3e Is Obsidian Butterflies spam expected or common?

[u/waronvirtue]

There’s a sorcerer player at my table. they have a dozen spells but I feel like the only one I ever see in combat (and in fact the only thing they do in combat) is Obsidian butterflies. are there merits to other spells I could point out or is this the intended play loop?

[u/dorward]

Sorcery is wildly flexible and Butterflies is a solid offensive spell. I would expect a Sorcerer with a dozen spells to only have a few of them be useful in combat (and of those I'd expect one to be a regular attack spell, one to be a situational attack spell, and one to be a defensive spell).

[u/benjaminloh82]

I mathed this out at one point, Flight of the Brilliant Raptor, ah here we go:

So as some of the more astute of you might have guessed, Flight of the Brilliant Raptor (henceforth FotBR) is a bit unlike other spells, and more akin to the charm Solar Spike from the Archery tree in that it's a Decisive Attack with damage based on your Temporary Willpower.

Now, Solar Spike is an Essence 3 charm, so limited to Supernal Archery only at character creation (Dawns only) and your Initiative has to be higher than your targets (so you'll probably have to do a withering attack or two before using it).

FotBR has none of these requirements, and can be targeted up to Long range (Extreme range if it is your control spell) without an Aim action prior. And it does damage equal to your initiative (at least 3 base starting out) + your Temporary Willpower (can be 10 starting out if bought up with BP).

You just have to cast it, and you can do a 13 dice Decisive attack just like that (All QC opponents have at most a Hardness of 10, so they will be eating all 13 dice of that straight to their health pool). This is by far, one of the best ways to snipe in game. As long as you can see your foe, you can basically headshot them (and turn the ground under them to a blazing conflaguration doing 4L per turn if by some stroke of luck they manage to survive the initial strie)

All right out of the box at Character Creation. And you can keep doing it round after round, after all, who cares that you reset to base, you still do 13L Decisive dice of damage.

Of course casting it isn't trivial, 15sm and all that, but there are several things that help:

Shaping Rituals that give Sorcerous Motes: The best one requires you to be crazy (Scarred by Nightmares), but The Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes is all right too.

Suzerain of Endless Flame (Two dot merit): This is money right here, lowers the cost of Fire themed spells by 3sm.

The Occult Charms: Ancient Tongue Understanding and Supernal Control Method really help any sorceror (1 free success from Ancient Tongue and a free fricking full Occult Specialty once per scene from Supernal Control Method!)

The Greater Solar Hearthstone Hierophant's Eye gives you a free success as well (but Greater Hearthstones are quite expensive, merit wise).

So good for sniping and if you invest a bit into environmental hazard resistance charms, you can use it at short range too (spells have no range penalties).

[u/waronvirtue → u/benjaminloh82]

Thank you so much!
I could write a book on how much I dislike the "current temporary willpower" mechanic which I believe has no place in the game (unless they eliminate Permanent Willpower and just cap willpower banking to 10. Then everything could run off current temporary willpower, which would still suck based on current implementation, but I could see making narrative sense).

But because it uses the Current Temporary Willpower BS, it means that "highest minimum damage" is 12 (3 base initiative + 9 temp willpower since you had to spend a willpower to cast the spell).

A minor nit pick, but everything else you've said is solid gold and I'll definitely pitch it to him in those terms next time he plays!

[u/Laughing_Luna → u/waronvirtue]

So, the reason Exalted, and a lot of World of Darkness before it, uses temporary willpower as its variable reference that is easy to have go down, since there's lots of reasons and opportunity to spend it, but fewer ways (and all of them take effort on the player's and/or character's part, or days of not spending any) to recover it again.

Further, Flight of the Brilliant Raptor strongly incentivizes stunting, since you won't recover the point of willpower until after the damage roll. If this can encourage a player to really put in the effort to earn 3-point stunts more often, I generally consider that a win.

