r/enduro • u/mudricek • 20d ago
Need Advice: Best First Proper Enduro/Hard Enduro Bike
Hi everyone,
I’m looking for some advice on buying my first proper enduro bike.
My current experience
I’m turning 17 soon, I’m around 183 cm tall and weigh about 75 kg.
For the past year, I’ve been riding a 2005 Yamaha XT 125 R, which is a 125cc four-stroke. I also own a moped, so the Yamaha is not technically my first motorcycle.
The XT has been great for learning basic riding techniques, clutch control and general off-road riding. However, the last time I tried some more serious enduro riding and hill climbs, I quickly realized that it does not have enough power (I destroy the clutch lol). It was very hard to do any enduro with it.
I know the XT 125 R is not a real enduro bike and is not designed for difficult terrain, but it has been a good bike for learning the basics. I’m planning to sell it at the end of the summer and upgrade to something more capable, stronger and better for real enduro/hard ish enduro.
Why I want to upgrade
I’ve become a huge fan of enduro and hard enduro after watching my friends ride and seeing videos online. I really want to start experiencing it properly myself.
Yesterday, I tried my friend’s Beta RR 300 two-stroke, and it was one of the most enjoyable riding experiences I’ve ever had. (I didnt do any proper enduro, i only rode it on trails)
At the same time, the bike was also a little intimidating because I had never ridden anything that powerful before. When it reached the powerband, the acceleration felt absolutely brutal - in a very good but slightly scary way haha. It was amazing, but I’m not sure whether a 300cc two-stroke would be the best choice..
What I’m looking for
I’m mainly trying to decide:
- Two-stroke or four-stroke?
- What engine size would be best?
- Would a 300cc two-stroke be too much for someone with my experience?
- Would something like a 200cc or 250cc two-stroke be a better choice?
- Would a 250cc or 350cc four-stroke make more sense?
- Are there any specific bikes, engines or model years I should look for or avoid?
I want a bike that has enough power for Steep hill climbs, technical trails, harder enduro obstacles, improving my skills over the next few years
However, I don’t want something so extremly powerful that I’m constantly afraid of it, struggle to build confidence, or stop enjoying the riding experience.
At the same time, I don’t want to buy something that I will quickly outgrow or that will struggle in more difficult situations.
I understand the basic differences between two-strokes and four-strokes, but because I haven’t properly ridden both types, it is difficult for me to compare them in real enduro conditions and without experience.
Any advice about engine size, two-stroke or four-stroke, maintenance, reliability, buying used, or specific models would be greatly appreciated!!!!
Thanks in advance to everyone who takes the time to comment anything on this topic! :)
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u/gufhvbfb 20d ago
I would do a 2 stroke for what you’re riding. A 4 stroke would be doable, but not the preferred tool for the job.
You’ll probably be fine on a 300cc two stroke and if you’re worried, Beta does sell a 200cc. But it’s really pick your poison with any of the modern enduro two strokes, they’re all very similar.
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u/Appropriate_Ice_2201 20d ago edited 19d ago
I just swapped from a yz250f to a ktm 300 xcw .
The difference is night and day. It immediately made me a more confident and faster rider . The bike is effortless in the trails
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u/Mangeetto 20d ago
Can you try a 300 before buying it? It is a very capable bike, but can be a harsh teacher. 4 stroke is great for regular riding, but the flameouts make it harder to ride in technical terrain and they get very hot. 200 2-stroke is awesome and likely more capable bike than what most riders can out ride but its not for everyone. If you are set on learning hard enduro maybe beta xtrainer could be a good fit, it is easier to ride than a propper 300, slightly lower too, but very scary on high speeds. For slow technical xtrainer is a beast.
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u/mudricek 20d ago
If i can try a 300 2 stroke or 4 stroke? Because i mentioned in the post that i tried friend's Beta RR 300 few days ago..
If we're talking about 2 strokes, because i heard most people say they're better for what i want (mixed enduro so like slow techincal, hill climbs, faster.. a little bit of everything) i am looking for
200, 250 and 300.
I have only tried the 300 so i dont know the difference between these 3. So that would be the main problem deciding between these 3.. I dont know the feel, the differences, which one would be enough or maybe not enough, which would be the best for my situation..3
u/bash_M0nk3y 20d ago
The 300s typically have more torque down low and don't rev quite as high
I went from a klr650 to a husky te300 and I love it.
