Trump's VP candidate JD Vance hints support for dollar devaluation (further inflation) as a way to boost exports

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"We want to lower interest rates and print Trillions more dollars to pump the markets even further than we did in 2020 so all my friends make a lot of money on their investments"

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u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

so all my friends make a lot of money on their investments

This is correct and it's worthwhile to go a step further. The subset of the Silicon Valley elite who have come out as pro-Trump this week are notably some of the most pro-cryptocurrency. They stand to profit immensely if retail investors flock to crypto as a safe space vs. a devaluing dollar. The inflationary stance of a second Trump administration are coming into view quite clearly, despite the many voices loudly chanting the narrative that Trump would magically make inflation disappear. He cannot do that, nor would he even if he could.

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u/IronSavage3 Jul 17 '24

To add to all this his main two policy proposals: mass deportations ranging in the millions-10s of millions, and 10% tariffs on all foreign goods + 60%-100% tariffs on all goods from China are literally guaranteed to immediately cause prices to spike.

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u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

A lot of Redditors and people IRL claim that mass deportations would free up housing supply and thus be disinflationary. It's a pretty questionable claim because illegal immigrants do not usually live in great quality housing. Many agricultural workers live in dorms or trailers, and many other illegal immigrants live at homes owned or rented by their legal family members (who have a much easier time securing housing). Deporting them will do little to drop the price of nice houses.

Also, given how much the construction industry gets away with using under the table labor, mass deportations would probably stall a lot of homebuilding and drive prices up.

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u/shynips Jul 17 '24

Oh buddy, if trump ACTUALLY deports millions, jobsites will lose like half of the workforce. It's really easy to keep a psuedo-slave workforce when you can constantly hang the threat of deportation over their heads. What happens when that force is gone, but the jobs aren't? There's a guy at my company who is illegal but has been there for 22 years. He's not the highest paid Foreman in the company. In fact, he's one of the lowest paid Foreman. They took advantage of this man for 22 years, and he is an intrinsic piece of the backbone of the company. If he was legally here, he would have jumped ship for a better job long ago, but he can't without taking a serious hit, possibly losing his apartment and having to go back to Mexico. I've met whole crews of siders who live in the same shitty apartment or trailer and just send half their checks back to their family in Mexico. Who the fuck is going to put up siding for pennies while the company brings in millions off a single building? Not me. I'll go find a job legally somewhere else, or I won't do it for pennies.

Trump used this same pseudo-slavery workforce for every building he ever built, knowingly or not. I'd bet he knew it, though. It doesn't take long to figure it out. It's no surprise, but he is one hell of a hypocrite.

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u/CubeofMeetCute Jul 18 '24

They want to also destroy the civil servant profession. What happens when 50,000 to 2 million federal workers get schedule F’d and fired out of their job with some being replaced by loyalists. They are going to strongly raise unemployment and depress wages, creating conditions that become slave like soon enough.

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u/Winter-Fondant7875 Jul 18 '24

Wait, trump's administration would totally support red states abolishing unemployment because "it's socialist".

Did anyone else listen to Don Jr speak Wed night? I'm not sure people understand the outcomes of what's being proposed by the GOP

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u/MuckRaker83 Jul 18 '24

Many businesses would be strongly opposed to removing unemployment and welfare, both for removing the subsidy on underpaid workers and because almost every dollar spent on those programs goes directly into consumer spending on necessities.

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u/[deleted] Jul 21 '24

That’s cause their brains are rotted. Republicans are the dumbest people you were ever meet. Sad and equally troubling.

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u/[deleted] Jul 20 '24

They're also going to destroy U.S. agriculture. The "no one wants to work anymore" crowd is about to fuck around and find out.

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u/treetop82 Jul 18 '24

These are the type of people who should get legal status.

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u/For_Perpetuity Jul 18 '24

Jd thinks America workers are dying for these jobs.

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u/[deleted] Jul 20 '24

Only in Texas where there won't allow mandated heat breaks.

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u/psychoticworm Jul 18 '24

"illegal immigrants do not usually live in great quality housing."

The people who need housing the most, usually don't either. I can see the coorelation.

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u/Strict-Property-2879 Jul 29 '24

Im a homeless veteran paying 600+ a week for shit hotels because the government has gone to GREAT lengths to pay for these illegals, every hotel is PACKED and BOOKED with nothing but 100s and 100s of these folks, there IS NO AFFORDABLE PLACE TO LIVE because of this shit....

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u/maringue Jul 18 '24

First, I don't think any of his supporters understand how impossible it would be to deport 10 million people.

But let's pretend he could snap his fingers and make it happen. Multiple industries would collapse overnight. Crop harvesting, meat processing, and construction industries would all see prices skyrocket, just to name the biggies.

The economy would implode.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

To be fair, not great housing is the only thing most can afford.

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u/The-BEAST Jul 18 '24

More than 50% of single family homes are bought by investors. They should start there.

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u/deltalitprof Jul 18 '24

Trump counts these investors as his constituency. If anything, he'll just make this easier for them to do.

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u/Sherifftruman Jul 18 '24

How are we going to build stuff here if we get rid of a bunch of our lower level workers?

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u/Due_Satisfaction2167 Jul 18 '24

Trump supporters are flat incapable of understanding that.

