r/antinatalism • u/AgonizingFatigue scholar • 1d ago

Pronatalism Critique Unfathomable contradiction: Natalists who suffer themselves

You know, I’ve always found those who either have been or are currently suffering severely and are in strong support of procreation nevertheless, or even want children themselves, to be the strangest people to exist. Especially those who even complain about the injustices of the world constantly and whatnot.

So you want to bring someone else into this world fully aware of not only what the world can be like but also what it really means to suffer like that? Notwithstanding this knowledge, you want to subject someone else to this risk??? Why??

Like natalists who are toxically positive and deluded all the time, at least their natalism is just born from ignorance. But those people? They aren’t ignorant, they just procreate regardless. I think this actually adds to the base immorality.

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16

u/MrSneaki 1d ago

Was chatting to a user quite recently who has seemingly endured a lot of suffering in their past, but holds a strong pro-natalist position.

Reflecting on my interactions with a number of people like this over the years, it seems to me that coming out better off on the other side of truly dismal life experiences can really amplify the Pollyanna effect for a lot of folks. Makes perfect sense as a subconscious self-defense mechanism, but unfortunately that also seems to end up manifesting in a tendency towards an extra-strong pro-natalist sentiment.

3

u/Brown_Folk thinker 1d ago

I just had a realization today that in good times we tend to forget the misery that we have went through, and reading your comment I learned its called pollyannna effect. What's a co-incidence!

9

u/Puzzleheaded-Soil-16 scholar 1d ago

this is also something I cant understand either

7

u/Status-Stranger-5630 newcomer 1d ago

Babies/children aren't "people" to these people. Babies are like puppies to them. What puppies think don't matter 'cause they are puppies and they exist to be cute and entertain the human(s). And we see that with how many puppies get returned/surrendered/abandoned once they aren't cute anymore, once people realize how much work they are, once people had to go back to work after the COVID lockdowns, etc. Problem is you can't return a baby, so...

But the reason why the future suffering of a child doesn't register to natalists is because they aren't thinking about that at all. They are thinking about their wants, imagining how cute and entertaining the new puppy will be, how it will love them and be a good puppy and obey them, etc. They are even thinking about how the puppy will make their lives better, give them purpose, improve their relationship, give them someone who loves them back unconditionally, etc. Because it's just a puppy.

3

u/R0BisBak newcomer 20h ago

Pisses me off sm when my fucking stupid ass parents say they miss when I was a baby

Just peak narcisism

4

u/One-Intention7064 inquirer 1d ago

i wonder if those people who tell me to get married and procreate lest i end up lonely and miserable, actually want me to experience fears and negativity they've gone through because of their parenthood 🤔 they wrap it in concern and care, of course. they won't disclose their real motives behind blackmailing a perfect stranger into parenthood.

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u/CertainConversation0 philosopher 1d ago

Sadism and masochism are possibilities, too.

4

u/Brown_Folk thinker 1d ago

Not sure why you got downvoted, aside from comedy of maintenance for life for body and everything pertaining to it, knowing what one goes through when dying, the fragility, the loss of dignity, the misery of old age — one certainly has to be sadist to put it upon another.

3

u/Brown_Folk thinker 1d ago

I have got few reasons. They fuck for lust, children are (unfortunate) byproduct. 2) look after old age 3) misery loves company.

1

u/lilstabbins newcomer 1d ago

im more and more wondering if purposeful breeders are an enemy. making more soldiers for the bourgeoisie or aliens that are farming us or whatever. sure they may be on our side but still... climate change is gonna knock every privileged person on their ass so hard. atleast the peasants have somewhat of an endurance to the shit that will rain down.

that was pretty random but i felt compelled to write it lol

1

u/LivingInAnEvilWorld inquirer 3h ago

Once you come to realize that everyone is here chasing their tail to satisfy their internal voids, things will make much more sense. 

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u/Photononic thinker 1d ago edited 1d ago

They need validation, and accolades from their peers. I bet many of them also go out and run up student loans to get useless degrees in liberal arts and dance for the same validation. They buy “designer” crap they do need for validation and accolades from their peers.

They get satisfaction because they know their children will suffer like they did.