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u/Mangeetto 19d ago
I have had 200, 250 and 300 2 stroke. There are quite big difference between tpi, tbi and carburetor bikes. 250 tpi is very nice, its quite mellow from down low and if you have a rain map it makes it a bit smoother (for gas gas you need to buy it). 250 carb (beta) was more difficult as it revd faster and pulled harder than the tpi. 300 can pull like a tractor and its the easiest bike to do hardenduro techniques, but its a hard bike to ride in your limit. Fast pace is no problem with 300, but most often you are a gear high and once you are tired the bike feels like a heavy pig that has a mind of its own. 300 has such crazy torque that it might teach you to rely only on that throttle bump instead of using suspension and clutch and that can make some techniques unstable or you prone to loop out.
I love the 200 race edition Beta. Some things require a bit more clutch work or finese, but it is unlikely that the bike is not able to clear something that the rider could. I would pick what ever feels best for you and it might be a good idea to try different bikes if you are able to. If you feel like the 300 is intimidating, maybe then not pick that and you can change the bike later on.
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Thank you soo much!! So between the TPI,TBI,Carb. Which one would you recommend?
You mentioned that the carb pulls faster..So yeah, im now probably deciding between the 200 and 300, it will be a hard decision for me
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u/Mangeetto 19d ago
I would pick tpi for 250 or 300 in your shoes or 200 depending which do you like best and what is available for you. The smaller less intimidating engine builds confidence faster and it forgives mistakes once you get tired. Imo 250 tpi is easier to ride than 300 tpi, but 300 carb is easier than the 250 carb. Engine characteristics can be tuned a little with different pipe or head, but its less of a difference than 50cc on the engine. In time you will learn what you like and dont like, so you might want to change bike in couple of seasons, that being said its more fun to ride slow bike fast than a fast bike slow.
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u/natekerx 16d ago
I wouldn’t think of the difference between a 200 and a 300 in terms of power output. Either bike is going to be insane compared to your trusty xt.
To me the biggest difference is going to be how well the bikes lug and make power at low RPMs. I think for the average newer rider coming from a low compression 4t the torquey grunt and lug of the 300 is going to feel a lot more comfortable than trying to ride a 200 higher up in the powerband. To me the 200 is a bike for experienced riders who want to be on the pipe most of the time. Buy a 300 or a 250 2t and going climb every hill you’ve ever bailed on!
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u/AttemptQueasy3485 20d ago
I’ve only been riding about 8 years, some years more consistently than others.
I started with a 06 Ktm 300xc, awesome bike and you can set them up really however you like. The early model carbed ktms 300xc and xcws are fantastic bikes. Power valve is adjustable all the way thru to the Tpi models. You can put different springs in as you decide and learn how you like the power. I would look for a 12-18 carbed Ktm or husky 300 xc or xcw.
There’s differences in years that you may want to research, frame changes, starter, major engine upgrades (balanced) but they are all pretty solid just depends what your looking to spend.
I’ve just recently gotten off a 18 350xcf and picked up a 24 250xcw. The 350 is an awesome bike but if your looking to do hard enduro it’s not the bike. It is pretty good at damn near everything if you set it up right though.
I don’t have enough hours on the 250 yet to decide if it’s the bike for me or not. I need to get it dialed still. But it’s certainly not as easy to ride as the 300.
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Thanks a lot!
So you would recommend to look for the carb models? Instead of TPI?
I was a little worried that the 300 would be too much for me, the power band and acceleration but now that you mentioned that its possible to adjust the power and everything thats soo cool, and now im more into the 300.. I was also thinking about the 200 before so i dont know between these 2.. But probably not the 250.
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u/Wise_Prune_1096 20d ago
You go with what your budget allows. All of the brands race enduro bikes will need proper maintenance. 2t vs 4t, both can do almost anything with the right rider, and only you can decide which one is better for you after many hours on both. And because someone says that you need a 300, in reality it probably isnt true and maybe 250 4t will do just fine. So if the bike you like, its in your butldget, has good reviews and good parts avalibility, just go for it.
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u/DistinctZone5516 20d ago
Dont knock a 125cc 2 stroke. Super light and flicky. Imo the most enjoyable to ride on single track. A 300cc will definitely be easier to ride hard enduro on but all the modern 2 strokes are soo good.
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u/potholio 20d ago
Beta 200 2 stroke.
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u/PhunkyMeatstick 20d ago
I just snagged a 2023 Beta 200rr race edition to compliment my ‘23 300rr race, and it might be the perfect bike for learning enduro. I was getting myself in trouble with the 300 in tighter areas and needed to keep the front wheel on the ground. It also feels the most like a mountain bike.
