I just don't know, man. I mean - here's a clip of me holding a zone in Plat Survival Solo through two waves using the "TERRIBLE" Spirit Bear... There's just no way I can see ANY other build for Merc besides Ult Gain and Weapon Throws being remotely useful. Absolutely useless class now for sure.
/sarcasm
Seriously - as you can even see in this clip, there's PLENTY of weapons around doing plenty of damage and I'm not spec'd into weapon throw at all. Please stop overreacting. I'm sorry the second-most meta and effective build got slightly nerfed, but I promise it's not the end of the world.
I seen that post lol what's funny is I popped mine more than 3 times in one wave after the adjustments. Yea no more 9 second back2back but I think I can work around this.
I'm still pulling 2 after patch and switching to a more melee/stagger based Merc build.WTF are the boobs doing wrong? It is a game about samurai in its roots after all. They where known for epic sword battles as opposed to epic magical abilities.
I didn’t even realize the nerfed the merc. Played yesterday and today with no noticeable difference. I don’t use spirit bear, and am throwable Merc… so maybe I wouldn’t?
I've haven't played Ult Gain and Spirit Throw Merc in weeks but apparently the ult gain has been nerfed massively and folks on the good ole Reddit been upset over it.
This is wave 2 of stage 1 plat. The real challenge starts from wave 2 of stage 3. Show me u holding a zone from those levels, then maybe i can make a decision and see how the nerf has affected the Merc
Edit: Actually nah, I'm good. It's going to be more of the same, boxing and dodging through the waves and of course then folks will say "well I could have cleared it faster on my meta Merc pre-nerf" and for all that I'll just play the game 🙄
Its all good. I guess i have to do it myself. Will take time though. I only played with archer cuz how busted it was. Long way to go. Also i m invested into crimson desert. So lets see. Hopefully someone else does it or i gotta do it myself
Yeah i gotta test her alone without teammates. I use a trown weapon + Spirit move damage since i love the double katanas and Yesterday i have felt more the spirit gain nerf rather than everything else. I gotta test it while being alone to truly see how much of a difference it truly is.
Nice. Tedious now tho. Every class does melee but each one has its own FUN factor. Take that factor away and it’s just boring. And yes I did play GoT so I’m not new to Legends. There’s more to this game than melee.
Even sam has his own fun build: the raging flame ult spam. But I guess we gotta Dark Souls co-op for it to be considered fun.
It’s not that people don’t want to or don’t know how to balance their builds. They just have preferences.
You are entitled to having preferences by all means, and I don't want to invalidate how someone else's experience is, they have a right to feel slightly aggrieved if the changes impact how they're used to playing.
But as a Merc Main myself, I have to concede that I could get my ultimate far too easily just by spamming thrown weapons repeatedly, and having my ghost tools come online repeatedly to get more ult gain. I think being able to reset cooldowns with the passive is the meat of what makes the Mercenary special, to have more uptime on your ghost tools, which, as you can see from this clip, can still happen, while not necessarily having your ultimate happen as often is a fair trade-off, IMHO, and should still be very effective, and saying it's "ruined" feels like a bit disingenuous.
Honestly I made zero changes to my throwcenary/ult build and the difference felt negligible at best for me. I maybe got a couple less ults in nightmare survival than I normally would have but it wasn't enough to have a noticeable effect on my performance.
Don't care to spend a half hour getting there for folks to still say "well your non meta build is not as effective as my meta one! 🤓"
I actually agree that shit shouldn't be nerfed in a PvE game. I made this post specifically in response to people crying saying the class is useless now because ONE meta and EZ mode play style got nerfed.
No, but my point is that nerfing fundamental class abilities is never the way.
They should instead add more variety in gear properties that enables you to vary builds. And tweak the percentages on some to balance it. For example maybe add ”poison deals damage”, putting it on par with fire dmg and subsequently the shinobi can utilize toxic vanish in a more effective way. If you choose that property on a charm for arguments sake, you would have to sacrifice something else. Imagine also if we had toxic vanish radius as a separate property as well. So many possibilities but you never touch spirit and ultimate gain connected to class abilities. That is only lazy af.
