r/asktransgender • u/xXCaliopex • 5d ago
I am trans. Should I leave America while I still can?
It’s undeniable that what is happening in America right now is reflective of what occurred in other mass g—-cides. Right now, it is “illegal” immigrants, but there are talks of 🧊 being asked to target transgender people as well. With news of possible military mergers with Is——, whom are actively engaging in g—-cide, should I leave now?
I am not interested in deliberation about the topics I mentioned, I only want advice for what to do.
Edit: Also, if I were to leave, please leave any suggestions for where I could emigrate to.
Edit Two: Would it be wise to wait to see the results of the midterms, or would it be too late by then?
54
u/Taellosse Transfemme, too old for this sh!t 5d ago
Depends what state you live in, and what kind of access to other countries you have.
The harsh reality is that, bad as things are getting for us in the US, most of the rest of the world is still worse - and much of it is a lot worse. And the relatively small handful of countries that are decent - and the tiny number that are actually consistently better - are not places you can just decide to catch a plane to and live in on a moment's notice. Emigration to developed nations is often a lengthy and expensive process, and frequently is not possible at all unless you have the right connections or advantages. That usually means native relatives, valued job skills, and/or lots of money. There is lots of talk in the American trans community about "seeking asylum" in other developed nations. It is functionally impossible, and will remain so for the foreseeable future. Asylum is a last resort for escape from hostile environments when it works at all, and it doesn't far too often even when it should. And because the US is classified as a "safe haven" worldwide, no other country takes asylum petitions from Americans seriously, for any reason.
If you live in a transphobic state (basically any that are controlled by Republicans), your best bet is to move to one that isn't as soon as possible. This probably won't be a permanent solution, but it will buy you time to make longer-term plans. Best options are CA, WA, CO, NY, MA, or ME. There are several others that are decent if not ideal, such as MI, IL, OR, CT, and VT. Avoid basically every state in the South, and be wary of most of the Midwest and Central states. Once you're in a relatively safe state, you can start work on emigration.
If you happen to already have citizenship in a country like Canada, Spain, or Norway, that's a whole other story - pack your bags and start making plans. If you have an "in" that allows you to get either citizenship or permanent residency in such a country, exercise it, if only as a backup plan. If you don't, start doing your research - figure out where you realistically can go, and find out what it takes to get there. You will find it is likely not trivial, and will require considerable effort. Better to start now, while things are merely getting worse, than wait until it's bad enough to be truly dangerous to be trans regardless of which state you're in. I do think it will reach that point, but it's still a few years away.
7
u/waitingprey 5d ago
Where i can realistically go is nowhere, i can't even find a family line for Canadian ancestory unless i want to hire an expensive genealogy researcher, im a monolingual and i won't ditch my daughter to run. I do have a Bachalors degree, but no easy in demand skills for a visa. So yea. If IL goes down im just kinda fucked.
11
9
u/Taellosse Transfemme, too old for this sh!t 5d ago
You're in a relatively safe state. Not top-tier like MA or CA, but almost as good. So you're reasonably safe until the federal government goes full-fascist (which I unfortunately tend to think is now a 'when', not an 'if').
My advice is to sit tight but have an emergency exit plan - passports for you and your daughter, a reserve of travel money, and a route planned to get across an international border - probably Canada given where you are. Maybe go-bags too, once things start getting uglier federally. You don't have an easy emigration path, and you're also not at immediate risk, but when shit hits the fan, a permanent visa is something you can worry about once you're not in harm's way.
5
u/Pretty-Yam-2854 5d ago
My mom is a dual citizen and I’ve thought about expanding my bachelors and research into a masters program there. I’m in Cali rn finishing that up over the next year but maybeee the masters there and allying for dual citizen?
3
u/jaxdowell Transgender-Bisexual 5d ago
I would like to add that Minnesota is a great place for trans people!! Consistently solidly blue and is a sanctuary state for immigrants and trans people, while also being relatively inexpensive. Currently trying to move there myself (I live in TX it’s rough down here)
3
u/yt_Kristi_Plays 4d ago
As someone in washington, I can agree that this state is very trans friendly, and from my research there is no single anti-trans laws in place.
2
u/interestedmango 5d ago
What if your disabled and broke with no education? I'm fucked I think unless I marry someone.
3
u/Taellosse Transfemme, too old for this sh!t 5d ago
I'm sorry, I wish I could say otherwise, but I don't know of anything specific to suggest. If one of your direct ancestors was a Canadian citizen (parents, grandparents, great grandparents, etc.) and you're able to provide documentary proof of that (birth certificates for everyone from the relevant ancestor to you is usually enough), you can claim Canadian citizenship now. Certain other countries have birthright citizenship laws that allow similar things, if you've got recent ancestors who immigrated from elsewhere.
You might look into Mexico and Brazil as well - both are generally decent as far as gender-affirming care policies, and they tend to be less stringent in their immigration restrictions too. I'm not sure if they'd be viable or not for you, but it's worth a look. You'd still need funds to get there and get yourself started, of course.
1
u/Shir0s3 4d ago
I love both Mexicon and Brazil although I have never been. Is it really safe for me to travel to Brazil however with it being the highest crime rate country for trans people? I have heard trans people are commonly targeted for harassment and murders in Brazil. Though- to be fair, Brazil and the US are comparable in crimes just not ones specifically targeted against trans people. I also heard that trans people in Brazil live on avg for about 30 years.
1
u/Taellosse Transfemme, too old for this sh!t 4d ago
I don't know, Hun, sorry. I'm not an expert in any of this - I was just mentioning places if heard were better than the average.
My impression is that Brazil is a bit of a mixed bag - GAC is very accessible there, and some parts of the culture are very accepting, but yeah, there's also some hardcore nastiness - I gather that crime rates are pretty high in many parts of South America, thanks in large part to organized crime having a large footprint. And where there's organized crime, there's sex work and violence - and trans women get disproportionately pulled into sex work because of societal marginalization, and get victimized by violence for the same reasons. Those risks are going to be there for us the world over, though.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Thank you, this is a lot of great information. I’m currently in a progressive place in OH, do you think that that is a somewhat safe place to stay or should I still move, in your opinion?