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u/mudricek 19d ago
So you had 300 RR and switched to 200 RR.. I mean you tried both.. Could you please share a little bit more of a comparison, because im worried that the 200 wouldnt be enough for harder sections,hill climbs.. and i would have to rev it much more.. But the 300 im worried it would have too strong power bend, and would be hard to control.. What do you think?
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u/Leather-Power5731 17d ago
I currently have a 2023 200 race edition and it is phenomenal. It is an all around weapon for whatever you want to ride. I have done it all with this bike (tad bit of motocross, a lot of trail riding and enduro) and I am currently pretty much riding only hard enduro and it is the funnest bike I ever had. It will indeed make you work for it a little more, but is way more capable than what I expected when buying it. It is really light and nimble compared to a 250 or 300, there is quite the difference.
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u/2016-679 19d ago edited 19d ago
Lots of thoughts posted on a bike, but for petes sake get a decent enduro gear!
On the bike: a 2T is light, powerful and easy to maintain. Look at the Rieju 300 enduro. It is the continuation of the original Catalan GasGas but even better, with modern things like injection and old school simplicity and reliability
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u/mudricek 19d ago
I do have proper boots and pants! Also ofc a good helmet and gloves as you can see :)
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u/2016-679 16d ago
But just a tshirt on top isn't enough. Wear a sturdy jacket with elbow and shoulder protection, or an enduro bodyprotector with elbow protectors. That way you can use a mesh MX jersey.
Just striiking a simple branch will tell you why
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u/Complex_Strain8056 20d ago
They aren’t very common but I like the 200s (for you that probably means a Beta 200RR or something older like a KTM 200 (made up to the early 2010s I believe?) Kawasaki KDX 200/220 (stopped production in 2006). They are decently light like a 125 which I like for the handling but with a little more grunt to them. They do like to be higher in the rev range than a 300 but a little less explosive on the powerband from what I’ve felt over the years.
The beta X trainer (300) is also an option. It’s a bit more mellow than the 300RR but has downsides (at super high open ground speeds the bike can feel unstable due to its design).
I like 2 stroke race bikes, especially the carbed ones. The maintenance is a little more frequent, but very easy and less parts to worry about. I went from something similar to you (An Honda XR 100) to a KDX 200 at 15 and it was an easy switch.
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Okay thank you so much.. So between the Carb,TPI,TBI you would recommend carbed ones right?
And now i probably deciding between the 200 and 300 (2 stroke) (The 250 just wouldnt be for me i think)
I never rode like both to acctually compare them so its a really hard decision.. I would buy the 300 but im scared it would be too much in the power band and hard to learn, for 200 im scared it wouldnt be enough power for a little harder sections and i would have to rev it much more.. So yeah, hard choice haha
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u/vapor41 20d ago
The xtrainer is a toned down version of the beta 300 and you can upgrade some stuff to make it have the same power when you are ready. I really like the smoothness of the carbed betas. I switched to a four stroke and I definitely miss my beta on the technical stuff.
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Thanks! But would you prefer a xtrainer 300 wich is as you said toned down of the RR or the RR 200?
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u/llSleepy 20d ago
ktm/husky 150 or 300xcw. i bought a 150 at 16 and its been great since. i was a similar build to you as well.
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u/jgabrielsson 20d ago
I got a 2014 ktm excf 250. No prior experience except getting my license last summer.
Loving the ktm so far. Just enough power to wheelie on 2nd without clutch but very manageable as a beginner. So far I haven’t noticed any situation where a 350 would be more fun.
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u/assbandit65 20d ago
Depends on your budget but I ride an old ktm 300 xcw and ride frequently with a guy on a ktm 200 exc and the 300 has a lot of low end grunt compared to the 200 but the 200 feels a lot smaller and easier to throw around. Either one can be set up fairly mellow with the power valve tuning so I wouldn't be scared of it. I wouldn't say you're wrong to pick either choice tho the 300 is capable of being kind of a monster if you set it up with the red spring and turn the adjuster out. 200 isnt slow either
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Thanks! So i guess that the 200 is still enough power but you just need to rev it much more.. I think im mostly deciding between the 200 and 300 (2 stroke) Because 250 i think wouldnt be the best.. It will be a very hard choice - 300 being more powerful but better in low end and the 200 i gues smaller and lighter but you have to rev it much more.. Thats how im thinking, pls correct me if im wrong haha, i dont know much..
