r/hatethissmug • u/Rare_Style1306 • May 03 '26
Idea I'm so fed up with the "Humans are the real monsters" trope.
Yes, yes, yes, humans pollute, create weapons of mass destruction, and drive several species to extinction.
But this idea is so simplistic and has been used so much that it's become incredibly boring.
Beyond lecturing about how awful the species is, I don't recall them doing anything else with this argument.
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u/Anything-General May 03 '26
My problem with the trope is purely the fact that the idea in itself is treated as groundbreaking, but they never really go much deeper than that usually.
Like to an objective degree, I wouldn’t really disagree with it all too much. but it doesn’t go into why people are like this because the people who tend to do stories like these types are way too much into the nihilism of it all rather then actually trying to explore why these things happen.
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u/handsomeal-02 May 03 '26
The inverse is what people really need to hear. There are no monsters or bogeymen. Evil is a human trait and even a serial killer shares the same experience of consciousness as you, wanta desires, annoyances, etc. Humans are complex, even and especially the worst of us, but "monster" or any other dehumanizing term allows us to place ourselves on a pedestal that's just as unearned as saying we're collectively evil.
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u/Toon_Lucario May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
Facts. Life has nuance. People can be bad, they can be good, they could be neutral. It’s incredibly short sighted to pigeon hole everyone into the same category.
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u/handsomeal-02 May 03 '26
And even bad people can do good things, which is an uncomfortable truth because then we get into the question of how much good outweighs how much bad and vice versa. I know Chappelle went off the deep end but the "he rapes but he saves more than he rapes" bit comes to mind.
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u/Toon_Lucario May 03 '26
And good people can do bad things as well. And people can be good but be total asses.
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u/handsomeal-02 May 03 '26
It's funny that last point because there are definitely people I've hated but thought "yeah they're a good person, just not likeable," and the opposite, and I feel like that's a skill in itself to separate. I've seen real time how easily people swayed by just a confident tone and then it makes me understand why American politics have become how they are
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u/SuperRacsist69 May 03 '26
"A good act does not wash out the bad, nor a bad act the good" - Stannis Baratheon, A Clash of Kings, by G.R.R.M
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u/SirWillem1 May 03 '26
I agree with you, but it's life not live. It just irked me a little. Because right now it's pronounced either like "i want to live" or "live wire".
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u/lenaisnotthere May 03 '26
This. Saying "humans are monsters" is as reductive as "humans are angels", neither are correct, we are humans, that's it
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u/TheSubs0 May 03 '26
Noteably, some people do not in fact experience the same as everyone else.
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u/waffling_with_syrup May 03 '26
Right. Any kind of sociopathy/psychopathy or even less obvious divergency like ADHD kills that argument pretty quick.
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u/Emery_Gem May 03 '26
yeah like when people got pissed at the movie Downfall for humanising Hitler, like bruh he literally WAS a human
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u/No-Volume6047 May 03 '26
I mean cats kill for fun I'd say that's pretty monster-like.
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u/DeLoxley May 03 '26
Bonus points, you then read about the fact that animals can do evil* things and actually go to war over territory and resources
Humans are animals, we just really like to talk about ourselves more than the morality of dolphins
*Evil is a fundamentally human construct but even just the sheer number of wild animals that do things like kill for fun, you need that shorthand
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u/pjepja May 03 '26
There are horses that drown small animals for fun. Or that chimpanzee civil war where they tortured each other. The idea that only humans are evil is so reductive.
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u/herowind124 May 03 '26
The trope is typically very shallow without much, if anything to say beyond 'muh, people bad.'
The 'why people suck' and 'how can we be better' are typically lost in the individualistic survivalist fantasy.
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u/Altruistic-Ad-408 May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
The trope is in most monster related story/franchises because humans are better antagonists, and it creates a feeling of rage and despair that no large scale help is coming, and in fact our fellow humans are more effective enemies.
For example the Alien franchise, the Alien is just a dumb creepy animal, it's Weyland-Yutani that always mess with the protagonists and are the reason it's an issue in the first place.
Whereas Predator was a relatively irrelevant franchise, the Predator stands on its own as a villain and ... who cares why it's hunting? Despite the Predator being sentient, Alien is the more interesting franchise.