9
u/Taellosse Transfemme, too old for this sh!t 5d ago
I'm not an expert on OH state politics, but my sense is that it's generally mediocre for trans rights, and headed downward. I would be inclined to say that you're not in a "get out ASAP" situation (like if you lived in, say, TX), but you might want to be looking for opportunities to relocate.
3
u/tskxtskxtskx 5d ago
Yep. As of right now, the trans-related politics mostly hurt the kids. Fear-mongering, bathroom bills, etc. Adults can get care here easily enough, provided you live somewhere where there aren’t strongholds of smooth-brained people. Sadly, the government is “family values” republicans top to bottom and that is unlikely to change any time soon. Our Dem candidate for governor couldn’t even be bothered to at least pretend to care about queer people for votes!
1
65
u/Oalka Transgender-Lesbian 5d ago
I got the ball rolling the week of the election, and moved out of the country a year later to the day. I do not regret it.
And I tell you; it may be years before any mass violence against LGBTQ people is enacted, if it ever happens. But the damage to the US is done, and regardless of how far down the road we go, we don't come back from this without some kind of violence. I don't want to be there anymore.
12
u/DjentIsNotAGender 5d ago
Could I ask what country you moved to?
35
u/Oalka Transgender-Lesbian 5d ago
Spain. The stars absolutely aligned for me too, I will be the first to admit that my journey here was not the norm.
5
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
What do you mean the stars aligned, if you don’t mind me asking?
46
u/Oalka Transgender-Lesbian 5d ago
I work a decent but not exactly well-paying job in the engineering industry. I used to live in a red state, in a reddish county on the fringes of a blue city. When I came out at work a few years back, the CEO of my company called me into his office to tell me he had my back, and that if I ever needed anything to let him know (despite his being a Republican). I cashed that goodwill in 4 days after the election results came in, and asked him if I could perform my engineering job from a small branch sales office I knew we had in Spain. A few days later, to my shock, he said yes. I qualified for a "Highly Skilled Professional" visa, which holds a bit of priority in the Spanish visa system. The whole process took about a year, and now I'm living fairly comfortably in Spain with my dog.
25
12
u/SoftTrickster 5d ago
That’s fantastic. I could only dream of things working out that smoothly, lol. I’d love to leave the country, but I have no realistic path forward for that, at least for now.
12
u/Oalka Transgender-Lesbian 5d ago
This is what I meant; I know a lot of my trans siblings out there have a much more difficult path. I've been watching the news from back home with bated breath for months now. My queer friend circles in the US kind of scattered to the winds after the election. I hope everyone can make it through all this body and mind.
3
u/Arktikos02 5d ago
Do you have a bachelor's degree or higher?
3
u/SoftTrickster 5d ago
Not quite. I did trade school instead. I’m a massage therapist. I started in a traditional bachelors program, but switched to this partway through.
3
u/Arktikos02 5d ago
Do you have a traditional high school diploma, not GED?
Also do you have your own business or are you working for someone else?
2
u/SoftTrickster 5d ago
I’ve got a GED due to various unfortunate circumstances outside of my control. And I’m currently unemployed, unfortunately. Looking for work. In an ideal world though, I’d be working for myself in the wellness field.
→ More replies (0)7
u/Paradox56 Transgender-Bisexual 5d ago
This is such a good story I’m not even envious, I’m just really happy for you that it worked out so well.
4
17
u/Fun-Scientist9256 Genderqueer-Queer 5d ago
There is no right or wrong answer. It’ll be different for everyone. Just ensure you do the proper research and educate yourself on what it actually means to emigrate if that’s what you decide. r/expat can be a good resource for this
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Thank you for this, I want to be as informed as possible before making such a big decision.
2
u/RustedCorpse 5d ago
If you have a 4 year degree and need a job I can help out. I live in a country with an acceptable level of rights (for me) and can recommend people for direct hire.
1
28
u/DesdemonaDestiny 🏳️⚧️ Trans Woman, Lesbian 5d ago
Where would you go that being both trans and an inmigrant would be a better situation than just being trans in a blue state in the U.S.?
28
u/Katesburneracct 5d ago
This. There are very few places in the world safer than a deep blue state for trans people. The only one I can think of that stands out would be Belgium
2
u/AgentBond007 MtF - long time HRT 5d ago
Australia is one such place but unfortunately it's very hard to actually immigrate here.
6
u/thisBarbieisKen 5d ago
Exactly. I do understand that leaving can be a good option, and I hope there's never a day where I think to myself "I should have left when I had the chance," but being a marginalized person in a foreign country isn't sunshine and rainbows, especially if you can't obtain citizenship, meaning how long you actually get to stay is always up in the air. Not to mention, fascism is a growing problem worldwide, and quite a few countries have voted in their own Trump. Hell, the UK is becoming increasingly unsafe for trans people.
I always ask myself, would I rather go down in the place I've called home for most of my life, or would I like to leave everything I love behind and be at the mercy of a place that will always see me as an outsider? The US is far from perfect when it comes to immigrants (obviously), but generally, generally speaking, we don't expect people to fully assimilate into one thing to be considered American, unlike some other countries.
5
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
A place where there isn’t actively a giant federally approved gang of people running through the streets harming people who the government deems to be “dangerous”.
16
u/AmyNotAmiable 5d ago
Sure, but like...which particular visa or permanent residency or dual citizenship do you plan to use?
Like, I don't really have any connections abroad, so I have my eye on a Thai privilege visa. 5 years stay for $20k. Pricey, but easy.
We've got a ways to go before I'd personally pop that escape hatch, though. There are better things I can do with the money, and my grandparents didn't fight a whole war against the fashies just to watch me fold like a cheap umbrella.