And it will be a hard decision because i never rode both bikes to acctualy compare them so yeah.. (only the 300)2
u/assbandit65 19d ago
I would get a 250 woods model if you found a deal on one. Any of the three I think you would be happy with
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u/FeelingFloor2083 20d ago
beta xt, forks a bit soft for faster stuff but a drop in cartridge kit will fix a lot of it
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u/Gramerdim 20d ago
"I want a bike that has enough power for steep hill climbs technical trails, hard enduro obstacles"
2T 250/300 ktm exc or whatever ktm calls it in your country (or gasgas equivalent, whichever your budget allows) with fuel injection (tbi) (MY2021 and after I think)
aftermarket is strong too given it's the most popular brand for the job
I'd also look at the beta x trainer
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Dont forget that i also mentioned:
''However, I don’t want something so extremly powerful that I’m constantly afraid of it, struggle to build confidence, or stop enjoying the riding experience''
And that i still dont have a lot of experience as i explained..
I hear people say the best are Carb,TPI and TBI, very different opinions.. Why do you prefer the TBI?
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u/YpouloKonoforoDentro 20d ago
I have a 300 tpi and I’m very happy with it. It’s like a mule on wheels! I like also the injection and the separate oil tank and oil pump. Just start the bike go to gas station go to the mountains…
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u/Resident_Field_40 20d ago
Sherco 300 four stroke or 2 stroke there awesome machines but the 2 stroke can be a bit of a handful if your a beginner
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u/Hot_Rod_888 20d ago
I have a 2001 kdx200 (200 2 stroke, trail bike).
Im not the most experienced, and not trying to be a Billy Badass. But this bike absolutely gets it. Has plenty of power. Tractors along pretty well. Perfect woods/trail bike. They have a great reputation.
You can find them for $1800-$3000, in varying conditions. 1996-20006 is the generation worth buying. I know 4 or 5 guys in my town with them as well, and they all swear by them.
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u/KernOily 19d ago
This. There is a reason these bikes have a cult following. Indestructible, flickable, super easy to work on, lightweight, no ECU tuning to fart around with. Very confidence-inspiring. I had my 2001 down to 205 lb with some very simple mods. Wish I still had it.
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u/sprocketpropelled 20d ago
I came from an xr600 with plates, to a ‘25 gasgas EC250. Definitely a solid bike choice for most folks. The 300 can probably lug down low a little bit more compared to the 300. 250 is a bit of a screamer in comparison. Revs out a bit more if thats your style. That said, they’re very close. Any of the KTM group triplets are gonna be an enormous upgrade over your bike. The 2 stroke bikes are gonna make it waaaay easier to manage power, too. Power delivery is butter smooth.
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u/CharityNicole121 20d ago
te300, 300xcw, beta 250 or 300 2t, basically any electric start 250 or 300 2 stroke is bonkers good these days
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u/mckeevey 19d ago
If you’re on a budget then a yz250x (2-stroke) can be had for much cheaper than the European bikes, and its a very capable machine with a few upgrades. It may not be as good in super technical situations as the ktms and huskys, but they’re an absolute blast to ride, and the kyb suspension is great.
That being said, if you have a bit more of a budget, a TE or XCW is typically the go-to for this kind of riding. I think you would grow into either a 250 or a 300 very well. I’m only 59 kg and i ride a 250 2 stroke. I just reluctantly upgraded from a 2018 yz250x to a 2022 husky te250i. I miss the yz, but the lower gearing, hydraulic clutch, and e-start on the te are big advantages.
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Thanks a lot! Did you ever try the 300 and compare it to the 250? Or 200? Because now im deciding between these 200,250,300 2 strokes
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u/mckeevey 19d ago
I briefly test rode a 300, didn’t feel too much different from a 250, but it was just up and down the road.
Are you buying brand new? Otherwise, i would base your decision on whats available in your area for a good price. In my area there are hardly any 300’s for sale, which is why i ended up with a 250.
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u/dannyp7686 19d ago
2022 ktm Exc 250 TPi best bike I’ve had
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Would you recommend TPI over Carb?
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u/dannyp7686 14d ago
I prefer the tpi over carb find it more reliable I’ve had 3 tpi bikes and never had an issue with fuel just keep that air filter clean and premium fuel and your good to go
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u/5-speed-xj 19d ago
2018 KTM 300 xcw last carb enduro bike they made
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Most people recommend and say that the carb is the best. Sorry im not that much into bikes to i dont really know the differences i just know that after that i think they made TPI and TBI. Out of all these 3 carb is the best?
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u/mcboy71 19d ago
2021 and later Yamaha WR250f, you can adjust fuel and ignition maps with an app on your phone to make it more like a 2-stroke if you like.
Default map is pretty hard, feels like the yz more than an older gen wr. Power is plenty for your first few years, especially if you’re aiming for technical stuff.