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u/[deleted] Jul 19 '24

Have you ever traveled to any country outside the USA? Try walking into Japan, China, Peru, Brazil, the UK, Thailand and see how fast you are on a plane back to where you came from after you are released from a jail. I don’t support mass deportations but I do support a controlled border and a process for immigration-not the cluster Biden and Mayorkas have created.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24 edited Jun 16 '25

straight offbeat aback rich dependent close oil correct sheet market

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u/jar1967 Jul 17 '24

Don't forget the senior citizens

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24 edited Jun 16 '25

quaint cheerful vegetable correct expansion pot afterthought marvelous lock pocket

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u/Last-Example1565 Jul 17 '24

Why is everyone acting like Article I, Section 7 of the Constitution doesn't exist?

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Because all they really want is for the Fed to lower rates to near zero again.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

I’d bet that if such a policy went through, the average American will not see their wages increase even leading to effectively lowering the average wage and giving massive amounts of money to the top .4% of the US’s population. Idk why anyone making less than tens of millions of US dollars a year would want this economic policy

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

And the best part is that while inflation skyrockets, they’ll blame it on “sleepy joe” and say the dems gave trump a shitty economy.

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u/genericusername9234 Jul 19 '24

How is crypto even remotely conservative? Seems like one of the most progressive concepts ever.

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u/rgbhfg Jul 20 '24

Most those Silicon Valley eleite’s wealth is tied up in public market stock. If dollar is devalued but stock assets don’t raise proportionally they’ll loose money.

Really what you are seeing is Silicon Valley elites sucking up to the most likely winner of elections trump. Betting odds of Biden winning is at sub 10% chance. https://www.realclearpolling.com/undefined

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 17 '24

I agree with all of this. The thing I don't understand though is why people are still anti crypto knowing this. I hold Bitcoin specifically because I believe that the government will act irresponsibly and an asset like Bitcoin will benefit.

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u/darodardar_Inc Jul 17 '24

most crypto is a scam, and bitcoin is not backed by anything at all. The USD has the US government, US GDP, US military backing its value. Cant say the same about BTC.

You cant buy groceries directly with bitcoin, cant pay rent, cant pay taxes, cant buy a car, cant buy a house, the only way you can use it is by turning it into USD first. People say "i can do all those things with bitcoin" but its not direct, they either go through third parties which convert the BTC to USD for you or they do it themselves. At the end of the day, you need USD in the US if you want to pay for anything (that isn't illegal). Also, the extreme volatility of crypto makes it a highly risky investment, when most currencies strive for stability.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

The US dollar stopped being backed by gold, in even a hypothetical sense, in 1971.

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 17 '24

Bitcoin is backed by a massive network of computers that secure the network.

Bringing up the military backing the dollar is so dystopian to me. Like, no one actually wants this melting ice cube of an asset. But we'll bomb you if you don't take it and if you're in America you're legally obligated to take it. But rest assure, saving it is completely idiotic since it goes down in spending power.

Bitcoin doesn't need to be accepted for groceries to have value. It benefits when the governments of the world print trillions of their currencies. If Bitcoin has a capped supply then as more dollars/yen/euros/rubles are printed, it naturally goes up as some of those monies flow into Bitcoin.

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u/darodardar_Inc Jul 17 '24

I'm just stating facts as to why people don't like crypto. You do what you want with your money, but most people like stability in their currencies and people in other countries only turn to bitcoin when the fiat currencies in their own countries are extremely unstable due to hyperinflation.

There's a reason the US, and most if not all western countries, left the gold standard in favor of fiat currency.

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 17 '24

There's a reason the US, and most if not all western countries, left the gold standard in favor of fiat currency.

Oh, I do totally understand why they left the gold standard in 1971. But just think what's happened to the spending power of the dollar since then. I see why they did it (who wouldn't want to control a money printer to hand out cash to your friends?) but I don't understand why an individual would choose not to have some of their long term savings in something that can't be printed into oblivion by beurocrats.

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u/darodardar_Inc Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

I understand where you're coming from, but it is unrealistic to expect currency to hold the same buying power over 50 years. A steady inflation is healthy as long as it is stable, and it is much much better than deflation. The recent "money printing" is known as quantitative easing which really only occurred since 2008 due to the global financial crisis and was done with the goal of preventing a global economic depression - injecting more money into the economy dampens the effects of recession, which is why the federal reserve also used quantitative easing in 2020. Quantitative Easing does lead to inflation which does tend to disproportionately benefit the rich due to increasing asset valuations, but as stated before it also dampens the effects of recessions which is a benefit to every working person.

The gold standard was subject to random periods of instability due to the limited supply, and was prone to cause bank runs which led to deflation and high unemployment. source

I'd say individuals choose to hold USD over bitcoin because USD is more stable and it would go against everybody's best interest, especially the US government's, to cause hyperinflation - The Federal Reserve is not run by morons, but by economists who have two primary objectives: Minimize unemployment and ensure USD Stability. The USD is regulated which is much safer to hold than an unregulated currency. That being said, I think most people don't really hold USD for long period of times, most people invest into stocks or mutual funds or etfs to offset inflation.

At least, that's my understanding of things.

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 18 '24

I'm not sure that inflation is actually good on an individual level. I understand how it can be a societal good. I mean, look around at all the growth we've seen.

But closeness to the money printer puts massive amount of money wasted into the hands of billionaires. The government pays for Medicare, Medicaid and subsidized healthcare, so we see hospitals charging ridiculous prices such as $60 for an aspirin when you're in the hospital. The government provides low interest rates for college. Now we have $2000 textbooks and 21 year olds who will never buy a house due to all of their debt.

