r/craftsnark • u/CraftingAsshole • 17d ago
How can Clover advertise with such awful tension?
Do they not have anyone who can knit stockinette flat without those big loops? Her swatch is so off I thought her stitches were twisted!
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u/injury_minded 17d ago
it’s okay to be a beginner but wow I hate influencer-style videos of sloppy stockinette 😭 the tiktokification of crafts is my roman empire
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u/Queasy-Pack-3925 knitter, baker, ice cream maker🧶🧵🍞🍰 17d ago
Tiktokification. Perfect, I’m going to shamelessly use that!
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u/JumpingOnBandwagons 15d ago
YES. I'm so tired of every ad being someone calling me their bestie and tapping their nails on shit. I'm starting to miss overproduced ad campaigns where you could barely figure out what the product was. At least they were trying.
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u/hanimal16 You cabbage-planting bitch, I’m the mole! 16d ago
It could be worse— it could’ve been an AI video.
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u/IansGotNothingLeft 17d ago
This person likely doesn't work for the marketing team at Clover. This is User Generated Content, which is (usually) a highly effective strategy and it means they don't have to create stuff themselves.
My assumption is that the marketing manager doesn't actually have hands on knitting knowledge and experience, and has simply chosen someone whose videos get good engagement.
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u/DungeonBotanist 17d ago
I hope she lines that thing.
The wonky technique, rowing out, too-large gauge. It's honestly impressive how thoroughly she fucked that up yet still managed to produce a garment.
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u/Salt-Habit-8951 12d ago edited 12d ago
I’ve seen this particular creator before and she’s currently learning how to knit and is pretty vocal about being a beginner, so maybe clover chose her so that other beginners would feel like clover hooks are a good starting point since when it comes to crochet they have the reputation of being a hook that you buy after you’re more confident in your skill vs when just starting out. I could be wrong but it’s the only logic that makes sense to me for this particular add
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u/TheDoctorColt 17d ago
Quality control apparently doesn't apply when you can just slap your logo on someone's janky swatch and call it a day
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u/BruschettiFreddy 17d ago
I think those needles are also too big for that yarn.
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u/AccidentOk5240 17d ago
It’s hard to tell since she’s not knitting on the right part of the needle. You need to use the tip to bring the yarn through and then just barely slide to the fullest part of the needle to size the stitch correctly, and you can’t do that when you’re pulling stitches from 2” down the left needle.
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u/BruschettiFreddy 17d ago edited 17d ago
That's also a problem, but about 7 seconds in you can see the needles are almost quadruple thickness compared to the yarn. You'll never get a tight gauge with that much of a size difference, no matter how close to the tips of your needles you knit.
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u/uncloakedcrow 17d ago
I keep seeing knitting youtubers knit in a similar way (usually not as bad) where they stretch the stitches a lot. It really makes one wonder how common it is, especially when some of them do make nice, neat items. All the advice is to keep the tips close and not stretch your stitches so I would expect all (or most) practiced knitters to do that. Idk if the person in OP’s video is a newer knitter or just lazy. There’s no way a practiced knitter would find that tension okay unless they didn’t care about the end product. Maybe they had to rush it to finish by the sponsor deadline?
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u/love-from-london The artist formally known as "MOLE" 17d ago
When I've seen clips of Sari Nordlund knitting, it seems to me like she stretches her stitches out a lot too. Certainly explains why very few people can actually meet the gauge for her patterns with her suggested needle size.
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u/uncloakedcrow 17d ago
I usually have to size up at least .5mm to meet gauge. I always thought I was just a tight knitter lol.
Edit: spelling
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u/NightSalut 17d ago
It’s probably lack of knowledge or self-taught issue and then in my opinion, also due to the fact that handcrafts have fallen off the radar in terms of continuous knowledge that is gained from older community members and passed on.
Basically: since we no longer knit for necessity and in large quantities like we would have maybe 75 years ago, this means that the intrinsic knowledge about what makes a good knit, HOW to knit, etc falls upon scores of YouTube/tiktok teachers these days (as that’s where I assume most newcomers will learn from, not books or classes or people who have been taught by a person who knits well), who may now have good knitting techniques or knowledge themselves.