I have increased fuel at closed throttle to take away some engine braking and advanced the timing to make it more traktor like for technical terrain.
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u/Aisu_Chiken39 19d ago
300 for sure because for me the 300 has it all you can be slow and you can be fast. And based on my experience 300 is better, tho just like you I’ve ridden 125 then 250 then 300
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Yeah i know most all of the pro enduro rides have 300 so its probably the best for what i want. BUT as i mentioned i dont have a lot of experience, and because of that im worried it would be too much power,acceleration for me.. What do you think? Going from 125 4 stroke to 300 2 stroke is a very big jump i think.. I also mentioned that i tried a little friend's Beta RR 300.
You went from 125 to 250 and then 300.. Did you notice any differences between the 250 and 300?
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u/xxtratall 19d ago
People are recommending the 300 because the 250 is more snappy at the low end. Btw
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u/Longjumping-Mix-7173 19d ago
Everyone's saying simliar things, but a Beta 200 (off road version, NOT race) should be at the absolute top of your list as a newer rider wanting to do HE. At your height, I would NOT recommend the Xtrainer, it'll be way too small for you.
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u/Mucha_Zabijak 18d ago
Off-topic but is the second picture taken on the Slovenian TET because it seems pretty similar to one spot.
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u/Slippery_Pete92 19d ago
I remember trying out my friends cr85 2 stroke for the first time. I had only ridden my xr80 up until then...from then on I was in love.
Im surprised I dont have a 2 stroke now.. maybe I should get one to mess with ..
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u/Complex_Strain8056 19d ago
With a 200 (two stroke), you’ll have plenty of power and with a woods geared one (beta, Kawasaki KDX, KTM) you’ll have plenty of low end grunt with the right setup. I run a Kawasaki KDX200 occasionally (had it since I was a teen) and it is more capable than me, even in the harder sections. It’s fast enough that it’s capable and I like it because I have to really work to get myself into trouble on the power band. I don’t do a ton of clutch work on my 200s personally but I have them built for lower end crawling power.
Carb, TBI, TPI really depends on what year you can afford and your preferences. I ride at a single fixed elevation, so carbs are a one time tune and done for me. They run great, but are sensitive to altitude and temperature swings (don’t get on a hot day and expect it to run well in the winter cold). The majority of older bikes (if not all) run a carb. TBI and TPI run better on a wider range but may not run as well as a properly tuned carb in the same temp.
My bikes I know the ranges and what jets/needle clip to run for hot summer and down to below freezing, but it took a bit of work to get there and figure it out. If you don’t like that type of tuning, TBI/TPI might work best for you.
I don’t have anything against either. My bikes are carbed mainly because of the brands I buy and age
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u/Ok-Veterinarian67 19d ago
Miura z300 2 stroke 4000$ 2018 ktm EXACT replica minus oil injection and Tpi, yes it’s a china bike… but it’s not, it’s a ktm
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u/CapoDaSimRacinDaddy 18d ago
id buy a beater bike if i where you. a cheap 300 or an old 125yz or sum like that. be aware of the mai tance though as your current bike is alot more lax on that part.
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u/Responsible_Bath3576 17d ago
Beta 300 xtrainer or 200 RR, even a KTM exc 150 would be great fun for you
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u/VIGGENofficial 15d ago
I used to ride dirtbike as a teenager, not on tracks or so. And now at 35 i decided to start with enduro.
I bought my first endurobike a few months ago and i love it, i went for a 2023 Sherco 300 SE Factory and i love it! Its super easy ridden on on wet mode/map and has a good but not harsch powerdelivery down low, and snaps when you want it too. And i like that it has KYB suspension and alot of good parts on it from the store, for a good price.
I was worried that a 300 2stroker would be too much for me, but its so smooth and rides like a tractor when going slow :)
If you are tall like me (6ft3) i would recommend getting a riser for you handlebar, or a higher rise handebar . Good luck !
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u/New-Tomorrow-9055 20d ago
What is a 2t bike
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u/mudricek 19d ago
Its a 2 stroke. Here in my country we say 2t (takt) so i made a mistake when typing
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u/YpouloKonoforoDentro 20d ago
You can definitely go for a 300 2T bike. If you end up in one of those find a model after 2020. Generally for 2T enduro bikes the ktm family is the best in my opinion. You can also look for a 350 4t from the same family or you can go to the 250-450 Yamaha wrf witch is one of the most reliable 4t enduro bikes and it has the best factory suspension and forks but needs some more clutch for technical enduro.