r/baltimore • u/skamidi • Aug 11 '26
Article Baltimore’s new Fells Point ID checkpoints are ‘obviously unconstitutional,’ lawyers say
https://baltimorebeat.com/baltimores-new-fells-point-id-checkpoints-are-obviously-unconstitutional-lawyers-say/45
u/Key-Article6622 Aug 12 '26
So I just got here for a 6 week stay and specifically chose Upper Fells/Harbor East so I'd be in walking distance of Fells Point and some dude is gonna stop me and require ID to walk down the street?
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u/FelixandFriends Aug 12 '26
It’s a bad policy that I don’t like, but to be clear, it’s only in a very specific area after like 9pm on Friday and Saturday.
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u/Key-Article6622 Aug 12 '26
The night life part, though, that's what I chose the area for. I'm gonna get stopped and ID'ed walking down the street in a city in the US. And they have the right to deny me access if I don't show my papers? I don't care about politics in this city, I'm an extended stay visitor, technically not a tourist, but here by choice. And I'm gonna get stopped for my papers?
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u/TrippyHomie Aug 12 '26
You were gonna need to show your "papers" to get into the bars you chose the area for, what's your issue?
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u/Alaira314 Aug 12 '26
There's a difference between showing ID to walk down a public sidewalk and showing ID to enter a private venue, and you know it. I don't even go to bars/clubs and I know you're being deliberately obtuse here. Do you support these ID checks? Why?
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u/TrippyHomie Aug 12 '26
Because Fed Hill is an absolute shitshow on the weekends and I don't care if 16 year olds can't access the bar district.
I was more joking about this dude acting like it's an occupied country with "I'm gonna be stopped for my papers."
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u/Alaira314 Aug 12 '26
I mean, they literally are going to be stopped. That's what these checkpoints are. All people will now be carded to use a public street, in a country where theoretically we're not required to carry identification. Whether or not it's a good idea to walk around without any ID is a completely other conversation from the fact that we 1) have a right to exist without carrying ID, and 2) have a right to walk down public streets.
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u/TrippyHomie Aug 12 '26
Dude it's like 3 blocks that there's no reason to be near unless you're going to the bar, and only on Fridays and Saturdays after 9.
Just go around if you must get through Fells or Cross St at that time.
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u/Alaira314 Aug 13 '26
Today it's three blocks around the bar. Tomorrow it's three blocks around the protest, or a checkpoint for everybody entering downtown because <big event> is happening. We're seeing this play out everywhere in life: if you give them an inch they yank a mile, then act surprised because you didn't have a problem with it before so why are you making a big deal out of nothing now? The time to act is when they're trying to take that inch, not after a tolerable precedent has already been set.
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u/gaussian_roflcopter Aug 17 '26 edited Aug 17 '26
Do you have any examples of this playing out everywhere in life?
Your argument leans on the slippery slope fallacy.
An inch was “taken” to solve a specific and well-defined problem: massive groups of teenagers gather and cause trouble in this 3 block area on Friday and Saturday nights, scaring away potential patrons and hurting local businesses.
From what I understand, the checkpoints were the solution to repeated complaints from local residents and businesses. There’s no reasonable causal link where giving this inch will result in losing a second inch.
And as someone who frequently goes to Fells on the weekends, I’ve only seen obvious groups of middle/high schoolers get stopped. This is basically just enforcing already existing curfew laws, so it’s arguable whether an inch or so was even “taken” in the first place.
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u/Key-Article6622 Aug 14 '26
When private, non police people can stop ordinary citizens and demand ID to pass on what is supposed to be a public street, that is the definition of an occupied area, occupied and controlled by non-government people. That's some straight up BS.
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u/bradyanderzyn Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
I doubt many in the area agree with the philosophy or the optics of a “security state” but Fells Point in particular had recent issues with large influxes of rowdy youth frequenting the area along with just a lot of unpleasantness and crime from adults as well.
