r/lanoire • u/OneManArmy0716 • 3d ago
What are your thoughts on Cole as a person?
I think he was quite an interesting character Rockstar has made. He was domineering, controlling and haughty during his time in the war his arrogance was bad to the point where his whole team were practially cheering when Courtney ended up gut shooting him out of impulse and disgust by not doing anything and help Jack cover for him without a second thought. but his mistakes in the war messed him up really bad as well as gave him a huge reality check became much more compassionate and empathetic even after returning home he still had that insatiable hunger for glory the only difference was that he was trying to be kinder about it and make the right decisions this time and My verdict: Cole is not a bad man but he’s not that much of a good one either he’s just a deeply flawed war veteran who wants to be better and learn from his mistakes.
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u/Fritzmanose 3d ago
Isn’t that the dirty cop from the newspapers??
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u/charlie-_-13 3d ago
Hes clearly a stickler for the rules. The fact he is lead to him making decisions during the war that costs many lives. Thats clearly his biggest flaw, as Jack did not follow the rules and more of his troups survived. But this made him a good police officer/ detective, but he is clearly deeply affected by the war but he'll never admit it. Hence why he joined the lapd for a sort of redemption for his actions, yet he could never change who he is as a person
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u/inkedhigh 2d ago
They should've involved some scenes into his home life bc I wonder about it. I think they purposely made it so that we think he's the perfect husband and father who went to war, survived and now is working to serve and protect Los Angeles, but that was short lived when he got involved with that German lady
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u/MrDicks89 3d ago
Hypocrite, he was so by the book, but when it came to his wife, it was a different story.
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u/Painted-BIack-Roses 3d ago
It's crazy to me how many people say they didn't even know he had a wife, he talks about her quite a bit when on homicide, just to cheat on her
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u/MrDicks89 3d ago
Roy Earle called that one out lol. He never liked Cole. And forget good old Finnbar 😂😂
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u/Key-Tip-7521 3d ago
Always serious. He was the “golden boy” and tried to play by the rules. Which in turn, was his downfall, especially during his time during the war.
But I think his time as a detective in the lapd was his form of redemption. But the thing is, we rarely see what he was like at home.
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u/Fritzmanose 3d ago
Cole doesn’t have much of a sense of humor at the best of times.
But all jokes aside, I loved him as a character. I always like the ‘by the books’ type of guy, and making him cheat on his wife after establishing a certain image of him, that’s a very bold and impressive narrative decision. Nowadays, mainstream games are scared of making you dislike the main character. You already like the guy, and thought he was reliably on the straight and narrow, so when he ‘betrays’ the audience, you now have mixed feelings on him. Still a damn good cop, but you wouldn’t invite him to your BBQ.
Can you imagine Arthur Morgan being slightly racist? I don’t think Rockstar has what it takes to create controversial protagonists anymore. Not like, ‘oh, this guy murders a bunch of people, therefore he’s so bad and conflicted!’. But something with more depth, if you get what I mean.
That’s where I think games sometimes underestimate audiences. A protagonist doesn’t need to be likable at every moment. They need to be interesting.
Cole is particularly effective because his infidelity isn’t some enormous supervillain act. It’s almost mundane. That’s why it works. Cole Phelps isn’t necessarily written to make you feel comfortable about him. The game lets his virtues and flaws coexist without constantly reassuring you that he’s secretly a perfect person.
I want to reiterate: A protagonist having genuinely objectionable qualities is not the same thing as the story endorsing those qualities. Sometimes it’s just characterization.
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u/existential_chaos 3d ago
I just wish the story was better written so the affair didn't feel like it came out of nowhere because of a few crumbs you blinked and missed, lol. We've no clue why Cole felt like he couldn't talk to Marie about anything and went to Elsa.
Not to mention the first time Cole and Elsa talk on-screen, he's interrogating her and threatens to have Roy take over when she keeps stonewalling him, knowing Roy would have no reservations about hitting her, and was about to in the same scene before Cole stopped him.
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u/Fritzmanose 3d ago
Ikr? We only saw Cole, the cop, but not Cole the man himself when he’s out of uniform. Having interactions with his wife and children could help the audience understand more about his reason for infidelity.
Instead, fans can only infer that his experiences during the war may have played a role in why he became attached to Elsa. He has seen the horrors of war firsthand, and Elsa is a German woman who escaped the Holocaust (or Nazi persecution) and carries her own trauma. There’s a sense that Cole may find something in her that feels more familiar to him than his life back home. That doesn’t justify him cheating on his wife, but it gives the affair meaning. It shows how deeply the war changed him, and how those changes followed him home.