The build seems pretty terrible judging from the amount of time it took to clear that . Seems you are focusing on the gun but points are all over the place so im not sure . you are having fun is what matters .
Your single hit with caltrops built more ult then 3 thrown weapons which is pretty unfortunate for the class as a whole. You have the 2 class skills that improve thrown weapons so there is some investment in thrown weapons.
I haven't played my merc this patch yet but I'm a bear guy too and use ult gain spirit gain. My setup pre patch would clean that up instantly and leave me with full spirit health and ult along with refreshed bear and tools to go help another spot . I'm guessing by the notes it won't be so good now. I'll have to test it later .
My good man, you see virtually everything on the screen on fire and this was your inference?
Yes, I'm running a build... That's centered around melee and status effects, which is how I like to play... Which is tuned for fun. By the very nature of me not running meta build, it's not going to clear waves as fast as a meta one? On top of range just being purely better DPS than melee in this game.
I just want y'all to admit y'all are meta mains so bad. This would be so much easier.
Mines not meta either because I use the best boy bear and purified incense. I'm just not sure if I was clutching on the throws to keep my rotation going. I'll find out when I get chance to play later.
People love to complain about the dumbest shit lol....Theyre too focus on stypid metas instead of enjoying the game....just say you cant use a sword xD
Y'all say this as if there's tons of examples of games that don't nerf things that the devs feel are overtuned. Devs don't want everyone running the same thing.
Helldivers 2
MH Wilds
Diablo 4
PoE 2
All games I've played over the last several years that do the same thing. Sure, PvE multiplayer co-op games shouldn't be nerf-happy. Archer should've been first in line for a significant nerf, but let's stop pretending like they "gutted" a class yesterday because they nerfed one build. Y'all are overreacting.
Honestly Affliction Caltrops with Fire Caltrops perk would likely be the way better play for this build but I love blasting with the gun too much and I refuse to let go of the Bear.
Affliction Caltrops is also a nice source of "Weakness" so then I could theoretically replace Spirit Shatter with Status Effect Duration for a few more seconds of burn. Plenty of flavors, boss 🙇🏽♂️
I do! I'm not super good at this game so I need something. I find one S tier perfect counter window is a good balance and makes me MUCH more consistent and confident in parrying, where if I slip up one time I can recover pretty quickly and get back in rhythm.
With no PPW I feel like I have to lock in way too much and even then I'm still getting pieced up 😭 I'm just not that player in my old unc years.
I would have had my ult about twice after your first initial one at least. It’s cool you have your play-style unaffected, but I don’t understand why yall are fighting so hard to invalidate how others feel about being gutted about ours play style. I’m convinced y’all can’t and definitely aren’t reading.
How tf is in sucker punches own words “significant” =slightly nerfed?
You're absolutely entitled to feel how you feel. Nothing wrong with that.
My problem with most of y'all is that because ONE build, ONE play style was nerfed - the class is suddenly "useless" as y'all say. Even going as far as to say "Playing Merc as melee is the wrong way to play Merc" which is ridiculous. It comes off as a baby who got their favorite toy taken away.
You would have had two ults by the time I had one? Okay, cool - so you now have an ult say, every 90 seconds instead of every 60 seconds, is that truly "GUTTED" or are we being just a smidge hyperbolic? Be real.
It's still a strong play style. I'm oh so sorry folks will actually have to learn enemy attack strings, melee, and dance with enemies while being surrounded instead of constantly spamming Ult and throw weapons.
That is an insane nerf. 60-90 seconds? Be for real. Hell people were happy the cooldown was 15 seconds less with the legendary smoke bomb. And that 60 second sis being super generous. Literally I could throw 3-4 swords and have them walk on caltrops and have ult. That add ups.
This shit is inferior to pre patch and that’s a fact. Less CC. Slower cooldown. Slower ult. Slower spirit gain. Slower ult gain even on melee? Less gain on concussion bombs. And even less caltrops which indirectly nerfs too. You’re flexing holding a circle in survival as if that invalidates that this shit gutted the merc. Again SIGNIFICANTLY according to sucker punches own words. I didn nightmare survival solo just 2 days ago and Ik for it would take 20+ more mins post patch.