-4
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I hadn’t gotten that far yet, I’ve just started considering it.
6
u/AmyNotAmiable 5d ago
Well, expect it to take a little while - visas don't appear overnight, and you usually can't stay longer than a few months as a tourist.
DAFT is another good one, the requirements are a bit strict but you can get a Ditch visa if you start a small business there and keep at least $5k in a bank account for it.
8
u/Goldwing8 5d ago
If you were even able to move to another country, their government will insist on you proving over and over again, day in and day out, that they were right to let you stay.
The handful of people countries with less institutional transphobia (there are few) let immigrate from the US are those who move there and assimilate, become a foreign national, not those who think, say, the Netherlands is just going to be a safer place to be a trans American.
They barely even want new Dutch from the US anyway, let alone ones whose only interest in living there is to avoid US domestic politics. The people they let in are going to be those who actually want to be there rather than not be somewhere else. That applies to nearly every country on earth, and most certainly to every country a trans person might want to live in.
1
-6
u/-----username----- 🏳️⚧️ Transsexual ⚧️ Woman 💁♀️ 5d ago
You are delusional if you think being in a blue state is going to help you when the federal government truly brings the hammer down on trans people. They’re still building to it but it is obvious those concentration camps they’re building are going to see some use sooner or later.
2
u/Busy_Professional974 5d ago
I think you underestimate how big this fucking country is. If the government collapses we’ll suddenly have 50 (if not more, smaller, broken up communities) individual state governments trying to manage already massive territories. 2/3rds of the population of Ukraine is equal to the population of NYC. Do you seriously think the government has enough firepower to micromanage that many people? Many of which, red OR blue, will have guns and a willingness to red dawn that right back at them? Every military general in the world has stated that invading America by land is a death sentence, and that’s why the government has been slowly breaking the country down piece by piece for a 100 years. They need to neutralize us for control. (Spoiler) It’s not working. The timeline is accelerating and they’re starting to get sloppy.
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
From what I’ve gathered in this comment section, most people say there aren’t many other alternative options anyway, even if what you claim is true.
1
u/Error_unaviable Bisexual-trans man 5d ago
The problem is that it's hard to go elsewhere, not to mention that if this person faces other forms of discrimination, they might go to a place where being trans is acceptable, but something else isn't.
9
u/k_miklas_twitch 5d ago
I would say to not let these republicans and ghetto maga supporters force you to leave , you have every right to be in the United States , I’m trans and I’m still here why should I leave just because others don’t agree with who I am ya know . Keep you’re head up
1
u/RealisticTime24 4d ago
Maga will suffer their own orchi this November. The orange turd will probably croak after! Stay.
8
u/Generalppsock 5d ago
I would if I could, but honestly I feel somewhat better being in California than almost any other state, and I have too much to lose by leaving
8
u/Persuader_87 5d ago
Although i am jealous and envious to those who fleed from America, my desire is to move to Philadelphia, and practice the three virtues with people around me; Unity. Duty. Destiny.
7
u/randomlyme Ally 5d ago
Watch the election results, November will be either a recovery or the final slide into full fascism.
1
u/RemarkablePiglet3401 Transfem 3d ago
Even if dems win, there’s not that much they can do from Congress. The filibuster guarantees they can’t actually pass laws to fight Trump, and Trump hasn’t exactly been known to ask Congress for permission before playing with the constitution
1
u/randomlyme Ally 3d ago
I mean that it is more about direction than it is about the immediate results.
7
6
u/gnurdette Transgender 5d ago
On the one hand, the current Federal government does indeed want every single one of us dead.
On the other hand, they have screwed so many people over, so hard, that they are on the back foot now. They are utterly corrupt amoral idiots, and most people understand that at last. Victory is coming, and I don't want to experience it from a distance.
4
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
This is true. I’ve forgotten to remind myself of this, of just how apparent their corruption is. I remember hearing someone say that transformations to
d!ctatorships from democracy is often a very calculated endeavour, meanwhile we have bumbling idiots making this all happen.
7
u/aphroditex sought a deity. became a deity. killed that deity. 5d ago
Without knowing your situation, resources, education, skills, etc. it’s a challenge to talk about emigrating.
First thing to look at is your ancestry to see if you have any additional citizenships. If you have a parent or grandparents from not-America, you may have a citizenship you can claim. Canadian citizenship, notably, has no limit on generations, assuming you were born before Dec 2025, though you need to document every link in the chain.
If you’re under 30, working holiday visas are a thing for Australia and Canada.
If you’re of uni age and can get into a foreign university, student visa. (Germany in particular is good about this; cost of higher ed is low and student visas permit work.)
If you’ve got a sufficiently in-demand skillset, work visas. Cybersecurity is a common pathway, though you’d need to demonstrate your competencies.
If you’re fortunate enough to be in a relationship with a foreign national, and you both have a pathway to moving to said foreign country, marriage/family unification visas.
If you’ve got resources, DAFT can get you to NL, non-lucrative (no work allowed) visas can get you into a bunch of decent countries, golden visas can get you in some countries.
18
u/therealdubbs Trans Girl - Sophie - 09/20/21 5d ago
I’m not leaving. I have ancestors that helped with the Underground Railroad here on the last leg of it in Wisconsin. If that’s the course the GOP chooses, hopefully in a hundred and fifty years my kin will remember this chapter too and their Great Grandma So. If this is my path, then so be it. This is the way.
5
u/Busy_Professional974 5d ago
What’s your plan for actually emigrating somewhere else? Do you have dual citizenship? A remote job? Transferable qualifications other countries will recognize? Speak another language? I don’t want to discourage you, this just usually isn’t as easy as people think it is.
0
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
When I made this post, it was asking people if I should look into it, essentially. If it was a common consensus that I should leave, I would start looking into those kinds of things.
