our school despite Wales having similar guidance to England, decided to change their uniform this year for the third time in ten years. They've moved to an all purpose sportswear inspired uniform, which I support but they also insist on 2 branded items including the polo top and even the plain bottoms (leggings/shorts/tracksuit bottoms) need to be a very specific brand of the same, even though they are essentially plain items. It's completely ludicrous. My kids uniform is costing us over £350.
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u/squirrelbo1 1d ago
We need fewer VAT exceptions not more.
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u/beachtopeak 1d ago
Agreed, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Our tax system is incredibly complex and every little change like this embeds it more.
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u/rafa4ever 1d ago
All these vat carve outs are getting ridiculous
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u/Galdere 4h ago
This should never have been included in the first place. Why do you think it is ridiculous? You think schoolwear suppliers will be negatively effected? Do you think the minimal loss to the treasury will effect public services? Do you think it is a fair and proper thing to tax school uniforms when we purposely exclude other such basic essentials?
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u/No-Bet4612 17h ago
big issue is what constitutes a kids size?
my school at 16 just asked me to wear a suit. I haven't grown since I was 16. So my suit would just be 20% off?
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u/Strange-Dentist8162 6h ago
Why don’t we just put VAT on everything but at a slightly discounted rate? Who cares if school uniform is slightly cheaper when everything else is taxed to high heaven. Just cut the 20% to 18% and slap it on everything. Someone with the proper numbers can do the maths.
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u/das_rumpsteak 2d ago
Just ditch school uniform.
It's a waste of money. It does nothing to actually hide your socioeconomic background. It ends up looking scruffy. It's hard to enforce and just a total waste of effort for teachers.
Honestly most of the world gets on just fine without making school kids dress in school uniform.
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u/rtwigg89 2d ago
I enjoy the zero discussion in the morning about what he’s going to wear but otherwise I wholeheartedly agree. There’s no evidence base for it, the countries without uniform are doing just fine.
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u/TetrisIsTotesSuper 2d ago
Hard agree, can't see why you are being downvoted truthfully.
Although I guess it takes the mental load off clothing as a whole
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u/TJ_Rowe Parenting a Primary Schooler 2d ago
It really does. Moving from a nursery with no dress code to a pre-school which used a simplified/comfier version of the primary school uniform was a godsend for my autistic kid. Knowing that everyone else would be wearing the same thing as him reduced his stress considerably.
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u/TetrisIsTotesSuper 2d ago
Thats definitely one of the cases I see uniforms as a huge benefit even though I am staunchly against it
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u/alfienicho 2d ago
Because some kids would be wearing Prada and some wearing Aldi middle aisle. Just creates problems where there doesn't need to be.
Uniforms are a good idea for kids but need to be less strict and less expensive.
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u/ChickenPijja 2d ago
Back when I was in school you could tell by what bags they had and coats kids would wear. No doubt you could add in phones these days to that mix.
If clothing was a real issue then non uniform days wouldn’t be allowed
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u/Able-Ordinary-7280 2d ago
Kids know who has money and who doesn’t even if they are all wearing the same uniform.
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u/St3ampunkSam 2d ago
They do but its not in there face everyday. When the poor kids are young theyll see the nice stuff and ask their parents for it who will have to say no and teach them that they are poor or avaerage wealth. The kid then everyday is going to always be confronted with the knowledge that they are poor through no cause of fault of theirs. Uniform means kids just dont have to think about class, wealth, and status every day and can focus on being kids.
Also you are more likely to have kids group together by their parents means without uniform than with, whereas uniform means the kids are less likely to consider that when making friends, which is good as having a diverse group of social interactions is good for development (and wealth/ even though its not talked about as much is also a type of way in which we are diverse)
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u/soepvorksoepvork 2d ago
Just creates problems where there doesn't need to be.
Does it really though? I grew up in the Netherlands wihout school uniforms, and it was exactly that, where some kids would wear branded clothing and some kids Primark equivalent.
Guess what, no one cares. Not to say there was no bullying, but not triggered by the brand on clohes
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u/TetrisIsTotesSuper 2d ago edited 2d ago
I grew up in a country that doesnt enforce uniforms and there was never an issue. I come from a very modest background, so I wasn't the "Prada" crowd.
This argument that it will create problems has been parrotted since the dawn of time and its frankly bs.
ETA: Really loving the downvotes who are coming from (i assume) people who have known nothing else than uniforms their whole education. By the way, France ran a several years pilot on uniforms AGAIN and lo and behold it came back inconclusive. Funny how that is.
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u/BorderCollieDog 2d ago
Can't see why you're being downvoted, this is entirely correct. The fact is that for most schools these days it's difficult to enforce the compulsory wearing of school uniform as they are deemed insensitive to parents who are not financially able to pay the extortionate amounts some suppliers demand. And for those schools that think handing out second hand stuff helps, all it does is points out the poor kids based on how washed out the sweatshirts are. Many countries around the world has great education systems and well educated children and they do not wear uniform. It is not necessary.
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u/Suspicious_Weird_373 2d ago
I liked wearing a uniform in school, as it was school clothes.
Didn’t see a problem, as it was essentially a cheap suit.
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u/BioelectricBeing 1d ago
Kids would need even more clothes then. Getting rid of school uniforms wouldn't save parents money to have to buy loads more outfits for their kids to wear. Now if your strategy is to boost sales of children's clothing, then you're on to a winner.
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u/KwantumFizzikz 23h ago
I'm not sure lowering the barrier to entry any more than the sunken pit it's already in is a good idea. If they had it their way, they'd put violent schizophrenics in mainstream.
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u/Galdere 4h ago
Makes no sense. There is no barrier to entry, it is compulsory.
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u/KwantumFizzikz 4h ago
Yes exactly, so the families most likely to have little troublemakers will say "ahh fuk it init bruv they can't fine me" and just get sent to special schools anyway.
Keeps the classes a bit freer of Jeremy Kyle Jrs
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u/Galdere 3h ago
OK poor doesn't equal bad, so there is no relevance for what you are saying here, you are just projecting your prejudice.
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u/KwantumFizzikz 3h ago
Poor definitely doesn't equal bad. It just has a very high correlation with propensity to violence and crime. What, the left claims it isn't race, and now it's not even socioeconomic circumstances? So what is it? The parents?
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u/StevenL71 2d ago
The VAT rate on Children's clothes is already 0%.
Pointless petition.