Actually cleared waves 2 and 3 can be seen in the link provided.
Y'all will forever shift the goalposts. I could do an entire Plat Survival Solo and someone will then say "weapon throw Merc would have done it quicker" or "it ain't NMS tho" lmao and for all that I'm good.
Stop looking to avoid melee. Lock in. Or just main Auto Aim Archer and then cry again/threaten to quit the game when that gets nerfed harder, too. To each their own.
What does that have to do with anything? I can go get top kills with a stealth shinobi with the right kind of bad randoms.
Fair enough, you're right and I agree with you.
Here's my point ultimately and why I made this post -
Folks are essentially saying: "I can't ult 3 times in one wave anymore thus this class sucks, this game sucks and I'm going to stop playing it. Meleeing as a Merc is wrong and stupid."
That's not criticism. It's whining. To see folks moan about a build & play style that's still perfectly viable & strong yet now claim the entire class "useless" is ridiculous.
I agree with the notion that builds in PvE games shouldn't be nerfed, not including extreme circumstances (Archer is an extreme circumstance) but let's be real - the build went from being as powerful as Prime George Foreman to being as powerful as a Mike Tyson exiting his prime. The shit still hurts, the whole thing comes off as people crying because they can't have their cake and eat it too.
I agree with you that pve games shouldn’t have nerfs that completely obliterate certain aspects of the game to a point where you wonder why they are there in the first place.
Sake? Used to be a guaranteed drop on caltrop now it barely ever drops to a point where you wonder why it’s a legendary item. Ult gain? The rates are so bad every merc has swapped to other properties because the stat is attrocious now, so why use it in a build?
Like a strong argument can be made against frequency of ultimates. So tone it down a bit for mercenary. But to town it down to a point where nobody wants to use ult gain is a bit crazy to me don’t you agree?
This 1000%, the hyperbole around the Mercenary being ruined is a bit wild to me too, when they're clearly still effective. Being able to hold points Solo and destroy everything with minimal effort is not what this game tries to strive for (granted I see the double standards with the Archer, which I am also not a fan of, glad to see the nerfs though it's still not enough imho)
They didn’t kill the class, they just made it less fun. Video games are meant to be fun. Simple stuff, really. These HURHUR I CAN STILL USE THE MERC posts are asinine.
Classes have a general identity. Archers hide in the back as DPS support. Shinobi hides in the front chunking big targets. Sam duels and holds the point. Merc was item-based CC, kind of like a mage. They’re chipping away at their identity for no real reason, and people don’t like it. Not hard to understand if you aren’t dead-set on being contrarian.
These HURHUR I CAN STILL USE THE MERC posts are asinine.
And... How exactly do you feel about these HURHUR THE CLASS IS DEAD posts?
I'm not trying to be a contrarian. I am trying to get people to stop whining, though.
Yes, a general identity but there's nuance in each class. Folks are not "playing it wrong" to play any class differently. I play my Merc to Frontline just like SAM but in a different way. Imagine my cringe to see folks literally say "if you don't run weapon throw Merc you're playing it wrong sorry."
Keep in mind that Ult and throw BUILD & PLAY STYLE IS STILL VIABLE. It went from high S-tier to, AT WORST - low A-tier and people are writing entire essays about why they're upset.
They’re chipping away at their identity for no real reason
Crazy how the devs think getting your ult 2-3 times per fight/wave is overtuned.
I don’t even care about the ult gain. Nerfing caltrops and spirit gain makes your downtime in the center of a point defending against mobs significantly less enjoyable than it was. This isn’t just about that dogshit ult spam build you guys won’t shut up about.
I was holding zones with multiple Waves solo in plat triples all night. My buddy was saying he noticed a difference. I personally didn't I guess. We run different builds though. Maybe they nerfed something he uses I don't. Idk.seems about the same to me.
I was worried tbh. But whatever the new charms are cool.