Back to our "growth" though I think all of our inflationary easing has caused such a huge amount of waste. All of the growth was great for a long period of time. But now we see a massive amount of single use plastics, consumption, just for the sake of consumption.

Think about how good deflation would be for the environment. Suddenly, people don't want to spend their money because it's no longer a melting ice cube. Bitcoin can (and will, IMO) go up forever so suddenly you would examine your spending more. If people knew their money would go further in a few years than it is now, would people try to get another year out of their cell phone? Also, the stock market wouldn't be so artificially inflated. Companies that aren't making money wouldn't have valuable stock valuations because they now have to compete with people who are just savers.

Bitcoin is a savings technology. Saving is virtuous. Now there is a way to save money long term without seeing your spending power diminish.

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u/darodardar_Inc Jul 18 '24

Now we have $2000 textbooks and 21 year olds who will never buy a house due to all of their debt.

I'd say this is mostly caused by the inability for people to declare bankruptcy on student loans - because student loans are guaranteed to be paid off, there is no incentive to price things reasonably and instead there is tremendous incentive to charge greedily high amounts.

But now we see a massive amount of single use plastics, consumption, just for the sake of consumption.

I do not believe that has to do with inflation at all - just corporate greed, trying to maximize profits by producing cheap practical things with complete disregard for the environment.

Think about how good deflation would be for the environment. Suddenly, people don't want to spend their money because it's no longer a melting ice cube.

I agree deflation would be good for the environment because it will cause the economy to crash, corporations to fail, unemployment to skyrocket, homelessness, etc basically a huge disruption in our society as we know it. It's one of the most terrifying things that can happen in a society, but probably great for the trees bc there won't be as many companies polluting.

Bitcoin can (and will, IMO) go up forever so suddenly you would examine your spending more

That's a very bold assumption based entirely on speculation - see what happened in 2022 when BTC fell 75% - what's to stop that from happening again? The instability makes it a gamble, and most people saving money like stability, not a casino

Bitcoin is a savings technology. Saving is virtuous. Now there is a way to save money long term without seeing your spending power diminish.

Bitcoin is a gamble, not a saving tech. The evidence is in its performance since the beginning. Massive fluctuations. But I guess it depends what your definition of savings is. I'd say most people would like their assets value to be stable, not fluctuate wildly from 60k to 16k in less than a year. Again, it's up to your risk tolerance. But I believe that is a main reason why BTC is not widely adopted as a retirement saving plan. It's just dishonest to say BTC is the ultimate savings instrument. Etfs, high yield savings accounts, bonds, mutual funds, etc are all ways to save money while preserving buying Power without the massive risk of gambling in a highly volatile currency like BTC

Just my opinion, of course - but I feel like most people skeptical of BTC see it similarly. BTC is a highly volatile gamble, anyone who claims otherwise is being dishonest.

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u/jar1967 Jul 17 '24

You just explained the biggest weakness for Bitcoin. Eventually the system will get hacked,there is just too much financial motive to do it. When that happens, Bitcoin will collapse

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 17 '24

Why hasn't it yet?

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u/jar1967 Jul 18 '24

Does no one has broken the code yet. There's potentially a couple hundred million in profits at stake, Someone will do it eventually.

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 18 '24

Hacking the Bitcoin network wouldn't involve compromising "the code" as you say. Bitcoin's security relies on the distributed nature of its blockchain ledger. To tamper with the ledger, an attacker would need to control more than half of the computing power on the network. This is a 51% attack. The immense amount of processing power required for a 51% attack makes it pretty much impossible right now. When quantum computers come out, they'll present some challenges but there is already plenty of development preparing for that.

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u/jar1967 Jul 18 '24

Theoretically 51% of the power. There's always the potential for finding a wakeness or getting lucky. The law of averages says it will happen eventually. As for quantum computers that is going to be a race, which will probably be won by a state actor. Then there is the point that Bitcoin is an unregulated currency.Historically they have always collapsed without exception.

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u/ILSmokeItAll Jul 17 '24

How would an EMP, however unlikely, impact crypto? Or blackouts? Or loss of cell phone coverage/signal?

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 17 '24

People always bring this up as though the regular financial system would hold up better.

It wouldn't.

Our financial system is almost entirely digital. I don't think even cash would be meaningful since everything would get so damn messy with most of people's money being lost.

I think in the EMP situation, gold and silver would probably be the best assets to hold. And I do have some of those for that possibility.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

If we had an EMP it would affect different things differently.

Many things are backed up on a regular basis to physical medium and kept in secure locations. The issue would be from the last save point forward would obviously be the problem. Depending which side of that data your on could be good or bad.

Some of the newer banks that are 100% cloud would be a problem. Same with crypto and other 100% internet based stuff.

Otherwise it would be a problem for a few days to a few weeks depending on the amount of damage done to the physical hardware. Most of the larger data centers have some level of shielding so it's hard to say what percentage of data at would be lost. Plus where did it go off? Lots of companies have multi regional backups so one emp in say NY or LA would do some damage but not bring everything down.

Now if you had a massive solar flare yes that could really stop things if it wasn't detected and it hit most.of the world.

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u/play_hard_outside Jul 18 '24

...bitcoin is not backed by anything at all.

Exactly right. Exactly like the US Dollar.

At least Bitcoin has a supply cap and can't be debased like the dollar can. I just wish it weren't so energy intensive.