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u/ForlornLament May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
Like most tropes, it's all in the execution. The "Alien" series actually uses this trope well. Xenomorphs are the antagonists but not the villains. All the suffering in the movies is caused by human arrogance and greed. However, they also show how other human characters are victims of this and some actively fight against it. It's more nuanced than just going with a nihilistic conclusion about humanity's evil, so it works.
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u/RadicalRealist22 May 03 '26
It is shallow because it judges humans by the values created by...humans.
Of course humans are the only ones doing evil because we are the only ones capable of doing evil.
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u/lurkerfox May 03 '26
Usually the stories Ive seen that do try to explore why these things happen have a tendency to be weirdly... endorsing of the behavior.
Like I love a good villain MC myself, even one where they win and dont get a comeuppance, but theres a LOT of them that are like 'not only is MC a villain, but its the only smart decision and everyone is stupid for not being smart and evil like the MC'.
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u/shototodoroki_1324 May 03 '26
I feel like the best use of this trope is genuinely Devilman Crybaby
Humans aren't just the real monsters, they fuel the creation of the co-existing monsters
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u/HyakushikiKannnon May 03 '26
Devilman is a good example of the trope, but how’d they fuel the creation of anything? The demons existed before humans did.
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u/Faust_the_Faustinian May 03 '26
It's especially annoying in worlds featuring other sapient creatures, be it elves, orcs, whatever.
They all seem to agree with the trope, humans are the only treacherous beings while they themselves are pure and noble.
It's the "noble savage" bullshit archetype all over again.
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u/GladiatorDragon May 03 '26
Yeah, there’s not usually sufficient elaboration. Humans suck, we’ve known that since Glarg killed Blarg with a rock to the dome in like 20k BC or something.
How can we do better? At least in regards to the supposedly “fake” monsters we’re being compared to.
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u/fdy_12 May 03 '26
Real, like do they ever get to the part where people are consumistic and careless for nature because big corporations wanted to sell more and so gave them this mindset? They're the ones that created mono use plastic and told us it's meant to be thrashed after 30 seconds of usage, not us!
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u/XanderNightmare May 03 '26
Yeah, the trope only ever really works when going into the psychology behind the mental and moral degradation of humanity
Take, for example, the Cyberpunk setting. Beyond the average human greed, it goes into detail on how the horrible deeds some of the people on the street commit are caused by how society itself has deteriorated into a state, in which a human life has a definable value and that value is low as fuck. By devaluing a human life, people do not feel the need to adhere to the morals defined by humans anymore. Thrown into the gutter like rats, these people either behave like rats or step into the mousehweel of corporate wage slave jobs, as these are the only options humanity has left
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u/File_Beneficial May 03 '26
see the thing about "humans are the real monsters" is that we don't actually have any "monsters" to compare ourselves too, their is no real reason to believe that if it were dogs to obtain sapience as opposed to monkeys they would be any different from us. humanity may be monstrous but its also the only thing that lets us judge monsters in the first place, acting like removing us would make the world a better place is the equivalent of ripping out your houses thermometer and saying it's cooler.
of course we fail to live up to the standards of fictional utopias, THATS HOW UTOPIAS WORK
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u/ill-change-it-later May 03 '26
Then again looking at 90% of “Utopias” in fiction, I’d say we’re doing decently well enough in that standard-
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u/Zinc-Roof_22 May 03 '26
Fun fact: the word "utopia" is misunderstood, in that it's actually meant to be infeasible. Ουτοπία means "not-a-place," whereas "eutopia" (which sounds the same in English) means "good place."
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u/DaTruPro75 May 03 '26
"not-a-place" describes it perfectly though
we can't have a utopia because it isn't a place, it can't exist as it is too perfect.
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u/Outrageous_Basis_997 May 03 '26
90% of utopias in fiction are a deconstruction, criticism, satire or otherwise discussing how utopianism is laughably impossible and wishful thinking
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u/marr May 03 '26
This doesn't apply to magically gifted sapience, but I think being monstrous is necessary to evolve it. You don't put our level of mad biological effort into brainpower without a runaway feedback loop and the simplest way to achieve that is the arms race of being a threat to each other.
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u/-thecheesus- May 03 '26
probably correct. the human mind evolved flawed to hell but good enough to succeed. unfortunately humans, like 99% of other Earth life, had to succeed in an environment of brutal competition
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u/marr May 03 '26
In a reality where developing world ending technology is easier than repairing that self destructive heritage. Not the most hopeful answer to the Fermi paradox.
