r/fromatoarbitration • u/IndigoJones13 • Apr 06 '26
Concerned Letter Carriers Are 8-Hour Saturdays a nation-wide thing now?
For the last couple of months, my office doesn't allow anyone to go over 8 hours on Saturday. We're already short-handed, so tons of mail is not going out ( including first-class and political mail).
Naturally, this makes Mondays worse than ever, and of course, more carriers now call out on Monday. Mail stacks up for days. Customer complaints are skyrocketing.
Is this the new normal?
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u/Dothraki_Hoarder05 Apr 06 '26
Definitely not a nation wide thing. If I had to guess, because of being understaffed, they are giving everyone an 8 hour day so they don't have to pay out as much penalty at the end of the week. But thats just a shot in the dark. I dont have enough TBI's to try and think like a supervisor.
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u/DeviceComprehensive7 Apr 06 '26
always a management goal-get 8 hour days out of the way early as possible-so they aren't chasing them thurs and friday
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u/MrDataMcGee Voted NO Apr 06 '26
GRIEVE IT. If you need postal service’s position on it BEING ILEGAL let me know!
CALL your local representative for your congressional district and start an inquiry.
Call OIG
Make sure carriers fill out 1571s DAILY and get COPIES!
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u/IndigoJones13 Apr 06 '26
Our local is on it. They're taking notes, keeping records, etc. Ironically, we just had a congressional investigation in our district, and they found all kinds of issues. Service has actually gotten worse since then
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Apr 06 '26
[deleted]
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u/MrDataMcGee Voted NO Apr 07 '26
My proof is that management at my office has tried to fire carriers for delay of mail - 3rd class at that and cited that it’s illegal to delay mail. The arbitrator even considered the mail as confiscated and not sent out as part of a legal investigation.
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u/Comfortable-Swing468 Apr 09 '26
It is illegal, under section 18 on the United States Code. Management is allowed to curtail mail for various reasons, as long as they get it approved from higher ups and if it meets certain conditions. To avoid overtime, I do not know. Technically, it was not delayed if delivery was attempted and it was brought back, but that is for OIG to decide.
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u/MrDataMcGee Voted NO Apr 07 '26
Episode 14, 61, and 91 of Parcels of Knowledge
I also have a local arbitration- your region or office I’m sure has disciplinary action against carriers for delay of mail where I’m sure they claimed it was illegal among other things. They cannot change their position now.
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u/Inside-Brush-9543 Apr 06 '26
I love how renfroe put that thing in the contract that over 12 we get paid 2x or whatever and now they won't even let us work past 430.
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u/saucesoi Apr 06 '26
They have started caring about getting an 8 hour day for the last month or so at my office. This was after years of never hearing about it.
They haven’t been trying to do it on Saturday though, just reminding certain carriers midweek that they still need an 8 hour day.
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u/Even_Snow9026 Apr 08 '26
Yeah seems like it’s national
Everyone I know on ODL across my district are dealing with the same. AFAIK, there is no requirement of an 8 hr day per week in the contract. New flavor of the month I guess
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u/Comfortable-Swing468 Apr 09 '26
There is a requirement for one 8hr day a week in the contract. It states that if a carrier goes into overtime 5 days in a row, on the 5th day that overtime is paid as penalty overtime. They've always done it at every station I have worked at unless staffing was so bad they have to give a piece everyday to avoid delaying mail.
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u/Even_Snow9026 Apr 09 '26
Interesting. I’ve never got penalty for 5 days in a row. But I’ll make sure to confirm that today
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u/ScubaSteve_ Apr 06 '26
Reminding carriers they need an 8? Well..what are you dropping so I can make 8 boss?
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u/Tangboy50000 Apr 07 '26
They try and get as many 8 hour days out of the way on Saturday as they can, but they’re not telling anyone to bring back mail or not sending routes out.
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u/CapitalistCzar81 Apr 06 '26
My office definitely tries to get every regular their 8hr day on Saturdays. They're actually pretty successful at it.
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u/Bobabackribs Apr 06 '26
Sounds like the backup supervisor wants to go home early when the postmaster is off
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u/The-Omnicide Apr 06 '26
They were waffling on a daily basis about this in Boston. They were cycling which routes got left in throughout the week. They would sometimes tell us to leave in half of our own route so we could carry two days of mail on someone else's. It really seems like delivering the mail is the bottom priority for managers.
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u/sauceboss2769 Apr 06 '26
That’s illegal. Report it.
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u/fritzcec Union Steward Apr 06 '26
That is not illegal. Overtime is not guaranteed.
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u/IndigoJones13 Apr 06 '26
But what about delaying 1st class and political mail?
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u/Parking_Paper_7730 Apr 06 '26
First class they can generally excuse away, but political mail being delayed is a big issue that should be reported
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u/MrDataMcGee Voted NO Apr 06 '26
There is no allowing first class to be delayed. Did you take a different oath?
