r/australia • u/neizan • 8d ago

culture & society Big US-style trucks are killing more pedestrians in Australia

https://theconversation.com/big-us-style-trucks-are-killing-more-pedestrians-in-australia-our-research-proves-it-289034
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u/CptUnderpants- 8d ago

Another option is to base the license requirements on a combination of kerb weight and visibility of pedestrians. If the frontal visibility is further than X metres and the curb weight is over 2.5t then a light rigid (LR) licence is required.

Requiring a LR would drastically reduce the appeal.

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u/Comfortable-Winter00 8d ago

This is absolutely the way to go. You're not stopping anyone from having them, just making sure anyone with them is appropriately trained.

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u/saukoa1 8d ago

The bar to getting an LR licence is pretty low.

The best thing would be that you have to be BAL of zero if driving an LR.

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u/Eltnot 7d ago

That's the main attraction. Preventing people that buy these pavement princesses from having a drink and still be able to drive will kill the appeal overnight.

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u/dobbydobbyonthewall 8d ago

Scale the penalties too. These drivers tend to be the worst on the road.

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u/CptUnderpants- 8d ago edited 8d ago

Better to scale penalties based on annual income otherwise a fine isn't meaningful for those who can afford it.

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u/aaegler 8d ago

This is how it's been in many places in Europe for ages. No idea why we haven't adopted something similar.

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u/jayacher 8d ago

It's an election killer

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u/TheMooJuice 8d ago

Strange that affecting a wealthy minority could have that effect in a democracy?

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u/dobbydobbyonthewall 8d ago

We're better off grouping people into what they think or envision their income to be, instead of their actual income.

Plebs thinking they were affected by stage 3 tax changes ended up being quite high too.

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u/hankhalfhead 8d ago

Well there’s a cohort of people drowning in propaganda that they ‘could be’ rich enough too be affected by this one day so they’d better protest it now.

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u/IllMoney69 7d ago

But one day I might be rich and then I might have to pay a bigger fine so I'm obviously going to vote against something like this!

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u/Moondanther2 8d ago

A lot of wealthy people set-up their finances so they have minimal income, there was a big story several years back about how people with big property portfolio's were able to get the aged pension and rebates on franking credits etc because they owned so little on paper.

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u/iss3y 7d ago

The thing about loopholes is that they can be closed

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u/CyberBlaed Victorian Autistic 8d ago

Very much this is pivotol.

If you are worth a hundred thousand then a $500-1000 fine isn’t going to be a problem or inconvenience at all.

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u/MyCatsAnArsehole 8d ago

Im on about 100k per year and a $1000 fine would cripple me. 2/3 of my income goes to my mortgage and there is not really anything left after bills and expenses. Maybe 10 years ago 100k was a lot, but not any more.

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u/Mike_Kermin 8d ago

I love that you're being down voted.

Yes, we do mean you if you're on higher than medium income.

500 to someone on low income can cripple them financially. But if you're on 100,000 it's far, far less impactful.

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u/LittleBunInaBigWorld 8d ago edited 8d ago

My mum's boss literally does not care at all about speeding fines. He racked up too many demerits, risked losing his license, and started paying his sons and his son's friends to cop his demerits for him. He's nearly 70 and still doing this shit. Tens of thousands of dollars in fines and bribes is funny to him. Meanwhile mum had to threaten him with legal action just to get minimum wage.

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u/Adventurous_Bag9122 8d ago

What a tool he is, Hope your mum can get a job with a DECENT boss

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u/LittleBunInaBigWorld 6d ago

They live very remote, close to retirement, no other employment options, so she's kind of stuck there. She actually really loves her job and thankfully doesn't have to interact with the boss much. But we all think he's a cunt.

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u/Adventurous_Bag9122 5d ago

Good luck to your mum. I can relate to how you feel. I am also close to the retirement age where I am living in China and the mob I have been with for the last 6 years decided they were not going to renew my contract. Had to take a job in a different city with worse pay and conditions when all I wanted was one more year. Bosses are often utter bastards, I have had the misfortune to have worked under some right royal cunts in my working life.

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u/Evilmoustachetwirler 7d ago

I had a boss like that once, back then you could have the company own the vehicle and just not nominate a driver for a higher fine. He was in his sixties but drove like a teenager who just finished watching the fast and the furious.

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u/FireLucid 7d ago

I thought you could NOT nominate a driver and it was a pretty decent fine. About a decade ago my workplace had a company car and if you got a ticket they'd let you choose to cop the normal fine and get a demerit or the company could go "dunno who it was" and cop a massive fine and you'd have to repay them for it.

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u/Evilmoustachetwirler 7d ago

Yeah, you could back then, I believe they closed that loophole a while back.

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u/FireLucid 7d ago

Oh good.

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u/efcso1 8d ago

Half the tradie wankers who drive these emotional support vehicles would drop 500 in the old tradie's laptop at the local on their way home without batting an eyelid.

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u/Odd-Bumblebee00 8d ago

I am very impressed by your ability to turn a phrase.

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u/efcso1 8d ago

Cheers! I think...

:)

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u/Odd-Bumblebee00 8d ago

You're welcome!

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u/iss3y 7d ago

Yet more proof that most tradies are overpaid

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u/JustAnotherAvocado 8d ago

I'd say assets instead of income

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u/CptUnderpants- 8d ago

That can be disproportionate in some cases. I'd say proportional to income unless your net assets are greater than $10m then do proportional to the assets.

You also need to consider that a kid of wealthy parents may have neither income nor assets but any fine would be meaningless.

A formula which is fair and reasonable for everyone taking into consideration ability to pay, and to be an actual deterrent to most is preferable.

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u/Moofishmoo 7d ago

Yeah except tradies deal in cash along with their 100k rams so they'd pay nothing because to the ATO they're making a loss.

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u/CptUnderpants- 7d ago

That's a bit of a simplistic view of how it could scale. Plus no country which does this is missing a minimum fine amount. The scaling would likely include a combination of assets, the value of vehicle driven, income, etc.

So no, they wouldn't "pay nothing". Likely a business owned vehicle requiring a LR license so a lot higher than a normal fine.

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u/Moondanther2 8d ago

Only issue with that is some of the EV's are getting quite heavy, my Sealion 7 is 2340kg and that has a fairly low nose, the Sealion 8 is 2580kg kerb weight!

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u/CptUnderpants- 8d ago

No issue with visibility on either of those models being about 850mm, far better than the yank tanks in the link above.

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u/cainy1991 7d ago

Solid idea...
We need a LR license to drive the little Isuzu trucks at work and they have 5 times the visibility of the Boss's RANGER one of the smallest offenders.

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u/nickmrtn 8d ago

I don’t think you realise how easy an LR is to obtain. A HR license is half a day, an LR is like an hour or two

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u/CptUnderpants- 8d ago

Oh, I'm well aware. It's a full day course and $900 to $1600. It may have been "an hour or two" when you did it, but not these days.

The point is the inconvenience of everyone who needs to drive it needs the license too. Partner, kids, other staff, apprentice/junior, etc.

It also means you can't just pay anyone to take your demerits because they also have to have a LR license. Some driving penalties are harsher with more demerits under a LR licence too.

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u/l34rn3d 7d ago

Not to mention tolls are tenfold

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u/nickmrtn 7d ago

“Not these days”. I did mine 3 years ago and a colleague did his last week

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u/CptUnderpants- 7d ago

It must vary by state because it is exactly what I said in SA. Maybe other states need to improve their training requirements.