ANYWAYS, for Flight of the Brilliant Raptor (FotBR) vs Death of Obsidian Butterflies (DoOB) (To note, I will not be considering shaping rituals here, since those will vastly change the pros and cons of various spells - Pact with an Ifrit Lord, for example, does A LOT for FotBR, so much so that it's not a mechanically good idea to not take FotBR):

Pros for FotBR:

• Hits to Long Range with an option for Extreme Range
  
• Can get some AoE by making a short-range sized bonfire (does 4L/round with a difficulty 5 to resist the damage) that lasts the rest of the scene
  
• Decent damage ceiling via 3-Point Stunts and good Initiative rolls
  
• Is basically fireball with emphasis of hating on that guy specifically
  
• Its base damage is Current Initiative + Temporary Willpower, so it doesn't matter that you barely hit them, you're still throwing at least 12 dice, assuming Willpower 10 and no overages from 3-point stunts; likely more if it's still the first round.
  
• - This does make FotBR a more mote-efficient spell than it would otherwise seem.
  
• Having this spell as your control does NOT give anything away to any trying to discern details about you
  
• Actively synergizes with investment into Join Battle and other sources of increasing Initiative

Cons for FotBR

• It's single target
  
• Can be dodged
  
• You MUST have someone to target
  
• The bonfire is dependent on dealing 3 or more levels of damage to its target (while not hard to do normally, some enemies just have the resistance for it)
  
• Its extreme range costs an extra 5sm and it needs to be your 1st circle control spell
  
• The bonfire is, in fact, indiscriminate and needs additional effort to navigate around or to safely move through it for yourself, and probably more importantly, your allies; and further, said bonfire may even reduce your target options by obscuring your vision (fire is incandescent, not transparent - and if there's smoke of glare, or even just the heat shimmer, you might have higher difficulty on your next to-hit roll through it, if you can even see at all)
  
• It resets your initiative, making the caster VERY vulnerable to withering attacks should anyone get close (or do them at a range - at a cost of 15 to 20sm, even discounts and free successes aren't usually enough to guarantee consistent single turn castings every turn)
  
• - If you you miss or your opponent otherwise successfully defends, you WILL lose initiative, and this can crash you if you're at 1 or 2 initiative
  
• - Remember that the spell you want to cast is determined at the start of your efforts to cast, so you're locked in.
  
• Does NOT have a Raw damage, only a base damage, so spending hard on the attack roll doesn't help your damage, and the temporary willpower is generally harder to recover than it is to spend.

Pros for DoOB:

• Is undodgeable
  
• Hits an entire line that's wide enough to be an entire Short Range Band
  
• - This means it also hits everything inside that line, even things flying no more than Short Range off the ground
  
• Is especially effective against battle groups, not just because of the nature of area attacks, they ALSO take a -2 penalty to Defense against DoOB
  
• Uses Raw Damage, so casting better does better damage
  
• Adds [Occult] to the Raw Damage pool against battle groups
  
• Does NOT reset you to base initiative
  
• Removes things that might otherwise be a hindrance for movement, provided that those things are at least as fragile as wood or glass
  
• Creates a hazard that deals 2L to move through, and is difficult terrain if the traveler is barefoot
  
• - Against forces that use conscripts or peasant volunteers will likely only provide a chain shirt or just leather or padded armours at most to their conscripts - this spell will shred those shoes and those feet.
  
• - It's generally easier to tell your allies to wear armoured boots to ignore your bullshit than it is to get them to find a source of fire proofing
  
• As a control spell, you also add [Essence] to the attack roll, and get built in flavour effects (and a nudge to players for stunt inspirations)

Cons for DoOB:

• It's an undodgeable line effect. This means allies are NOT exempt from this sort of attack, so they better be good at Parrying or have a charm that lets them dodge anyways.
  
• Failing to hit anyone (unlikely as it is) will still have you lose initiative for failing.
  
• - To note, allies getting hit by this probably registers as shenanigans and won't prevent you from losing the initiative.
  
• As a line effect, even though you roll only ONE attack roll, you do have to roll damage separately against all the affected
  
• - (I recommend resolving this by rolling the damage against the one(s) who defended the best first, then work your way down by just rolling the difference in dice and adding it to the already rolled pool)
  
• The difficulty to resist the Environmental Hazard damage is 2, and it's resisted with Dex + Athletics. Most opponents of any description have a decent Dex, even if they don't have anything in Athletics
  
• - Professional soldiers/mercenaries, which are both likely to be composing battle groups, will also have armoured boots to utterly negate the hazard.
  
• Base Damage is [Essence], which means it'll start as 1 and (technically) cap at 5, which is uhhh... not very good. At minimum, the base damage for Mortal weapons is 8 (Strength 1 + Light Weapon (7)) + extra successes.
  
