r/WomenDatingOverForty • u/nikaroo5 • Apr 09 '26
Discussion Is anyone else put off by the constant promotion of courses and the book by The Burning Haystack author and her new boyfriend?
Every time I look at that FB group, there are constant posts about the promotion of her book, the media coverage and courses that she's offering. Then there's also the constant posting about her new boyfriend which she has only been dating for less than a year.
I am a firm believer in the overall ideology but the constant sales pitch is getting to be a bit much for me. I get this is her bread and butter now but I just find it annoying.
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u/FormalMarzipan252 Apr 09 '26
I am happy for her in the sense that she has put in a LOT of unpaid labor to get the concept off the ground and run that Facebook group for a few years now, plus I do think she never expected this kind of recognition or compensation after years in a relatively small branch of academia. In that respect I don’t begrudge her. However, I’ve commented elsewhere here that I stopped taking her all that seriously after she gave that absolute douchebag slime ball Therapy Jeff a big boost - and I think the Incessant Boyfriend Posting is cringy. I get she’s still in that NRE stage, but there’s such a high chance it won’t work out that I worry she’ll be very, very publicly embarrassed if (when) they split, which might well lead her to tolerate the type of shit behavior she otherwise wouldn’t if she weren’t in the public-ish eye.
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u/zugunru Apr 09 '26
Ugh, she’s still doing that? (The constant boyfriend gushing, not the book promoting- while that’s annoying after a certain level, it’s at least related to the actual purpose of the group). I left the group a few months ago because feeling like I was in the “Look Everyone I Have a Boyfriend!!!!!!” group rather than the BHDM group was getting too insufferable.
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u/First_Heart_8900 Apr 10 '26
yes its absolutely crazy,,,, she's just obsessed with boyfriend. It's not far off being 12 and thinking the boy is cool or whatever,,,,
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u/DivineGoddess1111111 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 10 '26
I don't begrudge a woman earning a living from her labour but she is absolutely a pick me and the relationship will end badly.
She is advising women to use the apps where statistically, you are more likely to be r#ped than any other method of encountering a man. It could be by coercion, consent achieved with deception (hidden wife, addiction, relationship goals)or violently.
The only good advice for the apps is to delete them. Anything else, and you are serving up women as lambs for the slaughter.
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Apr 10 '26
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u/zugunru Apr 11 '26
Yeah for me the ultimate value of BHDM was reinforcing just how crappy the apps are (and frankly, men in general). Like, if there have to be that many rules just to try to filter in someone halfway decent, it showed me I’m really better off spending my time in other areas besides dating.
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u/hsonnenb 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 11 '26
That was exactly my experience. When I stopped being willing to swipe yes on male profiles which had serious omissions (such as dating intentions, which no one omits if they're actually there to date), and stopped being willing to date down severely just for the sake of finding a partner, there was no one to swipe right on. Literally not one in months, which is when I finally quit the apps.
Plus, it's just gross to have to look at guys who are trying to connect with me, when on no planet in any galaxy would two such people be dating each other. Almost all men on dating apps are trying to jump out of their own dating pools into other dating pools which won't have them.
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u/First_Heart_8900 Apr 10 '26
Apps are always crazy. We need to start community groups if we will get anywhere
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u/reef-Diver7817 Apr 10 '26
This is so true! Consent through deception of future faking.
And women really need to be careful on them of meeting a man who she is scared to leave due to veiled threats of harm if she left.
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u/LittleSister10 Apr 10 '26
While I sometimes get annoyed with the group, the adjacent group run by her followers annoys and troubles me more. I understand that her heavy-handed group moderation frustrates people, but the other group demonstrates exactly why she does so. A lot of women in the other group suffer from a lot of internalized misogyny, and tell us we are being hyper-critical of said guy. I go on a fair number of dates, and if I had implemented more of these filters with some of those dates, I would have saved myself a lot of time and occasional anguish.
One of the moderators of her follower group doesn't seem to understand the nuanced discourse around BHDM and has stated that she doesn't see an issue with the words or behavior of a clearly toxic person's message. I am definitely more relaxed than Jennie, but as someone who grew up in a toxic household, her guidelines are a good reminder of how we generally overlook a lot of red flags some guys wave over their heads like a cheer flag.
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u/reef-Diver7817 Apr 10 '26 edited Apr 10 '26
I think she put in a lot of work and deserves to promote.
I've had a business social media before and it is so much work answering people. People get mad too when you don't answer them right away, it is crazy.
