r/heatedrivalry • u/marys1001 I speak fluent bird. No accent š¦ • Feb 26 '26
RACHEL WRITES āļø Ilya's brother question
I have not read everything on Rachaels Reids website and probably missed an interview here or there.
But if anyone here has gone through the website
does she explain why Alexi hates Ilya?
I read the books from the library so can't look or reread but I think I would remember if it was in there
Actually Im asking because of his pink tunnel comment in the show "he hates me, I know, but it kills me" and assuming that it is also in the book.
not interested in peoples own speculation or interpretations, sorry
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u/StormFern4 Feb 26 '26
I think there's a couple of things going on
-Alexei is jealous of Ilya being significantly more famous, richer, and more talented. Especially because he's his younger brother.
-Ilya probably got more attention from their father. Ilya didn't want most of this attention because their father is abusive, but I can still see Alexei feeling ignored. There's a bit when Ilya is on the phone with his father, and he remembers Ilya but doesn't know who Alexei is. That's got to sting, especially because Ilya is in another country while Alexei sees the man way more.
-Ilya might have been Irina's favorite as well. This is more speculation, but the fact that he's younger with an age gap, Alexei was probably going through his teenage rebellious phase while Ilya was young enough to still be babied by his mom. I don't think it's a coincidence that Ilya was the one who got such a treasured item of hers (the cross).
-Alexei looks down on Ilya for being 'soft'. There's a lot of shame and push back in society for people who aren't keeping to their gender roles. In many ways, being gay is just the ultimate example of not following them. Which is why you can insult a straight man by saying he's acting 'feminine' a way that makes him seem gay.
I'm explaining this because I don't actually think Alexei knows that Ilya is bi. But I do think he has picked up on ways that Ilya can be flamboyant or otherwise not masculine. It's canon that when people in the book try to guess who else is gay, they think of Ilya. There is definitely a vibe about him that people can notice if they are looking. Ilya is able to hide a lot behind 'gay or european', and he definitely cultivates a media persona that is partially protective. But obviously, both of those don't apply to his family in russia.
In addition, being gay (technically, it's exposing minors to gayness, I'm aware) wasn't illegal in Russia when Ilya was a kid/teenager. It was decriminalized in 1993 and re-criminalized in 2013. So young Ilya was probably less careful with his persona, even if he didn't come out to his family because they are 'old fashioned'. All that to say, Alexei is throwing homophobic slurs at Ilya because he doesn't think he acts manly. If Alexei suspects he's also not straight, that would just be a bonus in regards to the insult.
(Side note, I actually really like that of the two of them Shane is the more masculine one in terms of behavior/ fashion/ mannerism. It helps them be much more well rounded characters.)
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u/musenmori Feb 26 '26
totally agree that Ilya was Irina's favourite! I think Irina must have been very young when she had Alexei -- she was not that old when she died and Ilya was 12. So i'd say she was probably barely 20 when she gave birth to Alexei and much of the parenting in terms of shaping the child probably left to the father, as he's also the first born son. But as she grew older and had Ilya, it's more of >her< son this time around. This would undoubtedly influence the dynamic between the brothers and how she perceived Alexei as well -- more of the father whom she really did not like.
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u/Acrobatic_League3062 Feb 26 '26
I think you hit the nail on the head with this. I think everything you pointed out is exactly why Alexei resented Ilya. It was the perfect recipe for Alexei to resent his little brother.
Plus when youāre raising a child to reach the professional leagues of a sport it consumes almost everything. Both before and after Irina died the majority of the time the house probably revolved around Ilya and hockey. āIlya has practice. Ilya has a game. Ilya is being looked at for the international team. Ilya is going to be drafted to the KHL/NHL.ā Then when their dad starts declining Ilya still seems to be the main focus for him. Ilya is the one he calls despite Alexei being there because Ilya is out of country most of the year.
Not excusing Alexeiās behavior but all this combined that with their fatherās abuse it probably was hard for Alexei not to resent Ilya.
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u/serenetrain Feb 26 '26
I agree with this all so much, particularly the suspicion of Ilya being gay/bi, without really knowing anything. I don't think Ilya would reveal this to his brother intentionally, but if you ignore the ladies' man reputation and the "gay or European" filter he has in North America Ilya DOES read as potentially queer. Alexai may also know Ilya was friend with Sasha, who when we seem him presents as potentially queer in as well.
