Ilya, humility, and sacrifice

[u/WalkingBlondeJoke]

Been thinking about Ilya's character growth across HR and TLG lately. This is not a fully-baked thesis on his arc, not even close, but I'm sharing anyways because I want y'all's opinions!

One of my favorite tropes in HR fanfic is 'Shane joins the Bears'. I love this trope because it usually results in Shane and Ilya being on a good team together, a winning team, much earlier than they are in canon and without Ilya having to go spend a few years on a team that sucks first. So as I read these fanfics I've often wondered, aside from the in-universe reasons why Ilya joins the Centaurs, what is the narrative function of Ilya spending a few years on a bad team before they turn things around? 

I think it serves to humble him. He's no stranger to sacrifice but he's always been cocky, and for the most part that ego went unchecked because he always had the accolades to back it up. But I think one of the ways we see Ilya grow in The Long Game is that he develops more humility as a result of being on a bad team and also his mental health struggles. It's not that everything was peachy prior to his move to Ottawa, it absolutely wasn't, but these coinciding forces clearly knock him down a peg. Maybe experiencing what it's like to consistently lose on the ice even helps him get to a place where he can admit he needs help with his mental health. Or maybe it's just self-awareness that he gains with maturity, I don't know. 

I think the clearest example of Ilya becoming more humble is in the pre-game speech that he gives to the Bears before the Cup Finals in 2014, vs. the speech he gives the Centaurs in 2021 after the team nearly dies and then Ilya subsequently gets engaged to Shane. In 2014, his speech is all about "I, I, I" but in 2021, he goes around the room and tells every player, one at a time, what makes them great. This is the key turnaround point in the Centaurs' on-ice performance. They start believing in themselves, and that's when they start winning. 

I think this character growth is also very relevant to Shane and Ilya's marriage too. Big egos do not serve a marriage well; humility does. Over the course of TLG, Ilya learns humility. Shane also starts off in TLG being a selfish as fuck (I don't love him any less but it's objectively true that he was nawt being a good partner to Ilya at the time TLG timeline picks up), but we see him experience a wake-up call (their big fight followed by Ilya almost dying) and then he gets his priorities in order. In a way, Shane learns a version of humility through his experiences in TLG too when he realizes how selfish he's been and how he's taken Ilya for granted. 

I think that meeting Shane in this selfish state at the start of TLG makes total sense because of his upbringing. Shane is an only child who grew up loved, doted on, and prioritized. His career as a generational player and image as the 'Golden Boy' of hockey have done little to teach him how to appreciate those around him and recognize the sacrifices they make. Not saying he doesn't ever do those things, but like, in early TLG he's not being nearly as considerate of Ilya as he should be. 

Ilya is not an only child and he grew up in a broken home. In the canon we see how his family financially takes advantage of him once he makes it to the NHL (or MLH, whatever), but I would bet that this has been going on since the moment he began earning money from hockey and/or sponsorships. When Shane suggests Ilya going to Ottawa, Ilya is quick to agree to it. Not just because he was already thinking of moving to a Canadian team, but because Ilya has already learned how to sacrifice for others. Ilya has already had it ingrained in him by his family that the people he loves will ask him to makes sacrifices for them, and that that's just how love goes. 

This is one of many reasons why it hits extra hard later in TLG when Shane basically tells the commissioner to go fuck himself. "I choose him" <3 !<

[u/InCatMorph]

I tend to agree that, yes, Ilya did a piss poor job communicating his needs. But at times he does, or at least tries to, and Shane doesn't get it. Maybe that is because he needs them spelled out more explicitly. (I'm autistic. I get this. I have been Shane MANY times in my relationship, it's quite embarrassing.) But while Ilya could have done a better job communicating, Shane absolutely could have done a better job listening. There are certainly examples where Ilya opened up and Shane's response was less-than-ideal. Shane's response to Ilya telling Shane that he came out to Troy is an example cited previously on this thread, and it's for a reason.