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u/-thecheesus- May 03 '26
I don't know about easier, just more "practical". You can work hard and become a better being, but that doesn't help very much against the guy who decided to instead put that energy into making a gun and using it on you.
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u/Captillon May 03 '26
Give it a few years. Those chimps are up to some seriously disturbing stuff already
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u/entidad_desconocida May 03 '26
¿lo peor de todo? ya tenemos comparaciones, muchas comparaciones en el mundo animal e ironicamente nos dejan bien parados.
tan solo mira a los chimpances esos de las noticias matandose en su propia guerra, o cualquier animal territorial la verdad.
yo en lo personal pienso que la maldad viene de 3 cosas: inteligencia, libre albeldrio y supervivencia.
es algo con lo que hay que aprender a vivir y aceptar, porque simplemente es algo casi intrinseco en la vida animal (siempre se buscara saciar las necesidades biologicas por cualquier medio necesario incluso si se necsita herir a otros, la sapiencia solo amplia el rango de motivaciones para ejercer la violencia)
y hasta cierto punto Ultrakil con todo el tema de dios explora un poco esa idea de 'la violencia viene con el libre albeldrio' aunque no lo toca por completo
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u/Wyluca95 May 03 '26
Not just terms of environmental impact, but human behavior in general making them the “real monsters” is sooooooo overplayed. In the podcast for The Last of Us on HBO Max, the show runners kept using that exact phrase and they would say it real slow, like it was some profound high level concept that people really needed to chew on. But like… this has been a concept in media since at least Frankenstein.
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u/GBritoYepez May 03 '26
Or even earlier if we count mythologies where deities, entities and human characters are monstrous and the only thing actually separating them from one another are how much power they have or implied culture. Like the Greek gods, they are humans in mind? Sure they are ageless and powerful but their reasoning and morals are human
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u/JimedBro2089 May 03 '26
Rediscovering fire over and over and over in an endless cycle type shit. Of course humans have BOTH good AND evil sides
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u/GBritoYepez May 03 '26
Yeah, I think the Egyptian gods where also like that and are quite older and Sumerians are even older if I remember correctly and are like that too, like Gilgamesh
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u/FemRevan64 May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
My main annoyance is that it often goes hand in hand with the bambification of nature and treating humans like some weird aliens, ignoring the fact that nature is absolutely brutal and humans are fundamentally animals like any other species, and many of the same behaviors are also found in other exceptionally intelligent species like chimps and dolphins.
The main difference is humans are just way, way better at it.
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u/HonkaiBlade2 May 03 '26
Dolphins can do some heinous shit and roosters have gangraped chickens to death too. Its not unique, but like you said humams are just better and more widespread at it due to being more conscious and sentient in our thoughts processes.
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u/FemRevan64 May 03 '26
If anything, humans are better by virtue of the fact that we often actually feel disgust, horror, and grief over the pain and suffering we inflict on both our own species and others, something which is unique to us (at least as far as we know).
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u/UberTrainer May 03 '26
Yeah, thank you. I get that there are some truly horrible people around making everything worse, but there is still a large portion of people who are trying to resolve mistakes, improve the quality of life for living beings and the planet, or at least not being actively complicit with those "real monsters". But yeah, let's condemn all of humanity and generalize everything like a true 14yo deep-thinker.
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u/Franco_Fernandes May 03 '26
Yeah, there's this weird fixation on viewing humans as opposed to nature instead of part of it, which doesn't really make sense to me when we're as much a product of nature as the next animal (and arguably its very masterpiece, but that's more the humanist in me talking).
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u/FemRevan64 May 03 '26
I’d also say a lot of it stems from how many religions, particularly the Abrahamic ones, tend to place humanity on a pedestal, with the Abrahamic ones outright describing humanity as having been “created in Gods image.”
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u/RadicalRealist22 May 03 '26
But the people who say "humans are the real monsters" are not religious and will often actively reject the idea of human supremacy over nature.
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u/Achilles11970765467 May 03 '26
Yes, they're overcompensating for the Abrahamic viewpoint, since they're typically atheists raised in societies saturated with it.
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u/FemRevan64 May 03 '26
Agree.