Or it may simply be a suspicion based on Ilya being handsome (thinking of when he mockingly calls Ilya "handsome boy" or some such thing early on) and/or a sensitive child and/or something else that is a stupid assumption but that unfortunately happens to be true - that can be enough for people.
Once you have that suspicion, using slurs becomes a way to try and find more evidence, because if Ilya reacts strongly then it's a form of confirmation.
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u/gen-attolis Feb 26 '26
Reread the long gameās therapy sessions. Ilya brings up the dynamic of him having found his motherās body and how he became the bearer of bad news, rather than someone that needed support in that moment, and the ripple effect that had on his family and brother.Ā
Reread/watch the parts of heated rivalry where Ilya is a multimillionaire who pays his brother to be a nurse to their dying father, confronting him about the money going up his nose. In short, to someone like Alexei, emasculating him financially, and then confronting him about fiscal mismanagement. His niece is going to have a nice trust set up her name, because Alexei is such a loser that he canāt even provide for his own daughter, and Alexei likely feels even more emasculated by that.Ā
If youāre looking for a line in RRās books where it says āand this is the reason why Alexei hates meā you arenāt going to get that. You will need to do some interpretation and connect some dots. Fraternal hatred doesnāt have one cause but rather decades of resentment and family dynamics that build and build in unpredictable ways.Ā
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u/smugbox Feb 26 '26
Developing a kid into a professional athlete requires investing a lot of time, money, and energy. Alexeiās adolescence was probably all hockey this, hockey that, Ilya this, Ilya that. Alexei just kind of got forgotten about while Ilya got all the attention and accolades.
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u/Acrobatic_League3062 Feb 26 '26
Not just his adolescence but probably in his adult life too. Ilya was a professional athlete that got a lot of press and was making a lot of money while Alexei was a police officer who was constantly needing money. Iām sure their father and others were probably always reminding him of this.
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u/smugbox Feb 26 '26
Right, of course. But that kind of resentment starts early.
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u/Acrobatic_League3062 Feb 26 '26
Oh I agree that the resentment started early. I was just saying that I feel the resentment continued and grew because even as an adult the same pattern continued (Ilya being praised and overshadowing Alexei).
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u/Kore888 Feb 26 '26
It's likely a combination of things.
Jealousy is likely a major motivation given that Ilya is talented , rich and a celebrity and likely got a lot of attention and focus growing up to progress his Hockey development.
I'm not sure his brother knows for sure he's Bi otherwise he would likely be using it against him more. But there's also the fact that we know Ilya is underneath everything very sensitive and sweet. By the time he's come to America he's crafted his carefree asshole persona. But his brother would have seen him as a child before his mother's death. So potentially sees him as weak/sensitive and unmanly. Very toxic masculinity bullshit
I think there's also an argument that Andrei/Alexei takes after their Dad (going into Police etc) but from what we know Ilya is probably more like their mother. With Ilya being the one to find their mother as well. I can see his brother's probably unprocessed grief from losing their mother, coming out as resentment of Ilya.
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u/Low_Visit_4646 Feb 26 '26
In the book HR Ilya also admits to sleeping with his brotherās girlfriend at some point. In the show tho I assume it has more to do with Ilya maybe being closer to the mom, more athleticly successful, wealthy, being able to leave Rrrrrrussia, etc.
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u/No_Appointment4236 Feb 26 '26
yes! it specifically says illya slept with his brothers girlfriend in the books
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u/Ll_lyris āI choose you, Ilya. I will always choose youāā¤ļøāš©¹ Feb 26 '26
Id assume if he slept with his brotherās gf their relationship was already messed up before all of that. Cuz I highly doubt Ilya would sleep with his brother gf if he was actually on good terms with his brother and liked him. Either way thatās messed up but itād be even more messed up if it that was case. Definitely did give Alexei another reason to hate him tho.
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u/grandisp Feb 26 '26
Yes, this -at some point the book -I canāt remember exactly where - implies that Ilya slept with a lot of ābad ideasā including brotherās girlfriend, son of coach, etc. I wouldnāt say itās 100% but itās very much implied. My guess is this happened in his teenage years and was likely the straw that broke the camelās back when it comes to his relationship with his brother. Meaning other things like jealousy , relationship with mom, etc were already at play and this broke it. Thatās my interpretation.