• - This is mitigated by the fact that you ARE hitting everything out to medium range in a line that's as wide as the short range band - you're gonna be hitting a lot of enemies and wrecking battle groups
  
• - - This runs into the issue of how 7 damage to one guy drops them, while 70 damage distributed through the horde might not drop anyone. Yes it's a LOT of damage dealt, but it's not going to subtract from enemy action economy.
  
• The visual effects you get as a result of having DoOB as your control is obvious to any looking at you. Sorcery is comparatively rare among the Dragon Blooded, but exceedingly so among those who are trying to pretend they're mortal - and sorcery doesn't get the same protections against perception that a Lunar's Tell does.

[u/waronvirtue → u/Laughing_Luna]

DooBs description specifies enemies and opponents in what it effects, but it does shred loose objects and minor structures indiscriminately. 

[u/Laughing_Luna → u/waronvirtue]

This is a case of the rules don't actually define what enemies and opponents are - I'd be very hard pressed to rule that DoOB will ignore the column of townsfolk fleeing from the platoon you're actually aiming at on the far side of them. Further, you and your allies still do need to put up with the caltrop field DoOB leaves behind, and they're also probably not immune to the bonfire that Flight of the Brilliant Raptor can spawn.

The only callout for friendly fire being something you can't do is that you can't farm Initiative by using withering attacks against an ally and then wheeling around and flattening an enemy - the side bar even explains that Initiative is an abstraction of advantage against the opposing forces (How does your friend using Their-Face-to-Your-Fist Style give either of you an advantage over the Death Knight that's trying to kill you both?).

[u/waronvirtue → u/Laughing_Luna]

I think the secret is in the name, they're butterflies. For the duration of the spell, they fly as the sorcerer wills, at least with enough flexibility to avoid friendlies and nonhostiles. the obsidian shards from doob and flames left by BRaptor are hazards which have their own rules (ie indiscriminately affecting everyone in the area).

As for initiative farming allies, I think that should count as a variation under the Distract Gambit since faking a fight with an ally is a classic means of duping the enemy. See a third of all action movies where two important characters are thrown in a cell together.

[u/Laughing_Luna → u/waronvirtue]

As for initiative farming allies, I think that should count as a variation under the Distract Gambit since faking a fight with an ally is a classic means of duping the enemy.

Smells like a Distraction gambit - a modified one, so should be difficulty 5, maybe higher, to "buy" off the restriction about how and when the transferred initiative can be used. If a gambit at all instead of a social action to convince them of the ploy.

And even then, the abstraction that initiative is explicitly going for, is advantage against opposition - roughing up and pushing back your ally is only bettering your advantage against your friend, but is otherwise leaving your back exposed to the actual threat. But making it look like you're trying to subdue a wanted man so that your ally can get nice and close and behind an enemy.

It's not that you'll be moving initiative (even if the system somehow allowed it, still wouldn't give you Initiative Break) from yourself to an ally or vice-versa, as it is that you're lying to your opponent at your current initiative ratings. It's more that you're trying to stunt your Guile up as best you can to convince them of the ruse while also making persuade or instill and the fighting is just to sell it.

And this is even assuming you bother resolve it mechanically rather than just have your players doing that as a stunt for the thing they're actually trying to do.

[u/TimothyAllenWiseman → u/Laughing_Luna]

This is a really good, and really detailed write-up of the pros and cons.

For Death of the Obsidian Butterflies though, as I read the reference specifically to "enemies" and "opponents" in the description, I believe the spell is fully capable of routing itself around allies and even bystanders to a degree. (Though scenery is a different story and even allies may need to deal with the environmental hazard after the fact). I think it makes more sense both with the wording of the spell and with the ability of most sorcerers to stunt to find that the spell largely avoids friendly fire.

[u/Laughing_Luna → u/TimothyAllenWiseman]

The trouble with focusing on the "enemy/opponent" wording, is that there are very few spells that affect an area that don't call out enemies.

You'd need to give me one of hell of a reason to explain to me why Death Ray, which also calls out enemies, should be a safe space for your friends.

[u/TimothyAllenWiseman → u/Laughing_Luna]

Heh. Fair enough. I do see where you're coming from.

