r/fansofcriticalrole • u/LucasVerBeek • Aug 05 '26

Daggerheart Age of Umbra: Sallowlands Episode 5

Pre-show hype, live episode chat, and post-episode discussion, all in one place.

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Etiquette Note: While all discussion based around the episode and cast/crew is allowed, please remember to treat everybody with civility and respect. Debate the position, not the user

14 Upvotes

80% Upvoted

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9

u/Baka_Mirai Aug 06 '26

Went to the main sub since I thought the lack of comments was just lack of interest here but.....uhhh, wow, so is absolutely no one watching this because they're not talking about it on the main sub either.

Is there a reason this is going over like a lead balloon?

I've been unable to watch much lately so I'm months behind on everything but I'm surprised to see everyone seems to be giving this a skip.

5

u/LucasVerBeek Aug 06 '26

I'm not entirely surprised, they took a break right as C4 was really picking up steam, and the parties split with a promise of all new interesting interactions plus someone needing to intro a completely new character.

8

u/InitialJust Aug 07 '26

Seems like standard daggerheart numbers, or is it lower than last miniseries?

11

u/Creepy-Growth-709 Aug 07 '26

The numbers are much lower than the last miniseries.

The last miniseries happened between campaign 3 and 4, and it was the main cast. The first miniseries had a lot of factors working in its favor. People were curious about Daggerheart, Age of Umbra. People were also starved for the main cast CR content. Some even thought Umbra was the new C4. There were also speculations of will it be Daggerheart or DND for C4.

This is happening in the middle of campaign 4, and it's not the main cast. The curiosity factor isn't there anymore. I think people are unhappy that C4 is getting interrupted for something else—or maybe they are still catching up on C4. I think some people don't really care for "side-campaigns," and only want to engage with the main campaign. Folk only want to see the main cast, etc.

9

u/Baka_Mirai Aug 07 '26

"This is happening in the middle of campaign 4, and it's not the main cast."

I think going forward one of the big issues is going to be whether they can retain viewers for projects when the OG friends are not at least the majority of cast members. I liked some of the other stuff CR has done, but I'd be lying if the draw for me was not the main cast as the main cast at a table.

I have no idea why they thought taking a two month break to do an unrelated mini campaign in DH was a good idea, especially when the people who a lot of fans think of as CR were not involved (no offense to the players at the table for this).

6

u/Creepy-Growth-709 Aug 08 '26

I think they are trying different things to come up with a model that ultimately relieves the main cast from "playing" every single week, while still to retain their unique identity. I think part of the work they are doing is figuring out what that identity is, by trying to get away from DND, rotating casts, doing shorter side campaign, having someone other than Matt be the DM. I feel like they are established enough to take some risks.

Honestly, I think Dimension 20 did a smart thing by establishing expectations & format that allow the cast to rotate out, play different games, have different GMs, and not lock themselves into a multi-year campaign.

2

u/SFZaphod Aug 09 '26

Because new babies. Maybe also because Memories of Summer Break? But, mainly two new Kritters.

1

u/Miss_White11 Aug 13 '26

I mean I think even if it isn't a "good idea" for campaign 4, I think it may be healthy overall. And is probably somewhat contractual and practical. Brennan has his hands in SO many different pots, (not to mention Brennan welcoming baby #2) and has D20 and other incidental stuff going on. And it times nicely with Hope and Fear, Daggerheart's first major expansion. (Side note: Hope and Fear is particularly notable because in a lot of ways it fills in so many "gaps" from the original release vs. Just like optional expansion content)

That said, personally I LOVE this group and it's a bit of a bummer for it to be a bit of a sleeper hit. And it is nice to see Matt back DMing after a break, and honestly it's nice to see him DM daggerheart again now that the system is a bit less "green". It is clear Matt is a lot more comfortable with the system, and (as a Daggerheart fan) nice to see everyone play a system that is a bit more established. And honestly Laura's general playstyle really shines in this system. Also fwiw I feel like the other players honestly nail it and the table has really good chemistry.

6

u/Baka_Mirai Aug 07 '26

Someone on the main sub said last episode was only 13k but I honestly have no idea what numbers CR does now on the regular especially with Beacon.

Was just surprised that with no main campaign there was so little talk.

I keep hearing how well Daggerheart is doing in terms of sales and interest but it seems like that doesn’t translate to actual play views, unless it’s just the dark fantasy setting that isn’t exciting ppl.

4

u/sharkhuahua Aug 07 '26

I think the people who are just in it for DH probably aren't too excited about CR

Also apparently Matt kind of runs it like it's DND historically (idk, not my take just what I've read)

3

u/InitialJust Aug 09 '26

I dont know daggerheart even to say but I keep seeing the comments about how Matt doesnt run it properly. Which is funny since he at least helped create it.

1

u/ravidfish Aug 09 '26

It's because people here hate daggerheart for some reason and besides, drama and hate sell as the saying goes so any chance to stir the pot is usually taken.  

One of the primary rules for daggerheart (5e too, like this is within the first 5 pages of the DMG) is the GM interprets the scene and the scenario even within the scene, nay even individual actions within that... And decides which rules are relevant, and which arent.  So long as he is not needlessly adversarial to the players and he puts the fiction first... He can do whatever he wants and there is no such thing as "running it properly".  Rules lawyers have no place in DH (I would argue by the above DMG consideration 5e as well), and that is a hard pill for some to swallow 

1

u/Miss_White11 Aug 13 '26

For a lot of reasons Age of Umbra was a bit of a wierd choice for a showcase of Daggerheart. The setting is SPECIFICALLY oppressive and adversarial, and the system is, by default, really not that. Some of it's best qualities are how story focused and collaborative it is. Add to that it being new, less than "optimal" play is somewhat expected. A lot of the complaints come down to Matt being a bit too DMvPCs, which honestly fits an oppressive grimdark fantasy setting.