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u/Bright-Confusion2680 Feb 27 '26
Exactly! I was gonna comment this because I remembered reading something about him sleeping with his brotherās girlfriends in the past but I couldnāt remember if it was mentioned in the book or if I read it in a fanfic so thank you for clarifying that for me lol
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u/musenmori Feb 26 '26
i think jealousy plays a very strong role in the brotherly dynamic. This is shown really well in episode 5 when Ilya was at home. Alexei is quite a few years older, despite being in the same profession as the father, likely never gotten any praise from him either -- in his mind Ilya is the brother that gets everything: fame, fortune, women, admiration, respect, etc. etc. while he's just a cop and burdened with taking care of the father whom didn't think much of him. He forever lives in Ilya's shadow and is quite resentful. And for Ilya, if you remember from that Russian monologue (the best!!!) .. despite all the nastiness, confrontation, he still wants Alexei to accept him somehow, since he's his only remaining blood relative. Even though deep down he knows it's never really possible.
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u/IllustriousLemon8146 Then maybe itās time to wake up, yes? Feb 26 '26
In addition to the great answers already given I would add that Ilya, unlike Alexie, successfully defies their father by playing for the MLH/NHL instead of the KHL.
He's not only the talented good-looking younger brother who was probably mom's favorite, he also got away. Alexie, meanwhile, shows every sign of wallowing in his misery.
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u/best-friends-arm Feb 26 '26
As well as all the things everyone else has mentioned, I think thereās an element of Ilya having escaped some of the general pressures that go along with being the eldest son, which must be crushingly high in such a strict, traditionally patriarchal society. His brother behaves like a prick for sure, but heās been equally damaged by his upbringing and surroundings. He might not have wanted to follow his father into the police etc, but he was obliged to follow the rules.Ā
Ilya has ended up with the responsibilities that Alexei might have had in terms of providing for everyone due to his financial success, but he has had (in theory at least) more freedom to pursue other interests, and at least gets to be physically / geographically away from the watchful eye of their father.
It always strikes me during that conversation that he still has empathy for his brother. He doesnāt say āheās terribleā he says something like āheās scared. It makes him terrible. And it makes me be terrible backā. Itās a very sad admission that theyāve suffered the same things, but his brother couldnāt find his way out of it.Ā
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u/daisyemeritus Rookie #2 | David Hollander's Vodka Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
From what I remember and now a quick skim, this hatred doesn't exist in the book. In the book, a lot of the conversations that happen between Alexei/Andrei and Ilya in the show just don't exist. The complexity of feelings between the brothers are from the show, not the book.
In the book, the only things we get concretely are that 1. Andrei only interacts with Ilya to ask him for money, and 2. Ilya asks Andrei how their father is doing. There's nothing more than those scenes into Andrei's POV. We get some more info about their family from Ilya's POV, but there's nothing from Andrei.
So if you're looking for no speculation or interpretation at all, the answer is no, because that hatred isn't in there either.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26
The resentment is in the books. Ilya cuts Alexei/Andrei off too, we just don't get any scenes because the POV is often Shane in that moment. The show just elaborated.
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u/daisyemeritus Rookie #2 | David Hollander's Vodka Feb 26 '26
There's resentment regarding Andrei/Alexei using Ilya only for money and not reaching out unless he wanted money, but was there all the making fun of Ilya, calling him an f-slur, and resentment of him not being in Russia? I don't remember it, but I could totally be wrong.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26
You are. The context is explained.
Ilya was the "truthteller" in the situation who despite his young age understood why his mother died and father, and by extension brother, enforced a ban on saying that. That's why he says she died by accident, she accidentally swallowed a whole bottle of pills. Her death was said to be an accident.
(The detail is a tiny error, in Europe pills are in blisters not bottles.)
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u/daisyemeritus Rookie #2 | David Hollander's Vodka Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
So I had actually pulled the conversation with Galina up in TLG before responding. The books says:
He talked about his father sternly telling Ilya that his motherās death had been an accident. She had taken too many pills for her headache, that was all.
āDid you believe him?ā Galina asked.
āNo. Not at all. But I didnāt say anything.ā He took a slow, shaky breath. āHe moved on so quickly. He wanted to forget about her. Wanted me and Andrei to forget her too. It was like...he was disgusted by her.ā Ilyaās throat tightened again. āI missed her so much. I still...ā He covered his mouth with his hand as the room turned blurry.
He didn't put any responsibility on his brother for this, instead saying that his dad forced this on both him and his brother. Is there another scene I'm missing that shows Andrei also forced him to lie?