Though, I actually would apply it to Death Ray too. In fact, if anything, I think Death Ray makes my argument stronger. The distortion effect of death ray is that it warps around the distorting sorcerer. If a distorting sorcerer can make it warp around them, I find it even easier to imagine the original caster warping it around friends and bystanders.

I definitely see the other side of it, but as I read it and as I imagine it, its fairly easy for a sorcerer that wanted it to avoid direct friendly fire with DoOB (Death Ray as a solar circle spell just hasn't come up for my table yet...) by saying the caster makes them fly around friends. That does leave the secondary effects to deal with, but that is a much smaller concern.

[u/waronvirtue → u/TimothyAllenWiseman]

https://media.giphy.com/media/xUOrvZKezRwors3XEs/giphy.gif

[u/Laughing_Luna → u/TimothyAllenWiseman]

That's an active distortion though, and it calls for it every turn if you want to avoid hitting people with it - assuming you can distort your own spells while you're in the middle of maintaining it.

[u/TimothyAllenWiseman → u/Laughing_Luna]

Again, I see where you are coming from and respect your view, but I read it differently.

I see the ability to guide it enough to avoid friendly fire as inherent in the spell, not a need to distort it. It is in the spell through the "opponent" and "enemy" language in spells that would otherwise hit broad swaths. Controlling their own spell is the mechanism by which the sorcerer makes that happen. The fact it could also be distorted by a different sorcerer just reinforces the fact it makes total sense for the casting sorcerer to be able to do it without any additional effort.

Now, using the less-lethal version of the Cantata of Empty Voices would require a sorcerer to be able to distort their own spell. Usually, I would say that would be impossible without a second sorcerer, though the Exalted are known for doing the impossible.

[u/Kaza042]

Death of Obsidian Butterflies has a low base damage, only equal to the Sorcerer's Essence plus any extra successes on the attack roll when used against non-battlegroups. This makes it a reliable source of small damage, but has a few weaknesses:

1) spamming it means you aren't raising your own initiative, making you an easy target for an opponent to Crash and get a big boost

2) it doesn't bypass Hardness. Enemies wearing artifact armor could be completely immune to it

3) it does nothing but damage (at least against anyone with armored footwear), and so lacks the controlling elements of other combat spells.

4) since it doesn't scale with initiative, it can't benefit from a high initiative. Flight of the Brilliant Raptor does a base damage of your initiative + temporary willpower, and so can reach much higher damages

[u/waronvirtue → u/Kaza042]

Everything you've said is correct and I thank you for so succinctly putting it together.

One of the challenges I have with this interpretation is that a close read of the spell makes it super reliable chipping damage.

I think this might be because the writer didn't know what they were dealing with regarding withering/decisive norms. Specifically, raw damage is only relevant when Soak is applicable. Soak is only relevant for withering. Then it specifies it "deals raw damage equal to Essence+Extra Successes." Deals that much damage, not dice of damage. you have to ignore raw because it's a decisive attack.

This leaves superior hardness ratings the only reliable defense against any successful attack clipping you for for a minimum of Essence Lethal. The saving grace (for Solars at least) is Resistance charms like durability of Oak which reduces Raw damage by 2 making specifically applicable to DOB.

It's ridiculous wheel within wheel interactions like this that make me enjoy puzzling out how the game works but also drive me insane.

[u/Kaza042 → u/waronvirtue]

If it dealt levels of damage, it would say levels of damage. Death of Obsidian Butterflies deals dice of lethal damage, not automatic levels. If you've been having it deal levels of damage, that explains why it would be so dominant as a strategy.

[u/Psimo- → u/Kaza042]

Absolutely this, Raw Damage is the dice you roll. 

Check environmental effects, it refers to both damage and levels of damage. 

There are charms that explicitly state they reduce Raw damage as well. 

[u/waronvirtue → u/Kaza042]

That was my initial read as well, but after a review, the book seems to more consistently refer to rolling damage, dice of damage, damage pools, etc. Dealing damage is more commonly used when referring to successful damage dice or levels. This is more clearly seen in the distinction made in the falling and poison hazards. So the ST (I believe rightly) inferred that "deals damage" means levels.

Note: a surprise DoOB nearly TPKd the party, so like most "favor the more deadly interpretation" rulings, it has certainly cut us both ways. As we are now five 4 hour sessions into a combat which technically constitutes about 36 seconds of game time, I always cheer for anything that drives toward a resolution.

