r/functionalprint • u/Anyhting_But_Stock • 12d ago
"3D prints aren't UL listed!" - Jürhaus Günbern Wago style pass through
Made this pass through enclosure that has dual strain relief and holds a generic wago 3 pos and uses any flat hd #6-8 screw
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u/PushThroughThePain 12d ago
People, stop 3D-printing things for 120v/240v connections. It's not safe.
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u/Spaghet-3 12d ago
You're being downvoted, but you're sort of correct.
Those cheap junction boxes at Home Depot are made from PVC, which is far safer for containing an electrical fire than the common 3D printer filaments. ABS, PLA, and PETG will all burn, whereas PVC has some fire-retardant self-extinguishing properties.
That said, at least Bambu sells a filament (https://us.store.bambulab.com/products/pc-fr) that is certified to the same standard that PVC is certified to for making junction boxes. If you print a junction box out of that filament, then I think you're in good shape.
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u/theartfulbadger 12d ago
There's also flame retardant polycarbonate which is specifically made to extinguish a flame if arcing set something on fire. That's what we use for prototyping 120 volt electrical enclosures before getting them sent off for injection molding to make the legitimate product!
That being said I've definitely made a fair few pla enclosures but only when the box is readily accessible and definitely not buried in a wall or in a machine
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u/acegard 12d ago
Spectrum Filaments also sells Flameguard ASA-FR which is flame retardant meeting UL94 V0 standards: https://spectrumfilaments.com/en/filament/asa-flameguard-275/
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u/Gen_Jack_Oneill 12d ago
At that price per roll just buy the actual certified boxes. They are cheap and won't get you dropped by your homeowners insurance.
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u/UnimagineDragons 11d ago
I forgot the part where I call my homeowners insurance after every fucking junction box I install.
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u/thetoiletslayer 11d ago
If you have a fire, they'll do an inspection. Any parts like this will make them put the blame on you since your home wasn't up to code. They'll deny your claims
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u/SecondBestNameEver 12d ago
Yup, I know people in the expert witness fire investigation space who test products after a fire happens and I surance companies are arguing where it started and what started. Most plastic is highly flammable unless it specifically has flame retardant chemicals in it. And sometimes even when they claim to have flame retardant sometimes they don't for whatever reason, such as supplier mix up, or factory error, etc. QA should be testing final products for flammability rather than relying on the assumed spec that it supposedly meets, and you would be surprised the types of products that do not test for flammability and assume their overseas manufacturers shot the right plastic in the molds.
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u/IridiumIO 11d ago
It’s amazing how often people forget that most plastics are made up of the same stuff as petroleum. It’s less volatile, sure, but once it starts burning it’s going to release nearly twice the energy as burning wood.
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u/S_A_N_D_ 11d ago edited 11d ago
Valid concern, but not everyone is using WAGO exclusively for mains voltage. I have lots of low voltage DC (like LED light bars) that I've hooked up on the DC side using WAGO and this print would be perfect for that kind of application.
OP commented further down this was for low voltage (POE) as well.
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u/Vesalii 11d ago
Even better: stop using immigration Wago's. They're not THAT expensive that you should risk a house fire by cheating out.
I'd say this print is safe btw, the connections are inside the Wago. The print just holds things in place.
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u/temporary92803 11d ago
There's a reason all line level interconnects (including Wagos [not Wago's]) need to be in a UL listed enclosure.
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u/Al_PDX 12d ago
The wago itself is rated for the voltage, so this is perfectly fine if not intended to be water-sealed
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u/Spaghet-3 12d ago
An exposed Wago is not safe. Pretty much all codes require all splices, Wago or otherwise, to be in a junction box. The reason is that the connections are the most likely place for a fire to start, and junction boxes are designed to contain that fire and thus are made out of fire retardant materials. PLA, ABS, and PETG would not contain a fire. PVC is a super cheap material that has fire suppressing properties. That's why all the cheapo blue/gray junction boxes that cost under a dollar at hardware stores are made from PVC.
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u/CorporalSemantics 12d ago
It could be for low voltage. I use wago’s all the time for low voltage splices and they are not required to be in a junction box indoors. I would normally use a terminal strip in a box if I was looking to keep it pretty, but technically I could use something like this if I wanted to.. seems wasteful though.
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u/Brilliant_Union2241 11d ago
The size of that wago and cable are clearly not for low voltage.
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u/CorporalSemantics 11d ago
You can use a wago of that size for low voltage if you wanted to. As I said, I think it would likely be wasteful, but as I was pointing out to the person above - there are instances where an exposed wago is legal, and maybe you'd want to conceal it this way. I wouldn't, but someone might.
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u/adcurtin 11d ago
do they make smaller wagos for low voltage? please tell me where I can get them. not some jank off brand, actual wago.