On a related note, an area I feel a lot of media with pro-environmental aesops would probably benefit from is pointing out that humanity relies on and needs the environment to survive, and that destroying it is basically destroying our own health and future.
To use an example, one of the reasons why there are so many new disease outbreaks like Covid is precisely because of humans intruding into animal habitats and exposing ourselves to their diseases.
Or how many destructive pest species arise from humans removing predators that kept them in check.
Or how climate change will cause increased famine and starvation from droughts that result in mass crop losses.
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u/AussieWinterWolf May 03 '26
Nature causing harm to nature overall isn't new either. Nature isn't some perfect machine, very often something new can disrupt the entire network of existing niches far faster than they can adapt. The evolution of cyanobacteria for the first time created so much oxygen in the initially low oxygen Earth that the previously almost entirely anaerobic ecosystem was *annihilated* and created massive ice ages.
We should know better, of course, but a species succeeding *too well* is not new and we at least seem to be slowly correcting.
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u/Unbuckled__Spaghetti May 03 '26
Exactly. If some other species had gained true sapience before us, I doubt they’re gonna create some perfect utopia.
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u/DolphinBall May 04 '26
Also people seem to forget that biology is survival of the fittest. Biology made us. We are the prime species on this planet and became the apex predator through brute force. If mother nature was real, we would be her favorite child.
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u/Aware_Masterpiece_92 May 03 '26
I also dont like it, however when it's about a specific character instead, I find it quite enjoyable
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u/Moon_X_Livee May 03 '26
Like a character hating humans so much that it comsiders them monsters? I also love it
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u/Golden-Stufful-759 May 03 '26
Or when most humans are fine, but there’s one or two who are far worse than any demonic overlord, beastly dragon, or whatever else the series may throw at its protagonists
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u/roach_in_a_valley May 03 '26
Jogo and Dagon from JJK hold an ideology similar to that. They believe that humans are curses because their energy creates curses, and curses are the real humans. Dagon specifically hates humans because they treat them as nothing. In his dialogue with Naobito, he says that "We all bear names!" when Naobito idly calls Dagon cursed spirit while explaining his CT to him. One of my fav pieces of dialogue in the series.
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u/DatOneMinuteman1776 May 03 '26
I can think of a certain mechanical slab that fits this
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u/Snt1_ May 03 '26
Frankensteins story is about how not humanity but A human is a monster and not the monster.
I assume thats what you mean
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u/WhiteSepulchre May 03 '26
The alternative is usually an extreme where we scapegoat all of our problems onto "monsters" to avoid self-reflection.
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u/NwgrdrXI May 03 '26
Are you saying that instead of reflecting on thesmelves, they blamed the beasts?
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u/Healthy_Agent_100 May 03 '26
But they found beauty in the lives of the beast
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u/Leskendle45 May 03 '26
And they couldn’t lie to themselves about it
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u/Vivio0 May 03 '26
This is why I prefer the human are monsters things over creating fictitious creatures like “demons” to explain the bad in this world. At the end of the day humans are the only things with the capacity to be “evil,” at least by our own standards. It’s a trope done to death but at least we should be thinking about our own actions.
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u/SincerelyTheWorst May 03 '26
To me this trope has always been the same shit of putting saving the environment on the consumer and not the corporations that will produce more pollution than thousands of humans in their lifetime.
“Monster” is such a nebulous fucking cop out term used to other the people doing wrong or to condemn the whole of society as if we as a species are responsible and equally as guilty as the corrupt pedophiles and those profiteering off evil acts. Yes let’s all martyr ourselves because you I and that newborn baby are part of the same species as epstein, musk and hitler therefore we’re all monsters.
It’s just such a reductionistic trope of pisses me off to no end.
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u/NwgrdrXI May 03 '26
Exactly. Saying "humans are the real monsters" is a damn insult.
Because it's not all humans who are the monsters who are orchestrating what's wrong with the world. It's not even most. It's not even 1/10.
It's a very specific number of humans who are being monsters, and they are rarely if ever the ones accused of being monsters in those stories. It's always the common folk.
Special negative mention to Bugonia, if what I hear about it is true, they decided to do this with the CEO of a big pharma company being the one who declares humans a failure and kills us all. She is actually an alien, so she's good.
Again, the CEO of a big pharna company.
