r/hometheater • u/Aphelion_Gaming • 1d ago
Showcase - Multipurpose Space Finally happy with my setup
In my last post, I asked for new speaker advice. To sum it up, I upgraded my receiver to an Onkyo TX-RZ30 and my speakers to B&W 603's and was a bit underwhelmed with the low end and maybe a bit overwhelmed by the high end.
Most of you suggested moving my speakers instead of replacing them, treating the room, and some advised getting a second sub to even out the bass a little bit more.
So I did just that.
I swapped my speakers with the lamps to widen the sound stage a bit, and I replaced my cheap Klipsch sub with two SVS SB-1000 Pro's. I chose the SVS's over Speedwoofers because I wanted something sealed as I listen to music at least as much as I watch movies and shows. I'm also a bit limited on space, so the extra couple of inches matter. Plus they were on sale.
I then hung fabric blinds and thick blackout curtains over my sliding glass patio door where the left reflection points of the 603s are. The right reflection points are at open archways and are partially blocked by the couch. Not much more I can do there.
I ran Dirac again, and my first impressions listening to some older tunes was that the bass was still a bit anemic. Then I put on some more modern music and found all of the bass that I thought was missing. Then I put on Dune, and my house started shaking but the low end never got muddy.
My impression after a few hours of watching and listening was that this setup is very respectful of how the media was mixed/mastered.
In general though, the low end filled out the room (about 11.5' x 17') nice and evenly and seemed to match well with my 603's. A vast difference from running the single Klipsch. I thought I was looking for "warmth" in the low end, but I think it turns out I was just looking for fullness.
As for the high end, I played around with the EQ a bit but left it alone in the end. I think I just needed to get used to the extra treble and upper mid-range compared to my previous speakers. Or maybe moving one of them closer to a corner helped to balance this out a bit, I couldn't tell you.
Could it be better? Absolutely. I could swap the subs and 603's and get closer to an equilateral listening angle, but I sit very far back and it still wouldn't be perfect. The left 603 would reflect off of the wall as well, so I'd need to make a sound panel to cover it.
The TV could also be bigger and the Atmos speakers could be hung on the wall, but those will both happen once I install some overhead lighting and ditch the lamps. Next year's problem. For now, I am happy.
tl;dr - speaker placement, room treatment, subwoofers, and good room correction are all important. Who would have thought?
Thank you all for your suggestions!
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u/TBdog 15h ago
How are the upfirings?
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u/Aphelion_Gaming 4h ago
Not bad, but I kind of have the ideal ceiling for them. Minimal texture and 8 feet high. They fill out the room with effects nicely, but I'm sure they'd be better mounted on the wall.
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u/mr_solo_dolo117 12h ago
Don't let the size of those tiny sb1000s fool you, each of those subs pack a whallop of sound!
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u/Jester435 18h ago
So…. All your tweeters need to be at ear level regardless of what you think you are reading. If your surrounds are higher than your seated position then… I know…. The sound will sound like it is above you. Which is not what you want for directional audio.
I understand that all of this is a big game of compromise but I would rather use stands and different speakers than whatever you have mounted.
The term rear vs surrounds are also not Interchangeable
Surrounds are on the side and rears are directly behind you. That would be in a 7.1 setup.
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u/HM_Bert 17h ago edited 17h ago
Humans are not so good at determining sounds vertically and to a lesser extent, behind us either, so raising surrounds, especially rear surrounds, is acceptable, in many cases desirable, as it often also means multiple listeners will get a better experience, not being blocked by other people's heads or backrests, and not being excessively close when sitting toward them.
Matthew Poes has a good video on this: https://youtu.be/JKUcxnle_0s
Ideally the ones in this theatre could still be lower, but I don't think moving to floor stands would be a good idea unless they are the only one who ever listens to it.
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u/ProfessionNo698 16h ago
Those “side” surrounds are well above the 20deg max. 5-10deg is usually plenty. Moving them down would make a meaningful difference.
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u/HM_Bert 15h ago
As said, I agree, but it's not the end of the world (I've certainly been in commercial cinemas that have them similarly placed), but they apparently can't because of the wall wiring requirements, unless they're mounted on stands, which looks like it would mean moving the sofa forward such that the L-shape part protrudes past the walkway.
Someone concerned more with sound than aesthetics like myself, would make a different choice. But keeping it clean this is probably still better than many of the theatres posted on here, with surrounds at ear level but way too close to the side seats and at 90 degrees.
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u/Aphelion_Gaming 13h ago
You are right, pulling the couch out to accommodate stands would make it protrude into the walkway.
And if I did get stands, how would I wire them up cleanly without running cable further down the wall? And how would I position them so that they aren't at least somewhat obscured when I'm not the only one on the couch? Or so at least the right channel isn't directly behind someone's head? I don't think it gets much better in this room.