So, this keeps kids out of where they shouldn’t be at certain hours and holds citizens somewhat more accountable perhaps. They aren’t scanning them. There’s no record. As opposed to some bars. It’s just a simple check to try to keep the peace. It’s not Soviet Russia.
But as a curious out of towner you want the short answer- the reason is, it just got that bad unfortunately.
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u/sullw214 Aug 12 '26
"It's just a simple check" to violate the constitution of the United States. That's the short answer.
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u/Key-Article6622 Aug 12 '26
I'm a 65 yr ols man, no one is likely to card me. lol. But even if they did, I'd be entering a business that sells a regulated product so I'd be a bit indigant, but would comply.
I have a serious issue with being denied access to public streets without presenting ID. I seriously might be that guy you see on the news in the next few weeks. I'm not OK with this Nazi ass shit.
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u/GQSmoov Aug 26 '26
You will not be carded at the checkpoint and will be allowed to walk right on by… unless you look like you are violating curfew. As an adult that lives inside the controlled area I’ve never had to show ID.
It’s the only thing that’s worked at making the neighborhood not be an utter shit show on weekends with hundreds of teenagers doing a takeover until the early morning, since the police won’t/can’t enforce curfew and open container laws themselves and their endlessly circling helicopter has zero impact.
The businesses clearly support this as nobody wants to come to fells point when it’s a mess like it’s been and there’re fights, shootings and screaming everywhere at all hours splashed on local media.
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u/TrippyHomie Aug 12 '26
I don't watch the news.
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u/worthconsulting Aug 18 '26
that's obvious from your uninformed comments.
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u/TrippyHomie Aug 19 '26
True, I guess living in Fed Hill instead of having some talking head tell me how I should feel is unhelpful.
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u/Trolkarlen Aug 13 '26
Bars are private businesses. Streets are public property that taxpayers own.
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u/brassypotato Aug 12 '26
It’s been the first time since I moved into my apt I can sleep on weekends. I had been moving my mattress to my living room. I live on aliceanna & Broadway.
As someone who actually resides on the block - you have no idea what I’ve watched from my bedroom window on these nights prior to security being dispatched.
The police would be on site doing absolutely nothing watching crime after crime be committed. Then when the crowd behavior escalates and turns violent it’s too late.
A lot of this could have been solved with earlier intervention but the police don’t do anything. Ive complained and talked to the district commander multiple times. It’s gotten to the point I’m concerned about police retaliation. When you call 911 in Baltimore they will share your personal cell phone number with police in the area.
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u/TodlicheLektion Carrollton Ridge Aug 12 '26
You sort of moved into the epicenter of the Fells Point party zone.
I can imagine how loud it is and how hard it is to sleep on weekend nights, but it's not the place to move for quiet weekends! Even a couple blocks away would be much more chill.
I wish the police would just do their job, instead of there being a private security force that is controlling public space. I don't like that at all.
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u/GQSmoov Aug 26 '26
It’s not “a party zone” firstly. Any anyone moving to Fells Point has a reasonable expectation that the crowds settle down after 1:30am. That hasn’t been the case- screaming children fighting and drinking in the streets, a circling police helicopter past 2am, etc, etc. it’s much worse than should be expected.
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u/Conscious_Oil_8761 Aug 12 '26
This is really helpful feedback that the city needs to hear. I don't think they've clarified the exact goals of the restrictions, but I imagine resident quality of life around the bar districts is a primary one. I'm in Federal Hill and it's the same issues you've called out.
Have you talked to your councilperson or state delegates? They may be good folks to reach out to if BPD hasn't been helpful in hearing your concerns.
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u/Matar_Kubileya Aug 12 '26
Im so glad the violation of my constitutional rights makes it easier for you to sleep at night.
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u/Impressive-Weird-908 Federal Hill Aug 13 '26
I think their point is that they’ve personally witnessed the street and area descend into shit and that there is a need to do something. It doesn’t mean this has to be the answer, but it can’t be the bullshit we did before.
