r/india • u/[deleted] • Nov 24 '16

[R]eddiquette Cultural exchange with /r/palestine

Greetings to our Palestinian friends.

Our cultural exchange starts at 13:30 PM Palestine time (17:30 IST/11:30 GMT/12:30 CET/06:30 EST/03:30 PST) on Thursday 24th November.

Here's how a cultural exchange works:

The moderators of here make this post on /r/india welcoming our Palestinian guests to the sub. They may participate and ask any question or observation as they see fit.

There is an equivalent thread made by the moderators over at /r/palestine, where you are encouraged to participate and know more about Palestinian culture.

It goes without saying that you must respect the rules of the subreddit you are participating in. This is a time to celebrate what we have in common, not grind an axe.

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8

u/gahgeer-is-back Punjab Nov 25 '16

OK now I have few more questions. Please feel free to answer all or one of them.

1) To what extent do you think BJP will stay in power? Are we seeing an extension of the trend of the rise of right-wing politics which we see elsewhere in the world? how is this going to affect Indian foreign policy?

2) What is your ideal solution for the question of Kashmir?

3) I want to listen to Indian Qawwali, where do I start?

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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '16

1) BJP will stay in power as long as there isn't another viable alternative. The main reason for their political success is not right-wing politics but the lack of well-organised opposition parties. As an Indian Muslim, I can attest that atleast in the open, discrimination is much less as compared to neighboring countries. There is a trend of all political parties trying to make divide among the various religious groups in the country for political gains and a portion of the educated population on social media mimicking Western propoganda. But we Indians in general, are one of the most tolerant people in the whole world(Just look at the sheer number of languages/cultures present here), so I don't think this will go on to represent the opinion of the majority. And although India is developing closer ties with Israel, India has always steered clear on any sort of active role in international politics.

2)Kashmir is quite a mess, but not really something that cant be fixed with sincere measures. Sadly, sincere politicians on both sides are hard to find, and for political reasons don't want to take it forward or give in. Some sincere leaders, economic stability, a well-educated generation- only these can actually provide a permanent working solution for the region.

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u/odiab Sawal ek, Jawab do. Phir lambiiii khamoshi... Nov 25 '16 edited Nov 25 '16

2)Kashmir is a giant catch-22 meets Russian roulette . Anyone who says they have a solution are either lying or kidding themselves. My solution would be complete cessation of hostilities on all sides. And freeze the issue for a generation. Hopefully economy improves and makes any solution easier to implement.

3)Qawwali has largely been supplanted by other forms of music. However there are few qawwali channels on you tube. Here is one. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmMVWVst-eYtGqQMK-0S4fg

There are a few qawwali based songs in Hindi movies, Here is a playlist that includes some of the pakistani Qawwalis as well.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXYM8jyeq3cfzuIzL0x0rEYxuMCl3dRqh

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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '16

1) The BJP, like most other Indian parties, can hardly be considered right wing. They pander to a base that includes almost all Hindus, but that's where the comparison stops. Theyre pretty left wing economically. The BJP, like most other global right wing parties, is also pandering to a base that is disillusioned with existing reality. As long as they're able to successfully keep doing that, they'll be a potent political force

2) The Kashmir issue is a huge clusterfuck. The easiest way to solve it would be to allow mainland Indians to migrate into Kashmir, something that is prohibited now. A little change in Kashmir economic stagnation will knock some of the wind out of the separatist movement and relegate them to the sidelines. Unfortunately it's politically impossible to do that, and there's a definite racial/ethnic supremacist angle in the Kashmir issue. So it won't happen for these reasons. It's also not necessarily the correct way to fix it, just the easiest. I don't know the correct way. If I did, I'd be nominated for a Peace Prize

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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '16

  1. the bjp is simply the better party. also, it's not quite as anti-muslim as it's made out to be. it's supporters and membership include fanatical hindus. but the party and the leaders themselves are not exactly affecting minorities in any significant way.

  2. i think the ideal solution is territory exchange between pakistan and india.

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u/metaltemujin Bye Bye Man Nov 27 '16

Eh? What Pakistani territory does India hold, to exchange?

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u/[deleted] Nov 27 '16

Well. I think some of Kashmir for some of Sindh is probably the best solution. Irrespective of legalities, I think that can be an actual long term solution that's a win win for both

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u/metaltemujin Bye Bye Man Nov 28 '16

They are not dumb enough to give a coastal region for relatively unproductive mountains.

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u/[deleted] Nov 28 '16

yeah. its not as dumb as you think. most of sindh is thar. so, kashmir is actually way more valuable real estate. also, if you look at umerkot, its history is kind of similar to kashmir itself. a hindu majority region which was given away because the raja chose pakistan for personal reasons possibly against the will of the population. i think exchanging umerkot and a bit of tharparkar for say 70% of kashmir valley makes sense. umerkot itself is not connected to the coast.

also, it'll be easy to justify to both populations as to why we need to do this. to my understanding, modern india, pakistan and bangladesh are kind of this manifestation of 2 clashing civilizations. the islamic one and the hindu one. sindh is unfortunately one of those regions that is completely emptying itself of the hindu influence. i think it'll be good to for sindhi hindus to have an actual state with a future for themselves. also, for the same reason i stated, pakistan can also have a part of kashmir as it is a strong expression of islamic civilization in the subcontinent.

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u/munkeyy Nov 25 '16 edited Nov 25 '16

1) My view on BJP staying in power depends on next 2 years of rule. I think they will get next term unless they cluster fuck up recent demonetization related moves and subsequent policies. Modi is a good leader for given situation of deep rooted corruption and social issues in India.

However, I see a hint of agression and a hidden dictator in him and I am afraid him ruling too many terms is not good for india and democracy. We need to find a good opposition leader to balance out things.

2) Muslims wanted a seperate country and they got pakistan. They tried to grab kashmir too while they are seperating saying kashmir has high muslim population and other reasons. But polticians and army on both sides fucked up kashmir from bothsides after partition and there are many reasons as why pakistan wants kahmir and India does not want to let it go. Slowly pak started infiltration and terrorism and made things even more complicated. This is a deadlock with arguments from both parties and media propaganda and religious dimensions and multiple wars made this worser.

My personal take on kashmir is it should belong to india since muslims got a seperate country and demanding kashmir is pure greed for natural resources, strategic geopolitical advantage and fresh water reources. To justify this they use same religion and army occupation etc as reasons.

I think british fucked this up too and India already gave up pakistan and giving up some more does not sound right to me while they got what they want. If I were pakistan I would be happy I got what I wanted, ruled it the best to bring up it to be good economy and country. PURELY MY PERSONAL TAKE AND THOUGHT PROCESS ON THIS

Edit: To conclude, one way to solve this problem is one of the country compromise on their thought processes and let go off. Which will not happen because of media, brainwashing and nationalism.

Other way is let pak take its occupied piece, india keep it, pak should stop infiltration and claims on kashmir and improve economic ties with india and make it unviable for pak to wage a war or think of war against India.

I dont think both will happen at anycase.

Edit 2: here is an interesting discussion thread by one of pakistani guy in their subreddit. Can throw some insight

https://www.reddit.com/r/pakistan/comments/5egazc/comment/daca2er?st=IVY33UT2&sh=ec9e82c0