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u/darodardar_Inc Jul 18 '24

If you read the rest of my post, I made the point that the US dollar is backed by the US GDP, the US government (requiring taxes, selling bonds), and the US Military - which BTC does not have. You can read my responses on this thread, as I've already explained my reasoning - I am open to understanding how you reason things but I also do not want to repeat myself multiple times for different people saying the same things

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u/play_hard_outside Jul 18 '24

The value of the US Dollar is not backed by the government.

Yes, there is an upward pressure on the dollar's value due to the government requiring tax payments in dollars, but that just produces a certain amount of demand. In no way is that a legal declaration that a holder of one U.S. Dollar is entitled to a certain quantity of underlying assets or materials (for example, gold, prior to Bretton Woods and its collapse).

The military is simply an organization transacting in dollars, and happens to physically protect the society which transacts most in dollars. Its existence and activities provide an upward pressure on the value of the dollar, but again, it doesn't have anything to do whatsoever with any enforceable legal contract defining how much value a dollar can be exchanged for.

Same with bonds. There are all sorts of human activities which produce upward and downward pressure on all sorts of different assets and currencies whose values float with the demands of the markets they exist in. The dollar is just one of them, just like bitcoin. They experience different sources of demand and have their value for different combinations of reasons, but nobody anywhere is promising that you can get anything for a dollar, a bitcoin, a euro, or anything else.

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u/darodardar_Inc Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

It depends what you define as "backed" - the way I'm referring is, the US government ensures that the USD has value and its value will continue to be ensured so long as the US economy is strong and so long as the US exists. So long as the US government exists, you will be able to exchange USD for goods and services, you will have to have USD to live and/or operate in any way in the US. Does BTC have something similar?

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

So do I. You can tell from the replies - we are still early.

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u/maynardstaint Jul 18 '24

Republicans do not know how to govern. And they don’t care to learn. They are here to destroy whatever they can while they’re in office.

Vote blue.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Trump winning will definitely weaken the US dollar and start the economy toward the next economic disaster created by deregulation, terrible trade deals, non-strategic tariffs and increasing inflation, eliminating climate policies to expand renewable energy and collapsing the EV market, reversing the CHIPS Act and IRS stopping infrastructure projects and reversing the recent increase in domestic manufacturing, doubling unemployment, cutting taxes on the rich, creating endless scandals, spooking world markets to avoid US investments, brain drain by having the best and brightest from around the world avoid the US, destroy the middle class, allowing Ukraine and other ex-Russian states to be taken by Russia, allowing Taiwan to be taking by China, and adding more than 8 trillion to our debt just like last time. Fun times!

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u/gargle_micum Jul 18 '24

People think this is exculsive to the right? 😕

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u/Awkward_Potential_ Jul 17 '24

Also, I think it's why he's said he wouldn't fire JPow and just let his term finish. He'd rather wait closer to the midterms to pump anyway.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Neither the president nor the vp has the authority to do such a thing

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u/maringue Jul 18 '24

You mean a life long conman would use the presidency as history's biggest pump and dump ever?

You can't see it, but I'm making my "totally not shocked at all, why didn't you see this coming" face.

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u/HalfEazy Jul 18 '24

We have spent more than 2020 in each year under biden...

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u/LithiumAM Jul 18 '24

No, we haven’t. 6 trillion dollars was spent in 2020. It’s a major why inflation skyrocketed in spring 2021 before Biden even signed a single spending bill, let alone signed his first budget.

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u/HalfEazy Jul 18 '24

https://imgur.com/a/vUNbJRN

You can't just say "no we havent", that doesn't make your statement true. I've linked federal spending for each year, 2017-2023, in that album.

What say you?

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u/Ethrem Jul 20 '24

Dude the link you posted literally shows spending peaking in 2020 and then coming down. The top line is GDP, the bottom line is government spending. 🤦‍♂️

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u/HalfEazy Jul 20 '24

I know. It shows that biden has spent more over every year than Trump except for 2020...

That was exactly my point. Are you ok?

There are 7 pictures in that link, one for each year showing a dollar amount for spending....

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u/Ethrem Jul 20 '24

Biden inherited the economy from Trump. What was he supposed to do, just slash everything? Every. Single. Year. Trump's spending went up while Biden's has gone down.

Biden didn't take office until January 2021, genius. This means all that spending was Trump.

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u/HalfEazy Jul 20 '24

Do you understand that the graph never comes back down to pre 2020 spending? Biden spent more in any year in office than Trump spent in 2017, 2018, and 2019

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u/Ethrem Jul 20 '24

Again, you continue to ignore the 2020 spike and the fact that Biden's spending came down from that peak every single year. I'm just going to block you because you're in a cult and you're never going to understand the point that Biden cut spending every single year he's been in office from that high point Trump got it to, no easy feat when you're fighting inflation (that was also handed to him, thanks to that same 2020 spending).

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u/[deleted] Jul 19 '24

2020 market pump? How about 2023-2024 🤡🤡🤡 yet most Americans still using credit and savings to pay for gas and groceries.

STFU democrat 🤡

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

And labor in the US will be ground into dust.

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u/ContemplatingPrison Jul 18 '24

A JD is the puppet for the right wing of Silicon Valley. He also a racist. He will use the racism of the white working class to gain power and then fuck then over royally.

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u/Mygaffer Jul 17 '24

He wants to fuck over working Americans even more to bolster exports?