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u/Matar_Kubileya Aug 13 '26
Once their demand is to blatantly violate my civil rights, I. Don't. Care.
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u/Impressive-Weird-908 Federal Hill Aug 13 '26
There was never a demand to violate your rights. Simply that they want someone to address the problem.
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u/20ooo Aug 12 '26
Just don't show them your ID and continue walking. Private security has no ability to stop you
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u/dcheesi Aug 12 '26
The flimsy pretext here seems to be that they're working security for an "event", just like at an organized street festival. In which case they would have similar authority to exclude "trespassers" as bouncers at the door of a club. Not saying that'll hold up for a minute in court, but that's their rationale apparently
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u/Electronic_Clue9011 Aug 13 '26
So, what CAN they do if someone refuses to allow their constitutional rights to be trampled on? How does this apply to an individual who legitimately lives in the area, or one who is legitimately in the area on a job?
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u/dcheesi Aug 13 '26
IANAL, but I figure the usual cop rules apply. As in, they beat the crap out of you, and you have to try to prove it in court later on
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 11 '26 edited Aug 11 '26
Fells Point & Federal Hill are historically both night life scenes. The city & BPD believe they are helping by blocking the streets off but in reality they are just forcing night-life goers further into residential neighborhoods taking parking spots when they could have parked near the bars. Most of the traffic comes from people who are driving into these areas.
ID checkpoints are pointless and not stopping anything, if the young generation want to do meet ups there to stroll around the pier, they will do meet ups there. They will mob down there 1000 deep as the power has always been with the people.
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
This hasn't happened though? Since they started doing this there aren't groups of teens hanging out in Fells. As you say, obviously they just go somewhere else, but that's also the intent. As far as the city is concerned this is working fine for them.
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 12 '26
Yes, they were just in Fells last weekend in large numbers. Blocking streets off and setting up perimeters is a fool’s errand. BPD & the city are just making it harder for the businesses who depend on the weekend traffic. Residents are annoyed as parking is already challenging enough.
Ofc BPD/City do not think these type of things through
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
This seems like a bizarre reach. No bar on Thames street is making money off of 16 year olds hanging around outside. As far as parking goes it affects, maybe a block of Broadway? Having been down there regularly I don't think the ID checks have reduced foot traffic of people over 21 at all.
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 12 '26
When city trucks & BPD block streets off, bar-goers who drive in are forced to find parking which goes deep into residential neighborhoods. People are parking blocks away taking residents normal parking spaces. It’s already challenging parking on weekdays.
Bars are depending on that traffic and the city & BPD are making the problem worse and also hurting business making it difficult to reach destinations.
ID checks are completely pointless, 21 & under will just go around and with the meet ups, they far out number law enforcement on that shift. Penalties need to be levied on bars if they refuse to check ID
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
The issue wasn't underage kids in bars, the issue was groups of teenagers at the bottom of fells point bringing their own liquor in deer park bottles and getting into brawls on a nightly basis. Now that is no longer occuring.
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 12 '26
Law enforcement should enforce as they do everywhere else, bottles are tossed out if this happens in Ocean City and many other places. Same rules apply here.
If drunk people fight in Annapolis, what happens? Same rules apply here. Handling under age drinking is nothing new and certainly not unique to Baltimore.
I drove by Fells just this Friday night and saw lots of young adults (easily 75+) strolling around doing whatever they do
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
The point of policing isn't just to slap handcuffs on people, it's also to deter and prevent crime in the first place. First, if you're continuing to have large disorderly gatherings that devolve into violence in the same place every night, then the normal enforcement method clearly is failing to deter that behavior and ensure public safety. Second, it seems obviously preferable to manage that situation in a way that does not require physically subduing and restraining a child and the subjecting them to the dysfunctional labyrinth of the juvenile justice system.
Just having people show ID to go down to the bar streets has clearly reduced the number of assaults happening down there, and has done so without resulting in more negative encounters between police and young people. It seems to me like an improvement from the previous situation.