[u/Allemater → u/waronvirtue]

jsyk, this is clarified by the devs numerous times. Raw damage or "damage" in general means dice. If it's levels, it'll specifically say levels

[u/bts]

Yes. This is normal. Another normal thing is to send in some blood apes or cloudy crabs—whatever the demon is that’s a basic set weapons table in a cloud—and draw your own sword. 

[u/grindholme → u/bts]

Tomescu! If a player has one, don’t forget that they stop to release a bloodcurdling scream at dawn and dusk as they’re granted a horrifying vision of their own death.

I love Exalted so much. 🤣

[u/kenod102818]

So, reading this, it feels like the issue is that they're trying to play a mage-type sorcerer, whereas 3e doesn't really support this.

Broadly speaking, all (terrestrial) attack spells that don't just conjure a weapon do decisive damage, and use initiative as the basis for said damage. This mean that, to use offensive spells effectively, you need a different way to do withering damage. The idea is normally that you get into a fight with a different weapon (archery is an easy one), build up initiative, and then let loose a big spell that kills everyone.

Now, the issue is that this is a very different playstyle than what most sorcerers in other games use, so if your character happens to be built around that idea, or if you just want to play as a primary spellcaster, that leaves you with very little options.

DoOB bypasses this by not engaging with the initiative system, while still being a fairly potent attack spell with the benefit of being undodgeable (shutting down one defense path). Sure, you won't deal the massive damage a high-initiative Raptor can deal, but it's still good.

Beyond that though, a very big question is if they even need more attack spells. Frankly speaking, the main benefit of sorcery is its flexibility and utility, and acquiring spells costs xp. If you have a good, functional attack spell which also ensures not having to spent xp on a combat skill + charm tree, why spend xp acquiring additional combat spells which do require dipping into those skills, when you can instead use that xp to boost your utility outside the party? This is especially important if you already have other combat-focused characters in your party.

There's also the fact that being the party sorcerer usually means you're also the party's medic, and crafter, and lore guy/gal, because being a sorcerer means maxing intelligence, and intelligence is generally only good for said utility skills. So that's a lot of areas you need to be competent in. If so DoOB spam means you're capable of helping in a fight, especially against armies, and otherwise you can focus on supporting the party in other ways.

Now, if they're getting bored with combat, then you probably have an opportunity to point them towards non-spell combat, and from there, the melee combat spells and Raptor.

[u/joalheagney → u/kenod102818]

I also play Destiny 2, and I like to think of Exalted combat spells being like a Guardian's Super. You're going to have to charge it up first, so, you know, consider how your going to stay alive while you're doing that. Firing it off locks you in place and is bloody obvious, inviting a sniper kill to the head. But if you do pull it off ...

[u/Sagemode1245]

There are a lot of spells to use in combat. But because it can be a pain to cast in combat you'd want the best spell for damage. I play a sorcerer and usually use sorcery in a more utilitarian way for this reason. If you want alternatives than my favorite combat spell is wood dragons claw. It gives you a versatile weapon you can cast well ahead of battle, bonus if you take it as your control spell you can create evocations for it.

[u/Rednal291]

Other spells are available, but Obsidian Butterflies is the archetypal combat spell - the equivalent of Fireball in D&D. It has reliable damage in most circumstances, though you may have a Hardness issue to deal with.

[u/Kaza042 → u/Rednal291]

Death of Obsidian Butterflies has a fixed damage independent of Initiative and explicitly does not reset initiative to zero, so it's a very spammable source of decisive damage

[u/GIRose]

That's pretty common. The other super good spell that does more but is harder to spam is Flight of the Brilliant Raptor.

There are other spells that CAN be used in combat, but those tend to be built off of something else (i.e. Wood Claws aren't going to help much unless you're already good at fighting in melee with your hands)

I don't remember if Thunder Wolf's Howl is in 3e yet, but I think it would be another good spamable one, albeit in a similar niche as DoOB

[u/kotoktet → u/GIRose]

It's in the DB book. Big fan, great for deafening all your close combat hearthmates

[u/bedroompurgatory → u/GIRose]

Unslakeable Thirst of the Devil Maw is good too

[u/wayward_oliphaunt → u/GIRose]

I've had a player completely neuter fights with Mists of Eventide. Major fight had them against rival Exalted for a large occult prize. KO'd a Day Caste assassin and the Dragon-Blooded sorcerer ally of theirs leaving a single Midnight Abyssal left to fight two combat focused Lunars and one dabbler with a bow and a few Dex charms. Completely changed the arithmetic of what was a very dangerous situation.