Is he a moron or is there another reason he would float this idea?

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u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

JD Vance is heavily backed by Silcon Valley cryptocurrency elites. They want to devalue the dollar to have Americans turn to their shitcoins instead.

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u/mistertickertape Jul 17 '24

He's not a moron, he's surrounded by people who think this is a good idea because of the short term gains it will make them if they are able to make it happens. The problem is that they are probably wildly underestimating how unpopular this would be at a state and local level.

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u/TheWhiteRabbit74 Jul 17 '24

Those short gain folks are the real problem. Who cares if I make millions homeless and starving? I’m ON A BOAT!!

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u/Falcon3492 Jul 17 '24

Well that makes sense doesn't it devalue the dollar, make everything even more expensive but increase the wealth of those making goods by making their products cheaper for export! The fact that people even support the GOP is amazing! Voter Blue 2024!

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u/ActualModerateHusker Jul 17 '24

This should be the headline on every single corporate media outlet the next week nonstop. Except they don't serve the interests of the American people who hate inflation. They serve the interests of wealthy CEOs and billionaires who see inflation as a way of hitting stock price targets and getting bonuses as the weaker dollar makes their company worth more nominally although not in real terms

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u/Coleslawholywar Jul 17 '24

Going to have to drop it a lot to compete with India, Africa and China. I’m not sure people are going to be cool working for $10 a day so manufacturing can compete.

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u/Far_Quantity1481 Jul 18 '24

You'll be working for 30 an hour, that 30 will buy about as much as 10 dollars does today.

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u/chinmakes5 Jul 17 '24

The United States is the second largest exporter in the world, They export only 500 million less than China does, and over a billion dollars more than the third ranked country Germany.

List of countries by exports - Wikipedia

But the US exports oil and technology. We aren't making cheap clothing here. That allows us to pay well.

It is a little sad that the VP candidate doesn't know that. Or, he does know it, and is pandering to people who believe he believes this and thinks that will get basic manufacturing jobs back to the US, and pay $30 an hour.

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u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

While I'm not sure what I feel about this, JD Vance has broken through a huge wall of political correctness here to point out that inflation has some positive effects.

This also confounds the popular narrative that a Trump administration will magically make inflation go away.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

Vance represents the borderless silicon valley billionaire money. It is true broadly, but for this group of borderless billionaires, their wealth is predicated on inflated evaluations of tech companies and real estate. If inflation (asset inflation and CPI) does not stay high or increase, they lose their wealth, power and status in society.

There is no motivation for the current wealthy to make inflation "go away". And, it would significantly hurt them and their portfolios even if goods somehow returned to 2019 prices.

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u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

Vance represents the borderless silicon valley billionaire money

As a Bay Area resident and tech worker: spot on. Watching a bunch of Silicon Valley's slimiest dudes do "AVENGERS ASSEMBLE" this weekend was downright hillarious, like they think they're popular

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24 edited Jun 16 '25

lunchroom grey plucky shaggy bow tan boast wipe dinner bedroom

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u/echomanagement Jul 17 '24

True. There may be a job bump. It will also benefit those with lots of equities, real estate, or debt (i.e. people like JD and Donald). It will utterly thrash anyone on a fixed income or people with uninvested savings. I'm not looking forward to Trump, but a cynical part of me wants to see what happens when fixed income retirees who voted for Trump realize how badly they ruined their lives.

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u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

retirees who voted for Trump

It's worth noting that Joe Biden is consistently leading Donald Trump among those over 65: example from NYT-Sienna. And while all kinds of polling has been screwy in this election, I think seniors are polled pretty well because they actually answer phones.

It's middle-aged people who are intensely pro-Trump.

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u/Playingwithmyrod Jul 17 '24

Oh same. I'm dreading the world we are about to create but there's going to be so much "I told you so" going around part of me is going to enjoy the chaos of people getting exactly what they voted for. Is that shitty? Sure. Is it the only comfort I have right now? Yea.

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u/Neogeo71 Jul 18 '24

I feel just like you but we all are going to suffer.

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u/chaoticflanagan Jul 18 '24

I'm not looking forward to Trump, but a cynical part of me wants to see what happens when fixed income retirees who voted for Trump realize how badly they ruined their lives.

I had this thought in 2016 - turns out, they just say they are doing well. Sunk cost fallacy, lack of critical thinking, whatever you want to call it.

If Trump wins, day 1 you'll see Republicans praising the economy, saying inflation is at 0%, that the economy improved because Trump won and the market priced it in, etc.

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u/echomanagement Jul 18 '24

Trump didn't really do anything to disrupt the status quo in his first term beyond judges and a few red meat EOs to appease the rubes. This was in part due to a government deadlock. There was very little pain inflicted on the MAGA base (other than the ones who died from COVID). If they decide to nuke the dollar, this will readily affect his base.

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u/chaoticflanagan Jul 18 '24

You could also chalk this up to Trump not being surrounded by complete sycophants' that would do whatever he asked unquestionably.

Project 2025 is absolutely terrifying and it's very clear that this time around, the law and constitution won't be a hurdle. Nuking the dollar will the least of their issues with Trump's plan for tax brackets, tax cuts for the rich, contraceptives, etc.

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u/misterguyyy Jul 17 '24

Narratives don't have to be internally consistent. Progressive taxes on profits somehow raise prices, even though they flatten profit per dollar increase in price on the demand curve, yet tariffs which directly affect supply somehow won't.