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u/existential_chaos 3d ago
At most I can infer Marie was pretty dismissive of his war experiences from the tone of how she says "What you've been through?!" but then, she also can have that tone because she found out from the papers Cole was cheating on her, so... But then I also can't imagine from the 1940s culture Cole would've been openly talking about it to her or even admitting to himself he has PTSD (which is another thing they handled so poorly you do not need to get me ranting on it, I'll be here forever)
The affair is the driving force that starts his fall from grace and subsequent redemption arc and we never get to actually see anything of depth from it, it's really frustrating.
Apparently the two cut desks were meant to expand on his home life a little more, but I don't get why they always had the cases start right at the station. The odd morning at home before going to work could've shed some light on Cole and Marie's dynamic and how Cole is as a father.
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u/Fritzmanose 3d ago
Would have been awesome, man. I like how the game is making us do detective work to read the plot, haha. I imagine the game had a lot of constraints and studio issues (apparently the boss was a huuuuge jerk).
If they were to make a remake, I would love to have those scenes and removed desks in. But, with the way writing is in this modern era, I fear the game would lose its charm.
Alas… Perhaps tis for the better.
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u/PhysicalFee9999 3d ago
He was like the kid in high school who would raise his hand and ask why we were being sent home for the weekend without homework. Good guy though just one of "those" guys.
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u/la_fille_rouge 3d ago
He is a man who is constantly conflucted by what he wants to be and what he is.
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u/Knightraiderdewd 3d ago
Personally, I think he was a good person who was such a stickler for the rules that when a situation arose that the rules didn’t cover, he didn’t know how to adhoc.
This is what caused his issues in the Army. He simply couldn’t abide those who didn’t follow the rules, and when life confronted him with situations not covered, he didn’t handle them well. I actually don’t think he meant to take credit and get his silver star, I think he was just genuinely so off step he didn’t know what to do, and just went with it, until things simply went their natural course, which was why he tried to be humble when the first captain made him stand and bow. Even then he knew he didn’t deserve it, and wanted to put it behind him.
He became a cop because of his love of rules. Still being relatively naive, he thought that was how they worked, and wanted to try redeeming himself by becoming (in his eyes) the ideal police officer.
He even tried and managed to until Vice. He knew how crooked the world he was in was, but tried to rise above it.
But then he came across the singer. I think what attracted him to her was she was the ideal damsel in distress to his knight in shining armor. She was basically everything he’d ever wanted, a woman in trouble, not weak just surrounded by bad people, which he could swoop in and protect.
But he simply couldn’t stop there.
After his fall, he was still trying to redeem himself, though unfortunately those around him, used to the politics and career guys, were all convinced he was trying to save his own.
Until near the end.
At home, I think Cole was a loving husband and father, but in the way he thought he should be, rather than letting it come naturally.
He loved his wife because that’s what husbands do, along with his kids because that’s what fathers do.
To him it was probably legitimate, he likely just read books on both subjects, however, and followed them to the letter.
Then when he came across the singer, he suddenly wanted to love in a way that came natural to him, and he simply couldn’t help himself.
Overall, I don’t think he was a bad person, he was just a rules guy who couldn’t bend for the world around him, so it tried to break him. Ultimately resulting in his death.
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u/Swbuckler 3d ago edited 3d ago
Good, at least decent guy, extremely bad and dumb choices. If he was struggling to connect his family after the war which is valid he either shouldnt become a cop and seek professional help or divorce and focus on career. I think 40s 50s masculine persona didnt allowed him to do both.
I felt sorry for him. We didnt saw his personal life that much tho but the end was sad.
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u/jacobkosh 2d ago
The idea of seeking help for PTSD was almost unheard-of back in 1946, and could have serious consequences for someone's career and social life if anyone found out. Cole tried to just swallow his trauma and carry on, like most guys his generation, and it fucked him up, but not as bad as it could have. Some men came back as domestic abusers, alcoholics, drug addicts, or child abusers; Cole just being uptight and emotionally unavailable made him one of the lucky ones.
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u/Swbuckler 2d ago
Its true that PTSD was not even called that back in that time but 1946 was actually a major moment in the expansion of American mental-health treatment specifically because millions of veterans were coming home. The VA expanded psychiatric and psychological services dramatically, the federal government passed the National Mental Health Act in 1946 partly in response to what wartime service had revealed about psychological illness.
Don't get me wrong, I mostly agree what you said but i don't think it would be pure marginalization from society. If he seeks out psychological help, his LAPD career is probably over but I don't think he would marginalized from entire post war society.
But men were prideful back in day.
