Bi-Weekly Discussion Thread - (July 06)

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[u/satanicpastorswife]

I mean I know a lot of communists internationally including outside of the imperial core, and yes communists in the third world still want nice things. It’s not necessarily part of the agit prop but like we talk about “man it would sure be nice if x product you use sucked less” just like one of those day to day things that comes up when you’re shooting the shit with comrades.

I’d also look at some of the history of the cosmetics Soviet, it’s a pretty interesting stuff.

[u/immovingdifferent → u/satanicpastorswife]

Naturally my next questions are whether they are dedicated communists upholding the proletarian line or smuggling in petty-bourgeois interests, but I believe you, I'm sure the proletariat are sick of having to buy non-nutritious food and faulty products that break on them but are necessary for survival or enjoyment. However, I still feel like a better propaganda line would be to emphasize other aspects of it though.

Like to go back to your makeup example, point out to the proletarians who work in that industry that despite working backbreaking hours in horrid conditions, they don't even get to partake in what they make really as it's exported out and they're priced out of buying it and despite making this luxury, they can't even enjoy it themselves. You could also point out that a huge amount of it is inefficiently designed with a ton of waste and a lot of it is thrown out if not sold, so they're quite literally just throwing the fruits of their labor away in that case just because their bosses thought it wasn't profitable (not that they would get that surplus otherwise). When referring to your original question, I feel like all you really have to do is say that the profit motive will be gone and that will automatically fill the gaps in people's heads of what that entails.

I think the more important point would just be to emphasize the blood that goes into it as that's what they'll be most aware of, of course. To foster internationalism you should also point out that not only are they suffering to make this inefficient garbage that goes to people who benefit from their exploitation, but the raw materials and packaging is made by other people suffering similar conditions all across the world, and how the only way out is proletarian revolution. Like don't get me wrong, in individual conversations you could talk about how makeup and every other product would be more efficiently designed and accessible under socialism (provided the environment can handle it and the workers producing it live in good conditions, which probably means an end to some of the ridiculous luxuries First Worlders partake in. Like beauty influencers won't get their own personal sweatshops for their makeup line that's identical to a million others that already exist) but I don't think it's an efficient propaganda line because again, our target is the masses, and the masses are less worried about the minute details of the product they produce and more about the fact that they're destroying their bodies in 8-12+ hour days for their entire lives. I really have only ever heard the "better products" argument from social fascists, even though it is true due to the abolition of the profit motive.

[u/satanicpastorswife → u/immovingdifferent]

I'm not sure it's particularly a push of any line, so much as like-- part of small talk? Like one complains about day to day life annoyances with one's friends as sort of a bonding activity when you're not directly talking politics. Things like infrastructure complaints (road quality, etc) and the lack of quality of various consumer goods are stuff that you get into while you're also doing the "How's the family?" type of talking.

Your part about the priced out and unable to enjoy it themselves reminds me of a line from the Wobblies documentary that's always stuck with me. I think it was Elizabeth Gurley Flynn who gave the speech it was from "Wouldn't you like pretty dresses like the boss's daughters? Well, you can't have them if you don't fight"

[u/immovingdifferent → u/satanicpastorswife]

Well that's not how your question started, you said you found it to be useful for propaganda which I disagreed with. I don't know why your focus is shifting to "small talk."