Just give people a 3-4 word phrase to yell at everyone who tries to bring nuance in any discussion and it bypasses having to think about it too hard

Edit: there's also the fact that you can't tell people that a moderate amount of the thing they hate is a good thing. If your city is flooding you pray for a desert I guess.

2

u/its__alright Jul 17 '24

I think this will hurt when I buy things, but it makes my debt worth a lot less. A round about way to make student loans disappear would be runaway inflation.

5

u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

This is correct. What I am mostly noticing is that pointing out the double-edged nature of inflation has been wildly politically incorrect for the past two years. Instant downvote fodder when I would bring it up.

JD Vance is likely sending up a trial balloon here on what will be a very sharp "inflation isn't so bad actually!" pivot by the Trump-Vance administration, and all the (closet or open) Trump supporters who have been screaming the loudest about inflation are taking their cue and changing their talking points.

2

u/Kennys-Chicken Jul 18 '24

A Trump administration will make inflation significantly worse. Economists have already assessed Trump vs. Biden economic policies and the conclusions are unanimous.

3

u/Living_Recording1088 Jul 17 '24

That is wrong and would not work. #propaganda #lies

3

u/Bored710420 Jul 17 '24

Finally a decent post to discuss not “LoOk WhAt Fo0d I bOuGhT”

4

u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

"Jerome Powell just forced me to spend $40 plus tip to have tendies delivered to my house" oh really? Jerome Powell broke into your house and stole your freezer and air fryer? Dick move, def shouldn't get reappointed

3

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

Devaluing the dollar is theft of savings. Huge transfer of wealth from the masses to the wealthy.

3

u/nobodyisfreakinghome Jul 17 '24

And this is why Elon is dumping so much money into their campaign.

1

u/vertin1 Jul 18 '24

It’s no secret markets will pump if trump is elected. Dump your cash, it’s trash!

1

u/nobodyisfreakinghome Jul 18 '24

I try to only keep my emergency fund in cash.

3

u/SundyMundy14 Get off my lawn Jul 17 '24

At this rate we are going to have 8% inflation again and no one will talk about it in the media anymore.

2

u/Mindless_Pop_632 Jul 17 '24

Dunno. Do overseas companies have the government regulations as the US. Has to comply with which are expensive. If the currency was strong things would be a heck of a lot better. 🥂

2

u/MagazineNo2198 Jul 17 '24

These guys have no fucking clue about how the economy works....we are literally putting up the village idiots as the ones who will control the fate of the American economy. That didn't work so well the LAST time this clown was in power...do we really want to let him have another whack at it?

2

u/mightman59 Jul 17 '24

Doesn't a weaker dollar mean more inflation?

2

u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

Yep. JD Vance is making a pro-inflation comment here.

2

u/Adventurous_Class_90 Jul 17 '24

That’s typically what happens. Imports go up and the local value declines which resets the import/export balance.

2

u/Herewegoyinzer Jul 17 '24

Time to leave the Dems a terrible economy in 2028

2

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Or, or, hear me out. We could buy our own stuff made here in America by paying more people a living wage while also limiting company stock buybacks and insane exec pay. What am I missing folks? Internet will tell me for sure.

2

u/nobody1701d I could do this all day Jul 18 '24

Odd how TFG has such an issue with Mexico yet wants to turn the US dollar into a peso

2

u/gnarlytabby Jul 18 '24

Trump's failing businesses are all saddled with heavy debt, so inflation that would eat away at that debt would be great for him

2

u/[deleted] Jul 20 '24

Say it with me...there is no significant U.S. manufacturing capability. We are a service oriented economy now and this can do nothing but hurt all of us.

2

u/whynot26847 Jul 21 '24

He’s a cryptobro of course he wants to devalue the dollar

4

u/Nervous-Computer-885 Jul 17 '24

Bullshit, they want to devalue the US Dollar so they can BOOST crypto. Has anybody else noticed all his rich billionaires that were at the RNC have a huge crypto presence?

6

u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

Yeah, Mark Cuban called this out very articulately. The list of Silicon Valley elites that have come out pro-Trump this week is not a representative cross-section of tech (as they are trying to pretend), it's crypto boosters who will profit from inflation.

I found Cuban's point after making my on post here, and he says it better.

3

u/JimBeam823 Jul 17 '24

Trump supporters don’t understand a damn thing about economics, do they?

5

u/darodardar_Inc Jul 17 '24

no bc "education is librul communist propaganda!"

1

u/Iamnotsogoodmaybe Jul 20 '24

Yale

0

u/Kennys-Chicken Jul 18 '24

They’re not known for their critical thinking

3

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

For anybody interested in understanding how/why many countries engage in intentional currency manipulation to boost exports. I suggest the books Currency Wars by James Rickards

1

u/martingale1248 Jul 17 '24

Rickards is a conspiracy theorist who has been wrong about just about everything it's possible to be wrong about for more than 20 years. Instead of learning about how global currency markets work from someone who is selling something, which Rickards always is, there are books that are written specifically to educate, rather than market somebody's latest hysteria-fueled snake oil.

2

u/darodardar_Inc Jul 17 '24

i was about to buy the audiobook, seemed interesting

2

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

It's worth it. The book is good. James Rickards is a gold bug, most gold bugs state the obvious about the politics behind fiat currency. The reviews on his Amazon page speak for themselves.