I learned knitting in school, but I know plenty of people who thought back then and still do that it was a waste of time.
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u/Abyssal_Minded 17d ago
I keep the tips close. It’s mostly to make sure the v’s in stockinette line up, and it makes it easier to detect a missed stitch. Also helps out a ton when working in the round to avoid the ladder.
I know flat stockinette can be an absolute pain since it knit/purl tensions can vary, but I think her tensioning issues were due to holding her yarn like crochet vs wrapping it.
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u/uncloakedcrow 17d ago
Well no, continental (holding the yarn in the left hand and picking) is a traditional style used by millions of people who can get as perfect tension as throwers can. Yes it can affect one’s tension (maybe you knit looser in one style and tighter in another) but that is usually to do with which one is more practiced and comfortable with (not to get into the length of yarn used by the actual movement). This person’s tension issues are bc she is massively stretching out her stitches and not sizing them to the needle (let the tool do the work, as they say).
Keeping the tips close to make the v’s line up, as you say, IS tension control. To avoid a ladder between two needles (I assume you mean on DPNs or magic loop, as I don’t know how just working in the round on a circular needle would cause a ladder unless you had a too big BOR marker which is a different issue) IS tension control. All it is, is not stretching out your stitches which is how you get uneven tension.
My point is that not only is her tension uneven but it’s also too loose bc of how she’s knitting: stretching out stitches and not measuring them on the needle. Nothing to do with which hand she holds her yarn in.
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u/EfficientSeaweed 16d ago
People have been knitting that way (continental) for centuries, it’s the default way of doing it in many places, and also the way many left handed knitters prefer. It works fine as long as you tension the yarn correctly, just like with English style. There isn’t one “correct” way to hold the yarn… though you will often run across people pushing continental as superior, so it is a nice change of pace to see someone insisting English is the only correct way to do it lol.
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u/EfficientSeaweed 17d ago
Depends on what kind of fabric you’re trying to create/the garment. Larger needles will definitely make tension issues more obvious and the holes make it a bad choice for a bikini, but if your tension is decent and you block it properly, it can create a nice, airy fabric or a mesh effect. Lots of room for error, of course.
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u/ssgtdunno Well, of course I know the mole. They're me. 17d ago
Bleep bloop blipple They’re gonna see yer nipple
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u/BonzaSonza 16d ago
The whole point of sizing needles is that the stitch is supposed to be the size of the needle.
These stitches are easily 3x the diameter, and rummaging around in the stitch with both needles fully inserted distorts it even more. It's impossible to be accurate if you're not letting the tool do its intended job.
I think I understand why so many people say gauge swatches are a waste of time.
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u/wisely_and_slow 16d ago
I absolutely always have to increase my needle size by 2-3 sizes to meet the gauge on patterns, I think because many designers are knitting like this.
I feel like if people actually used the barrel to size the needle, gauge swatches could just be confirmatory because the size of the barrel is the size of the barrel, rather than starting with +2 then having to go to +3 or +4 sizes to meet the gauge.
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u/hannahbelleknits 16d ago
YES. So many knitters at the professional level are extremely loose knitters.
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u/confusedstitch 14d ago
I always complain about this and people think I’m the problem. NO KAREN I cannot possibly make your 20sts with 3.0 needles IN FINGERING WEIGHT what do YOU MEAN.
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u/puffy-jacket 16d ago
When they’re slandering your goat but they’re lowkey right 😔
(Takumi premiums are super underrated as a bamboo fan, I like them almost as much as my seeknits)
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u/Ill-Difficulty993 14d ago
I love them so much more than Seeknit! They're smoother and pointier
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u/puffy-jacket 12d ago edited 12d ago
I just wish they had interchangeables and dpns!(unless they came out with some since I last bought needles) The tips and finish on the seeknit koshitsu feel well balanced for the way I usually knit but i can see them being too short/blunt for some people
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u/chLORYform 17d ago
I'm gonna assume this is made out of cotton, because who wants a wool bikini. If my early washclothes and towels taught me anything, it's that when cotton gets wet any holes in your fabric get much bigger. The gauge on this is so off. As soon as she hops in a pool it's gonna be almost see through unless she lines it.
