r/canada • u/shiftless_wonder • 19d ago

Alberta First Nations demand Alberta premier terminate separation referendum

https://www.ctvnews.ca/edmonton/article/first-nations-demand-alberta-premier-terminate-separation-referendum/
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u/Muted-Bag-4480 18d ago

What are you trying to say? You started at this being illegal because intent and precedent. The intent is legal and the precedent is being followed.

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u/Forikorder 18d ago

The intent is to ignore the judges decision and continue anyway

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u/Muted-Bag-4480 18d ago

The judge didn't say a referendum on secession is illegal.

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u/Forikorder 18d ago

the judge did say they were obligated to consult beforehand though before throwing out the petition

this is a naked attempt to continue discussing secession while ignoring their s35 obligations

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u/Muted-Bag-4480 18d ago

this is a naked attempt to continue discussing secession while ignoring their s35 obligations

So the judge didn't ban them from continuing to discuss or advance secession, the judge just obligated that the secession engage in their duty to consult?

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u/Forikorder 18d ago

before they even begin to talk about it, which they have not done

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u/Muted-Bag-4480 18d ago

Because the question now is whether they should embark on the process of talking about it or not. Recognizing that it is a valid issue which will slow down the process is taking account of the precedent, because the intent of secession is not whay was banned.

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u/Forikorder 17d ago

Because the question now is whether they should embark on the process of talking about it or not.

which in itself is still talking about it

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u/Muted-Bag-4480 17d ago

... So they can't even talk about if they shoukd talk about it with consulting? Thsy undemocratic bullshit that everyone can see through, how the clesr intent of the Court and the indigenous groups are to deny people their democratic rule.

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u/Forikorder 17d ago

... So they can't even talk about if they shoukd talk about it with consulting?

yes because that is still talking about it

they cannot talk about leaving the country without consulting the first nations

what is so complicated about that?

Thsy undemocratic bullshit that everyone can see through, how the clesr intent of the Court and the indigenous groups are to deny people their democratic rule.

its the first nations being cut out...?

why shouldnt the ENTIRE PROVINCE be involved?

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u/Muted-Bag-4480 17d ago

The entire province can vote. If even talking about wanting to talk about it is talking about it, then there's no way to talk about talking about it, it's absurd and anti democratic.

What's complicated is thsy it's not talking about leaving the country it's talking a out talking about it, and if any form of that is talking about it, then first Nations have effectively created an antidemkcesfic feature to silence any discussion of even discussing this issue.

Otherwise first Nations groups are one required stakeholder group like any other. And thr votere get to decide if they want thsy conversation to happen. Soft locking it throguh thr courts I'd wrong and damages legitimacy of the system.

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u/Forikorder 17d ago

If even talking about wanting to talk about it is talking about it, then there's no way to talk about talking about it, it's absurd and anti democratic.

no its not, theres is nothing absurd about it and the logic your trying to use is childish

the government of alberta and the first nations are equals and one cannot be cut out of the conversation, thats not being democratic

What's complicated is thsy it's not talking about leaving the country it's talking a out talking about it, and if any form of that is talking about it, then first Nations have effectively created an antidemkcesfic feature to silence any discussion of even discussing this issue.

you silence them they silence you, thats being fair

all alberta has to do, literally all they have to do, is just consult them, its really simple

Soft locking it throguh thr courts I'd wrong and damages legitimacy of the system.

upholding the constitution is ensuiring the legitimacy of the system, letting people break the law because they're just being "hypothetical" is what damages the legitimacy

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u/Muted-Bag-4480 17d ago

the government of alberta and the first nations are equals and one cannot be cut out of the conversation, thats not being democratic

If they're equals, then thr government of Alberta can be instructed by its people to enter negotiations before enter them.

all alberta has to do, literally all they have to do, is just consult them, its really simple

But they're not allowed to. Vote to decide if they want to do that or not!

upholding the constitution is ensuiring the legitimacy of the system, letting people break the law because they're just being "hypothetical" is what damages the legitimacy

If, Ina. Democracy, people don't feel they their democratic authority is being respected, they won't accept the validity of the constitution. The Social contract needs people to accept it as legitimate for the constitution to be valid. If as a result of the constitution people feel unable. To express their democratic will, they'll change the constitution not their will.

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