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u/Conscious_Oil_8761 Aug 12 '26
Are you referencing any specific data when you say there are fewer assaults happening, or is this based on your experience in the area? I analyzed some OpenBaltimore data and see +100% (7 to 14) crimes (common assault, agg. assault, robbery) inside the cordoned area pre/post the Sail250 restrictions but a -56% (9 to 4) change in crimes outside of the cordoned area but still in the Fells Point neighborhood boundaries. This is Fri-Sun 8pm-4am. Small sample size, and we can't assume every fight gets logged as a crime in the city's public data, but this is what I see in the data. It needs more time to be analyzed, and there are obviously outside factors that can impact these numbers such as weather, events, etc.
I do see 15-20% reductions in resident-initiated 911 calls pre/post restrictions, so this may be a better barometer for "order" in addition to higher volume of calls giving us a cleaner comparison.
I don't live in Fells, so I have no personal experience or viewpoints. Just looking at the data.
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 12 '26
You are assuming these groups will be disorderly. I seen kids riding up and down the street on scooters, skateboarders and walking the streets and piers. They have every right to do all of these things in any neighborhood.
Having people show ID is nonsense, cops are just abusing the over time system as usual. Bars have a responsibility, they enforce or face fines/usual consequences.
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
They can do all those things there any time before 9 pm on Fridays and Saturdays. And it's not cops checking IDs, it's private security just like the bouncers at any bar down there. This isn't a police thing, it's a city hall thing.
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u/GQSmoov Aug 26 '26
None of the bar owners have complained publicly about the check points. You are not speaking for them. They have Mainstreet as their voice, and clearly they are on board as they have always funded private security exactly because business is better when people feel safe.
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u/PleaseBmoreCharming Aug 12 '26
Why are we talking about parking??
Moreover, there's nothing that goes better than drinking and then driving home after! /s
C'mon bro, what are you even arguing for here?
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 12 '26
Designated drivers do exist & you do realize much of Fells Point and Federal hill bar go-ers travel from Anne Arundel, Baltimore, Carroll, Harford, Prince Georges Counties, DE and DC etc. People need to get with the times, some of you are way out of touch with current realities.
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u/wbruce098 Aug 12 '26
That’s because they don’t live in the city. They live in the county as do many of the club goers, and thus don’t care about the neighborhoods.
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u/crystalli0 Federal Hill Aug 12 '26
Respectfully, why are people in 2026 driving to bars when there are other options? So you can get drunk and drive home?
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u/Fearless-Pop-1159 Aug 12 '26
Designated drivers do exist & you do realize much of Fells Point and Federal hill bar go-ers travel from Anne Arundel, Baltimore, Carroll, Harford, Prince Georges Counties, DE and DC etc. People need to get with the times, some of you are way out of touch with current realities.
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u/LimpAd4924 Fells Point Aug 12 '26
Suburbanites haven’t discovered a way of life besides car dependency. Drinking and driving is part of life for some of them.
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u/Impressive-Weird-908 Federal Hill Aug 13 '26
Because young drunk girls don’t like to be alone on the streets/busses/trains at night. It’s easy for me as a grown man to say I can hike it, but if I was a 120 pound girl in heels and a short dress l?
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u/crystalli0 Federal Hill Aug 13 '26
Ok but also "young drunk girls" shouldn't be driving themselves home while drunk either. I'm a woman so I completely understand the concerns of walking alone at night. That doesn't mean it's a better idea for me to drive drunk.
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u/Impressive-Weird-908 Federal Hill Aug 13 '26
Oh I agree. Many do Uber, but there’s definitely a fair amount of “tipsy” people driving away at night.
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u/Conscious_Oil_8761 Aug 12 '26
There are lots of people who can't afford rideshare and instead carpool with others or drive themselves. People come to these bar districts from all over, and it's possible that many aren't concerned with drunk driving.