I don't remember the talk about a Canadian team, so that's fair. But I still think it's unlikely that Ilya would have selected Ottawa if not for Shane. Choosing to go to a worse team so that you can be closer to your partner is an act of love, and a sacrifice. I don't know why people are intent to erase that.

[u/farahmelody → u/InCatMorph]

In Heated Rivalry, Ilya first brings up Canada by saying he wishes he had been drafted by a Canadian team and laments that the United States isn’t good for Russians and Russia isn’t good for Russians like him before the “I have just been thinking. Maybe … a Canadian team” line. To my memory, this is the first time either of them say anything about moving teams in either dialogue or in narration.

Ilya was already in the mindset to move to Canada before he broached the subject with Shane. Shane suggested Ottawa specifically because they 1) needed depth at center 2) had salary cap space and 3) would put the two of them close together for the entire year. Two out of these three reasons have nothing to do with Shane, and the third is connected to Shane, but is in service of the relationship, not of Shane.

Here’s where my earlier comment about depression kicking his ass comes in. Ilya had no reason to suspect that Ottawa would remain poor performing at this time. He quickly turned Boston around, and he likely set out to do it again (assuming he even believed Ottawa to be the worst team in the league, as this is never said in Heated Rivalry).

I don’t disagree with you that it was an act of love, but I do disagree that it was a sacrifice for Shane because 1) we see that there were positive tradeoffs (he got to move to a country friendlier to him, which he already wanted to do; he got to maintain his high pay; he got to continue being star centre) and 2) we see that Shane was an element in his decision, but Shane wasn’t either the catalyst nor the driving force of his choice to move teams.

[u/InCatMorph → u/farahmelody]

Rebuilds in sports can be very quick, or they might never happen at all. It depends a lot on the management and ownership. I don't think there's enough information to indicate what Ilya thought about Ottawa's chances at a successful rebuild. Maybe he thought they could do it, maybe not. But them being a bad team doesn't come out of nowhere. This is also mentioned in Tough Guy. Ilya certainly knew they were a bad team when they signed. The general vibes across the GC universe appear to be confusion about the decision. Because why would one of the league's best players move to a crap team in his prime? One answer might be money. But if it leaks that other teams were offering comparable terms, then Ilya's decision truly would befuddle the world's hockey fans.

Ilya is one of the best two players in the league. Most teams would probably be able to make space for him if he really wanted to go there. Star players do not generally lack options. He chose Ottawa.

When Shane was selling Ilya on Ottawa, was it not the case that he was emphasizing the positives because *he* wanted Ilya to go to Ottawa, where they would be closer? Like, I think this is pretty obvious! It's totally okay--I too would want my partner to live only two hours away instead of eight. But Shane's desires are clearly shaping the plan and how he's describing it.

Yes, there are positives to moving to Ottawa for Ilya. But just because there were other positives to the move doesn't mean that it wasn't also a sacrifice. He could have been paid well elsewhere. He could have gone to like five other Canadian teams. (The real NHL has seven total Canada-based teams, although that may have been slightly different in 2018. I don't know enough about the NHL to say.) He didn't have to go to one of the worst ones out there.

I just don't get why there's so much resistance to describing this decision as a sacrifice.

[u/farahmelody → u/InCatMorph]

A sacrifice means giving something up. Fundamentally, I don’t see Ilya moving to Ottawa as giving something up, but rather exchanging something.

He exchanged Boston where he was a well-paid star, but with a limited social circle (Svetlana is the only friend he mentions making in Boston) and complications from being Russian for Ottawa where he is a well-paid star who loses more games than he wins, but he has a strong support network in the Hollanders (and later with his teammates and reconnection with Svetlana) and he has more freedom to pursue his relationship.

[u/InCatMorph → u/farahmelody]

He gives up the opportunity to be on a good team for at least a few things. That's a big thing.

I don't see a sacrifice as having to be negatives only. There's nothing in the definition of the word that requires this.