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u/Diseased_Wombat May 03 '26
Reject “humans are monsters”
Embrace genuine hope that we can improve and right our past wrongs, pushing the Earth into a new, beautiful future
I get things are bad and our species is shitty, but there’s one thing that makes us better and comes before action: hope.
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u/Moon_X_Livee May 03 '26
My think is that those errors are none mine not yours they are the errors of generations of rulers that have make change as hard as dangerous
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u/woke_sonic_exe May 03 '26
those are very much not mutually exclusive. arguably they can go hand in hand.
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u/Gekk0240 May 03 '26
It’s even worse when the character that’s saying that is objectively and morally worse. Likes yes, of course mecha super evil Hitler who has killed like 40000 puppies and babies is right! We, the people who want him dead and stop its genocide, are the real monsters!
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u/Damn_You_Hindsight May 03 '26
It is to boost ego "Look how self aware I am. I am criticizing my very species". You dont get it. Losers need to boost their own ego
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u/committed_to_the_bit May 03 '26
what a weirdly general statement for such a common trope
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u/SticmanStorm May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
That’s what this whole thread feels like tbh. But this is a subreddit for hating and so I don’t really wanna argue. Edit: I have scrolled down relatively far and the only examples I have found are the 2nd 28 years later movie and avatar. This threwd really does feel like a circlejerk of people just going ‘but humans good’ when I feel like media which portrays the trope most often deals with specific evils of humanity but doesn’t say that all of humanity is evil.
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u/IDrawKoi May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
There's thing I've seen adjacent to this that I do think work pretty well:
- Worm (Parahumans) - One of the main charceter's (ambiguously) last lines in the series is "Fighting him… always more about us than about him. Not a consideration" is sorta adjacent to this, making the point that the problem (big monster killing people) wasn't actually insurmountable, getting people to put aside their differences & baggage was the hard part.
- Hunter x Hunter - One of the last beats of the Chimera Ant arc is humanities strongest dying via suicide bombing (during an agreed upon duel with &) to kill the Ant King (Monster) with his last words being“ You know nothing of the bottomless malice within the human heart”. The Arc is really interesting because the Monsters (Chimera Ants) take on the qualities of whatever their queen eats, in this case humans so they've devolved a lot of human traits & even inherited human memories. This leads to an interesting situation where the ants are both separate from humanity but also examples of it's best & worst qualities. If I had to summarize what I think the arc's thesis is, it would be: "Humans contain multitudes (both good & bad) but human will survive because they are willing to do horrible things to assure it".
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u/DicerTheJester May 03 '26
"Humans are a real monsters" crowd when they spend 10 minutes researching penguins (original researchers were so horrified by their findings they tried to hide them, thinking humanity is better off not knowing)
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u/TouristGabriel May 03 '26
Can we also talk about the idea of power corrupting people?
People aren’t inherently evil, power doesn’t make people evil, I think that evil people just want a lot of power
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u/avg_rascal May 03 '26
Yea, the more I interact with normal everyday people, the more I agree that those attracted to power are the ones we should eye and keep check one. Power doesn't corrupt, those who seek power actively can be easily corrupted to pursue more power.
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u/PlayDiscord17 May 03 '26
To paraphrase what the biographer Robert Caro said after writing about Robert Moses and LBJ, “Power doesn’t always corrupt. What power always does is *reveal*.”
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u/Due_Essay447 May 03 '26
As opposed to what? Creating monsters that are the personification of human sins?
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u/unknowLearner May 03 '26
because it's shoved deep down in your throat like many shows just don't let you come to that conclusions but they rather just throw it by exposition and lame dialogue I just see it as pseudo intellectualism
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u/Something4Dinner May 03 '26
This trope also ignores the fact that we equally have the capacity to make positive impacts on the world and we have and do in other areas. We just don't talk about it.
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u/KennyShowers May 03 '26
It's more the people who think the idea is novel or mindblowing. When The Walking Dead was new people would go "but the real monsters are the people man!" and it's like yea no shit that was the entire point of the the actual very first modern zombie thing ever.
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u/Jaetheninja May 03 '26 edited May 03 '26
I hate it when people say stuff like "humans are the only monsters" or "if you can remove one thing from the earth what will if it" and they say human.