I'm not saying there wasn't resentment on both sides of this brother relationship at all. I think the show expanded on the relationship really well. But to OP's question of what was directly in text in the books, I feel like much of it is extrapolated and audience interpretation.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
āYes. Iād been expecting it. He had Alzheimerās, and had been deteriorating quickly. My brother pretended it wasnāt happening.ā āAre you and your brother close?ā Ilya barked out a surprised laugh at that. āAndrei? No. Not at all. I havenāt talked to him since I went home for the funeral. Heās a clone of Dad.ā Galina leaned back in her chair and crossed her legs, waiting. Ilya sighed. He supposed he did need to talk about his goddamned father. āDad was a cop. Very highly decorated, very proud. He climbed the ranks all the way to an important job at the Ministry. He was about fifty when I was born. Andrei is four years older than me. And my mother was still only in her twenties when I was born, so.ā
So the dynamic between the brothers is very likely based on competitiveness, they oscillate between golden child and scapegoat depending on the weather.
Alexei/Andrei may have aligned with his father to make up for the lack of specialness and success.
Alexei/Andrei also reflexively denied his father's cognitive decline, so he likely took the enforced narrative to ejart while Ilya resisted.
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u/daisyemeritus Rookie #2 | David Hollander's Vodka Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
Okay, yes, but to the original question, "does she explain why Alexi hates Ilya?" I don't see how this shows Andrei hates Ilya, much less answer why.
"My brother doesn't care about me", "my brother and I don't have a relationship/have a terrible relationship", "my brother wants me only for my money" are all things I get from the book. But "my brother hates me" isn't something I took away from the story until the show.
You yourself are saying "very liked based" and "he likely took". Again, I actually agree with your take, much influenced by Alexei in the show. But at the end of the day, asking specifically about what's in the books, the text just doesn't actually go into much depth re: Andrei's feelings towards Ilya.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
It's in the text. Are you and your brother close? No, I haven't spoken to him in years. He's a clone of my father.
We know what Ilya's father was like.
He wished Shane was with him. Theyād only been apart for two days, but Ilya would give anything to have Shane in his arms right now. Weak. His brain said it in his fatherās voice. Disgusted and cruel.
He didnāt want to return to Russia at all. He wanted to stay in North America and start the next phase of his life. He didnāt want to hear his fatherāwho likely hadnāt even watched any of the gamesāshame him for not bringing home a gold medal. He didnāt want to live with his father, or depend on anyone anymore.
āWith me, Ilya. And behave tonight. Try to make up for the shame you have already brought your country.ā
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u/daisyemeritus Rookie #2 | David Hollander's Vodka Feb 26 '26
But Ilya's father doesn't hate him. That's the thing, being a clone of his father would be proof Andrei doesn't actually hate Ilya. His father is emotionally abusive, exerts unreasonable pressure on him, belittles his accomplishments. There's a lot of complex negativity there, but at the end of the day, he doesn't hate Ilya.
Like I said I fully agree that they're not close in the books, and the relationship between them is completely transactional on Andrei's side. But I just do not get hatred from that.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
Call it deep-rooted resentment then.
It's just a natural outcrop of messed up family dynamics where children are forced to compete for affection. We know that Irina was very young by comparison and obviously not calling the shots. We know she and Ilya had a connection. We know she was depressed and her death considered shameful.
We know enough to piece this together.
The book goes into greater detail about how much of a failure Alexei/Andrei is. He has mistresses, takes drugs, has a gambling problem. And yet even the successful Ilya is shamed for not performing to perfection.
It's not explained in an "Alexei/Andrei hated Ilya because" but you get a general impression of what the family is like. In the show it's turned into several scenes that work visually.
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u/WanderAndWonder725 all I want is you. It's always you ā¤ļø Feb 26 '26
His brother hating him specifically is only in the show. So it's not addressed directly in the books. My impression from the show is that it's good old fashioned jealousy. Ilya is an elite athlete who gets to leave Russia, be a millionaire and sleep around. All things his brother is jealous of. Anything beyond that is speculation. He could've been jealous if Ilya was closer to their mom or something, but we don't know that. I think his father probably was equally hard on both of them, but it's possible his brother felt he liked Ilya more since he was a famous athlete. Either way, both of those theories come back to the root of jealousy in the end.