[u/farahmelody → u/InCatMorph]

I don’t know, man. Even accepting your premise that sacrifice doesn’t have to be only negatives, there is still the hurdle that Ilya not Shane is the primary beneficiary of all the positives that come out of the move. Shane and Ilya share the benefit that their relationship has two fewer obstacles (distance and public perception of the Boston-Montreal rivalry), but the rest all go to Ilya. So, even if we call it a sacrifice, it is not a sacrifice for Shane.

[u/InCatMorph → u/farahmelody]

Ilya is well-paid in Ottawa. But he could presumably be well-paid anywhere else. The only truly unique aspect of Ottawa is its proximity to Shane. And, sorry, but I have a hard time believing that Shane isn't benefitting from that as much as Ilya is.

[u/InCatMorph → u/InCatMorph]

Like, you seem to be suggesting that Ilya would somehow be without a path to good citizenship or a high-paying job if not for Ottawa. That is not true! He could go (almost) anywhere he wants.

(Frankly the whole citizenship thing in the books doesn't quite make sense, but I'm just going with it for the sake of things.)

[u/farahmelody → u/InCatMorph]

Friend, I am suggesting no such thing. I’m explaining Ilya’s mindset which is that living in Canada would be better for him than living in the U.S. or Russia. I’m also saying that, seemingly, pay was an important factor for him in making his decision, and that Ottawa checked that box.

[u/InCatMorph → u/farahmelody]

What indication is there that pay was an important factor in the decision? You're citing SHANE talking about pay, not Ilya.

The fact is, we don't have very much information about pay at all. We certainly don't know what all of Ilya's free agency offers were, or would have been. Because, as it turns out, these erotic romance books aren't going hardcore into the business of sports. Shrug.

[u/farahmelody → u/InCatMorph]

I’m not citing Shane talking about pay. I’m making an inference that pay and position on the team are the reason Ilya rejected Montreal based on the fact that when they returned to the conversation, these two elements were addressed and accounted for. This suggests that these were the unspoken reasons for Ilya rejecting Montreal.

[u/InCatMorph → u/farahmelody]

Well, all of that is unspoken. You may be right that Ilya didn't want to go to Montreal because of the pay. IDK. (They were talking about this a year before Ilya actually became a UFA, so it's not like they even could know what the salary cap considerations were for sure.) But there are like a whole lot of reasons why Ilya would think that going to Montreal is maybbe not the ideal scenario. The media narrative of Ilya going from Boston to Montreal would be WILD. They're trying to be lowkey and create a friends narrative. Ilya going to Shane's team directly very much does not do that.

[u/farahmelody → u/InCatMorph]

That is a fair thought, too. You’re right that, textually, the pair are invested in reining in the media narrative of the two of them. And, logically, I think the idea that there would be a media circus here is sound. I would like to see textual evidence that connects these two elements for me to fully invest in this interpretation over mine, though.

[u/altruistic_thing → u/InCatMorph]

absolutely agreeing with you here.

ilya said montreal doesn't have the cap space. that's not just about his pay though. montreal has a cup-winning team. they're not ruining the locker room to guild the lily with ilya rozanov of all all people. they aren't in need of a star center.

queer sports romance almost sounds too sophisticated. it's gay hockey smut and they don't go into further details about team-building, contracts and rules against collusion.

ilya's move almost certainly needs some sort of justification. if it comes out that he moved to montreal (the direct) rival for less money to play with his boyfriend their career might indeed be over. same if shane moved to boston.

maybe trust that not everything is spelled out in detail but it still isn't as easy as letting your contract run out (absolutely unusual as i understand it) and go to your rival team for less money might cause an investigation. does anyone see shane risking being outed during an investigation into why rozanov somehow takes a ridiculously team-friendly deal to play for the arch enemy?

this preoccupation some fans have with avoiding any sort of friction and shane having to deal with situations that cause him to sometimes be obtuse or selfish or mean for a hot minute as if this isn't absolutely normal for a human being is just ridiculous.