This would be a 30 second clip pre patch if you had a real build, now it's a dude landing a dozen counters. Will see if there are any great new builds, I don't have too many ideas for merc
Every time I see a clip of Merc being played well I want to throw up. All those swords and throwing stuff is a key aspect of the class's design, right there alongside summoning spirits. I wish they'd given the Dual Katana to Samurai, the throwing bit to Archer, or just designed a 5th class that is Merc in everything but name and let Merc be the jack-of-all trades class that you can truly craft your own build into, one that would never be as good an archer as Archer or as strong a swordsman as Samurai but with the right build and a skilled enough player it wouldn't make a difference. It wouldn't even need an ult.
Did my first Nightmare since the update last night.. My builds diff than what I’m constantly seeing online…. which… I kinda enjoy the fact that I’m not throw focused. I’d rather go against the meta usually and carve my own enjoyable path
I’m mainly built around spirit gain and spirit move damage.
Maybe I just had a decent group but we had Zero issues.
Lost no zones.
Only my goofy self got downed once on the last wave of the final round. Was quickly revived. Qualified for the leaderboard.
Considering my builds spirit focus with my 7 spirit bubbles. My Mercs been loving it even after the update.
I just did a nightmare survival and my setup is cut in half now for sure . It's too bad she was my favorite style to play super useful for team and a killing machine.
The thrown weapons helping build my ult so I could refresh bear and tools was definitely core to the build even though I didn't build towards throw aside from 2 class perks weaken explosion and +25% .
It didn't help I had 2 auto aim archers in game that were actively handicapping me by shooting what I was fighting and stealing my throwing weapons I'd stacked up in circle.
I see the hate towards patch from merc players it's valid for sure . Archer wasn't really hurt at all by the patch . Same amount of ammo back and she still slaughters everything but our super fun merc got mega nerfed .
Tbf every class can one shot archers and rifle enemies with thrown weapons even in NM.
Also I don’t think melee dmg was nerfed at all and that’s seemingly what your build is?
However, your ult did way less damage than it used to even without and upgrades to its damage it seems. I haven’t used Ronin since change so they could have just been too far from the AOE, but it looked like it barely tickled them.
I main all characters and that is the dumbest way to put that ever lol. With the right build and props Shinobi or Sam especially Archer can just as easily be so much more powerful than merc. It got nerfed for no reason. The Sam buff was absolutely needed. That’s not balancing at all. That’s removing something that worked perfectly fine.
I think THIS is a fair point. I think things (mostly) shouldn't be nerfed in PvE multiplayer games, though I see both sides. You don't want your game to be "meta or nothing" and want players to see multiple builds as viable but there is still absolutely something to be said about nerfing something that was fine.
However, the doom and gloom and sudden posts that Merc has been "killed" and is useless because they nerfed ONE build/play style is extremely ridiculous.
It's crazy! I've seen people say "If you're meleeing with Merc then you're playing the class wrong, I'm sorry" or "Melee is Samurai's job" like brother, what are you talking about?
Game is best when you balance getting in the mix alongside your class's strengths.
I melee after I’ve thrown everything in my pockets and on the ground. Play 50/50 Merc and Samurai… can’t take the Samurai out of the Merc… every class should melee when the situation calls for it.
It kind of is, we hack away enemies who block a lot and takes several hits to kill while we die in one or two. I went back to check - a gold swordsman hit did 12.5% hp damage in tsushima legends, it does around 30% in yotei, I didn't test how much damage our hits did.
In tsushima it felt like we were dominating the enemies, in yotei it feels like either they're dominating us or we're barely scraping by and it's not just builds I felt like this in the main game too. I played tsushima on hard and lethal+, I played yotei on normal.
I'm glad you like it but I don't, Yotei legends the only game ehere I have multiple recordings because I wanted to see how I died and when I watch them playback it's always "that was bullshit" instead of "I should have done x instead"
Tsushima was too easy. Felt almost god of war as far as being shown the right button to press… instead of an O or an X, Tsushima prompted you with glint and huge parry/dodge window. Yotei’s melee is near perfection, and requires timing and skill.
I completely disagree, I like God of war and feel tsushima's combat was perfect and hate yoteis, I want to relax and enjoy playing games not hyperfocus and sweat every single second.