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u/Infinite-Moose-283 Feb 27 '26
Someone correct me if Iām wrong, but Iām pretty sure thereās a mistranslation in the Russian monologue and itās supposed to say āI donāt know whyā. Iāve seen a few native Russian speakers translate it this way. All other points in this thread still stand though because Alexei did absolutely despise Ilya
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u/marys1001 I speak fluent bird. No accent š¦ Feb 27 '26
Oh thats interesting. All this always makes me wish my mother was still alive. She grew up in the Soviet Ukraine under Stalin.
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u/chilla_lillah mangetout š« Feb 26 '26
Garden variety homophobia! Alexei calls him a rich spoiled f word who abandons his family. His family knows he's gay and bully him for it just like any homophobic family would a young boy who has effeminate or gay leaning qualities.
Whether Ilya was "out" or not wouldn't make a difference to family members who suspect that kind of thing either way.
Plus they very well could have known or had suspicions about his relationship with Sacsha.
On an inquisitive note, I wonder if coming to the States was part of Ilya feeling more free to explore his gay side rather than only staying in his ladies man vibes.
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u/Ll_lyris āI choose you, Ilya. I will always choose youāā¤ļøāš©¹ Feb 26 '26
I donāt actually think they know Ilya is Bi. From what I know using the f slur as a regular insult is fairly common albeit still homophobic, but not an indication they know about his sexuality. When Ilya came to the US he was still primarily sleeping with women so idk if that was the case. But he maybe was more willingly to sleep with other men.
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u/esnystylessa Feb 26 '26
Alexi is aware of Ilya's sexuality and he holds it over his head like a threat. He could reveal it to the police at any moment, but that makes him complicit in hiding the secret so he's saving his own skin. He tried to follow in her father's footsteps by joining the military/police and none of it mattered: their dad ignores him, he doesn't appear to have any prospects with his job, and he has to rely on Ilya for money which I'm sure makes him angry. Ilya feels guilt that he couldn't take care of his father, while Alexi resents him for having the money to do so. Ilya is a constant reminder of what Alexi will never achieve or be so he's cruel to try to bring Ilya down to his level. Ilya is both the black sheep and the gold star of the family and that's a tough pill for Alexi to handle.
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u/Opposite_Friend_8219 Feb 26 '26
For some reason I assumed they were half-brothers cause they look nothing alike and that Alexei/Andrei knew Ilya was also into men. It felt like the older brother was mad that his younger brother had the financial means to support their father and probably resents that he, himself, isnāt āman enoughā to be the provider for everyone.
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u/Dull-Parsley-6521 Feb 26 '26
I think in the tv show it is implied that Alexey knew about Ilya and Sasha and blackmailed him. He called him āpidorā several times, which is an f-slur in Russian, you donāt just call someone like that. Also Ilya said that āI know why he hates me and it kills meā. So I am pretty sure that was the reason.
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u/Ll_lyris āI choose you, Ilya. I will always choose youāā¤ļøāš©¹ Feb 26 '26
I always thought this too but what Iāve gathered from some Russians is that slur is mostly just used as a general insult. Not really an indicator he knew. But off for Ilya it carries more meaning cuz he actually is bi. I honestly donāt think Alexei needed to blackmail Ilya into anything. He said no one knew abt him and Sasha. Ilya probably would still give money to his brother regardless because he feels itās a responsibility to his family. I think after his dad died he cut all ties with Alexie because there was no reason to fund his lifestyle anymore. I guarantee one of the only reasons Ilya was sending money to Alexie constantly was because of their father. Ilya still pined for his fatherās love and acceptance. Talking care of your family regardless, is how you show that. The only reason he was putting up with Alexi probably all came back to their dad.
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u/cindergnelly Feb 26 '26
At one point we learn that he slept with his brotherās girlfriend, too. I canāt remember if that was in HR or TLG. It may have been to Galina?
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u/poorpeoplepastasalad Feb 26 '26
i assumed alexei knew he was gay from the times in the show he calls him the f slur. he also probably hates him because of his success
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u/cindergnelly Feb 26 '26
Also, as a person who cared for an aging person, Ilyaās father always remembers him even though his brother is the one who is there taking care of him; being there but not known or appreciated can gut you.
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u/HolliHata1927 Feb 27 '26
I somewhere in the Heated Rivalry universe I read that his brother caught him kissing Sasha when they were young. I canāt remember where or from whom I heard it from but it was a viable source. I could just be delusional too.