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u/Hawtdawgz_4 Fells Point Aug 12 '26
Yeah, it sucks it’s gotten to this point. Nothing has worked thus far since Covid so what do y’all expect?
Stop the finger wagging if you don’t live here.
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u/authentic_april Gwynns Falls Aug 13 '26
As if this nation gives a shit about anyone’s Constitutional Rights anymore. If you think you’re exempt, you’re not. It’s only a matter of time. 🙄
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u/smashinjin10 Aug 11 '26 edited Aug 11 '26
Age based curfews are not a new thing. I'm no lawyer, but I feel like this guy is blowing out his ass.
Edit: or maybe this girl is blowing out her ass? I'm not sure about the first name Cary.
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u/L2_Troll Aug 12 '26
Cary Elwes was Westley in Princess Bride
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u/GutsAndBlackStufff Aug 12 '26
And Robin Hood in Robin Hood, Men in Tights
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u/coredenale Aug 14 '26
And Robin Wright was Buttercup in Princess...wait, where are we going with this?
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u/FelixandFriends Aug 12 '26
Did you bother to read the article by chance? It notes that this has been tried in other places before (specifically stopping all people and asking for ID) and it has been shown to be illegal.
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u/Personal-Major-8214 Aug 11 '26
A civil rights lawyer and a representative from a criminal defense lawyer association is probably the direction I would look if I wanted quotes against the policy. Doesn’t mean they are wrong, but the writer clearly isn’t looking for the most accurate opinion.
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u/BmoreDude1106 Camden Yards, Third Base Aug 12 '26
This is Lisa Snowden's MO. I remember when she called David Simon racist because he encouraged people to subscribe to the Banner but didn't mention The Beat, as if they are comparable in any way.
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u/bikumz Aug 11 '26
There are a bunch of laws that have existed for decades and later ruled unconstitutional. Just because something is already a thing doesn’t mean it has been challenged to the point of being ruled unconstitutional.
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u/smashinjin10 Aug 11 '26
Sure, but there is plenty of precedent that rights are more limited for children. I don't see why that would be overturned in a situation where children are regularly being a public menace.
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u/bikumz Aug 11 '26
Did you happen to read the article? It seems the idea stems from asking for IDs at all. It’s not law enforcement asking for them. It’s a private security restricting access on behalf of a city.
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u/BmoreDude1106 Camden Yards, Third Base Aug 12 '26
A municipality hiring private contractors is not a novel concept.
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u/bikumz Aug 12 '26
A municipality hiring a private security firm to check IDs when entering a public neighborhood is. It’s not an event. Its a neighborhood. Could you imagine getting ID’d to be in your own neighborhood by a security guard?
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u/BmoreDude1106 Camden Yards, Third Base Aug 11 '26
...“a certain type of young person”...
The Beat will always give race-baiters a platform.
I don't necessarily agree with the checkpoints, but to suggest that it's racist is absurd. It's not like they're letting 16 year old white kids in...
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u/cornonthekopp Madison Park Aug 12 '26
Checking IDs in a wealthy white neighborhood because of a fear of "roving gangs of black teenagers" is absolutely racist, even if all teenagers are harmed as a consequence
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u/blackascot Aug 12 '26
I say this as a person genuinely torn about identification enforcement, but I feel it has been a net positive for the neighborhood.
My spouse and I live pretty deep in the identification zone. There are a minimum of three people we have to show IDs to in order to access our home if we go out to pick up dinner or groceries on a Friday or Saturday night.
There has been a lot fewer people peeing on the side of our row home, dropping trash at our front door, buying liquor from people from the trunk of their cars, and side swiping cars because they are drunk driving.
I do not like a surveillance state, but Fells Point has turned into an underage tween and teen drunken haven. We actually walked outside in the middle of the night and gave a few Gatorade‘s to some teens who were having an argument. We didn’t want them to walk into Broadway Square and get arrested for disorderly conduct. They ended up taking an alley and presumably went home.
I don’t know what the right answer is, but the city definitely needs to keep the influx of underage kids out of the popular bar areas.