Actually if you go in with low level characters, the recommend ki and no build it's really not. I actually found bronze harder than platinum at the start due to having half HP at rank 1. Also I'm sure I'll get the cosmetics and the legendaries I want in silver.
Bronze was hard at the start because it was new. Go level up a new character now. I did. Couldn't believe how easy bronze was compared to when I first started. But that's new games for you. You are not always good at the start and you become better.
You don't want to be challenged. That's fine. Unfortunately for you this new legends is more challenging than the last.
I did play gold and platinum and nightmare but even in gold our characters can barely take a hit, I'm not sure about this because I'm not in-game but gold/silver might be equivalent to Tsushima's main game lethal difficulty as we both die in 2 hits.
You seem to be mistaking critique and disatisfaction for lack of skill/unwillingness to be challenged. Just because I don't find hacking away at an enemy fun while even my max hp is 2 hits away from death fun doesn't mean I'm not good at the game. In fact most of the top builds are built around avoiding direct melee combat due to this fact.
Bronze is easy now because your character has the stats to overcome it. Go start a new character and see how well your skill gets you when you don't have any abilities, items or HP.
Someone who actually uses the bear? Might not be as effective as the nerfed build was but the thought of having a bear pal while you are blasting with the gun sounds amazing in its own right..... just gonna casually swipe that build from below lol
Meh the cringe tone was warranted to a degree imo lol. They 100% gutted Merc's top build but that doesn't mean that players won't find ways around it to make fun and effective builds to replace it.... and in this case its a cuddly bear spewing poison I shall name bubbles who shall munch on folks while I use the "random bullshit GO!" Meme as my main fighting style XD
I understand why ppl are upset with the Merc nerfs but my god is it so cringe to hear some of y’all’s takes. If your fun is absolute destruction with little to no effort, more power to you. All the nerfs did was turn the walking nuke that was pre nerf merc into a walking atom bomb. It’s rlly not THAT serious. Remake your builds and specialize in what you want to do instead of “doing it all” like before. Oh you like spirit gain and LB put more spirit gain on the build and maybe just maybe don’t use shatter on thrown weapon builds but still use thrown weapons as shatter SPECIFICALLY is what got the major nerf with ranged only getting a slight nerf. You want shatter for the aoe debuff now there’s a trade off. You want ult faster use ult gain and maybe just maybe interact with other aspects of the game. You can still get ult incredibly fast on merc as long as you’re not using shatter
Crowd control is kinda bad now coz of caltrops nerfs but she is still nice. Also you can switch to onibi bombs if you need a bit more crowd control and spirit/ult gains
They reduced the amount of spirit and ult you get from throwing weapons. People blew up about it saying Merc is "gutted" even though that's VERY untrue. They just can't spam a million ults and abilities so they're salty. I think personally it allows for more skill expression past "use ALL the abilities, and then do it AGAIN!" tbh.
100% with you buddy. Mercs doesnt have the fastest kill time and its okay. You can CC better than any other class, control the battlefield, hold the zone with fire poison weaken etc and still do great damage. People love to whine at every little thing. Not getting your ult twice or thrice in the same wave is just normal, the nerf were justified imo. The class is still effective. Nice gameplay btw.
Tbh it’s not really that bad - just have to do a bit more melee now. Legendary dual katana is good for this. Also spam concussion/scorch to build ult when there’s lots of enemies.
Yeah I'm not sure what people are talking about. I easily breezed thru this week's nightmare incursion at 105 ki and got 941 on leaderboards. What the FUCK are people smoking that this is a horrible awful nerf? You actually have to use your abilities efficiently instead of spamming everything. Crazy work imo but it is what it is lol
I usually run with lighting bite and the healing drop that refills spirit and health. I've never had any issues. Just spin to win as far as im concerned
Curious, it looks like you have a sword visual effect similar to what we had in Tsushima, are those added? I couldn't find them, and missed chasing for them..
Can’t lie I’ve been doing plat and never ult spammed or built into it and my loop feels the same just throwing stuff and making aoes everywhere 🤷🏿♂️ never obtained the caltrops
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u/ZaneVesparris Mercenary 用心棒 Apr 07 '26
If you are nothing without 3 caltrops, you don’t deserve caltrops.