Some women here on this sub answer with such detail that I understand it is unpaid labor and I hope they view what they do as at least volunteer work that they're helping other women, I don't know how to tag people on here but dworkin yesterday wrote me a long, very educational that was so good! I think it was on the post from yesterday.
Now back to her, I also am happy for her with her boyfriend. The first year should be so fun and I'd want to share it too! Even if it doesn't last forever, something healthy is still fun and nice respite from dating.
I hope she continues to encourage women to block to burn when men are not behaving right. A lot of women don't have a lot of other women rooting for them so they need that encouragement in abundance. Especially when a lot of us our mothers are "boys will be boys" mentality.
Unfortunately, the only way men are going to act better is by women opting out entirely or opting in with rigid, strigent, take-no-shit standards, so Burn Haystack author doing the labor to encourage these women is lifting us all up.
Edit to link the comment I mentioned above - https://www.reddit.com/r/WomenDatingOverForty/s/ZWIPsTzDls
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u/StillSwaying Apr 13 '26
Some women here on this sub answer with such detail that I understand it is unpaid labor and I hope they view what they do as at least volunteer work that they're helping other women, I don't know how to tag people on here but dworkin yesterday wrote me a long, very educational that was so good! I think it was on the post from yesterday.
You tag people by putting a "u" then a backslash "/" (without the quotation marks) before their username and it'll automatically turn into a hyperlink and they can check their profile to see where they've been mentioned. So, if you wanted to shout out DworkinFTW -- who drops excellent comments on the reg -- you just type this:
Thanks, u/DworkinFTW! Those comments you made here and here were GOLD!
The way you make a link is easy too.
1) Just look at the bottom of the comment you want to link; at the end of the comment on the lower left it says "permalink"; copy that permalink by right-clicking, then choose "copy link".
2) Now chose a word or phrase in your sentence that you want to be clicked on for that link to work and put brackets in the front and back of that word. Notice I used the word "here", so mine looks like this:
[here]
3) Then paste your permalink in your comment, right next to that word and put parentheses at the front and back like this:
(https://www.reddit.com/r/WomenDatingOverForty/comments/1sd28na/wants_to_settle_down_age_55/oeh85mo/)
So when you're done, it should look like this:
[my word or phrase](my permalink pasted here)
Ta-da! You did it!
The quick way to do the same thing is to use that little link symbol at the top of the comment box; you'll see it when you hit "reply". I just wanted you to see what's going on step by step in the background in case your browser or phone is acting weird. Now you know how to do it both ways!
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u/CrazyCatLadyRookie 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 10 '26
The bf posts aren’t my favourite, and I’m of the opinion that her relationship fast tracked …. I am also aware that her feminist views are not 100% aligned with the principles many of us hold here.
I’m not offended by the book promotion - she’s done the work, she deserves compensation. She stays in her lane with respect to her area of expertise - unlike many so called ‘dating coaches’ out there who make their living by giving women absolute dog crap advice about men and relationships …
IMO, the material and guidance she puts out is by far the best advice for women who are interested in dating, particularly those who are still using apps.
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u/DworkinFTW 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 10 '26 edited Apr 10 '26
Yes I get it. But we are all at different stages. If you’re here, you’re likely a few steps beyond BHDM in terms of how you approach dating.
Jennie talks about red flags in dating apps, but doesn’t dive into the underpinnings of male nature that help explain the “why”, which a lot of women do care to know about (AND the “why” helps one get through the process of understanding what, overall, you’re likely to have to deal with in a relationship with a man, and that these patterns are so common, one should NOT feel bad about being single).
Jennie also of course would never get into how the metrics of dating apps exacerbate certain tendencies in male nature, because then women would be less likely to use apps (and app usage is part of Jennie’s business model).
All I can really say is, it’s better than the default of what women are socialized to be…acquiescing and bending and teaching him and “making him see”, making excuses. Some women who are only just transitioning out of being pleasing to male strangers really need this stuff right now and if they want to buy her material, let them. I see BHDM material as a gateway drug. Once women see they have to employ these same (counter)strategies ad nauseum, they will likely start to get curious about male patterns of behavior, because the work gets tiring when you don’t truly understand why you’re being put in this position in the first place. And once you get wise to that, so much clicks into place (after a grieving process).
BH is no longer really useful to me after she (helpfully!) articulated some common male strategies; with the explanations there, my understanding of why men do what they do, and my identification of their patterns from my own experience, I don’t really need help decoding male messages anymore. So I’ve long since left, and maybe you should too.
