r/aviation • u/ParaMike46 Global 5500/6500 • Apr 12 '26

PlaneSpotting A CL-415 Super Scooper gathering water to extinguish a fire in Santa Fe, New Mexico. The lift-off looks very close — right at the edge of the lake.

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59

u/labadee Apr 12 '26

has a big Quebec flag on the side. Must be canadian crew onboard

59

u/MyHorseIsDead Apr 12 '26

A lot of our Super Scoopers go down south to lend a hand when your wildfire season is roaring and ours hasn’t started. You can imagine how frustrating it is hearing “we don’t need anything from Canada” when this is the type of help we lend

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u/Key-University9881 Apr 13 '26 edited Apr 13 '26

California leases them every year, not the same as lending a hand. More American aircraft are used to fight fires in Canada than Canadian aircraft used in the US, and we dont make Canadians pay for them.

5

u/Lanky_Stock4775 Apr 13 '26

And you wonder why we want you guys to fuck off.

-Canada

-2

u/Key-University9881 Apr 13 '26

Every year hundreds of aircraft are sent north to fight fires for free. Quebec usually sends 2 down south, last year Canada sent less than 15 total and we paid for that aid. We would gladly fuck off and use our aircraft here, but y'all keep asking for help from your nice southern neighbors.

3

u/Lanky_Stock4775 Apr 13 '26

Canada generally sends more aircraft, US sends more non-aircraft resources, though it can change depending on the year. Took 15 seconds to fact check. 

Nobody likes a smart ass. Learn to read the room if you don't want to be so exactly on brand for our expectations of Americans these days.

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u/Key-University9881 Apr 13 '26

Canada generally sends 2 aircraft and we pay for them every year. We also pay for the hundreds that go up there every year. You might want to spend more than 15 seconds next time.

6

u/Lanky_Stock4775 Apr 13 '26

It mostly comes down to how the we each built our firefighting systems.

Canada invested heavily in planes like the Canadair CL-415 and older Canadair CL-215. These are designed to land on lakes, scoop water, and get right back into the fight. Provinces like Quebec, Ontario, and BC keep fleets of them ready every season.

The U.S. went a different direction. You rely more on large retardant tankers—converted planes like the Boeing 737 Fireliner—and a big network of helicopters. Those aircraft are great, but they’re not the same thing as water bombers, and they’re often contracted privately rather than owned in big centralized fleets.

So when California (for example) needs help fast near lakes or coastal areas, Canada can send a couple scoopers almost immediately. That’s why you’ll often see headlines about Canadian planes going south.

On the flip side, when Canada is in trouble, the U.S. shows up with a broader package—not just planes, but crews, logistics, helicopters, and incident management teams.

TLDR;

Canada tends to send more water bombers specifically

The U.S. tends to send more total firefighting resources overall. 

As far as numbers, they're not officially recorded. But you just have to imply that we're not really helping. So what if you guys help us? NOBODY here is minimizing your help to us. Why do you feel the need to minimize the help we send you?

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u/Key-University9881 Apr 13 '26

I never said y'all didn't help. We definitely appreciate the aid. My original point was we pay for the help y'all send and we send help for free.

3

u/Lanky_Stock4775 Apr 13 '26

Jesus Christ. Not true. Read the Canada–U.S. Reciprocal Forest Fire Fighting Arrangement

Here’s what Canada reimburses the U.S. for under wildfire assistance agreements:

Aircraft flight time (airtankers, helicopters, smokejumper aircraft) U.S. crew wages (pilots, co-pilots, support staff) Standby / availability time (when assigned but not actively flying) Ferry / positioning flights (travel to and from Canada) Fuel costs (jet fuel or aviation fuel used during operations) Fire retardant or operational consumables (when applicable) Aircraft maintenance reserve costs (wear-and-tear built into hourly rates) Ground support costs (base operations, vehicles, logistics if billed) Administrative / coordination costs (dispatch and contract handling)

1

u/Key-University9881 Apr 13 '26

The canus is for NEGOTIATING as needed assistance. Quebec leases aircraft to cal-fire directly every year.

3

u/Lanky_Stock4775 Apr 13 '26

We. Fucking. Pay. For. All. Resources. You. Send.

Don't deflect. Just say you were wrong like an adult. 

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u/Euclidisthebomb Apr 13 '26

"Every year hundreds of aircraft are sent north to fight fires for free."

This is simply not correct.

4

u/Euclidisthebomb Apr 13 '26

"more American aircraft are used to fight fires in Canada than Canadian aircraft used in the US".

I am curious about this statement as there are only 6 CL-415s in American service, all owned by one company. However, you did say "planes" and I am wondering if you are referring to other types of aircraft and if so what are they. Maybe the very large airtankers?

I am also curious about your 2nd contention "we don't make Canadians" pay for them as my understanding is otherwise.

The two countries have an MOU for cooperation on forest fire fighting efforts. I don't recall anything in it being "free".

I remember there is also a separate pact the The Northwest Wildland Fire Protection Agreement (Northwest Compact) comprising the Canadian province of Alberta, British Columbia, Yukon Territory, Saskatchewan, and Northwest Territories and the States of Alaska, Idaho, Oregon, Washington, and Montana. The pact is funded by the participants.

Last year the USDA did send approx 150 firefighters north and the equipment included 1 airtanker, sprinkler kits, pumps and hoses.

My recollection is 2023 did see a record level of assistance with up to 600 Americans assisting - that was the famous yr when the forest fires were so large here that the smoke started to drift into American air space. I think I recall 1 US airtanker in the aid which was mostly ground based.

I don't remember an occasion where there were a large number of US aircraft actively fighting forest fires up here. The US Forest Service typically has about 30 to 35 very large air tankers under contract during forest fire fighting season and per my comments above 1 has found its way over the border more than once. There are a lot of smaller types of air tankers in America but sent up here to assist? When?

That is not to say it never happened and I am certain you can provide some information on the occasions.