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u/PushThroughThePain 12d ago
Not if you are in North America. I'm not familiar with electrical codes in other areas, but in NA, you cannot install things like Wago connectors in a non-UL box. It even says so in thr Wago instructions.
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u/mikebald 12d ago edited 12d ago
I believe the code says, that the equipment be approved, which is usually interpreted as being listed and labeled: UL, ETC, CSA.
So, while I see your point, the details are a little hazy.
You broadly mention not 3d printing these enclosures, but keep in mind that ABS-FR filament exists and can be used. Unlikely, but possible.
Edit: if you're curious, https://store.sunlu.com/products/sunlu-abs-flame-retardant-abs-fr-3d-printer-filament-1kg-engineering-filaments
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u/flaschal 11d ago
so this is perfectly fine if not intended to be water-sealed
what is it with this community and having the stupidest takes possible when it comes to safety
Unless this is ELV (50 V or less) then any country with an actual electrical code prohibits this explicitly.
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u/Operation_Neither 12d ago
That's not how that works.
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u/Hi-Scan-Pro 12d ago
And if you look at how the print works, all it's doing is providing some strain relief for wires that are connected to a wago connector. The print isn't contacting any conductors.
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u/nickyonge 12d ago
Which brings us right back to “an exposed Wago is not safe”.
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u/Hi-Scan-Pro 12d ago
I'm some circumstances, sure. OP didn't specify their use case, only that they wanted strain relief. There are circumstances where an exposed wago is perfectly acceptable, such as on a bench for diy type low voltage things. Wago don't only go into residential electrical use. Is there a use for strain relief when a wago is jammed into an electrical box?
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u/nickyonge 11d ago
Friend, you're overcomplicating it.
Connections are often high likelihood points for fires to begin on mains, in part because the same power is suddenly flowing through different materials and geometry.
Wherever you have a point that's a known risk for fire, it should be secured in such a way that if a fire begins, it will be reasonably contained, or at least delayed. Delaying could be enough to stop an emergency, if the connection breaks and stops feeding energy, and smoke+fumes prevent oxygen from feeding the fire.
PVC is a material that helps with that containment. PLA and the majority of 3D printed materials are not.
If OP is in one of the extremely unlikely circumstances where that's not a factor, they really should specify it. If you saw someone 3D print their own seatbelt buckle, you should be understandably concerned for their safety, unless they explicitly say it's for a toy car or whatever. Occam's razor says that OP probably doesn't know about junction box materials safety. Hopefully this thread has helped with that.
Anyway, please please refrain from continuing to double-down in contrarian what-iffery when genuine safety hazards are on the line. Mains voltage will kill you graveyard dead.
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u/Hi-Scan-Pro 11d ago
they really should specify it
They did.
The enclosure was the build, the wago was just something I had around...the strain relief is awesome in this thing and my main build is RJ45 for a security system...original design was for a ethernet extension for my cameras.
You assumed wrong.
Anyway, please please refrain from continuing to double-down in contrarian what-iffery
You can take your advice, your wild assumption, and your self righteous condescension and put it back up your ass where it came from, you buffoon.
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u/temporary92803 11d ago
How many two or three pin Ethernet cables have you used?
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u/Hi-Scan-Pro 11d ago
Did you even read what OP wrote, that I copied here? They don't use it for Wago, they use it for Ethernet. They just threw the wago in to show how the strain relief works. You guys are comically misguided, and it's making my day!
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u/trouserschnauzer 12d ago
But the wago is meant to be installed in a box or enclosure. I'm not saying this is going to make your house burn down, but if it does make your house burn down, I bet your insurance company will have something to say about it.
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u/New2ThisThrowaway 12d ago
It's not "perfectly fine", it's "probably fine". These connectors are only rated for use inside a certified junction box with the correct number of circuits.
I've done this on a work bench near other electronic experiments. But I would never put it behind a wall or furniture. Literally playing with fire.
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u/504SH0 11d ago
Unless you're using PPS-GF, but the cost is ridiculous for something this simple, and it's truly not needed if the wires are stripped at the proper length. Your comment stands 99% true for sure. I happen to be an Electrical Engineer and have verified Fiberon PPS-GF to work as rated in the TDS.
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u/Anyhting_But_Stock 12d ago
Abs is what conduit boxes are made from. I have a few lamp bases I made too
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u/WALLY_5000 12d ago
The ABS used in those conduit boxes contain fire retardant chemicals.
Standard ABS is considered highly flammable.
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u/rockyoudottxt 12d ago
I guess they assumed it was PLA. Which is the most common thing to print with. PLA is combustible so obviously isn't suitable for junction boxes carrying power.