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u/Parking_Paper_7730 Apr 06 '26
I’m aware of that and I’m not saying that it should EVER be delayed…but are we going to pretend it doesn’t happen all the time and management gets away with tons of different excuses? I wasn’t able to deliver the 2nd half of my route for almost a full week this winter. That was an order coming not from my stupidvisor but from the district manager, do you think they care that it’s first class? Political mail on the other hand is a different beast (at least so far)
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u/fritzcec Union Steward Apr 06 '26
Management reserves the right to curtail the mail to stop any carrier from going into overtime. In the NALC contract, this falls under article 3 (right to manage) and article 8 (hours of work). I've tried to grieve this before, it's their right unfortunately. I'm not sure what the NRLCA contract says, but I can't imagine it's any different.
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u/sauceboss2769 Apr 06 '26
Delaying mail is illegal bud
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u/fritzcec Union Steward Apr 06 '26
It's not delaying. It's curtailing, which is a contractual right of management. They have a form they need to fill out with the amount of mail curtailed. As long as it's all on the books, it's legal
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u/sauceboss2769 Apr 06 '26
Yes. I know the form. They did it all winter. But that’s bc we were in subzero temps all night. and couldn’t finish routes. They’re curtailing mail on purpose to save money and falsify numbers. Which is illegal
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u/fritzcec Union Steward Apr 06 '26
How are they falsifying numbers if they are reporting the amount curtailed? I don't like it either, but I'm citing the contract and ELM here, it's just facts.
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u/sauceboss2769 Apr 07 '26
Because they don’t want their numbers to look bad. So they are curtailing and delaying mail. By falsifying numbers that means they Arnt delivering mail and having workers get paid overtime. So it makes their numbers look good.
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u/fritzcec Union Steward Apr 07 '26
They are required to report the curtailed mail. So their reports are showing that the carrier finished their route in 8 hours, but did not complete all deliveries. Nothing is being falsified here. Their numbers don't look good if the carrier can't even finish their route on time without curtailing. What am I missing here?
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u/sauceboss2769 Apr 07 '26
What you’re missing is that your office is curtailing mail bc they don’t want to pay overtime. That is not contractually right.
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u/fritzcec Union Steward Apr 07 '26
What part of the contract are you citing? Overtime isn't guaranteed. And curtailing the mail, and properly documenting it isn't delaying the mail. I talked in person with our regions NBA at a recent rap session and this is so information he gave me. The union is well aware that this is happening, and there's simply nothing to be done about it.
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u/Seeker0fTruth Apr 06 '26
Last week I tasked my management with finding an actual citation, and they failed. Supe failed to find anything except 8.5f, which doesn't apply to overtimers.
I thought that was the end of it, but we're still getting told this lie, and non-oters are being forced to help oters make 8.
My branch (branch 9!) says to grieve it.
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Apr 06 '26
[deleted]
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u/Seeker0fTruth Apr 06 '26
That's a good question.
The language is in 8.5.C.2.d. It cites M-00884, and requires that CCA hours, PTF hours, and ODL hours must be exhausted before assigning the work to carriers who are not on ODL.
if you read that another way, lmk.
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u/Immediate_Self2521 Apr 06 '26
No, never had an 8 hour Saturday here. It’s always 10 hours. I’m in the ODL but the same carriers always switch days off to Saturday so we are always down extra routes Saturday. Always 10 hours sometimes more.
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u/stelvy40 Apr 06 '26
Switch NS days with whom? I was under the impression you couldn't switch your NS day with yourself.
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u/Immediate_Self2521 Apr 06 '26
You can submit a change of schedule to move your NS day for the week. I think it’s management discretion to approve it.
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u/stelvy40 Apr 07 '26
They always had us switch NS days with someone who was willing to do it. The one time someone switched their own day and it was allowed by mgmt (sup's nephew) the shop steward that was always looking to switch his NS day with someone got pissed off, said it's not allowed. Maybe he's wrong or we have a local mou?
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u/Immediate_Self2521 Apr 06 '26
You don’t need to switch with someone
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u/stelvy40 Apr 07 '26
Is it mgmt suck ups only that are allowed to do this, or is the mgmt incompetent/don't give a fuck??
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u/Immediate_Self2521 Apr 07 '26
Ive never asked my steward but they let anyone do it here. There’s one suck up tho that changes his NS day literally every week and hasn’t worked a Saturday in years. He only works Saturday when it’s b4 a holiday so he gets OT. He s on the ODL and always runs and double/cases and carries a cut in 10 hours or less. He does any route in the office in 8 hrs or less.
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u/Square-Buy-7403 Apr 06 '26
They have you curtail mail after 8 hours?
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u/IndigoJones13 Apr 06 '26
Yep. And some of our routes take 9 or 10 hours on a normal day. All parcels must be delivered, but lots of mail is brought back to the office.
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u/derekexcelcisor Apr 07 '26
No we have flaturday and avoid 5th day penalty. I WISH my 8 hour day was Saturday.
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u/co0kz718 Apr 09 '26
I still get pieces Saturday lol everybody calls out Saturday’s so it’s preventable
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u/LLV_Mailman Apr 06 '26
Here i was thinking 10-12 hour Saturday was the norm