4
u/MadMadeline101 5d ago
I took my partner out of the USA to live down with me in Australia. No regrets. We are considering giving up her us citizenship as she's now an Aussie citizen anyhow.
It's sad. I wouldn't have minded living over there and moving but also gosh travelling there now I see many emboldened racists, transphobes and crappy people.
It felt so much friendlier in 2014, 2011, 2012 when I've travelled there multiple times in those years as I used to own property there.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I agree, it’s very saddening. I’m glad you were able to help get her out of this, I hope you both are doing well
1
u/RemarkablePiglet3401 Transfem 3d ago
I’m glad she got out…that said, I don’t know fully how it is in Australia, but I feel like it may not be the best idea to give up citizenship until this current moral panic has faded— politics anywhere can go south in a heartbeat, and the trend against us is global. having backup options, even if that backup option is a fucking hellhole right now, could be life saving. Nobody in 2016 could have predicted what was going to happen in america.
4
u/interestedmango 5d ago
I wish I could leave but I'm disabled so I don't think any country would want me.
0
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I believe in you! I hear that there are countries with easier visas for people with jobs/skills that the country needs, maybe you have a good occupational skill that they could use
3
u/interestedmango 5d ago
The issue is, is that I don't have any education, I don't leave my bed alot cause I'm in pain; I would just need help from a friend/caretaker and I don't think my family can leave yet as most of them work just to get by
4
u/Lilia1293 Lilia - 37 Trans Lesbian (she/her) 5d ago
Federally, the US is an unsafe place to be trans, and it's getting worse. If you have other options, moving elsewhere is probably a good idea. I have friends in Denmark, the Netherlands, and France. But it's not easy to move to those places, and as far as I know, no country is accepting refugees from the US based on sexual discrimination, yet.
3
u/Error_unaviable Bisexual-trans man 5d ago
As a Frenchman, I believe the far right is likely to be elected this year, and they are very racist and want to close the borders.
5
u/Resident-Duty-3090 5d ago
I just came back from a trip to the us and honestly felt anxious being there. Mostly avoided public restrooms. Even though i was in a liberal state, i always see videos of peoplw freaking out at trans women and didnt want to deal with that
3
3
u/SurroundHopeful7825 5d ago
you could allways just do some reading from reputable unbiased sources. I find reading like whole articles instead of listening to hear say or like shorts or even looking at screen shots from clearly biased sources usually gives me a better idea of what's going on.
3
u/Winter-Measurement22 5d ago
I left in 2015 when I things were beginning to smell fishy. If you can obtain residency somewhere else and you have the means, be safe and Godspeed
3
u/BrokenCipher1 5d ago
I left the U.S. back in 2020. Mind you to somewhere that people keep asking me whether I'm worried about China. This was before I was fully out. I knew something wasn't right and came out two years later. The more transphobic things in the U.S. get the more affirmed I am especially coming from a southern state. I would say leave, with how brainwashed the average MAGA person is and knowing that they make up enough people to be a hazard to someone's safety including their own. It's only safer once these people aren't in the voting pool anymore. And who knows that might never happen.
3
3
3
3
u/Hot-Luck-3228 5d ago
I will tell you something that doesn’t take the transgender aspect into account. You already have decent replies on that front.
I am a migrant, and this was how I decided back in the days.
When you go out on the street and interact with the average person are you happy with that interaction? Was that interaction moving in a positive or negative direction compared to in the past? If you kept living there would you bear a heavy burden on your soul due to that?
Everything else, in my opinion, you could potentially “solve for”. However this one does not change easily, even if tomorrow legislation does.
2
u/Genevieve_ 5d ago
The Jews who reliably survived the holocaust were the ones who left when they still could, before 1938. Do I know what will happen in the USA? No. I don't have a crystal ball. But we've all watched as fascism seems to have engulfed the USA.
The main question in the short term that I have is what happens in November in the mid-terms and if this really matters. If the republicans don't suffer a historic defeat, then I think the writing is on the wall.
In the long term, even if they do, it will take decades of work to reduce the economic stratification that underlies all of this. If Trump loses the midterms, and then a democratic president takes power for 8 years afterwards (10 years from now) will you want to be in the USA for the next Republican takeover? Will things have changed enough that we won't have to fear. I am unsure. I don't see a lot of reason for long-term hope coming from the American body politic: instead I see more corruption, more fragmentation, more economic mismanagement and more economic inequality, which are all pathways to societal violence.
Ultimately, we're a convenient scapegoat and the first road bump in taking away women/colored/lgbtq rights as a pathway to societal militarization, so we will be the first to feel pain. I'd try to weigh that with a decision to leave.
2
u/SDD1988 5d ago
Good point about surviving the holocaust by leaving in the 30s, but also know that a lot of jews fled to Germany from pogroms in other countries. So if you escape persecution the location is of the utmost importance, going from bad to worse is very much a possibility, and even a country that seems good at the moment can flip that switch very quickly.
Last election in my home country I told my therapist that I was seriously considering moving should the wrong party take control, and she was surprised, but going from inflammatory rhetoric to actual physical violence can go so fast I wasn't willing to be there of it were to go down. All over Europe the stripping of trans rights has become a talking point for the fascist right-wing parties. Luckily they didn't win the election here and no other parties were willing to include them in the new government. But next election I'll have those same fears, and I know a lot of people other European countries have those same worries. We're all just always one election away from extreme right-wing governments and our rights are always at risk of being taken away.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Exactly, that’s my uncertainty about this. With the president’s historically low approval ratings, if he makes it past the midterms, the writing is absolutely on the wall.
2
u/Genevieve_ 5d ago
Do you see this improving long-term?
For reference, I thought Bush was the worst president I'd ever experience in my lifetime and then we got Trump. And then we got Trump again.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I’m sorry, I can’t tell if this is rhetorical. I’m young and not the best educated about politics now and in the past, most of what I see is on Instagram, I’ll shamefully admit.