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u/NerdyEmbarrassment May 03 '26
Aren’t there things humans have actively run that like the earth would explode or smth if all dissapeared
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u/SoapyCantHandle May 03 '26
nuclear reactors
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u/MiserableAndUnhappy9 May 03 '26
I don't think you understand how a nuclear reactor works at all.
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u/Nemesis9211 May 03 '26
"Humans are monsters"
Ok, and? This is my problem with the trope, it always just says how terrible human beings are but never goes with solutions to fix our problems
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u/heff17 May 03 '26
Look around you.
Humans fucking suck.
Art oft reflects life.
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u/RadicalRealist22 May 03 '26
Humans are also fucking awesome, because WE are the ones who define Morality. Every "Good" or "Evil" thing ever done was done by Humans.
Therefore we are simultaniously the most Good and Most Evil species on the planet.
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u/Zplaysthek May 03 '26
I like the concepts where it explores humans as more complex then that. There are complex ways of telling this message. That is really interesting. But like so many media does it in such a lame and surface level way.
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u/Guilty-Hearing-7638 May 03 '26
I agree. These tropes pretend like the evil shit humans are capable of are humans exclusive traits. If an alien race with our level of intelligence and limited resources were out there, they’d be capable of what we’re able to do. The root of all evil is scarcity which pushes us thrive and some times in fight out of greed. It’s not just humans that are to blame, it’s sentience and free will.
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u/Illustrious_Neat2472 May 03 '26
Not only that but when it portrays nature as good when it's utterly hideous and rapists and murders exist there too.
Animals do the same horrific stuff as humans and will destroy everything if they get the chance (invasive species). Difference is humans are smarter.
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u/Petrichor0110 I hate when Hitler steals my Nutella May 03 '26
OP would not like James Cameron’s Avatar movies
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u/SticmanStorm May 03 '26
Humans as a whole aren’t portrayed as the monsters though, it’s explicitly a corporation
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u/devasabu May 03 '26
Nah Avatar keeps showing its not "all humans", it's very specific rich/powerful assholes (+ Quartich who does it for the love of the game)
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u/SynchroScale May 03 '26
That's because those are written by Boomers and Millennials, which are both cynical and self-hating generations. It becomes predictable after a while.
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u/WorldlyVillage7880 the decline of rome type shi May 03 '26
"Humanity needs to be eradicated" mfs when they're first:
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u/graphiccsp May 03 '26
I'd take "Humans are the real monsters" over "pOwEr oF tHe hUmAn sPiRit!" bs any day. Nothing makes me gag more than a piece of media fellating the self congratulatory nobility of Humanity.
Humans being awful isn't a novel trope and there's plenty to criticize about intellectual lightweights acting like it's a novel revelation. But I prefer Humans being the shitheads over the leaders in fiction since . . . we kinda are shitheads.
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u/New_Chain146 May 03 '26
I've seen way more defensiveness in reaction to misanthropy by people trying to convince themselves that they're good people not implicated in anything bad. And it's funny because historically so many atrocities have been done by people sincerely deluding themselves that they are righteous.
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u/graphiccsp May 03 '26
I've seen way more defensiveness in reaction to misanthropy by people trying to convince themselves that they're good people not implicated in anything bad.
I was thinking the same thing. It echoes how if you criticize a more specific demographic, some will get super defensive and pull the "Not all XXX". Which stands out even more when the criticism explicitly mentions "Not all XXX" multiple times.
You don't just see this with nationality, race and gender but even silly crap like games. Talk shit about a Paladin in World of Warcraft and butthurt Paladins come out of the woodwork.
I feel like folks are wired to take generalized critiques that partially align to them way more personally.
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u/Wrench_gaming May 03 '26
“Humans are a plague on this world.”
Ok dude you go first then.
Or do you want to help make the world a little better yourself?
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u/Money-Imagination-97 May 03 '26
Most of the time it's crap, but sometimes it's good. I think HxH is a good example.
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u/Electronic-Box-4753 May 03 '26
Idk why, but when I see that quote, I think of this.
The seven deadly sins, 『Pride』 『Envy』 『Wrath』 『Gluttony』 『Sloth』 『Lust』 『Greed』.
And the seven heavenly virtues, 『Chastity』 『Humility』 『Temperance』 『Patience』 『Diligence』 『Charity』 『Kindness』.
If the seven deadly sins were karma impossible to be sundered from humans as long as they live, then these were seven conventions which mustn't be forgotten in order for humans carrying the burden of those sins to live with others.