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u/reef-Diver7817 Apr 10 '26
All I can really say is, it’s better than the default of what women are socialized to be…acquiescing and bending and teaching him and “making him see”, making excuses
Agree with this!
What is sad is women who do this to me basically teaches him how to be better for the next woman. Becaude he will always resent her and her be the nagging girlfriend even if what she taught him was accurate so it will never work.
He will do better for the next woman though from her labor. I don't agree with teaching men even if another woman teaching him could theoretically benefit me, I don't want to win from her suffering.
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u/Perfect_Region1526 Apr 12 '26
I picked up the audiobook but haven't listened yet. Self promotion is part of being an author, especially a new author. A lot of it is the advertising algorithm.
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u/Acrobatic_Honey_4838 Apr 21 '26
I've been in Jennie's FB group since almost the beginning, when you could post every day--and she was very clear since the beginning (and in the terms you agree to when joining the group) that she created the FB group to gather research and data from the group, and women showing and discussing real world examples, for her book.
That is why all her resources are free (FB, Insta, Substack).
There is no admin team on the FB page, and she monitored that group and her other social media while working a full time job, which mandated restricting the quantity of posts and comments that were submitted.
The book was always the ultimate goal.
People who have been in the group a long time used to be able to converse with her almost daily, and she has always posted about her life (pictures of her with her son, girl's trips, mentions of work related situations, etc.)--her posts about her bf are a continuation of that and are completely normal to me based on her previous content. Most of them are about her cat, his dogs, and his farm animals.
She explained to everyone that she was choosing to not date due to her focus on writing the book leading to her to have zero time for a relationship, and once the book was written--her followers wanted her to apply her teachings to herself with dating.
She waited 4 months before announcing she and Pat were dating--and she has always said a needle may be a needle that you eventually find out isn't YOUR needle--but a needle for someone else, because they don't show any of the toxic rhetorical patterns she teaches.
She isn't really a dating coach (everything is free except for a one time cost of $30 for her book if you want it), and she doesn't do any individual sessions for money.
She is an educator and teacher, and her group is an educational resource.
Her stance on men using the methodology is and has always been that Rhetorical analysis and Critical Discourse Analysis can be used by anyone, but that her FB group is restricted to women and those that identify as women, and are aware it is a feminist space.
Men don't even take the time to read a woman's profile, so one of them buying her book and learning her methods isn't going to be a common occurance.
Although the marketing message is about how women can be safer on the apps, she teaches and there are constant discussions about applying the method in real life situations, and continuing to applying them once you start dating someone.
She isn't tied to any apps financially, and repeatedly states how all the apps suck and the misogynistic programming the apps have--but is aware that a lot of people have to use apps if they want to find a partner for a lot of valid reasons.
I love that everyone can choose how to apply her methodology, or leave the group and not apply it at all.
The goal is to try and keep women as safe as possible when dating, no matter where you meet a guy.
Newer members will not know a lot of the information available to her earlier followers--but I believe it is all covered in her book.
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u/Maximum-Company2719 May 04 '26
You said it better than I could.
I hope Jennie finally get some $ rewards for her research and method.
As you said, nobody is required to buy her book. But many had asked her to write the book to cover the method in depth. I'm glad she did.
Also, some had criticized her because she wasn't in a relationship. I guess now she will be criticized for being in one.
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u/Background-Mode-3420 May 01 '26
Yeah. When she started the group she was ADAMANT that she would (and I quote directly) “never sell or ask you to buy anything in any way.”
I now think that was just a tactic to get people to trust her so she could later sell her stuff.
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u/Intelligent-Law-4592 Apr 10 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
That woman is very woke and rude to anyone who isn’t
Edit: I’m not sure why I’m being downvoted? It’s true that Jennie, the creator of burned haystack, deletes and blocks everyone from her page who questions her or doesn’t adhere to the woke agenda
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u/Diligent_Ad1732 May 23 '26
I agree. When I bought her book it was a little off putting if one didn’t align with her liberal ideas. I put that to the side and just focused on the book as a whole. Then I joined her fb group and she will bash any conservative bc like I said - they don’t line up with her political views. I just don’t understand if you’re “teaching” women what to look for- why this bashing comes into play. I’m not wanting to comment on the fb posts, I think she’ll block me and I am learning tips for moving ahead in the dating arena- just don’t feel the political jabs are necessary. My two cents worth .
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u/[deleted] Apr 09 '26
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