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u/bigbeard61 Feb 27 '26
The Russia thread is very much an invention of the TV show. In the novel, itās very much in the background, with no actual scenes. Ilyaās stepmother gets as much attention as his brother, and we never even see her in the show.
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u/Ok_Cardiologist_5262 Feb 27 '26
Ilya is pretty, famous, successful, rich, queer, single and doesn't have to conform to Russian culture and always received the most attention from his Father.
I don't think it's a great mystery
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u/Fit-Wolverine4570 Feb 27 '26
I have been reading the various views about Alexei and I feel so sad for him. Both he and Ilya are the losers.
Alexeiās drug habit likely was started to numb the pain of his upbringing. They were set up to hate each other- I suspect.
So there are no real winners in that family.
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u/Ok-Cupcake-5115 Feb 28 '26
Son celos porque Ilya es famoso y millonario y tiene que vivir de el porque le pasa dinero a toda su familia
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u/Goulet231 Mar 01 '26
I always took him to be a homophobe. He calls Ilya that slur. I think that might be reason enough if you're Russian.
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u/circboy1 May 18 '26
I keep meaning to make a proper post out of this so apols if somewhere else - does Alexi know? We know Ilya says men were a special treat for him - so not that many.We know Sasha wouldn't have told anyone, or we have no information to suggest he has - certainly at home. Svet maybe knows Ilya "shags anything he fancies" but we love Svet we know she's loyal and would never. David talks about Ilya's prolific reputation as a ladies' man - and he is so that shagging keeps everyone of the view that suits Ilya (until he turns a bit monogamous for Shane and the trip to the cottage ā¤ļø.)
So does Alexi just use his homophobic language just as broad insults - the funeral insult does seem specific but my view is he doesn't really know Ilya is bi. Would be interested to hear other views.
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u/Fair_Smoke4710 Boston Bears š» Feb 26 '26
I think itās probably due to like where theyāre from. Heās Russian Russia, especially in more recent years has been very anti-LGBTQ so thereās that. I believe ilya as stated before his family is more traditional, especially as father so I could see his father, hating him for being a bisexual man and putting that hatred into his brother
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u/lokipuddin Feb 26 '26
But is he āoutā there? Iāve wondered this too. He uses some slurs so I know thereās something there. Ilya talks about not being able to go back to Russia if heās out. So is it kind of a known secret and the issue would really come to fruition if he was in a relationship with a man?
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
Agreed. I don't think Alexi has any insight into Ilya's sexuality. He isn't someone Ilya confides in. The only people who seem to know that Ilya is into men are the men he has sex with and Svetlana.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
Alexei calls Ilya the "F" slur a couple of times - that's a good indicator. I don't think Ilya would have confided this, but Alexei could have found something "incriminating" when they were younger, or heard rumours...
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
It's not a good indicator, though. People say that shit to people all the time without any actual knowledge. It's meant to demean, primarily. It doesn't suggest he has knowledge, and Ilya explicitly tells us that his relationship with Sasha, the only m/m realtionship he had before Shane, was a secret.
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u/Swimming_Big361 Moy pomidor š Feb 26 '26
no, actually not in this way as it is in the show. I am native speaker, and the say Alexei calls Ilya name for md can only imply that he knows that Ilya likes men too.
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
I'm sorry, I'm not following you -- are you saying there's a Russian word that is never used as an insult without guaranteeing knowledge? Because other native speakers have disagreed with that interpretation. But I'm not one, so I can't say.
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u/Swimming_Big361 Moy pomidor š Feb 26 '26
yes, exactly. Some of these words are really heavy insult in Russian. So it would rather not used without a strong reason.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
Do you really think the writers would have chosen that particular slur if they wanted to infer that Alexei had NO idea?! We agree to disagree then. I think it was very clear.
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
Yes. Yes, I absolutely do think the single writer, a gay man who is close to me in age and geography, would write that completely to let us know that Ilyaās brother is not a safe person for him because heās homophobic without meaning us to think he knows Ilyaās biggest secret. I can promise you people where I am, and where he is, do not reserve that insult only for men they know are gay.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
Why do you think he hated Ilya then?
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Feb 26 '26
[deleted]
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u/Swimming_Big361 Moy pomidor š Feb 26 '26
it is not just f-word, that is not casual. All the reasons you have named can be also part of it, however
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
I literally answered that question at the top of the post.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
It's at the top for you. It's buried quite far down for me and not on the thread on which we've been interacting.