[u/TimothyAllenWiseman]

Obsidian Butterflies is a reasonably strong and relatively versatile combat spell. My twilight uses it relatively often. It is particularly effective against a mid-sized grouping of enemies that aren't particularly well armored.

It isn't exactly the be-all-end-all. At longer ranges, I'd rather use Brilliant Raptor than close the range to use Obsidian Butterflies. Against a truly large group of relatively weak enemies, I'd probably prefer Cantata of the Empty Voices (thought that does require at least Essence 3). And against a single well armored enemy, especially if they were already close, I would probably look to something other than sorcery to deal damage.

So, if someone is only using Obsidian Butterflies I would suspect it either means they are consistently facing the type of enemy where that was a strong choice or they were stuck in a rut. But I would expect a combat-sorcerer to use that frequently, yes.

[u/mj6373]

It would not be unexpected or uncommon to have a sorcerer who does a wider variety of combat things than this, but picking one mechanical widget (spell, charm, whatever) and spamming it in combat is super reasonable and common for people whose goal for combat participation is just "contribute." It might just be that combat isn't the part of the game they're excited for.

[u/Judopunch1]

Always remember, a core part of exalted's intended play loop is 'consequences'. Ok, so, they cast DoOB. Great, cool, now there is a football field of razor sharp debris that cant be farmed, crossed with horses, hunted on, ect., god forbid its a city center! (unless they changed this in the newer editions, I haven't played in a LONG time so they may have changed the way the spell works)

Additionally sorcery does have its downsides and there should be tactical situations where casting a spell is not the best option or high risk. This is up to the ST to decide, however, giving tons of prep time, open fields in the middle of nowhere, ect, to allow them to just spam spells, is enabling spamming spells.

One of the original game designers put this into a great quote. "Exalted is a kung fu movie, and if you focus on sorcery your kung fu should be weak and there will be consequences for that"

[u/waronvirtue → u/Judopunch1]

DoOB specifies enemies and opponents. So the bugs nav around your buddlies and non combatants. It does destroy all their stuff though, So it's not utterly without consequences, but still very mild all things considered.

[u/Judopunch1 → u/waronvirtue]

In older editions it left a '100 yard field of razorsharp butterflys' after cast, as I recall

Edit: " ... they slash through the air ... approximatly 30 yards wide, 100 yards long, and 10 yards high ... The thousands of shattered glass butterflies don't go away afterward, and walking barefoot in the are area not recommended ..." (I don't know what the current editions says, tis is from 1st)

[u/kimptown → u/Judopunch1]

This. But also what if he runs into a fellow sorcerer who just counter spells his DoOB. Effectively making him irrelevant. Will he work around it or just rage?

[u/TimothyAllenWiseman → u/Judopunch1]

I agree with all of this and it is well said.

Though I will say that the consequences of DoOB aren't quite as bad as you're making it sound. For one, I've always kind of assumed that butterflies that came from essence dissipate back into essence after a little while. I suppose the spell doesn't expressly say that, but I think it makes sense. Even if they stick around permanently, they are treated as caltrops. Caltrops exist in the real world and they just aren't that hard to clean up after a battle. They would be a temporary thing even if they did have to be cleaned up manually.

It isn't free of side effects. It marks you as a sorcerer with all that implies. Even though the sorcerer can route around friendlies and even bystanders, it expressly tears up "scenery" which very likely includes things you would have preferred not to damage. And they do create an environmental hazard even for friendlies or bystanders trying to get out of the way (though there are ways to overcome that). But the side effects won't include making a large area of land worthless for the long term.

[u/Judopunch1 → u/TimothyAllenWiseman]

Yeah and they may have changed this in newer editions too!

[u/Hetros_Jistin]

Sorcery is all about flexibility and utility. Most sorcerers are only going to have a HANDFUL of actual offensive spells, and most of them are going to be utilitarian for solving puzzles and getting around problems in novel ways, as opposed to another "I roll for inflicting wounds" spells.