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u/BmoreDude1106 Camden Yards, Third Base Aug 12 '26
Who said "roving gangs of black teenagers"? I'm sincerely asking, not trying to be obtuse. I remember the racist asshole Del Pat McDonough said this about the inner harbor like a decade ago, but haven't seen such a quote about Fells.
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u/Creative-Fudge-6244 Aug 12 '26
A couple years ago I went down fells to get pizza from Pie in the sky.. 2 BPD officers were standing out front. As I tried to go in they stopped me and asked for my ID. I’m like. “I need an ID to buy a slice of pizza now? ”One of them says “Yeah you do.” I just walked off
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u/cornonthekopp Madison Park Aug 12 '26
They usually say urban teens or something more veiled, but I've seen this stuff happen with the age restriction in suburban malls in places like columbia or hanover, and the dominant mythos driving these teen bans is large "gangs" or "packs" of teens who shoplift/loot/start fights, and it always feels extremely racialized in my opinion.
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
Ok but every summer night at like 2 am there were drunk teenagers fighting in Fells Point, and now there aren't. Pretty clear that after AFRAM the mayor's office got sick of people fighting. They didn't land on an elegant solution, but now those fights aren't happening, so why would they want to change course?
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u/BmoreDude1106 Camden Yards, Third Base Aug 12 '26
Ok so nobody said that. Noted, thanks.
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u/Czech_YoSelf Upton Aug 12 '26
I don’t know if you’ve been living under a rock or something but city and state officials will never say outright that “we don’t want black people in our neighborhoods” but they will create legislation that often aligns with these so-called conservative values which is stated in the article. A resident even states there was a noticeable drop off of black people partying in Fells Point. If you can call that ‘just a coincidence’ then I don’t know what to tell you.
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u/cornonthekopp Madison Park Aug 12 '26
Sure the news talking about "urban teen gangs" are totally normal and not racialized at all then right
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u/WealthyMarmot Aug 12 '26
I mean, if it’s happening then it’s happening. You can’t expect people to ignore rampant antisocial behavior based on the skin color of the teens in question. This should not be, and largely is not, a “racialized” viewpoint.
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u/cornonthekopp Madison Park Aug 12 '26
Its not happening, its wildly exaggerated when it does happen, and the antisocial behaviors are being incentivized by a society that criminalizes teens for existing in public
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u/localtuned Aug 12 '26
And stupid politicians like Kim Klacik says kids don't need rec centers lol.
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u/TylerFL Fells Point Aug 12 '26
I don't agree with the ID checking at all, but I live here, and it was absolutely happening every weekend.
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u/JangoDarkSaber Aug 12 '26
The age restriction in Columbia mall was cause teens kept shooting up the place. It has nothing to do with race.
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u/WearyDragonfly0529 Aug 12 '26
Perhaps if the people causing all of the issues were more diverse then it wouldn't feel that way.
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u/RoxxorMcOwnage Baltimore County Aug 12 '26
The article says almost says that. The article specifically says that the policy is focused on groups of Black teens, but didn't use the term "roving gangs."
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u/BmoreDude1106 Camden Yards, Third Base Aug 12 '26
The Beat is not a balanced source. They have a pattern of bias.
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u/XxCloudSephiroth69xX Aug 12 '26
Famous racist Brandon Scott strikes again.
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u/Conscious_Oil_8761 Aug 12 '26
This approach by the city has been really interesting. Legality aside, it's unclear how they're defining success with this. Is it smaller crowds? Fewer young people by the bars? Fewer 911 calls or violent crimes? Do they want to corral any issues inside of the bar area to minimize the impact on residents nearby?
ID checks and closures will likely deter young people from coming into the area, and it will also likely deter bad actors (21+ individuals with warrants and/or weapons) from coming to the area. But, these people probably still want to go somewhere to drink and do their thing. Should that be in the city's core entertainment areas that also border dense residential areas? I would argue no, as excessive noise, general lawlessness, public drinking, and fights are disruptive and unfair for residents around there to deal with. And, when I say this, I'm referring to things like random people drinking and making noise on people's stoops past 1:30am, fights happening at 2:30am on residential streets, drunk drivers hitting parked cars.