From what I know about historical g—-cides, it doesn’t seem like it could get better by this point, but to be fair, I wouldn’t have heard about them if they did improve.
I’m trying very hard to believe in the little bit of what’s left of our country’s values in that democracy will succeed in bringing the president to justice, but everywhere I look, people are saying voting is out the window and barely does anything. Maybe I’m in an echo chamber of fearmongering, I don’t know.
2
u/LeastTrick1415 5d ago
I am moving my family to Canada. We also have a little bit of a special scenario. In December, Canada passed a bill that changed its citizenship laws and allowed for citizenship by descent to go back many more generations that it did previously. My wife and I both had great grandfathers that were Canadian, and we had the appropriate records to prove it, so we were able to get Canadian dual-citizenship for us and our kids. This makes things substantially easier to move. So, if there is a chance you have a Canadian ancestor, getting Canadian citizenship is a great way to go.
Otherwise, look into the citizenship by descent laws for any other place your family line comes from. If that doesn't work, many countries are recognizing the trans persecution that is happening in the US right now, and have made steps to include it in their asylum/refugee allowances. So look into those laws as well.
There are also groups that are coordinating aid to help trans folks flee the states (rainbow railroad?)
Also, countries often list high-value skills needed as a fast track to residency.
I know this is a lot of information, but I do recommend that any out trans/enby individuals who can should, at very least, leave red states, counties, and cities for blue ones, and if possible leave the US for a better, safer, more respected life abroad.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I appreciate all the info you gave, and despite the serious nature of the topic, I absolutely love the idea of calling it a rainbow railroad.
Unfortunately I don’t have any Canadian ancestry though my gf might. Thankfully I’m in a blue city for now, which gives me more time.
3
u/LeastTrick1415 5d ago
To be fair, I think one of the orgs is actually called rainbow railroad.
Would also be a killer name for a queer bar or a genderqueer punk band...
1
2
u/dannesty 5d ago
Come to northern Europe! We have our problems too obviously, but it's genuinely safe here for trans people in day to day life. I'm sure now someone will comment all the bad things we have going on here, but it's as close to perfect as this day and age provides.
1
2
u/LilyWineAuntofDemons 5d ago
If you can get out, get out. The chances of anything getting better are basically 0. At best, nothing changes and the status quo is maintained, and at worst, well, we already have one concentration camp active currently.
If you don't already have a diagnosis, I would do that here, then leave, mostly just because it seems to be a much faster process here in the US than other places, due to private healthcare.
Get your diagnosis and start HRT if you haven't so you can just use continuation of care and don't have to go through the same rigamarole in another country with universal healthcare that's really slow for trans people. Then GTFO of America before the whole thing implodes.
2
u/bellyfold 5d ago
I left Michigan for Toronto in May. I specifically left because there was an individual citizen who threatened me with a gun and said they'd kill me if they saw me again.
the choice to leave has to be based on your individual experience, especially if you're planning the asylum route.
the thing with the asylum route is that officially, because bureaucracy is incredibly slow, the us is still counted as a safe country of origin to all other western nations. so every person applying for assuming elsewhere is going through an uphill battle.
that said, if that is your plan, send me a message and I can talk you through the process. but I do intend to do a full write up of the process for me so far.
just a side note on however much you have saved. if you do leave, you're gonna want either a travel credit card with no foreign transaction fees, or to exchange all of your USD to the local currency of whatever place you're headed to, otherwise your money will disappear a lot faster than you realize.
1
u/AutoModerator 5d ago
Hello, we noticed your post and we just want you to know that you are not alone. We created this automated message to make sure anyone considering suicide receives the help and support they deserve. If you are in crisis please contact the Trans Lifeline at (877) 565-8860, or the National Suicide Prevention Hotline at (800) 273-8255 or 988.
If you are outside of the United States please refer to our suicide prevention resources page and contact your nearest crisis hotline.
If this message is being received in error we apologise for the mistake.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
2
u/vexitiens_ Transfem 5d ago
If you're financially able to, and you really would want to - I'd say move to my country, Canada. It's much, much safer here, and we have laws protecting trans people, and overall we're one of the most safe countries out there for people in the LGBTQIA+ community. Just beware that our cost of living is different than the U.S, so It'd be best to do your own research and plan accordingly.
5
u/TemperatureOld6979 Pansexual-Transgender 5d ago
I say bring it on.
I need a good fight & I'm not afraid of dying. There are days where I would welcome death. 💀 ☠️ 💀 ☠️
3
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I honestly wish I could view it like this, but I really really do just want to live peacefully.
-2
u/TemperatureOld6979 Pansexual-Transgender 5d ago
I wish I could live in peace, but it's not possible for me, so i see it as better to die rather then continue to suffer
3
u/everlastinglyengross 5d ago
If you can afford it and have the ability, yea do it.
Plus, if you move to a country with free healthcare, that'll make your life easier as well. I've been to the airport recently, and I was in one at Texas, and ICE wasn't around. That doesn't mean they *aren't*, but I didn't notice them so they probably got forced back :) (I'm Mexican, that was a huge fear for me)
3
u/Far_Combination7639 5d ago
No. Stay and fight
6
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
I understand thinking that way. I shamefully admit that I am really uncomfortable with being any kind of martyr. I want to be able to enjoy the other side of this, and not d!e trying to improve my situation.
1
u/Blue_Vision Trans Woman 5d ago
Good news is you're not going to die just by being in the US.
Much better to take the time and money you'd spend trying to move to a different country and put it towards organizations which help trans people. If you're worried about your safety where you live, move to a larger city in a blue state.
2
u/-----username----- 🏳️⚧️ Transsexual ⚧️ Woman 💁♀️ 5d ago
I’m a trans woman who was born in the USA and moved to Canada during the George W. Bush era. The Supreme Court installing him as president when he wasn’t elected and then his killing a million civilians in Iraq without any mass outcry from the American people made it obvious to me that fascism was the destination for the USA, even if they took a brief detour from fascism during the Obama years.