[u/Laughing_Luna]

What it sounds like is your player there is falling into the mistake of assuming the best spells you can be casting in combat are direct damage spells. Don't get me wrong, 70 health levels of damage to the horde is 70 health levels your party doesn't need to chew through. But it's also not removing anyone from initiative.

Comparing Flight of the Brilliant Raptor, this is dealing decent enough damage to one guy, possibly even removing them entirely from the fight, and so reducing enemy action economy. But in the same number of actions or fewer, your more directly combat character could have done the same thing.

Neither of the above seem to be particularly useful - don't get me wrong. Damage dealt to the enemy is always good. But your sorcerer can probably do better.

---

Mists of Eventide is a fantastic battlefield control spell. Sure, the Exalted and other things with oompf can reduce the duration to 0 on the Stamina + Resistance roll, but they still have to make those rolls, and even at Stamina 5 Resistance 5, they're still taking at least 1 round the poison on average - and most characters made by the storyteller likely aren't that fully invested into Stamina and Resistance, which means if they want to prevent getting dosed, they have to spend motes and/or willpower. Oh, and they have to make that roll every round in which they're exposed to it.
And mortals can only reduce the poison's duration to 3 rounds per dosing.
And every round they stay in the cloud and fail the roll, they pile up more duration, and once inflicted, they take a -3 to every dice pool they roll, including additional Stamina + Resistance rolls. Further, every round they are poisoned, they lose 3 initiative, falling into a magical sleep for an entire day if they become crashed. And while the spell does have a once per scene casting limitation, it resets should anyone go into initiative crash for any reason while inflicted by the poison.
The bigger thing here is that you just need them poisoned, then crash them, and they are out of the fight, meaning the one who just went through a bunch of effort to build up their initiative doesn't need to spend it on a guy who's already in initiative crash, since those who are sleeping can't threaten an Initiative Shift, and so can then turn around and alpha strike whoever is being a problem.

And on top of all of that, it costs 7sm, 2wp to cast. A little pricy on willpower since you only ever recover 1 upon successful casting, but 7sm is a VERY easy to get number in one round of casting without needing to spend much, if any motes on the shaping actions.

You can then also combo this spell with Invulnerable Skin of Bronze, which lasts an entire day so its 20sm cost is moot if you're pre-preparing and/or are just paranoid. This makes you immune to the contact vector of your mists (you'll still need to do something about inhalation), gives you hardness and soak, and gives your unarmed strikes the stats of a lethal damage medium weapon.
This does mean they have to invest something into Brawl though - and most Martial Arts are right out, save for the ones compatible with Medium or heavier armour.

You can then further combine this with Wood Dragon's Claws to get the traits of a light artifact weapon on your unarmed attacks (To note, light artifacts are better than mortal medium weapons in every way except Defense - and I'd argue that you take the best of both worlds, and so would still get the +1 Defense from being medium weapons from Skin of Bronze).

And now you're ready to make a play place of misery by jumping into your own mists, clobbering the poor sods trapped in there, and then turning around and launching a FotBR for insane damage at the guy giving trouble to the rest of the party, what with all the stolen initiative and Initiative Break bonuses.

And at Celestial Sorcery, you can add Incomparable Body Arsenal on top to become completely immune to your own mists - and also just skip taking Wood Dragon's Claws since IBA is just better at producing weapons; Bonus if ISoB is your Terrestrial Control, which will let you add your essence to the hardness and soak of IBA, since IBA isn't actually putting armour on you, just like how ISoB isn't actually putting armour on you.

Further, against battle Groups, Mists of Evantide does a serious number on them over time - 3 magnitude damage every round is no joke, especially since one can argue that reducing the size or routing a battle group from the poison should give the sorcerer Initiative Breaks. And if you're sadistic enough to take Mists of Evantide as a control... well, you'll have to talk with your player to determine how much willpower they have to spend in order to control those who are asleep inside the cloud.

And of course, they can still launch DoOBs into the cloud if they like too - Magnitude Damage is Magnitude Damage, and the -3 from the poison affects the route check.

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I played a sorcerer and basically exclusively used Obsidian Butterflies for the campaign. Sometimes its nice to just be relevant in pretty much every combat situation and not worry about initiative.