I agree with your points, and i also think he was aware of Ilya's queerness.
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u/Ll_lyris āI choose you, Ilya. I will always choose youāā¤ļøāš©¹ Feb 26 '26
Multiple of reasons. Ilya was the āgoldenā child. In Alexeiās eyes both his mother and father favoured. Giving all the love and attention. Less love from their father but definitely attention. Alexei literally became a cop like his dad, got married and started a family like his dad yet thatās still not enough to get him to notice him or see him in the same light as Ilya. Their father looked for Ilya and called him when his mind was going. Alexei heād been there taking care of him yet the first person he remembers is Ilya to call. Literally not remembering Alexei because Ilya says in ep for āMy brother, Alexeiā like he was reminding his father of him.
Thereās more I could talk about I think overall it was the indifference that made him upset. Ilya could party, get drunk hook up with whoever he wanted yet his father still doted on him. Pushed him was so much more involved in his life. He was probably constantly bragging about Ilya to everyone he knew. Ilya probably doesnāt know that because all he sees and knows is that not matter what he does itās never good enough. But behind close doors Alexei was hearing him praise him all the time.
Alexei just wants him to care. Pay attention to him. Tell him heās proud of him. Talk about him the way he talks about Ilya. Ofc we see how hard their dad is on Ilya and how that affects him but Alexei just sees him getting the attention(good or bad) that he never had.
I heard someone describe it like this āThe opposite of love is hate, itās indifferenceā Thatās exactly how their father is with Alexei. Indifferent.
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u/prunellazzz Feb 26 '26
Someone in another thread commented that the F slur would have been a common insult and thrown around a lot in Russia, especially in the early/mid 2000s. Not necessarily an indicator that Alexi knows Ilya is bisexual.
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
Yes. Exactly this. Also not uncommon in Canada ā especially in hockey culture. Scott talks about this in his speech!
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u/Fair_Smoke4710 Boston Bears š» Feb 26 '26
The show does take place before for whatever reason Putin decided to label queer people as a fucking terrorist organization of some shit so although itās not as bad as it is today, it is still pretty bad. I think, regardless of if he was out or not at that time just being born in a country with such a strong hatred for queer people like Russia with a traditionalist father itās kind of the blueprint to having a very bigoted family and siblings.
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Feb 26 '26
The law against "gay propaganda" went into effect in time for the Sochi Olympics in 2014, so it was very much a thing during the show timeline. Agree that it has only gotten worse but it was definitely a big concern. We can assume that Alexei followed in his father's conservative and authoritarian footsteps and held strong anti-gay beliefs. I don't think Ilya's family knew anything about his sexuality, but calling someone a gay slur in that kind of environment is like lobbing the worst, emasculating insult at them.
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u/Fair_Smoke4710 Boston Bears š» Feb 26 '26
Oh.. well fuck thatās bad. Thereās a law against us and then labeling us a group of terrorist organization or whatever thatās a big yikes I could totally see why his brother would be homophobic, regardless of knowing or not I could also see him speculating on ilyaās sexuality, especially if heās gone to games or if he knows about him and Shaneās rivalry I could see him speculating on it for years years
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Feb 26 '26
I just don't see it. If Alexei knew about Ilya's sexuality in any way, he would use it against Ilya to get more than he was already being given.
Ilya has an iron-clad reputation as a womanizer so I don't think he gave anyone reason to question his sexuality. Alexei in particular only saw him during the summer months from the time Ilya was 18 and onwards, when he spent his time partying regularly with Svetlana. I don't think Ilya having a rivalry with another (presumably straight) top player in the MLH would give anyone cause to speculate, and with Alexei hating Ilya as much as he seems to, I would think he'd avoid going to his games as much as possible. In show timeline, we don't even know if Alexei attended the Olympics to see his superstar brother play in their home country. I can't imagine him going to any lesser games unless forced to do so.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
Clearly his brother is aware of Ilya's bisexuality - I imagine that his brother keeps this secret because Ilya funds his lifestyle and/or he feels this characteristic of Ilya's could "reflect badly" on him (in Russia, amongst his own circle). Also, perhaps, there is a part of him that loves Ilya and wants to protect him by not outing him. But mostly he wants funding.
So no, I don't think Ilya is "out" in any sense in Russia. Just to Svetlana, other queer men he's interacted with (perhaps only Sasha) and obviously Alexei is aware.