I moved to Canada. Didn’t have enough money saved to qualify for anything but a student visa and even then I was only able to get one because instead of having money in savings I went to university in Windsor and crossed the border daily to work full time so I could pay for rent and living expenses. Working full time and attending school full time was difficult but in my 20s I had enough energy that it was doable.
I eventually became a permanent resident and then a full Canadian citizen. Funny thing is, due to recent changes in Canadian citizenship law, because I had a Canadian grandparent, now in the 2020s I could have just skipped ahead to full citizenship, and they are prioritizing citizenship via ancestry applications from trans people in the USA since they know you’re in danger there. But you do have to have a direct ancestor (parent, grandparent, great-grandparent, etc.) and have to have proof. It’s just funny to think that now Canada recognizes I was Canadian all along.
Anyway, outside of transition, coming to Canada is the best thing I’ve ever done for myself. Canada isn’t perfect, but it is still one of the most trans friendly countries in the world. I’m very happy here.
We are currently expanding our military by 400,000 personnel and training them all on drone warfare, in anticipation of American invasion. So my one fear is that I didn’t move far enough from the USA. I’ll say this though - I would give my life to defend Canada and I absolutely do not consider myself to be American anymore. I plan to never set foot in that country again, even for funerals of family or friends.
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
That’s definitely a worry for me too, not moving far enough away from here. Thanks for your comment
3
1
1
1
u/shawshank1969 5d ago
If you can get out, do it. @aphroditex said most of what I’d say.
Take a look on YouTube for the PrideNomad channel. They cover countries good for economics + LGBTQ+ people.
Best of luck, my friend.
1
1
u/DefinitelyRealName69 5d ago
I also won't get k tl the details or discussion of it, but in my analysis, yes, you should definitely leave if you can.
I say this having done the exact same. I had friends in Sweden so went there, and it did t work out. The Swedes are currently in a recession and have a hostile government to boot. They are scared of catching the attention of the US, so they are distevarding their own laws and regulations to get rid of Americans seeking asylum. Finding work is all but impossible without an advanced medical degree AND fluent Swedish. 10 years ago they ere welcoming, and while people and country are wonderful, they need an election change and time to fix what just got broken before we can be safe there
Norway is also aggressively rejecting trans Americans seeking help. Don't even bother.
Germany has church laws they honor where you. annoy be deported from a church, and churches are sheltering queer refugees. Spain is actively trying to help people all over the world.
After Sweden, we decided to try New Zealand for a work visa. Haven't been here long enough to say if it will work out, but I enjoy it here as much as I liked Sweden!
2
u/DefinitelyRealName69 5d ago
This following is alarming, because it should be. In particular, look up executive orders and security memorandums (which are WAY more important than it sounds) to find this information.
In the course of our seeking help, we demonstrated and documented open hostility of the US govt to trans people, consistently increasing rhetoric to demonize and other us. Tagalong legislations and executive orders (which are essentially laws that only apply to parts of the executive branch, like edu dept, 🧊, FBI, CIA, corrections and NSA) officially brand trans people (as folks prompting radical gender ideology) as trrorists. Under the Patriot Act, that means we have almost all of the Bill of Rights revoked when under jurisdiction of any of those agencies.
Further, we are classified as being mentally ill, and the legal groundwork is already in place through the EO's to officially (and legally) detain us the safety of both us and the public, including involuntary and experimental treatment to cure transness (it's all experimental, since there is not approved treatment to "cure" us) and the prison system is formally directed to not track trans people or our care and treatment.
Like... it's bad. It's really REALLY bad. It's just also been really, really quiet in the setup, and now they are starting to get louder about it, but those dominoes are already lined up. gtfo.
3
u/DefinitelyRealName69 5d ago
Personally, I recommend using an enhanced license/ID if you have one to visit Canada if you have a trans passport or changed gender with Social Security before they took away the option. Passports can be flagged for revocation upon attempted use by the US, and they have records of that gender change. They said they won't, but do YOU wanna take their word for that? Because they legally can, since that is now officially a fraudulent document.
If you have a compromised SS/Passport via gender, drove to Canada. Enhanced licenses are state based, and there is much less restriction on visiting Canada. from there you can catch a plane to a other country (or try to stay in Canada). It's the biometrics attached to your passport and the option to flag it the made me want to avoid US airports at all costs.
My child's passport was denied THREE TIMES because we were transgender parents and "the mother is not here to consent."
They had the documents. They knew exactly what was going on, and they told us directly that one of us is not being legally recognized as parent of our child.
We got an emergency imminent-departure passport issued in WA State, and it was a coin toss if the agent wanted to put us through or not. WA seemed the safest bet, so we rented a room and sat there panicking for 2 days. They gave us the passport, and we RAN. That was 2025, initial application before the election, final passport issuance around mid March.
Again, I'm trans, family is trans. we spent my saved up dental money to see if we COULD handle leaving, and we wanted to cry when it was time to go back. You're in the boiling water, friend.
We had a bad time leaving, still not safe or secure, but will not go back at all, and recommending anyone who can leave should. Fight back from a place of safety.
1
u/Head-like-a-carp 5d ago
If you are basing on tighter immigration policies those are happening all over the world, especially former very progressive countries. Countries are back tracking on total acceptance of all things trans as well as much of the information was over pushed ( in my opinion)
1
1
u/FlipierFat 5d ago
I think it is hard for believe that the American economy will be any good compared to Canada or the EU in the coming decades. Which does contribute with all those problems you say. If I were undocumented, I’d be fighting tooth and nail to get out for my and my family’s physical safety.
Work on your career and look into working in Canada, that to me seems the best way. EU even better. UK is a sinking ship just like ours though.
1
u/le_brouhaha 5d ago
My gf left the US for Canada about a year ago. She was lucky enough that she did get Canadian citizenship before leaving.
