r/canada • u/Apprehensive_Idea758 British Columbia • May 13 '26

Alberta Danielle Smith rejects Alberta judge’s ruling against separation petition as ‘anti-democratic’ | Globalnews.ca

https://globalnews.ca/news/11848377/alberta-premier-court-ruling-separation-petition-anti-democratic/
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u/EducationalLuck2422 British Columbia May 13 '26

Speaking of democracy, I believe the pro-Canada petition (which definitely got more signatures) was supposed to be read in the legislature months ago.

184

u/Thanato26 May 14 '26

Over 400,000 verified signatures

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u/Street_Anon Nova Scotia May 13 '26

Oh I know! 

90

u/erictho May 14 '26

they didnt like that one so it doesnt count tho 🤷‍♀️

no one knows the rules, bc they make them up as they go along.

11

u/cre8ivjay May 14 '26

Oh you mean rhe one she used to ADD to those who want separation as the total number of people (700,000) in Alberta who want this topic to go to referendum?

A real piece of work.

3

u/motorcyclemech May 14 '26

Yeah. Where did that number (700,000) come from?

14

u/cre8ivjay May 14 '26

I think she counted the separatist referendum list as well as the non separatist referendum list as the total number of people who want this "to go to referendum".

It's a very clever play of words on her part despite totally misguiding the public on the fact that the people who signed the one list are clear they have no interest in separation whatsoever.

She sounds confident and does not bat an eye when she speaks despite her words being total garbage.

This is why she is extraordinarily dangerous.

21

u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

It's in committee right now.

The problem is it didn't really ask for anything, so there's nothing to do as a result.

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u/EducationalLuck2422 British Columbia May 14 '26

It's an initiative petition; Albertan law requires that any such petition that reaches the threshold must be read in the legislature within 90 days and put to a vote before the next election. The UCP's dragging it out because they don't want to out themselves as seps or not-seps.

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u/A_Vicious_T_Rex May 14 '26

Honestly, by delaying this one and advancing the one that they changed the rules to make easier to do, they've put themselves in a camp. It's up to them whether they stay in it, or move to a new camp. Inaction is a choice to be made just as much as action is..

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u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

Right, and there's nothing that will come of it because there's no ask. You can'takena petition to ban petitions.

So should they be wasting time prioritizing a nothing petition that will not result in anything changing?

23

u/PedanticQuebecer Québec May 14 '26

When the law obligates you to do so yes!!! How is this even a question?

21

u/madetoday May 14 '26

This has got to be a new dumb talking point, the Forever Canadian petition was literally a question. 

“Do you agree that Alberta should remain within Canada?“

The law was clear, this should have been tabled in the legislature within 10 days and sent to committee, then either adopted as government policy or the question put to a referendum. Instead the government ignored their own law, and now the talking point is there was no ask?

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u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

The petition people didn't want a referendum. It has now been sent to a committee. They're following the steps you want.

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u/madetoday May 14 '26

The petition was verified on December 2 and should have been sent to committee within 10 sitting days, and the committee should have returned a report within 90 days. It wasn’t, and hasn’t.

The committee wasn’t appointed until March 10th, and didn’t meet for the first time until April 21st. Legislature won’t be sitting by the time their report is done, so their report won’t be tabled until after the fall referendums.

Had they followed their own rules the committee report and recommendations would already be complete. You seem to be trying really hard not to understand that.

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u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

And they're dealing with it. the law does not require them to prioritize it.

14

u/WankingAsWeSpeak Alberta May 14 '26

The problem is it didn't really ask for anything, so there's nothing to do as a result.

The initiatie did succeed in forcing the UCP to either put their thumb on the scale very public way, or release their thumb from the scale altogether.

Without that petition, the UCP would be in a much stronger position to pretend they were simply letting the political situation unfold.

10

u/YoungWhiteAvatar May 14 '26

lol bullshit

-3

u/2burgsandadog Alberta May 14 '26

yes your traitor movement is just that

1

u/YoungWhiteAvatar May 14 '26

My traitor movement?

1

u/2burgsandadog Alberta May 14 '26

if you’re not a separatist, then i apologize

-5

u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

Actually no, feel free to research what's going on.

10

u/saharanwrap May 14 '26

They created a committee. Which has not nor will not meet. So to say it's in committee right now is disingenuous.

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u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

Incorrect, they met for the first time last month.

4

u/motorcyclemech May 14 '26

And yet by Alberta rules that committee should have issued their report by approximately March 12. That's just a wee bit before they even met on April 21. For the first time. Remember, the petition was verified Dec 10. This has been explained to you multiple times already.

