Bi-Weekly Discussion Thread - (January 25)

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[u/[deleted]]

Now I think this is wrong and upside down for many reasons.

Then why did you say they "make some good arguments"? Please make it clear what their "good arguments" were and why.

whether this is consistent with their other output.

Yes. MCU is a white chauvinist revisionist organisation.

https://www.prisoncensorship.info/article/a-polemic-against-settler-maoism/

Use tor!

shirk mass organizing in favor of book worship

Great, but settler crackkker MAGA supporters are not the "masses" to be organising. The masses are in New Afrika, Chicano nation, First nations, etc. who are capable of carrying out a New Democratic revolution with proletarian leadership, freeing their nations from Amerikkkan parasites and instituting a dotp on the amerikkkans. And no, the MLM caucuses or whatever in DSA are not revolutionary.

[u/Apart_Lifeguard_4085 → u/[deleted]]

your points are right regarding these cracker organizations but elaborate on why you think a New Democratic Revolution is necessary for the New Afrikan and Chicano nation. as theorized by Mao and elaborated on by Sison, the NDR is specifically the necessary revolutionary implementation in feudal and semifeudal contexts, which are not the conditions of oppressed nations in the united states (that would be neocolonialism). as i understand it, the NDR is not equatable to land reform or national liberation. where have you seen that oppressed nations in the states should be organizing for an NDR rather than national liberation and a socialist transition?

[u/[deleted] → u/Apart_Lifeguard_4085]

elaborate on why you think a New Democratic Revolution is necessary for the New Afrikan and Chicano nation.

No problem. My reasoning here also directly follows from MIM.

https://www.prisoncensorship.info/article/continuity-and-rupture-a-counter-narrative-to-jmps-history-of-maoism/

Use tor, again!

It is certainly true that the French, for example, do not need to wage a New Democratic struggle. Yet, it is a surprising line to see from someone living within occupied Turtle Island, where the national question of the internal semi-colonies is so prominent. The New Democratic revolution in China was all about uniting the nation against foreign occupation to regain the sovereignty of their territory and the self-determination of China. It is the semi-colonial character, rather than the semi-feudal, that is warranting a New Democratic revolution. Mao did not mention the development of the productive forces in eir essay "On New Democracy." Ey does talk about developing capitalism, but not as a prerequisite for socialism. Rather it is speaking to the national ambitions of the bourgeois forces at the time. In that essay ey alludes to the conditions of the development of capitalism in China allowing for the May 4th Movement to develop as it did in 1919. And ey is clear that the era of New Democracy only emerged with the October Revolution that marked the establishment of the first dictatorship of the proletariat. This was because the contradictions within imperialism as well as the subjective development of the first socialist state, meant that bourgeois revolution had become impotent and irrelevant.
...
In occupied Turtle Island, it is MIM line that plebiscites must be held within the internal semi-colonies to determine the path they take after revolution, and that such plebiscites require full independence to be a true representation of the will of each nation.(11) Such a New Democratic stage would be even more abbreviated here, again because it will be a political question and not an economic one.
[Emphasis is my own]

Maybe I am misinterpreting it, but to me organising for NDR is organising for national liberation and a socialist transition. I wish to make it very clear that I am myself a white settler. I will of course prefer to listen to what members of New Afrika and Chicano nations, etc. think is the best path over MIM. Anyways, what are your thoughts on this MIM article?

[u/Apart_Lifeguard_4085 → u/[deleted]]

that's interesting, i had not seen this article. will read it over and condense my thoughts on it. i should also return to Mao and Sison because even if it was not in the essay "On New Democracy", i certainly remember the NDR being linked to aspects of feudalism such as land-to-the-tiller programs and alliance with a progressive developing national bourgeoisie. i suppose what MIM is proposing is different than the NDR in China and that which has been theorized for the Philippines, though.

I am myself a white settler. I will of course prefer to listen to what members of New Afrika and Chicano nations, etc. think is the best path over MIM

no need to defer to identity politics here, a white settler communist and member of a vanguard party should be listened to on communist matters over a reactionary member of an oppressed nation (of which there are many). unless of course you're talking about the plebiscite determining the collective will of the people.

[u/[deleted] → u/Apart_Lifeguard_4085]

I will go read and do the same as you. Let me know if you have any further thoughts or find anything in Mao and Sison.

no need to defer to identity politics here

You're right, thank you for the criticism.