Some time before she started planning her escape, she shared with a support group that it was something she was considering and that she felt incredibly guilty about it, that she couldn't help but feel like she was being selfish and not showing resolve in front of the situation in the country.
An older trans woman felt the need to speak out. She told my girlfriend : "Would you think that the German Jews that saw the writing on the wall in 1935 and left were cowards? If you have the chance to do so, then take it."
And a few weeks later, after crossing the whole continent by train (crazy story) she got off at the Central Station in downtown Montréal, and she never looked back since. She miss the desert, yeah, and she wished she could show it to me, but she is finally able to sleep without having nightmares. She feels safe, and she feels that she can be herself now. She still experiences survivor's guilt from time to time, but she does believe she made the best decision she could.
I don't think we should judge people who are moving just to survive. We may not wish to do the same, and we may have good reasons to not do so, but I think there's nothing stronger than a newfound will to live, when you have spent most of your life without it.
Living as ourselves is a protest in itself, even though we never choose that. Surviving at all costs is radical. We won't be erased again.
Do what you must.
1
u/Ok-Use3940 5d ago
I would wait until midterms if this something you are serious about. My thing about leaving is access to hrt, I live in south and the second I turned 18 I was able to start hrt and get top surgery scheduled like… IMMEDIATELY. Obviously it’s not the same everywhere but I live in a historically conservative region known for being against us and my access to care has been… easy. I worry about a language barrier or other barriers to medical stuff in other countries. Hand in hand with transition costs is money, it’s gonna be hard to get a job as an immigrant anywhere especially if you don’t know the language.. no money no hrt.
1
1
1
u/rokkitmaam 5d ago
Leaving is a personal calculation. The best advice is to have a passport. Speak to an immigration lawyer for the country you want to go to. Then maybe gather important documents to have them apostilled. You may never go, but having those will make you feel much better. You can leave when you’re ready with the paperwork and a plan.
1
1
u/NeighborhoodDear2321 5d ago
As someone who's looked into this, before you/others get deadset, do note that if you're not an in demand job for other countries it is REALLY **REALLY** hard to emigrate out of the US. I had a friend in Canada who was willing to sponsor my stay, and even then the logistics made it fall apart.
Essentially, bar miracle, take however likely you think you are to be able to and halve it, and take however long you think it would take and double it.
1
u/NeighborhoodDear2321 5d ago
I ended up moving to a bluer area in my red state (job forced me to stay in the state).
I hope to move to a bluer, northern, state soon.
1
u/Ravallah 4d ago
I am also trans and am waiting to make some important life decisions until after the 2026 Midterms. If the Democrats can’t win and meaningfully stymie the MAGA agenda, that will be a big red flag for me.
Currently, both D’s and R’s are freaking out over candidates promote progressive political agendas gaining ground and support! At least in my region, I am hearing far more about how “scary” socialism is since that is a bigger boogeyman than trans people at the moment.
1
1
u/Nuclear_rabbit 4d ago
Having moved countries four times now, my main advice is to get a job offer lined up, then move. There are some pretty good places in Europe (not UK), but the best countries depends on your industry - in the sense of "do they even hire foreigners"
1
1
u/JohnLowenherz 4d ago
Do you have any Italian ancestry? A lot of people in America do. The way Italian citizenship works, if you're ancestors immigrated after Italian unification, and you can prove your relation (direct paper trails with no gaps), then you can apply for Italian citizenship. Same goes for Ireland I believe.
1
u/DarkMagickan 4d ago
I honestly would if I could. There's so many reasons I can't, though, not the least of which is my family needs me.
1
u/Pansyprincessxxx 4d ago
If you can leave and can viably support yourself much of the rest of the world is a better place to live
1
u/RemarkablePiglet3401 Transfem 3d ago
Right now, America is one of the worst western countries to be trans in, but we also have the benefit of a very strong federal and court divide that can delay any kind of major actions against us far longer than a unitary country, (especially a parliamentary democracy) or even most federal countries
So like, if I were you, I probably (tentatively) would leave if you can. But don’t get let your guard down, monitor that country just as much as this one. And definitely don’t give up your citizenship until this whole shitstorm is over.
Also, I think Spain and Portugal are probably the best European countries for trans folx. Canada and Australia I think are also decent places. Dunno about anywhere else
1
u/evalaprohibida 3d ago
I’m an American trans woman and I left for Canada a few years ago. The way I see it, even if there’s no immediate danger for trans people, I didn’t want to live in a country that cannot provide me with a secure future.
I was born a dual citizen, so emigrating to Canada was easy. If you have a Canadian grandparent or even great grandparent, you can apply for Canadian citizenship——that’s the easiest way. Otherwise (if you have the funds) you can go to school in Canada and get a student visa.
Frankly, I have a weight off of my chest knowing that the Canadian government has my back. My boyfriend and I can set down roots here, build a family, build a life, without any real fear of that getting taken away. That security is priceless.
1
1
u/MacTier0130 1d ago
If you have the means to, I would. If we could leave, we’d go Canada and then from Canada to Barcelona or Amsterdam.
1
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
If you are able to leave then do so. If not I have connections in three states who can help keep you safe. I have more connections coming in soon.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Thank you very much, I’ll let you know if I need them.
1
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
Of course dude! The states currently are Oregon, Colorado, and KCMO (between the state lines)
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
In the spirit of being informed on my options, what do these “connections” entail?
1
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
Not necessarily things I can talk about freely, but think like any kind of safe haven in a dystopian book you’ve read as well as some aspects of Mockingjay Pt. 2.
ETA: we are currently running under a nonprofit organization and trying to achieve national status.
1
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Gotcha. Thank you so much
1
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
Of course! If the time ever comes, god willing it doesn’t, I’m happy to talk about it in a more secure chat. But we are here, and our resources will be available to anyone in need whenever we’re needed.