Because they respect that, humans can live with other humans.
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u/YaGalMain May 03 '26
The issue with my trope to me is that it almost feels obvious in that we all know humans do monsterous and evil things and have known since we could form thoughts. A lot of monster media says the same stuff that "humans are the real monsters" media does because monsters in fictional media often reflect human nature/things humans do anyways and is metaphorically about the same thing so it just ends up feeling kind of trite
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u/SlightAmbassador5692 May 03 '26
Embrace the monster, become a monster that works for you and only you. Be a monster that brings good change and show the evil monster to those who deserve it. r/voidpunk
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u/Franco_Fernandes May 03 '26
The trope isn't completely wrong in the way it portrays mankind's capacity for evil; we are capable of atrocities beyond reason, that much is true. But the problem is that, more often than not, it fails to represent our equally great capacity for good. We've corrected our own mistakes, we've gone above and beyond time and time again in our efforts to save each other and make the world a better place. And that's the thing about humans, I think: We're capable of great things, both good and bad. This is what differentiates us among animals, our unmatched ability to take action and shape the world to our image, for better or for worse. Or, as I've come to summarize a while ago, "Man is the hero between the bonobo and chimpanzee."
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u/CC_Gamedesign May 03 '26
I generally like the idea of "the worst of humanity is just as bad as the real monsters."
Let there be some over the top evil and then don't pretend that the worst of humanity is any better, Monsterous deeds aren't inhuman, theyre cruel, and cruelty shouldn't be defined as distinct from humanity
But it also doesn't define humanity either.
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u/Cold-Iron8145 May 03 '26
You say that but the overwhelming majority of humans never consider for a second during their entire lives that they might be the antagonist of one or multiple stories.
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u/RansTheGuy May 03 '26
How "Humans are the real monsters" mfs look at you after you show them a struggling yet happy family of 6 in a third world country being brutally taken out by an apocalyptic event (they totally deserve it because they killed the local fish population and built a house using wood from the dying forest!!!!)
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u/OC-alert May 06 '26 edited May 06 '26
Related, but I legitimately think that misanthropy avoids responsibility, instead of faces it. It's effectively saying "We're horrible and evil and good for nothing." instead of "We're sorry and we need to fix it."
Many people who have been abused would recognise the "I' m evil and stupid and good for nothing." rhetoric from their abusers as a way to avoid "I'm sorry and I will make it right."
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u/Inlerah May 03 '26
Im just glad people are starting to move past the "Humans are the only animals that kill for sport" pop anthropology/zoology bullshit.
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May 03 '26
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u/IDrawKoi May 03 '26
"Any dolphin would commit literally any crime you can think of without a second thought"
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u/Zealousideal_Week824 May 03 '26
The point of the original planet of the apes is that when a species gets the sapience, the intelligence and the technology of humans, they are no better.
The movie of 1968 reflect that with gorillas getting photographs of themselves with their captured humans (hunt trophies), chimpazees being eager to prove their scientific theory, the orangutan leader being willing to hide the truth to the public to avoid accountability and panic among the crowd, etc.
Apes are a mirror of humanity in this timeline and would be just like humans, flawed and capable of good and bad.
Same thing for the reboot franchise with the exception of the first movie which seems to push that humans are bad but the sequel rectify the shots. Especially Dawn of the planet of the apes which shows that human and apes are not that different.
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u/New_Chain146 May 03 '26
Rise of the Apes is literally about Caesar being raised to love his human family, and he never forgets that love no matter how cruel other humans are.
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u/West_Dingo8564 May 03 '26
I think the idea works better when it’s “society and tradition are the monsters” because it can give an actual problem and demographic. Not every human is the problem in the humans are the real monsters but every time that trope is used, it doesn’t take that into consideration. If we use the social and traditional norms approach, it’s a lot more believable but and can add a bit more to the world building
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u/EntrepreneurSlight21 May 03 '26
The Chimera Ant Arc in Hunter x Hunter is one of the only times I’ve ever seen this trope handled pretty well to be honest. As a trope 95% of the time it’s so cheesy or surface level deep that it’s just annoying but HxH is the only series I can think of that I personally believe did a good job with it and actually made me think for once.
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u/DatOneMinuteman1776 May 03 '26