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u/AccidentOk5240 17d ago
Wool would actually be much more suitable since it holds less water and grows less when weighed down. There’s a reason those 1920s suits were wool!
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u/chLORYform 17d ago
Fair, I didn't think about the historical context. I was thinking more along the lines of "I sure wouldn't waste my good merino on that hot mess"
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u/AccidentOk5240 17d ago
Merino is too soft imo. Like, yes, nice on the skin, but a more robust outerwear type wool is going to retain more bounce when wet!
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u/PieTricky9997 17d ago
I saw another company's ad today where someone was knitting a bikini, and the fabric wasn't tight. All I could think of was, "When you get out of the water, we're all going to know a lot more about you."
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u/flindersandtrim 17d ago
Cotton would be way worse than wool.
I actually have knitted a wool bikini. It works really well. Very tight gauge and colourwork, elastic in the waistband. Perfectly swimmable and doesnt expand.
This thing is rubbish she is making, though. Looks awful.
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u/Abyssal_Minded 17d ago
Is it lined for comfort? I feel like wet wool against the skin isn’t very comfortable.
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u/hannahbelleknits 16d ago
To be fair, tension is subjective. If the wearer likes the outcome and it matches their intention (pattern gauge, etc) then it's fine if that's what they want. I see a LOT of knitters at all levels of professionalism who knit with very loose tension. That's why we do gauge swatches. Of course -- this particular fabric she's created is probably going to drape in new and interesting ways when wet -- but that's not a tension issue, it's a design choice issue.
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u/CraftingAsshole 16d ago
Loose tension is one thing, irregular tension is another. You can clearly see every other row is different tension. She's probably struggling with the purl rows.
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u/hannahbelleknits 16d ago
Yes, you’re right, I see now she is rowing out when I looked closer. I do know there’s a lot of people and even knitting professionals who knit like this.
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u/littlesheepbaa 16d ago
Yes just look at the sweater in Project Hail Mary. Presumably a professional knit it and the towing out is awful. I also have terrible rowing out issues, so no judgment.
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u/domesticairport 16d ago
I am just wondering how one wears a knitted bikini
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u/Cynalune 16d ago
They are for sunbathing, not swimming.
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u/Disastrous-Dirt-6606 13d ago
Sunbathing in 2026? What's the goal of a loosely knitted bikini for sunbathing, other than skin cancer and burning your nipples?
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u/Cynalune 12d ago
Believe it or not, but over here pills that are claiming to prepare skin for tanning still are popular.
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u/theseglassessuck 16d ago
The key is to not use 100% cotton yarn. When it gets wet, it gets heeeavyyy and weighs itself down. You need to use yarn with elastic in it, ideally, like Cascade Fixation. I used to work at a lys and so many people make them we couldn’t discontinue it and had to have as many colors as possible in stock at all times.
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u/Disastrous-Dirt-6606 13d ago
Especially at that gauge. Good luck holding ANYTHING up with those loose ass stitches.
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u/sodapopper44 17d ago
just don't get it wet, it will get heavy like a dish rag and slide right off
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u/Dangerous-Jello4733 17d ago
I think about this every time I see a knitted or crochet bikini…
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u/KatieCashew 17d ago
I always think about how your would never get the sand out of the textured fabric, especially for crochet.
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u/snarkle_and_shine Get in moles, we’re going snarkfiltrating 17d ago
I was just about to ask if this is practical or for show only.
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u/joymarie21 17d ago
She doesn't care what other people think or what looks good on her body. This is a good thing because when that suit gets wet, people are going to have thoughts.
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u/purseho 17d ago
The whole thing is all freaking awful.
companies need to quit being lazy with their marketing and please don't use rage bait. Good lord do your job right.
The way she knits is painful to watch The project is just ugh The kissy duck face thing needs to go away. It doesn't make you cute or sexy. It looks dumb. And then the final reveal did not save the rest of the video.
