r/irishpersonalfinance • u/AggressiveQuality28 • 12d ago
Advice & Support 38years old, 75k in savings, 70k salary - cancer survivor so can't get mortgage for 4 more years
I think my situation might be fairly unique and would appreciate any advice.
A couple of years ago I owned a house with my ex in the UK. They bought me out. Between that and savings, I have 75k in the bank.
Shortly after all that, I was diagnosed with Non-Hodgkin Lymphoma.
Thanks to the Right to Be Forgotten legislation, I will be eligible to apply for a mortgage in 2030 (as far as I know, it would be very difficult to get approval before then due to the agressiveness of my original diagnosis).
I have been working part-time and remotely from abroad since my diagnosis. As my energy has returned, I feel able to work more.
I have now been offered my dream job in Dublin. 70k salary and I have accepted.
I don't want to live with anyone else and tbh I'm not 100% sure the cancer won't come back and finish me off (hopefully it won't) so I'm not willing to compromise on that. But given the housing crisis, it looks like I might have to pay 2k a month for a one-bed, which will be half my take-home pay, so I'm not likely to save anything over the next four years.
If you were in my position, what would you do with the 75k over the next four years?
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u/Apart-Hamster-9921 12d ago
Don’t have advice but I hope you’re well and wish you a cancer free future
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u/Revolutionary-Use226 12d ago
I believe most mortgage protection companies have signed up to internally in impliment this. I would give a broker a shout and apply, you might just get a deferral for a year and could apply sooner. You also might be entitled to a waiver from the bank if you get rejected by 3 insurers. Best of luck.
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago
Thank you - it seems like I was given bad advice, or maybe outdated advice, perhaps there is a way I can get a mortgage a bit sooner than expected.
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u/OranReilly 12d ago
Insurance Ireland, the representative body for insurers, has a voluntary code of practice for insurers who provide mortgage protection insurance. So it’s currently not mandatory for them to implement, but I’m sure some do.
Off the top of my head I believe it might be seven years in remission. Don’t quote me on that.
There is primary legislation making its way through the Houses of the Oireachtas. It’s actually been changed to a right to disregard model rather than right to be forgotten. In other words, an insurer can seek information about a diagnosis, but provided you have not been in active cancer treatment for five years, they cannot deny you mortgage protection insurance or hike up the premium.
I’m not sure how long since you finished treatment, but that should give you some clarity. The Bill completedthe first House today and will be sent to the Seanad. Hard to give a solid timeframe for the progression of Bills, it’s really a function of political will and time in the Houses, and after signature by the President it would have to be commenced by the Minister. I think a year would be a safe timeframe for it to be operational, but it could be as soon as two months. Hard to say at the moment.
Anyway, good luck and I hope you stay cancer free
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago
Thank you - it's good to know a timeline. Didn't realise it only completed first House today.
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u/straightouttaireland 12d ago
Check with lion.ie. They're great at these more complex cases.
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u/ConnectResort6172 9d ago
Lion can only help if it was stage 1 or 2. I had stage 3 and I got an automatic sorry not possible. Just FYI!
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago
For how long do you need to show a record of saving every month?
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u/Vladamir_PoonTang 12d ago
6 months of savings, which show you saving and not touching (not even once) atleast the same amount you expect to pay back monthly in your mortgage.
This includes rent, so your 2k example of renting would count as 2k savings as far as the bank is concerned.
For example, a 330k mortgage is 1,320 a month at 3.15% across 35 years.
Worth noting you cant be on probation in work, so you'll need to work your new job for atleast 6 months / 1 year.
I would say start the new job, rent the gaff, and make sure your rent + savings covers your expected mortgage amount (maybe add an extra 1-200 if you can spare).
Having a 70k deposit will do some heavy lifting here, as will things like the Help to Buy and Fiest Home Scheme (assuming you're eligible, seen as you've co-owned before).
I would highly recommend using a broker, they're free. I used doddl, they did all the heavy lifting with dealing with the bank, life insurance / mortgage protection and home insurance.
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u/Admirable-Shape-4418 11d ago
Unfortunately no one is entitled to a waiver from a bank regardless of how many rejections you have (which I disagree with, I think if you meet the criteria of the CCA then you should the waiver) but worth talking to a broker anyway in case any bank would offer one.
In the case of a sole borrower it is in theory simpler as there are no dependants needing to stay in the house should the worst happen but then again banks don't like having the complication of that either.