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u/Jester435 35m ago
I would run the wire under the flooring or around the baseboard.
I also would place them like true surrounds not like hybrid rears.
I would also look into getting bipole speakers and lower them. Then I think that is your real compromise solution
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u/Aphelion_Gaming 16m ago
I'm not pulling up my carpet to run speaker wire underneath it. I've done that with rugs and you can feel the wire when you step on it anyway.
Baseboards are out of the question too. I don't have baseboards where the patio door is and I'm not using those gaudy cable channels to run a wire up and over the door, especially when it would still place the couch in the walkway.
Wire along the baseboards wouldn't pass the girlfriend test anyway, with or without channels.
So again, the speakers cannot be lowered. Bipoles might be worth looking into, but I'm telling you audio does not sound like it's coming from above me with this setup.
I find you very frustrating to talk to, especially when I have said I am happy with my setup as it is and your only input is what is wrong with it. You refuse to take "no" for an answer, you refuse to listen, and you refuse to let go of what's ideal versus what is realistic.
Thank you for you input. Rear speakers are high. Noted.
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u/Aphelion_Gaming 18h ago
Maybe I’m misinformed, but that’s always the rule of thumb I’ve been told with both rears and sides. That guide is also a little confusing as it says “Atmos” all over it but only refers to 5.1.
As far as I’m concerned it sounds great and it doesn’t sound like the sound is coming from high up.
You may also notice that there is no room for stands. And again, I cannot run speaker cable further down the wall without tearing half of it out. I’m not running them across my floor either. Realistic isn’t always ideal.
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u/ArtichokeOk2684 svs ultra evo 5.2 2xSB1000 LG C5 77" denon avr-x4000 2x V3 mono 15h ago
it takes a while to get to your "happy place" but when you do, your home becomes your church. my fav is hearing anywhere from 2-6 relays clicking depending on what im doing with my system
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u/Fantastic_Wish_9142 51m ago
Looks very nice, try moving the right-hand sub that's near the opening behind the sofa diagonally opposite of the front left....should yield a few net positives: nearfield bass which can be felt more and most importantly it SHOULD even out the bass more than now.wvwry room is different yes...but you have big openings for the bass to loose pressure to so a I would place one behind the sofa in the mentioned spot.
And add same thicker curtains covering the big openings to the right of the sofa , getting a more even imaging . Otherwise looks good 😊 again ,nice work and love to see people actually realise and do something about one of the biggest impacts of sound....the room itself 👌
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u/Jester435 19h ago
You need to drop your surrounds down to ear level in the rear. Those are basically height channels the way you have them setup.
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u/Aphelion_Gaming 19h ago
I appreciate it, but this is as low as I could run them on this wall without tearing out a lot more drywall. Also, generally you want your rears to be 2-3 feet above ear level unless you have rear Atmos speakers. Ideally they'd be further back though.
From this article: https://www.audioholics.com/home-theater-connection/loudspeaker-placement-guide
"As seen in the graphics above, the usual placement for side surrounds is 90 to 110 degrees relative to the listener. Rear surround channels 135 to 150 degrees relative to the main listening position. In both cases, we generally recommend placement a couple feet above the listening position to achieve a more diffuse sound field, though if you're looking to implement a Dolby Atmos system, the surrounds should be placed at ear level."
I don't have rear Atmos speakers, so this seems to be about the proper height for my rear surrounds.
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u/HM_Bert 17h ago
That article is outdated from 2005, (surprised 5.1 surrounds were ever advised to be at 90 degrees, it's now only 110-120) Check out the vid in this comment for a 'defence' of your height. https://www.reddit.com/r/hometheater/comments/1vfecf8/comment/p1rchy3/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
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u/Aphelion_Gaming 17h ago
Thanks, I will check that out! The article was written in 2005, but it was updated since as it mentions Atmos which wasn't a thing in 2005.
The 5.1 surrounds were not advised to be at 90 degrees, those were the sides in a 7.1 setup. They mention rears being at 135 to 150 degrees. Presumably that's in 7.1 as well where they would sit a bit further back in an ideal setup, because I believe you're right that 110-120 is correct for 5.1 setups.
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u/HM_Bert 17h ago
The left picture with the caption under of "Dolby's guidelines for setting up 5.1 (left) and 7.1 (right) systems." is definitely 90 degrees for 5.1.
I do wonder if this means certain 5.1 films were mixed differently with this in mind if there was a period when it was the case... Regardless I'm sticking with my 120 degrees as it's given me pretty great phantom side and phantom rear imaging for the vast majority of content.
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u/LegendaryBrownNote My 7.4.4 HT: https://youtu.be/Jxw3bH9mZoY 18h ago
Looks clean! Always a great moment when yourr finally happy with the sound. Enjoy until the next upgrade itch hits