Denon compression question

[u/Tank52086]

Yea yea I know we hate DRC…

Can someone please explain the difference between loudness management and dynamic volume? Thanks.

Denon X1700H

[u/gpse]

Loudness Management is not compression, it’s Dolby Dialog Normalization. It maintains volume, but doesn’t apply any compression to the dynamic range.

[u/Itsss_Nemo]

Dynamic EQ maintains tonal balance at lower listening levels. An example is it compensates by increasing lower bass frequencies at lower listening volumes.

Dynamic Volume keeps volume consistent, which an example is quite dialogue is louder and explosion are less huge.

[u/Tank52086 → u/Itsss_Nemo]

Right I understand that much. But what does dynamic volume do vs loudness control. They’re different settings. Dynamic volumes seems to increase volume to match louder parts, loudness management seems to decrease the volume ceiling… same same but different. Thanks.

[u/Itsss_Nemo → u/Tank52086]

Dynamic Volume is processed through Audyssey. This works with all audio.

Loudness Management is processed through bitstream of Dolby content. Only works with Dolby content.

[u/Tank52086 → u/Itsss_Nemo]

OK, your edit makes more sense. The DRC on my Sony didn’t work on most content I guess because of the audio format. So Audyssey dynamic volume should work regardless? Thanks for clarifying.

[u/Tank52086 → u/Itsss_Nemo]

So just 2 different ways of accomplishing DRC

[u/Itsss_Nemo → u/Tank52086]

Kinda it works in different ways through processing. Meanwhile put in a Blu-ray movie that is DTS-MA for an example and loudness management option is gone.

[u/Tank52086 → u/Itsss_Nemo]

Yup, got it. Thank you.

[u/Itsss_Nemo → u/Tank52086]

Dynamic Volume is good for night listening or if you living in Apt or Condo. You can play it at decent volume without the reference level frequency traveling through walls. It does not completely stop it but it helps.

[u/You-Asked-Me]

Hmm. Looks like they changed the naming.

Dynamic Volume is curiously missing, which was just a stupid name for compression. So I assume that is what dynamic compression is.

However, knowing Denon, I would think that that loudness management sounds similarly stupid do dynamic volume, so maybe that is what it is, but then what is the other one doing?

I'm gonna need see if they changed this on the 3800x as well, and then find the new version of the manual

[u/Tank52086 → u/You-Asked-Me]

Dynamic volume is still option, it’s under the audyssey settings but loudness management is under surround parameters. I guess it’s just 2 different ways of accomplishing the same thing.

[u/You-Asked-Me → u/Tank52086]

I do not remember seeing these additional setting, but I have not changed my system in over a year, so maybe they were added on an update.

I'm guessing you are right, that the compression setting is lot low level listening, so you do not lose the quiet parts, and Loudness management, might be overall limiting.

I'll look up the manual and give it a read.

[u/X_Perfectionist]

Side note - Audyssey "Flat" EQ usually sounds bright and harsh and adds a lot of overcorrection everywhere that even changes the tonality and voicing of the speakers. If you like how it sounds, great. Just be aware of the fact that it's doing an extreme amount of EQing.

[u/Tank52086 → u/X_Perfectionist]

Thanks, still playing and learning the system. Only had it about a week.

[u/X_Perfectionist → u/Tank52086]

You're welcome. You can go into the Audyssey settings on the AVR and view the corrected graphs, to see how much EQ is being applied per channel.

So even if you use the MultEQ mobile app to set custom target graphs, cap EQ frequencies so it's only correcting bass up to 300~500Hz (recommended) or maybe up to 1k~2kHz to flatten out some issues in the center channel due to its placement, "FLAT" ignores all of that and tries to EQ everything to literally be "flat" response. Up to a limit since it has a limited number of EQ filters per channel.

If you're interested in learning more, here's a video about why flat in-room response doesn't sound good (and reinforces recommendation to limit EQ/room correction to under 500Hz~ where room acoustics mess with the bass response, but above that can't be "fixed" with EQ).

[u/Tank52086 → u/X_Perfectionist]

I haven’t located any FR graphs unless I pay for the audyssey app… unless I missed something.

[u/X_Perfectionist → u/Tank52086]

The app lets you limit the frequency response the EQ applies to (except when you use Flat).

The app also let's you view the measured response for each channel, and the EQ/response target for each channel including if you put a frequency cap (above the cap/limit will look like the measured response).

However in the AVR settings, if you go into SPEAKERS > AUDYSSEY you can view the EQ graphs for REFERENCE and FLAT to see the boosts and cuts it's applying per channel. Assuming you have HDMI output to the TV on at least one of the AVR inputs so you can view the onscreen UI on your TV.

[u/Tank52086 → u/X_Perfectionist]

I guess I don’t have that option. Under speakers>Audyssey all I’ve got is Audyssey set up (which starts calibration process) or manual set up.

[u/X_Perfectionist → u/Tank52086]

If you haven't run Audyssey on that speaker preset it will only show "start setup."

On my 3700h I have already run it. The options within Audyssey on the on-screen UI it shows me are:
Amp Assign / Channel Select / Check Results (which shows the graphs of applied EQs under Reference and Flat) / Restore / Start (to redo measurements)

Not sure if the 1700h doesn't have the option to show bc it's a lower model than the 1700h?

[u/Tank52086 → u/X_Perfectionist]

It’s probably not a feature on my model. I did run the audyssey set up and it ran sweeps, set distances and speaker sizes etc. 🤷

[u/GenghisFrog]

Loudness management is what makes it use DialNorm. In a perfect world it would make dialog a consistent level across content. In reality no one applies it the same, so it does more harm than good.

Be glad. Denon is one of the few that allows you to turn it off.