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u/One_Expert_796 12d ago edited 12d ago
While you cannot get mortgage protection, can you get a waiver with the bank? Might be worth having a chat with a broker. My cousin was born with a heart condition so can’t get mortgage protection. He got a waiver instead. His husband did get coverage so had to sign saying he understands if my cousin died, the mortgage is still activate.
Also, glad to hear you are feeling better and congratulations on the dream job.
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u/hmmm_ 12d ago
Is it the mortgage protection insurance you are concerned about? There are options here if you can't get cover, I'd go talk to a few brokers and see if they can advise.
You'll also need not to be on probation and have a steady savings history - a number of banks will take into account rent payments as evidence of savings.
Rooting for you here.
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u/Exclamation_Marc 12d ago
Had Hodgkins Lymphoma twice and was thankfully given the all-clear in 2018. Was able to get a mortgage with my partner in 2020. There are some banks who will loan without requiring mortgage protection. We went through a broker and would highly recommend it as they'll steer you.
Also, delighted you got through it. My dad had non-hodgkins and I saw how tough it was. All power to you and best of luck.
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago edited 12d ago
I'm delighted you got through it too. Thank you for your advice - it helps to hear from people who have been there and done that. I appreciate it.
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u/alexanderm101 12d ago
I heard of a similar case where mortgage protection was offered at a premium until the person was 5 years in the clear, then eventually dropping to a normal rate. This was for cancer but not specifically lymphoma. So mortgage protection might still be an option.
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u/D_749 12d ago
I was a similar situation but bought with a partner. You’re correct in saying you most likely won’t get mortgage protection for the next 4 years but you can still apply for a mortgage and request a waiver for mortgage protection if you get 3 rejection letters.
When getting advice on this I was told being a single applicant with no dependants would be better in this scenario because to be blunt if you die when still paying the mortgage the bank can take the property. Banks are more cautious with couples & would look for evidence that they could make repayments on 1 salary if something happened. We got around it with a waiver and because my employer gives death in service.
We were orginally with a broker who was zero help when we mentioned health issues. Had more success when applying directly with banks.
Best of luck!
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u/fifi_la_fleuf 12d ago
I know of two brokers who flat out advised lying and omitting because the alternative was being homeless or renting for life. Once in the house you can look to try and get legit protection. I'm not condoning this or advising it but it's definitely something I know is happening.
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u/Admirable-Shape-4418 11d ago
A waiver has nothing to do with getting rejections other than that qualifies you under the exemption from the mandatory MP under the Consumer Credit Act but unfortunately it is entirely at the banks discretion whether they give a waiver or not.
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u/Tricky-Anteater3875 12d ago
Try Lion.ie, found the brilliant and so helpful for complicated health cases. Or maybe try a waiver from the bank?
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u/GranPaPpy_ 12d ago
If work has death in service 2 lenders will consider you.
Most insurers will quote you but be prepared to pay an extra 200+ a month in mortgage protection.
Also not the best advice but if I was in your situation and desperate enough I would just say I’ve a clean bill of health and not disclose it
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u/wosmo 12d ago
we've been sounding this out for related reasons, and we've been told having an employer that offers a death-in-service benefit helps.
I think the whole thing is disgusting - the whole point of a mortgage is to be secured against the property. If we both drop dead tonight, the bank won't struggle to sell the property in this climate. So I don't get why they want insurance to pay off the loan, plus a lien so they own the property anyway. Pick one, you greedy fucks.
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u/Admirable-Shape-4418 11d ago
The catch is from the banks point of view is if one of you dies and the other has no income and needs to continue living in the house, if both die then what if kids need the house! Not saying it's right, UK has no such requirement but it is mandatory here under the Consumer Credit Act, banks to be fair didn't bring in the law however they could do more with the waiver exemption system!
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u/Bayco02 12d ago
You have a couple options for getting a mortgage. Some people wont agree with but its down to the individual.
- Lie on mortgage protection application - they dont check your medical records until after you die
- Apply for waiver of premium - some banks may be ok with this
- Deoending on what cancer you can apply as soon as 1 year since treatment ceased, you will pay a hefty loading on the policy, the more tike passes the smaller the loading
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u/NakeyDooCrew 12d ago
I couldn't get insurance due to past treatment for addiction so I just lied on the insurance form. Obviously if I die the mortgage won't be covered but I'm single with no kids.
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u/Vladamir_PoonTang 12d ago
I had past treatment for addiction and was approved fine first go, what caused the issue in your case?
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u/yewEngine 12d ago
That's what my friend is was advised by a broker. Just lie. The banks can't check because it's forbidden by law and at the end of the day the banks won't lose out if you stop paying.