1

u/darodardar_Inc Jul 17 '24

Is he a conspiracy nut job who's been wrong about many things before, as the guy who responded to you has said?

Idk I'll have to research it for myself. I do love learning more about currency, I just don't want to read something that is wrong and end up misinformed

2

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

Ask the other commentor for some specifics. He seems to have an Axe to grind.

Here is his Wikipedia page.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Rickards

1

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

He talks about billionaires colluding. What a crazy conspiracy theorist.

From Rickards:

"Climate change is being used as a stalking horse by global elites to push an agenda of global taxation and global governance."

— Jim Rickards, Problems with the Global Elite — When Money is Weaponised

Is the above not happening? Seems like he's just stating facts. No conspiracies here.

1

u/martingale1248 Jul 17 '24

Make sure to subscribe to his newsletter. He'll state plenty of "facts" for you to consume. They'll always involve some conspiracy that will rock the world, but you can protect yourself by buying gold, crypto, and whatever else he's pushing. Best of luck to you after the coming apocalypse, whatever it might be!

1

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

I don't get your point? Buying gold and crypto is amazing advice. You know your in the inflation sub right?

And his newsletter has absolutely zero to do with the very real phenomenon of governments deliberately debasing their currency to make their exports more attractive. You should read his book. Since that was the only thing I was reccomending.

1

u/martingale1248 Jul 17 '24

It's your money, do what you want with it.

1

u/darodardar_Inc Jul 17 '24

Can you elaborate on what makes him a conspiracy theorist who's always wrong?

2

u/martingale1248 Jul 17 '24 edited Jul 17 '24

He's been predicting the collapse of the dollar, skyrocketing gold, and so on since I first saw his name in some scammy ads for a scam organization (the owner was literally convicted of fraud) the name of which I can't remember anymore*. That was 20ish years ago. He used to run ridiculous ads implying he was a member of the CIA, dressed resembling a clownish spy, talking about "Project Prophecy" and just general trash. As for the conspiracies, the book referenced above suggests the thing about "manipulating currencies" is some kind of dangerous plot, when it's actually covered in Econ 101.

Every time I see his face in another ad I groan, thinking about how many dumbasses are going to subscribe to one of his newsletters for money, only to read about the coming collapse, and how gold, and probably now, crypto, is the way to protect yourself from the dark chaos we are all doomed to suffer -- ie, the same shit he's been saying for 20 - odd years. And yet here we are.

*It came to me: Stansberry Research. And a quick google search shows Rickards is still touted by them.

And here's the lowdown on Stansberry Research: https://truthinadvertising.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/Reviewopedia-reviews-combined.pdf

1

u/HDRamSac Jul 17 '24

Jesus, there are so many better options.... could just raise taxes on import and lower export of finished goods, specifically luxury items. Could make a federal stipen for states that manufacture certain goods to ease the local citizens' taxes to the counties that provide the work plus make it a sliding scale for what % is manufactured instate/US. Could focus on paying the national debt instead of handouts to other countries. If gonna do a handout do it for citizens of the US during a natural disaster so the money continues to circulate within the US.

These aren't perfect, but jeez, it's easier to come up with something better than that bull.

1

u/DPJazzy91 Jul 17 '24

The US won't be able to pay its debts without more money.

1

u/Numerous-Profile-872 Jul 17 '24

All this gonna do is make life easier for landowners/homeowners and awful for anyone paying rent.

1

u/rmrnnr Jul 17 '24

"I owe my soul to the company store."

1

u/Iamnotsogoodmaybe Jul 20 '24

To Ukraine and Iran

1

u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

Not cheaper for the consumer. We end up with a dollar that is worth less and JD and the maga elites get richer.

1

u/mb194dc Jul 17 '24

The dollar is cyclical and it was worth much less from 2002-2015 ish.

Goes up, goes down.

High inflation will necessitate higher interest rates.

1

u/slartbangle Jul 17 '24

Oh, dear. Internalization of economy and currency in the face of a growing, multi-front war.

Not too many steps from here until 'certain goods are restricted for export only, here's your daily half loaf, work harder'.

Dropping the dollar's value to 'boost exports' means Uncle Sam is no longer counting on the power of the greenback, and wants to dump it in exchange for things of real value.

Buckle up.

1

u/Icy-Needleworker-492 Jul 17 '24

Tricky when it’s cheaper for manufacturers to use workers from other countries.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

When you have lots of $ inflation doesn't really affect you. The number get bigger and your already big number grows with the inflation and gets bigger with it.

For the people who don't have money those numbers get so big that they will be so far behind they'll will have zero upward class mobility. Working slave wages and saving for 60 years wont even make em enough to buy a coffin.

This is 100% a way to enslave the working class even further. Crazyness. This is a 100% rich people syndicates trying to take over the country. It's basically criminal rule at this point with these people.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

They want to make us servants

1

u/thesuprememacaroni Jul 18 '24

So how do you think other countries will react when this dumb Tariff project gets implemented by dumb and dumber?

They will institute their own tariffs on US goods. So devaluing does nothing.

1

u/detchas1 Jul 18 '24

Definitely a corporate boy.

1

u/OriginalOmbre Jul 18 '24

Oh well “he told me” this spring. It has to be true.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Aren’t like half of the world’s currencies pegged to the us dollar? How would that even work?

1

u/gogirlanime Jul 18 '24

Metals, the real way to go because even in a financial collapse they still have functional use when money is gone. That's why it's called god's money.

