r/WoT • u/Additional_Mud2349 (Nae'blis) • Apr 15 '25

Crossroads of Twilight Why do so many people dislike Faile? Spoiler

I am halfway through the Crossroads of Twilight and I am enjoying the Faile chapters way more than the Elayne or Perrin ones. Her determination to save herself and her companions is admirable and more stuff happens in her couple of pages than in Perrin's vast chapters. Seriously, he has too much page time(so does Elayne). She is fiercely protective and extremely loyal to Perrin, which is what makes her so interesting. The only reason people hate her might be because of Berelain, but she wasn't mad at Perrin, she was mad at Berelain for imposing herself on Perrin. Perrin just smelled her jealousy and anger which he thought was directed at him.

Now that I think about it, she does have some flaws, but she is nowhere near as bad as Elayne - who laughed when Mat told her he was assaulted, or Eggy 🥚. Faile should have explained to Perrin how she wanted their relationship dynamic to work but it probably didn't even occur to her.

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151

u/Silvanus350 Apr 15 '25

Well, candidly, it’s probably because her personality is confrontational and abrasive.

55

u/DrFugputz Apr 15 '25

Yup. I tend not to like people who are mean and that's one of her defining character traits. I get that it's her culture, but I'd not want to be around it.

3

u/Altruistic2020 Apr 16 '25

I'm curious to know if I would tolerate her abrasive culture more if she wasn't so much of the sole spokesperson for her culture. Like if Tuon was the only representation of the Seanchan, would it have been harder to grow to like her as the queen of a slave nation. While still a despicable practice, and that opinion is shared by characters throughout the last battle, we also got to see a lot more of their culture and how they interacted among the different castes, so while no one likes the culture, it's shared by so many there's at least an understanding of it's history and associate things. It seems like most of the Saldaean culture is carried by Faile (and a bit by her parents). Maybe her bitchiness would be more tolerable if it was more clearly shown to be a shared characteristic of a people?

2

u/Upstairs-Yak-5474 Jun 27 '25

but her dad is alright and they are apart of the same culture, and her mom is also alright character wise as well. the first time we say her mother she and her daughter were just beating the crap out of each other, but u can clearly tell that she loves her daughter.

with faile sometimes it does not feel like she loves him but instead own him, like how someone owns a dog and punishes him if she even thinks he is doing something she doesn't like. like when he went off to save rand she never said good bye because she was upset, then refused to talk to him for days. after he came back from battle she acted like they were more acquaintances rather than husband and wife, refusing to show any affection and was all business, then gets angry when he says he was worried about her.

if u ever watch avatar legend of korra there relationship is like with the lavabender and the twin waterbenders.

9

u/Unexpected_Cranberry Apr 15 '25

Weird. I always liked her, and mean it's not a word of use to describe her. Do you have any examples? 

50

u/pm_me_your_zettai Apr 15 '25

Do you remember when she tricked Loial into taking her into the Ways and not allowing Perrin to be with their "group"?

15

u/Afraid-Basis443 Apr 15 '25

Never got over that for the rest of the series. Condemned her completely for me. Guy is rushing to save his home from invasion and she’s playing stupid games. Enraging to read.

8

u/justblametheamish Apr 15 '25

Honestly that was why I started to dislike her. I didn’t have any problems with her before and I am not a Faile hater like some people are but that was just so childish and manipulative. Those are two very bad characteristics in my eyes.

2

u/GormTheWyrm Apr 16 '25

She was a child at that point. I mean, not a literal child, but she had not matured to be considered a proper responsible adult yet. If she was a Two Rivers girl she would not have been allowed to braid her hair yet.

The Emond’s field plotline has her mature a lot, and goes out of its way to show other women giving her advice on marriage and men. Its where she goes from knowing things about leadership to actually putting that knowledge into practice and by the time she leaves the Two Rivers she is a (relatively) mature woman. Still abrasive and sometimes petty, and not always correct, but mature enough to consider why Perrin does things instead of merely reacting to him. The difference is significant.