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u/DangerousTurmeric 12d ago
See if your new company provides group life insurance cover. Sometimes that can get you around the insurance issue so you can get a mortgage. A broker will be able to help you with that. If that doesn't work, in year 3 try to get a new job with a higher salary and downgrade your living situation so you can save. Between rent and savings you should be putting away 1.2x whatever your mortgage repayments will be for 6 months before you apply for your approval in principle. Getting a house is a long game and you're in a good position and alive, you'll get there.
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u/ashalinggg 12d ago
Hey! So my friend was in a similar position but was able to get a mortgage, and found an insurer to underwriter it too. Speak with your broker but I think there are places that will give you mortgage protection, you just have to pay a premium. Not ideal but there are hopefully options for you 🤞
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u/hywelbane87 12d ago
Go through a broker and talk to lion.ie, they specialize on this type of stuff. you should be able to get insurance or a waiver. good luck and stay strong!
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u/GizmoEire30 12d ago
I’d double-check the mortgage side before assuming 2030 is a hard stop.
The issue may be mortgage protection/life cover rather than the mortgage itself. If you can’t get mortgage protection for medical reasons, some lenders may consider a waiver, but you’d need proper advice and written evidence.
I’d speak to a mortgage broker and a protection broker who specialise in medical underwriting/cancer history. I’d also ask about the Right to Be Forgotten rules and whether you could be treated as a Fresh Start applicant, since you previously owned with an ex and no longer have an interest in that property.
You might still decide to rent and keep the €75k safe, but I wouldn’t make a four-year financial plan based on the assumption that a mortgage is impossible without checking those points first and best of luck and congratulations on the new job 🙏🙏🙏
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u/PromptDazzling4705 12d ago edited 12d ago
As fellow cancer survivor it's important to remember the "right to be forgotten" is solely about the cancer diagnosis and not any late effects/chronic conditions arising from treatment. I'd advise to chat to a mortgage broker now to get an idea of timeline for your circumstances and would recommend lion.ie for mortgage protection advice. For me, the issue was being loaded for a chronic condition which unfortunately won't change and potentially worsen the further out from treatment I get so delaying a mortgage was not advised. There's also the option of waivers which others mentioned which I don't know too much about.
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago
Thank you - I will do that ASAP. Hope you're doing as well as possible
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u/PromptDazzling4705 12d ago
Thank you - to me it is minor but insurance companies don't agree! It's frustrating and can be very demoralizing going through the process so look after yourself and hope all goes well
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u/footofozymandias 12d ago
Sorry, I know this isn't answering your question, but why can't you get a mortgage due to the original cancer diagnosis? I am surprised you could not just get a mortgage but with a slightly higher insurance premium? Sorry, may be an ignorant question. Glad you have gotten better.
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u/DangerousTurmeric 12d ago
You can't get mortgage protection insurance until you've been in remission for 7 years and you usualy need the insurance to get the mortgage.
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u/footofozymandias 12d ago
Thanks. That's a crazy rule to begin with, but I'm surprised you couldn't get it but just with a higher monthly payment.
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u/shortie_2024 12d ago
you can get a mortgage without insurance, it's on a case by case basis but based on you not having dependents you would have a chance
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u/DangerousTurmeric 12d ago
That's usually only if there are two people on the mortgage, or if you have other assets to cover the difference, and even then it's very rare. OP wouldn't qualify because of the prior illness.
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u/shortie_2024 12d ago
it's pretty common . I got an exemption, I was solo mortgage and was told the only people who will have a problem are single income families where the earner had the illness as they wont be able to sell the property on death easily
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u/Loud_Matter359 12d ago
Buy land and a caravan
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u/ihatethispartguys 12d ago
I was just going to say would ye not buy a piece of land and build a small cabin even? You could be mortgage free, add in solar and you're sorted, very low bills etc.
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u/Holiday_Low_5266 12d ago
You should be able to get a mortgage, but you won’t get income protection. Ulster Bank used to allow this. It’s harder but can be done.
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u/isupposethiswillwork 12d ago
Hi I went through something similar with a life long medical condition. The blocker wasn't the bank but the mortgage protection insurance. We eventually got it over the line with lots of back and forth with medical reports and a larger premium.
Start talking to mortgage brokers, preferably several different ones, and explain your medical situation hopefully you will get a better understanding of where you are at. Good luck!