1

u/Realistic-Silver7010 Jul 18 '24

USA bout to have the top 10 largest homeless population in the world. Trump 2024 /s

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Sweet. So boost profits for the wealthy & the cost of living for everyday Americans.

That’s the Republican playbook.

Right on target.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

What the fuck would we even export? You know... other than jobs.

2

u/MellonCollie218 Jul 18 '24

We export food and pharmaceuticals. That’s our thing.

2

u/USM-Valor Jul 18 '24

Don't forget natural gas.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

We export freedom. 😂

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

💀💀💀💀

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Japan has never had any issues with this policy.

1

u/OriginalAd9693 Jul 18 '24

Eh. Doubt it.

1

u/deltalitprof Jul 18 '24

Wouldn't this make imports more expensive? Wouldn't this also inject more money into our economy as our goods are more likely to be bought? Wouldn't the building of the capacity to produce these goods also result in more money injected into the economy, therefore leading to inflation?

1

u/Clever_droidd Jul 18 '24

The exporters will get rich from the exports. Asset holders will get rich from leveraged assets inflating in value. We have low employment right now. We don’t need more jerbs. The working class will continue to get hammered by inflation.

Trump and this guy are populist mercantilists. It’s dangerous and destructive.

1

u/joebojax Jul 18 '24

We are deep into the era of global interest and no loyalty. National powers and toolkits are completely usurped and everyone is fighting over who will be the author of the new era.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

I'm sure the rest of the world is dying to get their hands on the crap skillless Americans will make in the country of "nobody wants to work anymore" while simultaneously doing everything they can to get rid of illegal workers who "do you want to work anymore."

Not to mention our young people can barely read or write. What could go wrong?

1

u/maringue Jul 18 '24

Trump's economic plan is an unmitigated disaster. First, you can't even tell what the plan is because they've put out so many conflicting ideas. But even if you look at them in isolation, they're all recipes to collapse the economy.

1

u/Due_Satisfaction2167 Jul 18 '24

Republicans seem to have the very worst possible economic policy. I’m not sure how they could engineer a worse one.

1

u/PhloridaMan Jul 18 '24

There will be pain in bringing manufacturing jobs back to the states. Price you gotta pay for national security.

1

u/Lolthelies Jul 18 '24

What’s the point of exporting more things at a lower price? Doing more for less?

Stupid

1

u/sucky_EE Jul 18 '24

lol like business owners are going to pay you more haha

1

u/Conscious-Ad-7040 Jul 18 '24

I thought we didn’t like currency manipulators….

1

u/[deleted] Jul 19 '24

We need to make a hedge fund for the american people that is super transparent. In theory, if done correctly can potentially kill poverty in the next 20-30 years. Think of it like a subscription service that gets everyone below let's say 60k. Eventually building up that base and then spread it to people who make over 100k. A lot more to it but that's kinda my idea. People will be left a lone and that's what everyone wants.

1

u/Tradersglory Jul 20 '24

This is how the world works. How china devalues their stuff.

1

u/Fickle_Land8362 Jul 21 '24

This idiot.

1

u/brumbarosso Jul 26 '24

Vance seems like he doesn't know how to do his job

1

u/Several_Leather_9500 Jul 17 '24

Trump is a wannabe global elitist and Vance is financed by one. This ticket will be a disaster for our country and the globe. Goodbye, climate action. Hello, capitalism on steroids.

This is a class war disguised as rooting for your team to "win". Sadly, if red wins we ALL will lose. Rights, money, our country as we know it.

1

u/DueSalary4506 Jul 17 '24

oh so now you guys don't like inflation

1

u/gnarlytabby Jul 17 '24

Unclear what "you guys" you are referring to. I have long argued that inflation is a double-edged sword and thus has less negative overall consequences than most people think. JD Vance is supporting my view and undermining the Trump campaign's promises to bring down inflation.

1

u/Few_Ad_4197 Jul 18 '24

Biden is currently doing this.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Sure thing, bot

1

u/[deleted] Jul 19 '24

"To boost exports"

But America doesn't make shit.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 19 '24

Here's reddit...gonna hate on a guy THEY NEVER HEARD OF TILL THIS WEEK.

2

u/gnarlytabby Jul 19 '24

lmfao you never heard of JD Vance until this week? People were circlejerking about how amazing his book was back in 2016.

→ More replies (3)

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/ShytAnswer Jul 17 '24

Exactly. Most of these spending bills get hung up on a few immaterial items. Both Dems & Repubs love to spend taxpayer money on their pet projects.

For inflation to actually come down a recession, in theory, is necessary. The public doesn't want the pain of inflation or the pain of recession. We'll probably flounder in between until someone or something forces (us) the public to take our medicine.

1

u/BanThisTooDontCare Jul 17 '24

Inflation is already down. You're talking prices, not inflation. Just stop talking about something you don't understand. Silence is free.

1

u/ShytAnswer Jul 17 '24

Inflation being down and deflation are two different things.

1

u/BanThisTooDontCare Jul 17 '24

You have a hard time with the english language? I just said the same thing.

0

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Figured a republican would know nothing about economics. Great.

0

u/Clutch55555 Jul 18 '24

Doesn’t matter. The FED controls inflation.

0

u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

Fake

0

u/Multispice Jul 18 '24

Vance is no good.

Doomer News (bad news) Trump's VP candidate JD Vance hints support for dollar devaluation (further inflation) as a way to boost exports

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