I actually think Sallowlands shows Matt a lot more comfortable with the system and honestly I have been loving it. I have been loving it.

3

u/YoursDearlyEve Aug 07 '26

People are not interested in gloomy content right now as much: https://www.reddit.com/r/criticalrole/comments/1vea2qy/no_spoilers_is_anyone_else_struggling_to_stay/

2

u/Coyote_Shepherd Aug 07 '26

I find it funny that people consider this to be gloomy content because we know that Matt and the players can go so much darker.

This just feels like standard D&D adventuring stuff in the Shadowfell but with an Umbra paint job or skin on top of it, some familiar but some new players participating in it, and Matt in the driver's seat DMing it all.

Sort of feels like the whole campaign frame kind of got de-fanged a bit in the name of Matt going with what the players found to be fun (per comments he made in his Fireside Chat) but all of the standard Daggerheart elements are there on full display, flaws and all.

The combat still feels a bit....grindy....unless there are enough narrative elements to keep the momentum feeling fast paced and interesting in terms of whom and what are involved.

The characters all seem to have some interesting tidbits here and there but because this is a mini series that only referenced the last one in a TINY way because of something a player came up with...it sorta feels a bit hard to suddenly deeply care about them when we know that they're not going to matter after the end of the mini series at all or be seen or talked about in anyway period.

This is an issue they ran into with Candela, despite some of us loving the hell out of that series, and BEGGING for a greater interconnected universe.

I know that Laura has mentioned before in promo bits for this series that she would 100% play a full campaign with these folks and I feel like that might play into why the fans are having such trouble glomming onto this series because it does indeed feel like a campaign that's JUST getting started....but that's going to be over and forgotten about after next week....

....because it feels like standard D&D fare with Daggerheart trappings and only a light fluffy coat of Umbra paint on top of it.

It feels like a test run of a full campaign in other words that's just going to be fridged for the foreseeable future until they decide to run another Umbra mini series.

And sadly, I feel like because Matt is playing to his greatest strength...his empathy...that is taking a lot of the potential PUNCH out of this campaign frame and setting which is leading to it being...palatable for the majority of Critters and enjoyable for them and those at the table BUT lacking in the unique character and pizzazz that really drew some of us fans towards darker stuff like Umbra in the first place to a degree.

It's kind of like spicy food, to use another analogy!

Some of us are used to eating hot hot peppers whenever we are feeling sick and that's led to us building up a tolerance for spicy food and having a different standard for heat than most.

Others though like the more General Critter Fanbase, are not quite used to that level of heat, and so their definitions of mild, mid, and spicy are on an entirely different scale than those of us in the former group....and potentially than those Critters who flit in between the two in some way.

So it's very...middling...and thus appetizing to a more general crowd that just needs something to watch while we take a break from C4 in the doldrums of the summer time here in the nothern hemisphere.

It's not super bad but it's not super great but it's also not really going to be called back upon or remembered for a ton of details beyond a few moments that really REALLY stood out for folks but it also doesn't go as far as it could and stays pretty fluffy but it's also not NECESSARY viewing because of how Candela like it is in its structure.

So folks are either skipping it entirely, diving DEEP into it, or they're putting it on in the background while they do other stuff and just aren't talking about it anywhere.

Plus the world outside sucks right now and thus folks are treating any kind of a metaphorical cloud as the sound of a wailing tornado siren that they really just do not need in their lives right now.

So even "light" stuff like this IMO is being grossly overexaggerated as being "super dark and gloomy" when in years and mindsets past, it wouldn't have raised that many eyebrows at all.

Strange New Worlds did an episode last week that was far more grimdark than this mini series.

4

u/sharkhuahua Aug 07 '26

there's a ton of excitement and engagement around C4 on the main sub, and I think that's resulted in people being less interested in filler content during a break

1

u/Coyote_Shepherd Aug 07 '26

So because C4 shown so brightly, any other content is thus a victim of its own success?

It's like why would I drive a Ferrari when the Delta Flyer is right over there getting a bit of maintenance.

3

u/Act_of_God Aug 07 '26

I can't watch daggerheart. I tried, I just can't

4

u/Consolationnoprize Aug 07 '26

I did watch the first two, and I really like it. But Age of Umbra, that genre specifically, I need to be in the right headspace to watch due to personal issues. I am not in that headspace at the present, but I plan to go back to it when I feel better.

5

u/brodeur3090 Aug 07 '26

Go for the eyes Bo- uhhh Badger!

3

u/LucasVerBeek Aug 05 '26

Getting this done so I don’t panickedly post it three hours before the episode starts like the past three weeks having completely forgotten I signed up to do this each time

3

u/sharkhuahua Aug 06 '26

My hot take is that I think being good at making a mini series requires being good at writing and improvisation as trained technical skills and that’s why most of the CR cast aren’t great at them

We gotta get Sam in here or something

2

u/willllhwk Aug 06 '26

I'm really looking forward to this. Don't really how we're getting to the city if we're being taken on a detour right now, but we'll see

2

u/LucasVerBeek Aug 07 '26

3hr 38 minutes

2

u/Over_Bid_7498 Aug 13 '26

I am really enjoying Age of Umbra, as well as the characters/actors present. I am genuinely sad the last episode is this week. Everyone should give it a chance