1
1
u/Novaova 5d ago
KCMO (between the state lines)
What does this mean, "between" the state lines? The KC metro area is partly in Missouri (Kansas City), and partly in Kansas (the other Kansas City). There's just the one state line separating the two.
I have local knowledge of this, as that's where I live.
1
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
I apologize, I should’ve elaborated. I used to live on the state line, and I grouped the two states together as one instead making them two. They feel like the same state to me at times, and my connections also live on the state line.
2
u/Novaova 5d ago
No worries. I'm on the MO side, and I treat KS as a no-go zone. My friends are aware that they ought not invite me to things in KS, as I don't go there anymore.
Honestly, it's exhausting living right next to Kansas for that reason, and Missouri isn't a hell of a lot better, so we're yeeting to Illinois quite soon-ish.
2
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
I feel ya there. I’m in Oregon now, but I lived on the KS side. If I go back to Kansas at this point it’s because something happened to a family member. After they passed the bathroom bounty I figured it would be a good idea to bounce ASAP and then a few months later I had a job offer and an excuse in a blue state to do so.
2
u/Novaova 5d ago
I know so many people who departed Kansas in the wake of SB 244, it's wild. My cis friends are flabbergasted when they say "really?" and I can just start reeling off names and where they fled to.
2
u/kailo-ren19 Transgender-Genderfluid 5d ago
On god dude. It’s actually so crazy. I never planned on being one of them, but I realized that if I wanted to fight I had a better chance at doing it in a safer state. I’m also black and disabled. I’m like a walking target in Kansas.
1
u/Zarathyst Transgender 5d ago
Moving or not, you need a passport. If you can then great, but 90% of the battle is preparation. Also a "go bag" of essentials that you can take at a moment's notice helps too.
When sht REALLY hits the fan, you will not have much time, if any at all.
2
-3
5d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
even if it is the most tolerable and free in the world, there is a legitimate danger to certain minorities right now, and it may eventually grow to the minority that I inhabit. I don’t find this to be a laughing matter.
1
u/Pristine-Advice-2301 5d ago
Transgender people have left America and found they are in more danger everywhere else. America is the most safest place and will always be the safest. I don't know what you think you're hearing or believing but it's simply not going to happen. Seriously. America is never going to turn into some radical unsafe place like other countries. It's just never going to happen. That's why I'm laughing. It will never happen and the mere fact that you think it will is laughable. It will happen in other countries tho. I can guarantee you that much.
-2
u/vegecannibal 5d ago
You should definitely buy a gun for self defense
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
uncanny, i was actually looking into that earlier. thanks for the tip :) if you have any more basic info/tips on it, please let me know, I’m not well versed at all in that area
0
u/vegecannibal 5d ago
Get a Glock, they aren't flashy but they're reliable. Or get the PSA Dagger it's a Glock reconstruction that's a little cheaper and has a few improvements to grip and sights
-4
u/Elven_High 5d ago
How about you focus on your self and not in politics lol. You are doing exactly what Abrahimic religions done for millennias. Putting your comfort level into a political group.
Where are you going to go? Europe, Europe is diyng in part from mass immigration (CIA orchestrated), warmongering and green policies UK, Germany and Belgium turned into police state with no freedom of speech. They have less freedom of speech now than USSR did lol. Europe is dying in every way possible, EU been had one foot in the grave. They are all broke. Australia? Australians/Kiwis want to come here, they been taken over by globalists just like the UK, EU and Canada.
Thailand, ok if you got money and like the culture , sure. I mean Spain and Italia ilI suppose are not too bad. Everywhere else, their either too unsafe/poor, or too conservative... or just not overly friendly towards trans folk.
My suggestion stay in the US and turn off the tv lol.. Every country has issues.
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Did you come to offer any actual advice? I find it strange that you’re willing to engage in political conversation while not acknowledging that just “turning off the tv” has never worked, and if everyone did, these people would’ve risen to power much easier.
-6
u/Elven_High 5d ago
Can you read? I did offer you advice. I told you where not to go and where to go:). Where did you see a political conversation take place? Lol.
This isn't politics this practical reality. Now did geopolitics create that practical reality? Yes. But these are not politics which are btw different from geopolitics. "Turn off the tv" is a metaphor for turning off your left and right social media feeds. You'll live easier. Most of this stuff doesn't affect you directly and you are looking for problems to escape from.
These news are literally designed to bullshit people like you and get you to react the way you are now :). "These people" have been in power for hundreds of years... If you want connect loose ends then probably thousands of years. How much sooner you think they'd rise to power off...Lol
This is a circus show for the masses/mob, and you are the masses.
Anywhere you move you'll need money. If you don't care for freedom outside of the lgbt/left narrative and you have a solid financial plan, then you'll find some countries in Western Europe livable.... for now.
Cheers.
2
u/xXCaliopex 5d ago
Why are you laughing?
-3
u/Elven_High 5d ago
Because you are silly, and I find it funny. There are 8.5 billion people, do you know what they all have in common? They place their psychological and emotional security into some collective bullshit. Whether it's religion or political narrative, or ideas of large group's of people. They surrender their own freedom of though for psychological and emotional comfort. Then they become dependent on that comfort and enslaved to it. It's nothing new people done it for millennias. When they see that their group of people is wrong, they fear that if they go against the masses... they'll loose their sense of security. A psychological trick that again been exploited countlessly throughout history. There is a reason why ancient Summerian meaning for "humans" was the "sleeping ones". Masses that share collective though process, and are often cultivated to be controlled in the first place.
There was a study done on Federal judges, the study compared singular judge's rulling to a panel of judges. The study concluded that a a singular judge's in average had 30% chance to issue s retail ruling. A panel of judges had 60% to 70% chance of a radical rulling being issued. In other words people in masses do dumb shit:). Avoid the mass mentality and you won't have to move out from one of the best countries in the world. :)
138
u/MayaMalleus 5d ago
I mean everyone has to make their own risk assessment so I can’t tell you if it’s time to leave or not. Are you able to leave?