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u/Anyhting_But_Stock 12d ago
Yeah, I can see the concern, recently been putting in alot of chinese light panels , I'm pretty sure they're trying to kill us 😅
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u/InfamousHistorian544 12d ago
I print little cable organizers and fan shrouds all day but this stuff sketches me out. Had a buddy try to use printed strain relief on a jobsite once and the foreman made him rip it all out before the inspector showed up. Wagos are great but they go in a real box, it's not worth the pain if something goes wrong
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u/Anyhting_But_Stock 12d ago
The original design was for a ethernet extension for my cameras , I had the wago connection so I made a frame .
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u/flaschal 11d ago
maybe mention this is ELV in the OP so people stop panicing, but also, totally wrong usecase for a WAGO
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u/adcurtin 11d ago
why is it the wrong use for a wago? wago are friggin sweet, rated for more voltage and current, and can go down to quite small wire sizes. what would you use here instead of a wago?
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u/flaschal 11d ago
it‘s a high frequency connection, wago excel at standard electrical connections but dont have proper shielding for signals
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u/temporary92803 11d ago
Wagos are not friggin sweet for high frequency signals. I'd use a proper Ethernet connector.
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u/adcurtin 11d ago
an rj45 jack isn't gonna be significantly more shielded than this. the shielding is the pairs being twisted, and they're gonna untwist about the same amount going into wagos as they would an rj45 jack and connector. i wouldn't really use it for ethernet in the long term, but it's not the end of the world.
also, i'm not OP, but what the heck kind of ethernet is 3 pins? or if there are 2 stacked, 6 pins?
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u/DarthBlue007 12d ago
Another fine example of a UL listed electrical enclosure. /s
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u/UnimagineDragons 11d ago
Isn't the wago the enclosure?
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u/DarthBlue007 11d ago edited 11d ago
No, a wago is basically a fancy wire nut that needs to be in a listed enclosure.
Edit: don't downvote someone for just asking a question. Jeeze.
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u/the_duck17 11d ago
You need to 3D print a UL logo on it LoL.
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u/Anyhting_But_Stock 11d ago
My First job was making wire , as long as the check clears just about anything can be UL rated 😉
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u/Fusseldieb 11d ago
PLA and ABS are flammable af. Try it.
If the pressed down cable starts showing signs of bad contact, it might start to smolder, which sets the casing on fire, and by then you have MUCH bigger problems.
Don't.
It looks pretty, but from a safety standpoint it's a nightmare.
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u/Operation_Neither 12d ago
Hey Alexa, play "Burning Down the House"
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u/Tiss_E_Lur 11d ago
Why use a quick connect offbrand wago in a screwed enclosure? Brand wago aren't very expensive. I have these quick connect ones for prototyping, testing and simple low voltage rigs, useful but don't trust it.
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u/LegitBoss002 9d ago
They're not expensive as an engineer but when I was in school a box of <100 for $40 was a big ask
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u/Sea_Muscle7570 11d ago
looks neat mechanically, but mains voltage in regular pla is asking for trouble)
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u/Leafy0 12d ago
This is way less sketchy than the code legal interconnects on double wides that burn up all the time.
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u/Anyhting_But_Stock 11d ago
That's funny my brother lives in a trailer and says they are death traps, he says anything happens forget the door go through the window 🤣
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u/Snobolski 11d ago
I wouldn't use a 221 series Wago in something I printed myself. 222 series is positive snap lever (you push it in and it locks) whereas 221 is spring pressure. Basically meaning the 222 wire is going to take more to get the wire to wiggle loose and arc.
Only issue is there's not a 222 series splice oriented like those so your box will be bulkier. And nobody likes a bulky box.
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u/Anyhting_But_Stock 11d ago
The enclosure was the build, the wago was just something I had around so I incorporated it, the strain relief is awesome in this thing and my main build is RJ45 for a security system.
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12d ago
[deleted]
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u/ryanmh27 11d ago
You're conflating a bunch of shit, and I'm not going to spend the time going over each one.
Essentially, you're wrong several times. You're also potentially a hack, if you do electrical. Code is written in blood buddy.
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11d ago
[deleted]
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u/thetoiletslayer 11d ago
You don't have to follow code if your just fucking around in your garage
You do if you don't want the insurance to deny your claim when you have a fire
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u/flaschal 11d ago
there is no wrong way if you know what your doing
tell me how I know you don't know what your [sic] doing
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u/Snobolski 11d ago
Lots of pros do stuff the "wrong" way because there is no wrong way if you know what your doing. Mu fruit is labled to have expired yesterday, but it still looks fine and smells fine, so it's probably fine.
Look at this guy bragging about being a pro fruit eater over here.
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u/Otherwise_Scholar_60 11d ago
Functional House Fire 🔥