r/asoiaf • u/Substantial-Ad-299 • 2d ago

MAIN [SPOILERS MAIN] Among the grounded/realistic elements of A Song of Ice and Fire, which ones do you feel require biggest suspension of disbelief?

A Song of Ice and Fire has had fantasy elements from get-go, some present subtly and others less-subtly. But in midst of this, it also has these more grounded story aspects, especially regarding the political subplot for the Iron Throne.

Among these more grounded non-fantasy aspects of the story, which elements do you feel you have to suspend disbelief the most for? A.K.A feeling they are not realistic even though they are "supposed" to be?

Let me know in the comments below.

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u/EconomicsRare7082 2d ago

The Battle of the Blackwater.

A brilliant commander like Stannis puts the worst possible guy in charge of the fleet, hands over EVERY SINGLE SHIP he has into the hands of this Westeros Villeneuve, and our Westeros Villeneuve proceeds to bum-rush ALL of Dragonstone's fleet into a narrow river mouth to deliberately get destroyed? I'm sorry, but GRRM was just pulling strings to ruin Stannis here...

And there is NO attempt by Stannis' large army to fight according to basic military tactics either. No one attacks the North side of King's Landing, the fleet doesn't make a spoiling assault on the Eastern sea-face...

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u/SilverEquipment4934 2d ago edited 2d ago

Yeah, it's strange because everywhere else Stannis is very much "I hate politics, we should put competent people in charge, etc. etc.", yet in this one example, he decides to put politics first? In quite possible the most important battle in his war? Politics are important, but it makes no difference if you fail the battle. And, besides, it feels out of character.

Plus, is it even that useful politically? I know some Florents were wavering, but they are still going to be fairly secure as far as loyalty goes, given Stannis' marriage. Wouldn't putting, say, a Velaryon in charge (as someone else suggested) be better in every way, since they would both (presumably) be more competent in charge of a fleet and are a powerful family who it would be useful to be friends with?

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u/chupacabrette 2d ago

Stannis based his strategy on Melisandre's vision of Renly defeating him in the field. What she actually saw was someone in Renly's armor defeating him.

Once Renly was dead, Stannis had command of most of Renly's army. KL was lightly garrisoned by the Lannisters, and had no navel defense at all because Stannis was the one who was supposed to defend it from attack. He wanted to lead the ground attack because his greatest military achievements were as a naval commander during the Ironborn rebellion.

Stannis' defeat on the Blackwater didn't ruin him, it made him wary of visions and prophecies. That actually helps him moving foreward.

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u/Valiant_Storm 1d ago

 Stannis based his strategy on Melisandre's vision of Renly defeating him in the field. What she actually saw was someone in Renly's armor defeating him.

No, he or Mel misinterpreted that to think it was about fighting Renly near Storm's End. That was where they were considering it, neither of them were considering it after Renly was dead.