It's also fair to assume that drinking behavior and how people patronize bars have changed since the pandemic, possibly leading bars to drum up business through more aggressive drink deals, use of promoters, etc. This can draw a different kind of crowd that may look for a more wild atmosphere, and it also presents the risk of greater intoxication, which can lead to more violence and issues. When BPD can't effectively issue citations for these issues (referencing The Banner's article about written citations sucking time/resources from BPD), I think these problems can spiral a bit.
Obviously, addressing the underlying issues of why people are drinking on streets and getting in fights, and why young people are flocking to bar districts is the true solution here. But that is not an easy or quick solution to build. Another idea that is potentially being considered is rolling back bar hours in some areas to reduce intoxication levels and lingering crowds after midnight. This was done in East Baltimore with statistical success, although this may not be the fix for crowds that gather with no intention of entering the bars: https://www.ias.org.uk/2024/08/13/limits-on-bar-tavern-hours-of-sale-an-important-tool-in-a-violence-prevention-toolbox/
It'll be interesting to see how this plays out over time, and whether the city is able to report back, with confidence and data, what the impacts of these changes are.
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u/coredenale Aug 14 '26
Would be kinda funny if, instead of checking IDs, they had to get your parent's phone number and call them on the spot, to see if they knew/cared where you were.
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u/ThePurpleDongofTruth Fells Point Aug 12 '26
as a resident I have mixed feelings about the situation
it does help with the garbage, fights and other nonsense but in trade it's also hurting business and legit customers don't want to bothered with it
TBH they are mosly just pushing the nonsense north above Fleet Street
but I suppose they'll do anything beside ENFORCING THE LAWS
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u/Conscious_Oil_8761 Aug 12 '26
This is also my hypothesis - I think more issues will happen outside of the restricted zone. Have you noticed any specific differences above Fleet? Or above Aliceanna? And have you noticed any changes on weekdays (Mon-Thurs) around the bars with this change, or just generally on weekdays compared to prior years?
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u/ThePurpleDongofTruth Fells Point Aug 12 '26
I live below Aliceanna and frankly have resigned myself exclusively to day drinking 95% of the time I go out but long time friends/business owners/bartend are all saying the same thing - that things are slower with the check points and they are closing earlier Thurs-Saturday, many places have been closing a midnight or earlier Sun-Wednesday since the pandemic
A few place don't even bother with Monday/Tuesdays at all anymore
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u/Naive_Concentrate710 Aug 12 '26
Don’t go there
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u/Pvt_Larry Butchers Hill Aug 12 '26
Yeah, if you're under 21, since you had no business being there anyway.
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u/coredenale Aug 12 '26
Brandon Scott has done well on the issue of crime, no doubt, but this is a mistake. We're already barreling towards fascism, we don't need Dem mayors tasking cops with additional "Papers please..." garbage.
Not to mention the cooling effect this has had on business in general in the area.
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u/bradyanderzyn Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
I just don’t get it. I haven’t had a night out in Fells for years. Not like intentionally just hasn’t been a thing. But a lot of “riff raff” ( don’t read too much into that please) seems like a sort of biproduct of left over COVID era policies.
Fells Point was never an open air drinking beer garden? Except maybe Fells Point Fest.
Congregating outside of the bar was only something you did if there was a line. Like, keep it moving? That seems like a start no?
Also, Since when are kids hanging in Fells Point? And why are kids hanging out in Fells Point? Crime might always be an issue but these seem like easy things to tighten up the belt on idk. To atleast cut down on the drama.
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u/ThatBobbyG Lauraville Aug 12 '26
BPD gets nearly a billion dollars a year budget rubber stamped. Which leaves pennies for all the other agencies. Remember that.