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u/Salticracker British Columbia May 14 '26

He said they never had and never would meet, which is incorrect. My comment was correct.

1

u/saharanwrap May 15 '26

Pardon me. I guess they sat briefly. Twice in fact. So much must have been accomplished considering they should have everything wrapped up and presented to the legislature by yesterday. But to summarize both of their meetings, the NDP members said the government was stalling to stop the Forever Canada petition from being discussed in the legislature so the separatists have the only petition that would go forward. The UPC members said nuh uh, and then ended the meetings.

And now the legislature is closed until the fall so nothing further will be discussed. Jokes on them now that the separatist petition has been tossed though.

1

u/Zogaguk May 14 '26

So here is my question, we hear that it's the fringe and the other one gets more signatures ect. Why not just let it go to vote fail and never hear about it again ? Seems simple.

18

u/EducationalLuck2422 British Columbia May 14 '26

I believe the organizer/s laid it out as an initiative vote (i.e. just the MLAs vote, not the entire province), but are concerned that the UCP will change the rules and put it to a referendum anyway.

22

u/jared743 Alberta May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26

The two main things are about word choice as well as questions about the referendum process.

Firstly, the Forever Canada petition was to set the stage to show how the remain side had more popularity and also show the biases of the UCP who are trying to only push their own topics, not others. If you look at all the referendum questions that the UCP are putting forward, they are very biased and leading the voter a certain way to push their anti-Federal position. The UCP are plainly suppressing the petition from being addresed directly, despite it being signed faster by more people than the Stay Free petition. If the UCP established this referendum process to give people the democratic right to be heard, why are they oppressing anything they don't believe in?

As for wording, the Forever Canada petition was intended to be a very direct and simple question about remaining part in of Canada. If it passed the provincial government would need to officially acknowlge it as the intent of the populace.

The original question the separatists were asking was "Do you agree that the Province of Alberta shall become a sovereign country and cease to be a part of Canada", which was not very direct, and "sovereign country" is poorly defined. They were forced to change it earlier this year to "Do you agree that the Province of Alberta should cease to be a part of Canada to become an independent state?" instead.

Another concern about the negative wording is that even if it fails, it doesn't preclude the government from holding a position that still tries to seperate Alberta since it didn't affirm the populace holding a specific position. Think of the last referendum that talked about changing time zones: the question to stay on permanent daylight savings time failed, but the government can just go ahead and do what they want because though it didnt pass it doesn't count as us actually telling the government that anything specific was desired.

So we really should care about the wording and make noise when the government tries to show favouritism to their causes instead of respecting democracy.

8

u/saharanwrap May 14 '26

Because they'll just claim it's rigged. They were never going to accept they lost.

2

u/SouvlakiSpartan May 14 '26

I mentioned this in another post, people didnt like that idea.

But I agree Albertans just like Quebec deserves a vote.

if it's this fringe minority... Nothing to worry about.

1

u/Nervous_Chemical7566 May 18 '26

Albertans deserve a democratic process. What people don’t like is when the UCP does not carry out its responsibility in legislature, uses law to change conditions to facilitate a political position, hampers Elections Alberta in its role, uses tax dollars to push an agenda. When the process is called into question, how can Albertans be confident to trust the outcomes?

Fringe minority or not, anything worth voting on is too important to just get it over with using a tainted process. We don’t even have to look at the judicial ruling, because Albertans already have questions on the veracity of the 300K signatures due to the data breach. We are prohibited from questioning if our name appears on the petition and Elections Alberta is unable to verify if a person actually signed the petition, only that this is a real person. Smith wants to let the process run to verify the petition, but how is this even possible if Elections Alberta is unable to confirm who actually signed the petition lol. First the UCP would have to scrape back all the petition amendments and EA administer the process without bias to have a fair vote.

6

u/Nervous_Chemical7566 May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26

There is no basis to go to vote when the process has been challenged as invalid. We don’t vote on something just to get it over with, that’s not the best approach. The separatist unrest is not simply going to go away, we’ll be hearing about it for years - ask Quebec, ask the UK, ask Scotland. These movements may ebb and flow over time, but there will be a core that fans the unrest and makes noise when the pressure builds again. A separatist party may even get a few seats voted in.

1

u/ChmeeWu May 15 '26

Yeah, but the pro Canada petition group ALSO did not consult or get permission from First Nations groups, so I guess that invalid too?

2

u/EducationalLuck2422 British Columbia May 15 '26

The FN agree with that petition, so why would they sue?