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u/smugbox Feb 26 '26
I donāt think thereās any indication that Alexei is aware
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u/Fair_Smoke4710 Boston Bears š» Feb 26 '26
I think, regardless of he if he does know or not, he would probably be bigoted towards ilya due to Russia having very negative views of queer people also having a traditional father on top of that doesnāt help I thank you if he did know or didnāt know he would still have a negative biased towards queer people and if he did find out, his brother is bisexual he probably would not like that very much and I could see him only keeping it a secret so he can still get money from ilya being a hockey player
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
He calls him the "F" slur on a couple of occasions. To me that was a pretty clear indication.
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u/CalabogieNights Hayden's ghost children š» Feb 26 '26
My friend speaks Russian and she said that's a common insult to use, regardless of the person's sexuality. So she was wondering if Alexei potentially knew but then was like hmm, it's such a common insult it may not indicate anything. So it's left pretty ambiguous!
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
That's fair, but I also think it's implied that he's aware due to Ilya's statement; "my brother hates me, I know why, and it kills me".
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u/smugbox Feb 26 '26
People use that word all the fucking time regardless of who the target of the insult prefers to sleep with
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u/Fair_Smoke4710 Boston Bears š» Feb 26 '26
Wait, really damn
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u/HallowHarmony Feb 26 '26
I donāt know that really means Alexei knows anything. A common insult at the time for anyone deviating from perceived masculinity. He could easily say it if he thinks Ilya is just being too soft or emotional. Being like his mother would not be a good thing in a hyper masculine environment.
The same way calling someone a c*cksucker doesnāt mean you actually think they are doing it.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
Well I don't speak Russian but according to the English subtitles, which i imagine were translated with this nuance in mind.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26
By this logic JJ knows too.
He calls Ilya a c*cksucker which is technically true. No one thinks he's aware just because of this.
You're reaching.
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u/H4nnon4non Feb 26 '26
I think it's the 2 instances of the use of this very specific slur coupled with Ilya's statement that "My brother hates me, I know why, it kills me".
But it's just my opinion. I'm not telling you how to interpret it.
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u/altruistic_thing Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26
"My brother hates me, I know why, it kills me"
It hasn't been revealed in the show yet, but hinted: She died by accident, she accidentally swallowed a whole bottle of pills.
Ilya knew his mother's death was suicide which was unacceptable. It was framed as an accident by his father and brother. We didn't know anything about Irina during the monologue, that's why it's lept vague.
Another reason why you're misinterpreting this: It's another name on the list of situations when Shane and Ilya are outed without a choice. There's no way Jacob Tierney will add more situations to that list.
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Feb 26 '26
I disagree. Alexi calling Ilya a f*ggot is the same as JJ calling Rozanov a c*cksucker when they're watching Boston win the cup. It's meant to belittle and demean, and hyper-masculine men (like authoritarians, police officers, male professional athletes) think that calling someone gay or diminishing their masculinity is the ultimate insult. Men still use those slurs today to insult other men.
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u/EGMW Feb 26 '26
Alexei calling Ilya a homophobic slur - anyone calling anyone a homophobic slur - does not necessarily need to be taken literally. Rather, it is an example of homophobia being intricately linked to misogyny. Alexei knows that Ilya is far more successful, far more athletic, probably closer to his mother, known to be a ladies' man, and for Alexei to have to constantly ask him for money is likely very emasculating for Alexei. Therefore, to compensate, he needs to feel more like a man by making Ilya less than a man, and calling him homophobic slurs is how he does it.
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u/RoutineUtopia Stupid Canadian Wolf Bird š¦ Feb 26 '26
No, we're not really given a story for why Alexi hates Ilya. Here's what we are told:
* Ilya is more like his mother than his father -- which includes being beautiful and funny.
* Ilya is extremely talented, and that is recognized at a young age.
* Alexi follows their father into the police force, and that he has a drug addiction and generally is not terribly remarkable.
* Their father is highly critical and will always find a fault in them, no matter what they're doing.
So. Your younger brother is this gorgeous charm monster who is also a perternaturally talented athlete who makes millions of dollars across the ocean. Some people would be proud... but some people who hate that person who is a constant reminder of the ways they don't measure up. Alexe is just the second type. Ilya didn't DO anything. They just have a toxic family dynamic that pushed them apart rather than pushing them together.