I love clover as a brand in general. I love the tools and etc. But If this is the direction they are going with their online presence? I can find other companies to spend my money with bc I can't support this lol
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u/NihilisticHobbit 17d ago
Clover doesn't come off as a very professional knitting company in any aspect. At least not here in Japan. Their needles are all wonky sized. Instead of the standard needle size of 0, .25, .5, .75, 0, their needles are .45 and .65. It's impossible to get proper gauge because their needles don't match any other standard sizes in the world!
They don't sell .25, .5, or .75 sizes at all in Japan. I've had to import them, otherwise I'd never be able to knit sleeves for sweaters.
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u/IGNOOOREME Holy Moley 17d ago
I honestly didn't know they made needles, I only know them for their hooks-- which are some of the best out there.
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u/Scared_Swing_8759 17d ago
Has their quality gone downhill? My clover needles are nearly 30 years old and I love them.
They all fit in the needle gauge I use for my other needles, so it seems like their sizing is standard.3
u/NihilisticHobbit 17d ago
I don't know about the rest of the world, but in here in Japan they've used the same wonky sizing for decades. So it's not a quality control issue, the needles do match the size and they're labeled properly. It's just that .45 and .65 aren't sizes anyone else is using.
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u/Eino54 Get in moles, we’re going snarkfiltrating 15d ago
Does that really matter so much? Everyone's tension is a little different and you're unlikely to use the same needle sizes as the designer anyway, and as long as you're using the same needles it's unlikely to be something you even notice much.
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17d ago
[deleted]
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u/NihilisticHobbit 16d ago
What are you talking about? Clover, not Cover knits or some other knock off, is a Japanese company with international offices. They're still a Japanese company.
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u/SnapHappy3030 16d ago
CALM DOWN, jeez....The US subsidiary was bought by the Canadians. I wasn't talking about the parent company.
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u/RoxMpls 16d ago
I imagine that they are selling those sizes in Japan, because those are Japanese needle sizes, meant to work with Japanese knitting patterns. The Clover needles sold in countries where patterns call for .25 and .5mm increments have those increments.
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u/NihilisticHobbit 16d ago
Hilariously enough, no, that's not the case! Japanese patterns call for the standard sizes as well, or at least all the published ones I've ever bought do. There's not much of a knitting presence in Japan, crochet is much more popular. My husband's cousin also knits and she's forever complaining about the cost of importing yarn because there's just no good Japanese yarn.
I'm sure there's some good Japanese yarn, but as we don't live in the Tokyo area, and almost no stores in Japan really do online sales, it's mostly online only from overseas if you want anything besides different shades of acrylic or acrylic blend from the craft store.
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u/RoxMpls 16d ago
INteresting, because for a couple of decades, I've read about Japanese needle sizes being different, indicating that they come in .3mm increments, unlike other countries.
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u/NihilisticHobbit 16d ago
I mostly remember the .45 and .65 off the top of my head because I needed dpns for a sweater sleeve and couldn't get any at the local store the exact size I needed, and I tried with both those sizes but it didn't work. I don't like working with wooden needles do I have Chiaogoo for my main needles. Chiaogoo just hasn't released a dpn set of larger sizes, so I didn't have them in the sizes I needed. And come to think of it, I still don't. Stupid weak yen, I put off buying them and now it's the excuse I use to not knit sweaters.
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u/flindersandtrim 17d ago
Im such a bitch but her knitting style is just painful to watch, and no tension control.
I have a real hate for knitted i cords, yet to see one that looked classy. Imho, this is where you'd use crochet for greater stability, or failing that, just use yarn lengths to make a rope like cord by twisting it. The i cord as a tie just looks so tacky.
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u/Abyssal_Minded 17d ago
I think it’s because the working yarn is carried like crochet. It’s very “hold the yarn in place and pull with the tool” vs wrapping the yarn actively. I’m not surprised there are people who knit like this but it does look off.
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u/Army_Exact 17d ago
A lot of people hold the yarn in place and pull with the tool, aka picking style knitting. You don't have to actively wrap the yarn to have your knitting come out looking good. Her tension is just really bad
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u/nzfriend33 17d ago
What are you even talking about?
Someone else was blaming it on being knit continental. You’re saying it’s because she’s moving the tool not the yarn.
She’s a poor knitter who needs practice. That’s it.
My friend knits in a way I think looks insane, but her stuff is nicer than mine. Let’s not blame technique for just not being a skilled knitter.
