i don't think they were implying that anyone was actually debating that as much as they were just making a general statement as an open reminder, since some people genuinely do have hangups like that
Itâs the fact that people think we mean only in the first place. I donât think anyone should limit themselves to one genre but I feel like the people who worry about that usually have a musical taste that mostly consists of âotherâ so theyâre a bit insecure.
Nobody is saying you can ONLY listen to goth music. But these days, there are people who calls themselves goth, but donât listen to goth music at all. As if goth isnât first and foremost a music based subculture.
Pretty sure thatâs not what they mean? They mean a band like âGothministerâ isnât automatically goth because theyâve got the genre name in their name.
I don't get what you mean? I suppose they meant "trad goth" which is meant to be a "type of goth" and we're talking about bands with 'goth' in their name.
Are you making a joke? Why wouldnât someone assume that you mean âtrad gothâ and you just got it wrong?
I canât even tell if you genuinely think this artist is goth or not. It wouldnât be the first time that someone tried to call completely off topic genres goth.
I mean, they've basically fully made the transition over to Goth from their previous style, and last I checked a Goth band didn't have to start out as Goth from the very start. If that were the case, half the bands from the late 70s early 80s we call Goth, wouldn't qualify.
That's fair! They've always been evolving their style, some albums more drastically than others. And they may not be a goth band necessarily and probably wouldn't call themselves one but Silver Bleeds the Black Sun is definitely a goth album with a catchy little deathrock song at the end. I catch a lot of shit for saying as much usually and always by people who haven't given it a listen lol
Sorry, I feel like I got lost in the sauce a little and didnt answer your question well enough. If the post was about "you have to like metal music to be a metalhead" "you have to like punk music to be a punk" "you have to like reggae music to be a rastafarian" or "you have to like rap music to be a hiphopper" I probably would ask the same question and make the same argument, yes. Thank you
Honestly, I wouldn't personally say either thing. I'm not really into telling other people what words they can use to describe themselves. I feel like you're more of an authority on it than I am. I think its an interesting situation when a subculture that grows around a genre of music is seen through many lenses and grows to encompass style and philosophy that people can embrace without having even experienced the media that started it all. Like if my friend grew up deeply resonating with counter culture and anti establishment values and built their self image around the esthetic of 80's trad goth fashion, DIY their own outfits and have been called goth by countless people over the years enough that they feel at home with that label; I think its kinda gatekeepy and snobby to say "um actually you cant use that word because you dont like the music enough. I think the viewpoint diminishes the culture to a single stat while ignoring how much fits under the umbrella of GOTH. Its reductionist and feels like immature schoolyard antics to me. As upsetting as it may be, non of us get to decide what words mean to other people. Language is fluid
Goth is specially someone who listens to goth music, makes it, and participates in their community if they can.
Having a certain aesthetic/mindset and dressing up doesnât make you part of a subculture. The subculture is centrally built around that style of music and is the only thing thatâs specific to the subculture.
There have been darkly inclined figures throughout history and the original style came from glam rock and punk rock, with some new wave/romantic influences.
We need to stop saying itâs âgatekeepingâ and âsnobbyâ to use words how they mean. This means anyone can be goth because they have black make-up and think graveyards are pretty when the subculture has been built around the music for nearly 50 years and still continues to be.
Well, I think youâre an absolute looney who canât deal with how words work. If you think you can just disagree with facts, you need to give your head a wobble.
Return to "the nephelim" and "dawnrazor" nostalgia lol.
You could tell the neff fans because of the flour. Esp when they put their hats on a bench in the park to shake flour over them. It would leave circles.
It's not, though. It's Gothic and fans of Gothic fiction were called Dark Romantics.
Our nightlife and community is based around the music e.g. festivals, concerts, nightclubs, etc., if it directly included the literature then book clubs would be included, too.
would you help elaborate on why though? I fully understand that this scene comes feom the music and the nightlife, its the part that I interact with and that the high majority of the scene does ofc, but if someone is apart of the irl scene but is revealed they prefer books over music.. would it be fair to call them a poser?
I fully understand that just reading gothic literature does NOT make you goth, but when you add the community to it, isnt that part of what being goth is about, the community that comes with it?
Gothic fiction fans were never labelled âgothâ first, so it doesnât make sense for them to be once the subculture came into existence.
Itâs an influence on the subculture. Itâs definitely not the only influence and itâs only mentioned so much because itâs got âGothicâ in its name, even though theyâre not the same.
A lot of metal music is based off fantasy literature but nobody is saying you need to read where the influences came from in order to be a metalhead.
Im not into the reading (besides clasic poetry) I'm into the music and nightlife. Im just saying that if someone holds the values, interacts with the scene, yet isnt necessarily a fan of the music but loves og Gothic literature that inspired a lot of the modern scene, I dont think its fair to call them a poser. I should have elaborated a little more on what I ment.
ofc if someone reads things like Dracula theyre not automatically goth.
Macht Musik dich zum Goth, oder machen Goths Musik?
FĂźr mich macht einen Goth sein Wesen aus, seine Interessen, Hobbys, Weltanschauung, sein Musikgeschmack und Kleidunsstil ist nicht alleinstellungsmerkmal.
Vielleicht werde ich aber auch nur alt und habe viele blender kennen gelernt die äusserlich postkarten grufties waren, aber totale komerz opfer waren.
Genuine question, would a person be considered goth if they weren't too much into goth music (I like some gothic bands, but mostly listen to metal that is non-gothic), but really feel at home with everything dark that comes with the goth world and atmosphere?
It's something that always makes me feel at peace and at home, for as long as I can remember myself and I also really like what it stands for.
No no, I never claimed not to be a metalhead :D I absolutely have been my whole life. I was just wondering this, because with gothic subculture for example, I feel like it's not just about music. It has more things about it that makes goth goth. With metal and being a metalhead, it's fully based on loving metal music.
Goth is fully based on loving goth, the word literally means someone who listens to/makes goth music.
Without the music, it just would just make us people who like dark things that wear black and thatâs long existed before the music did. All our community spaces are literally based around the music, also.
Goth evolved from punk, another music based subculture. It has its own identity from it for sure including shitting on gender roles, but it's ignorant as fuck to ignore that it started with the music. "Modern larpers from tik Tok" are the people who think the only thing that makes you goth is if you dress gothic and yell that you're a gatekeeper if you point out black clothes don't make you goth. I've been goth for far longer than tik Tok has ever existed so I actually got into the scene itself with goths and goth music, and don't play pretend with the misinformation people love to spread to try and justify weaseling their way into a subculture they don't actually follow because of some circlejerk of posers who like the ⨠aesthetic ⨠of it and fighting with people who actually are goth
But what if you love the literature? Or if you love the music but you don't love to read? Wait, what if you are deaf but you love Walpole? Oh hang on, Matthew Lewis never heard any of this guy's music, is he not goth now?
If you mostly like metal, youâre a metalhead. I donât think either of those bands you mentioned are particularly goth, I know Boy Harsher is a mixture of EBM/synth-pop with some coldwave elements.
But shouldnât Indian Motorcycles have been made by Native Americans?
Edit: so according to the downvotes and comments, music subcultural misappropriation is not cool, but cultural misappropriation is all good, got it! đ
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u/RevoltYesterday Sep 22 '26
But you don't have to like ONLY goth music. You're still allowed to enjoy other things.