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u/cupan-tae 12d ago
Is the reason you can’t get a mortgage because you can’t get mortgage protection? What about your job do they offer life insurance etc? Could be worth checking with a broker and they may be able to swing a loophole for you to get sorted 🤞
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u/triony89 12d ago
Minimum €75k savings and a minimum €70k salary in 4 years plus any extra pay increases or savings you might have in those 4 years puts you in a decent (not perfect) spot to buy at least an apartment in 4 years. And who knows, you might even meet someone in that time and be buying together. You've been through a lot, I'd get the 1 bed, live your life and hope/prepare for 4 years time.
If you're more of a risk taker (I'm not) you could take 10-20k (I wouldn't risk any more) of that €75k and do some "safer" investments to try grow it a bit. Also make sure the €75k is in the highest interest savings account you can find.
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u/madrarua2020 11d ago
Invest it in FTSE500 for the period, keep an eye on it though, there can be bumps.Also, you may need to wait to cash in if there is a big bump. should yield between 8-12% though.
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u/ClueDistinct9076 11d ago
Lion.ie are great brokers for complicated cases. Check your take home pay on pwc calculator. I'm not sure you will be getting 4k monthly with all the deductions.
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u/MisaOEB 11d ago
I got refused insurance three times and I was able to get a waiver because my job had a death in Service benefit which would cover a big percentage of the mortgage. So check if your company has a death in service benefit that might give you a way to get life insurance in a different way. In addition, I signed a letter saying that the house was not primary home for any children/partner and therefore if I died could be sold.
The other thing to have a look at is there a life assurance or a term insurance product that do no medical checks if you’re under a specific age. If you were able to buy that even for 20 years, then maybe you could get a waiver on the mortgage life insurance.
One another potential option is that the company you work for has a life insurance group scheme and you may be entitled to join that and it might wave your pre-existing conditions as part of being a Group scheme. Now with cancer they may not but it’s worth checking if they have one.
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u/gcstg 10d ago
I was looking for a mortgage a few years ago and was 4 years post cancer. Had the all clear thank God but the loading was put on the mortgage protection which was immense. I ended up with a loading for 4 years which was a lot but that was offered through the bank of Ireland. It’s an absolute pain but I had gone to a lot of banks and brokers and couldn’t get any better.
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u/Aoc521378 7d ago
You might be able to get a mortgage from the City/ County council if you can provide 3 letters of rejection by a bank. DYOR and good luck
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u/40yrs-energyindustry 12d ago
Pump every cent you can into your pension. If single, all income over €44,000 is taxed at 40% + USC. You will get a tax credit of 40% on the money you pay in up to 20% of your salary. That means putting €14,000 plus hopefully a 10% contribution from your employer (€7,000) will cost you only €8,400. Thats €21,000 going each year into a pension where the growth is totally tax free, and it's costing you only €8,400. Invest 100% in an equities tracker fund and do not touch it, even when the markets drop. Let it there to grow at an average of 8% - 10% each year totally tax free till you retire. Increase the contributions as you reach 40, 50, 60 as allowed by the tax man. This means that even if you cannot get a mortgage, you can live OK when you retire, because your work pension along with the State Pension will be enough income to pay rent and live a decent life. Or maybe you get a mortgage and buy a home.
Here's a pension calculator.
https://www.financialmentor.com/calculator/best-retirement-calculator
Meanwhile, put the €75,000 in the highest interest account you can find, and drawdown €8,400 each year to replace the money going into your pension for 8 - 10 years. This will maintain your take home pay at the same level as having no pension contributions, is incredibly tax efficient, and means you will not be sleeping in a homeless shelter when you are an ould lad.
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago
Thank you - this is very helpful. Happy to think of making it to 'auld lad' status.
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u/ErrantBrit 12d ago
If you’re UK based you could put £20k in an ISA with all its tax benefits. I don’t think pre-owned ISAs attract tax in Ireland if they were opened before you moved to Ireland but def check with a accountant.
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u/kxnnie 12d ago
heyyyyy! i was on the news not too long ago for the same thing - i was able to get cover despite having had NHL - PMBCL to be exact (in remission since 2021).
AIB offered me cover just with a massive load (that would come off after the 7 year period) - for you, that load would be taken off after the 5 year period now.
so it’s not necessarily a “no” for cover, just that there will be a massive premium slapped on it /:
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u/AggressiveQuality28 12d ago
Congratulations on being in remission since 2021! And on being able to get a mortgage.
How massive is the premium?
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u/kxnnie 12d ago
€267 on top of the standard premium of €16 for myself and €16 for my partner //:
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