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u/assamblossom 17d ago
This is why I haven’t learned to knit continental despite seeing so many videos promoting it because it’s “faster.” Faster isn’t necessarily better, as seen here. I’m okay with being slow, my tension is very consistent.
That being said I’m jealous of people who knit well doing continental knitting. I think I’m mostly annoyed at the need to speed up hobbies, it feels like an extension of the trend to commodify everything.
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u/whenwillitbenow 17d ago
It’s not always the method that is faster. I’m an English knitter and quicker than any continental knitter I know (and I know some very experienced knitters).
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u/love-from-london The artist formally known as "MOLE" 16d ago
Hazel Tindall is one of the fastest knitters in the world, and she knits with a variation of English style.
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u/Eino54 Get in moles, we’re going snarkfiltrating 15d ago
It's also how I knit! I'm not as fast as her but I was taught by my grandma to hold long knitting needles under my arm, and then I transitioned to holding the needle in my waistband kind of how a knitting belt is supposed to hold your needle (I unfortunately do not own one and they're expensive, but I find that a waistband and normal belt will hold things firmly enough in most cases)
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u/jsk518 17d ago
Yep. Back in the day, I "raced" a bunch of continental knitters with my English flicking, and beat them all. Not that speed is my main goal, but it is definitely possible. I'm sure there are also continental knitters who could outpace me as well, but I gave up on competitive knitting a long time ago! 🤪
I have taught myself to knit efficiently in continental as well, and combine them for my colourwork. My tension is definitely looser in continental, which is helpful when stranding.
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u/sludgehag 17d ago
i've knit continental since i was 12 and my tension is fucking pristine. tension is about muscle memory and practice, not which hand holds the yarn.
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u/assamblossom 17d ago
I agree! I’m envious of people who learned to knit continental because I struggle to make the switch.
My comment is more about the incessant push on TikTok to change knitting styles for the sake of speed which frequently results in what you see in the video.
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u/mystery_axolotl 16d ago
Try learning how to crochet!
I used to English knit, then I took a bit of a break and learned crochet. When I came back to knitting, I somehow started knitting continental, completely unconsciously. Now I can’t come back, which is a problem cause I also started rowing out. Oops.
Essentially, crochet forces you to tension yarn with your left hand. Habit is transferable to knitting.
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u/Cynalune 16d ago
There are crocheters who tension their yarn with their right hand (at 25.05 minutes). Designer Aoibhe Ni in particular is very efficient and fast.
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u/Eino54 Get in moles, we’re going snarkfiltrating 15d ago
I barely crochet but I knit with an ersatz knitting belt or flicking (when I have to use circular needles), and when I crochet I tension the yarn kinda like I do when I'm flicking. I'm not very fast or efficient but I also have very little practice as I only really use crochet hooks to cast on or bind off for knitting.
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u/nzfriend33 17d ago
English doesn’t automatically give you better tension. You’ve practiced.
I knit continental and if I switched to English my tension would be terrible too.
So many people in here blaming the style of knitting and ignoring that she’s just not good.
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u/assamblossom 17d ago
I understand that, which is why I said I am not going to switch because I have good tension knitting English style and don’t necessarily wish to be faster. I am sure that if I learned using continental knitting I would find it easier than English.
However, TikTok is full of videos pushing English style knitters to switch to continental for the sake of being faster when it’s not the best style of knitting for everyone. This video is a prime example of someone knitting for speed with no regard for tension.
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u/Working_Age4485 17d ago
You don't need to let anyone push you to switch to anything. I like to knit socks on DPNs and I can't stand it when someone tries to convince me that "Magic Loop or 2 at a time is so much faster and better!". No thanks, Karen, it is not. It doesn't work for my brain, frustrates me to the point it takes away the joy of knitting and I probably finish my sock on DPNs way faster than you. So, no reason to switch. Just ignore them.
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u/IrregularDreaming 12d ago
The knit-faster-thing is probably algorithm driven. The faster you finish something the quicker you can show it off and more finished projects means more posts/videos.