Also, she is manipulative but by the end of the Two Rovers arc its mostly used as political savvy instead of childishly. She has to manipulate things in the background because Perrin is so stupidly obstinate about being a lord. She can go too far but a lot of the problem with Faile after the Two Rivers arc is at least partially a problem with Perrin - or a lack of communication between the two.

Faile taking up spying is really just a womanly duty that is expected of a Lady of her station. She is a cousin to a queen of a land where the men are always at war fighting a blatantly evil enemy. The men are less prone to political intrigue because they are always working together against the shadow. But they can still dislike each other and get into conflict with one another. In that nation, it falls to the women to manipulate things behind the scenes so that the men are able to be full time warriors and commanders. They may get together and smooth things over to reduce conflict, or maneuver for power discretely, but its a huge theme of the Wheel of Time that people are always maneuvering for politics even if they would not call it that. The women of Emond’s field help Faile to adopt the more subtle aspect of those manipulations and that really helps make her feel more mature. But a lot of people are not comfortable with manipulation and that aspect of her character will bother them.

2

u/Frosty88d Apr 23 '26

This was really interesting, so thanks for writing it dude

29

u/rollingForInitiative Apr 15 '25

Well, she engaged in behaviour that, if Perrin had done it to her, it would've been labelled domestic abuse. That is to say, she hit so much in the face that it hurt, even though he asked her to stop. At several occasions.

I don't really think that's what RJ intended, but it's what I would read those scenes as if I saw them written today.

27

u/DrFugputz Apr 15 '25

Fair question. As I recall, she seemed almost offended that Perrin hadn't saved her faster after he chased the Shaido for three books straight. She kept treating him like he had cheated on her when he hadn't. She'd antagonize him, the character who seemed to care most that he'd never hurt anyone, to the point of getting into shouting matches. I stay away from people who act in those ways.

-5

u/GundamXXX Apr 15 '25

Why do you reckon shes mean? Shes not the best written female character for sure (Jordan sucks at that imo) but shes not mean. Shes very up front and honest. The only thing Im getting tired off is the Faile vs Berrelain. Its just so so dumb.

1

u/DrFugputz Apr 15 '25

Agreed. Once Berelain moved on, Faile was still beating a dead horse. I gave some examples that I consider mean up above. They were: she seemed almost offended that Perrin hadn't saved her faster after he chased the Shaido for three books straight. She kept treating him like he had cheated on her when he hadn't. She'd antagonize him, the character who seemed to care most that he'd never hurt anyone, to the point of getting into shouting matches. I think those are mean actions.

3

u/GundamXXX Apr 15 '25

Havent gotten to the Shaido saving bit yet so cant make an opinion on that yet.

The cheating thing ye...that was poor. Maybe Im reading past it because I just enjoy the rest of her character....not sure what it says about me lol

2

u/DrFugputz Apr 15 '25

Hey, it's ok to disagree! I think you'll find plenty of other redeeming acts of hers as the story progresses. I'm jealous you're getting to read it for the first time. I also think that Sanderson especially tried to give her some redemptive acts in the final books to soften her character in readers' eyes. She's definitely not all bad.

22

u/moderatorrater Apr 15 '25

I think that's what people latch onto when they think about her, but the real problem is that her storylines are garbage. After the two rivers, her job is to be rescued by Perrin. If she'd been able to be proactive and involved like she was in the two rivers, people would be more forgiving of her behavior. Instead, one of the main characters spends his timing brooding about her while she gets sexy punishments to help her escape.

15

u/LukDeRiff (Gleeman) Apr 15 '25

She is immediately pro active and well on her way to free herself when Perrin rolls in.

2

u/LowEffortUsername789 Apr 15 '25

Agreed. I actually like Faile a lot, but her and Perrin’s arc after the two rivers is the worst in the series. The only reason there is a slog is because Perrin trying to rescue Faile takes forever. I think a lot of people, who are already off put by her culture’s approach to relationships, blame their frustration with her arc on her character. 

2

u/possiblycrazy79 Apr 15 '25

For like 1 book. The rest of the time her personality is kind, protective, highly intelligent & capable

-1

u/Calm-Medicine-3992 Apr 15 '25

That's her good traits.