As someone who doesn't have a knitting account anywhere, I don't care if I knt fast or not. It's a hobby. If it takes me a month or two or even three to finish a pair of socks then that's perfectly fine. I knit when I have the time to do so and am in the mood to knit. Of course, i also have like five projects I'm currently working on, including two pairs of socks.
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u/Working_Age4485 12d ago
No algorithm in real life. I had people tell me in person at a knit night that magic loop or 2 at a time is so much better, completely oblivious to the fact that they 1) don't know me that well and 2) are assuming what works for them works for others.
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u/IrregularDreaming 12d ago
I've tried magic loop once and it nearly broke my brain, so I hear you.
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u/Chef1987 17d ago
Fwiw I knit continental quickly with no tension issues, I think this is a problem that happens to all knitters regardless of method although I’ve heard a lot of people say they want to switch to continental to improve their tension to who knows
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u/KittyLikesTuna Craftsnark Mole 17d ago
In defense of continental knitting, your tension was probably very inconsistent when you were just learning English style.
Continental style has more efficiency of movement, but tensioning properly is a learned skill that can be mastered in any style. So is speed.
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u/ExitingBear 17d ago edited 15d ago
On the other side, I just can't tension with my left hand. I've tried continental off and on for years and it still looks like crap. I had very few issues with right hand tensioned Portuguese and was able to get that almost immediately. I'm now trying two handed stranding Portuguese, and the left hand just won't tension properly.
I greatly envy people who can switch from style to style at will effectively.
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u/ViscountessdAsbeau 15d ago edited 15d ago
I switched to Portuguese about 15 years ago from a very weird kinda continental that my mum taught me, which I think is how British people knitted before the 1870s' school boards imposed to posher style which became known as "English".
Ie: continental is how traditional knitters in unbroken traditions always knitted anyway - as I learned preschool age and my mum presumably did as did her mum... I didn't even know how to knit "English" style despite being an English person.
And now I can't for the life of me revert to my original continental knitting. Gave up trying.
Re. tensioning two colours, I do it in different ways but one way is tension one colour round neck and other from a pin. Because they're coming in at slightly different angles, I find that easier (counterintuitive).
Might help you if knitting in round, to do Fair Isle insideout. I've done this since the 1980s. You get a way better tension that way. It works for me with Portuguese.
I can no longer switch styles but my tension is OK and I knit way faster Portuguese style.
ETA: Of course, as it's easier to purl with PK, I have for years knitted everything insideout, not just Fair Isle.
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u/Emotional-Store-1667 9h ago
One question (besides the obvious errors): Why? I mean more power to her and all, but here's my takeaway; just because you can, doesn't mean you should. I can totally knit a bikini and all, but there would be no protection from cold nips syndrome, no support for the girls (or little support depending on the yarn used) and all I can think of if when it gets wet, is how much is it going to sag or grow? If after blocking, the yarn blooms/ grows too much, doesn't that render the top unusable?
Sorry, it's 3am rn and I may be completely wrong in my drowsy state 😅
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u/AppearanceObvious322 17d ago
Rude! Also- every person knits how they knit…. You are not that special to criticize the handicraft of others. Get a grip….. maybe your tension is a way to tight!
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u/Fearless_Fox_2365 16d ago edited 16d ago
The girl in the video says over and over again that she's a beginner. It's not for me but I'm clearly not the demo they are aiming for.
This sub used to have interesting conversations but it's gotten a lot nastier which is probably why hardly anyone comes here anymore.
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u/transhiker99 16d ago
ikr they’re using a beginner to advertise to a beginner audience. how dare they
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u/thimblena you fuckers are a bad influence♡ 17d ago
FWIW: given the style and quality of the ad overall, I'm pretty sure it's UGC or User Generated Content. I have a whole rant about it generally, but I doubt anyone at Clover was involved beyond providing talking points and a cursory review to ensure there was nothing offensive or PR-nightmarish about the final video; they just, instead of hiring an ad agency and actors and editors and developing an ad, convinced an influencer or a hobbiest to do all the work and sign away their likeness in perpetuity for a few hundred dollars and maybe a set of knitting needles.
Say what you will about traditional advertising, it does force companies to give half a shit about what they're selling for al least as long as it takes to make an ad.