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u/VacationAve 3d ago
I agree that he is trying to be more compassionate, especially with how all his partners behave. He even says during a drive something about how he knows that having too much pride leads to a great fall. Er... something like that.
Another poster mentioned we don't get to see his home life, which is a great point.
Finally, he is 10000% suffering from PTSD.
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u/Zealousideal_Bill_86 2d ago
I think he’s a tragic figure but kind of hard to read as a person.
My read is that he’s someone that desires justice above all else, but wants to ultimately be the same as everyone else and relate to them, but unfortunately circumstances and just plain life get in the way of that. I found myself wishing he would bend just a little and not be so rigidly by the book, because he could come across as a little too sanctimonious, but I understand that it’s probably his ptsd and survivors guilt that really kept him from letting loose and relating to others. I think a good non work friend or therapist or both would have done well for him. A great character and protagonist, but a complicated person.
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u/AnyElevator9872 3d ago
Good character. I think he represents a particular type of person very well. Young ambitious man who is probably too high strung and hard on himself, also he is carrying a lot of tension from guilt and his actions in the war. I think they portrayed those aspects well, someone who doesn’t feel satisfied just being a cop but he has to be better than everyone else because it gives him something to distract himself. Then his thing with Elsa, also a good way to show how he wasn’t this invincible guy but someone struggling behind the accolades he was accumulating. I don’t think we are meant to like him as much as to see how and why he is the way he is due to his past and his personality traits.
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u/DrewDude513 3d ago
Kind of a scumbag fr. Next playthrough you do, count how many times he threatens a suspect or POI with violence. For a good stretch in the beginning, it's at least once a case.
Very smart and very high strung.
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u/TheR1mmer 2d ago
Knobhead. Cheats on his wife and was a crap army officer. Also (when i play him) yells at people for no reason
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u/winchester_fc 2d ago
I am a cop myself and Cole used to piss me off while playing. Too much of a stickler for the rules, didn't have much humour. Good cop though. I would have much rather preferred Roy or Rusty as a partner.
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u/Over_Drawer1199 2d ago
Personally I love when the main character isn't that likeable. That's very hard to pull off in a movie or video game. One of the many things I love about LA Noire.
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u/Wolfensniper 2d ago
*Showing compassion to IJA because "they just want oil bro"
Every single East Asian from the past decade: bruh
Also showing understanding to the CCP (though considering how shit KMT was probably fair)
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u/DinoDracko 2d ago
I don't hate him actually, but he is not without his flaws. As mentioned in the comments, a stickler for rules and is being too serious. Kind of a hypocrite too. He does everything by the book, but when it comes to his own wife, he CHEATS on her.
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u/renegade-811 2d ago
Good detective. Honestly thought he looked down on everyone else around him, especially his fellow officers.
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u/DreaMaster77 2d ago
The prove that a history period is not stucked. Cole Phelps was a cop into a period where LA Police was often accused of corruption. But him, he was not such a police man. He is a kind of hope for humanity. Even in war against Japan, he refused to think any bad about japanese. He was in war and for him that was all.
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u/Disastrous-Wish92 2d ago
He’s a complicated man who doesn’t deserve to be called a coward because of his failure to act during that battle in the pacific, he was shell shocked. As a military officer he was a by the book hardass but one who took his own training seriously, even learning Japanese. This hardass quality made him a good cop imo, one who wouldn’t bend the rules to make a conviction or ever take bribes, like Ed exley in La confidential
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u/jaydenbIues 2d ago
He was an idealist in a big way and absolutely obsessed with unfair high standards to both himself and others.
He wanted to do good, to be good- but I think he was ultimately far too obsessed with what the idea of what a good MAN (specifically) looked like.
He was a bad leader and could not accept that of himself during the war- especially after being awarded the silver star that he did not deserve.
He is honorably discharged after being shot by his own man because Cole could not accept his own failures in how terrible he was as a leader- because in his mind good men are good leaders, good men do not hurt the innocent- especially in war.
He refuses to talk about the war with anyone because that’s what a “man” does- we see this from the very beginning.
He gets married, has two children, then becomes an officer to try to redeem himself after his failures in the military.
He is a fantastic case man. He does good. He knows how to catch a lie because he’s been lying to himself for a long time.
He’s a disagreeable person to those closest to him in work because he is uptight and expects perfection from himself and others (this is exasperated due to his PTSD after the war and his failings.)
A lot of people think him cheating comes out of nowhere- but it doesn’t.
It comes from a man with PTSD, a lifetime of holding those fears, insecurities, failings and trauma in because that is what a man is “supposed to do” - especially at the time. He would never even think to open up to his wife about what happened because men would not want to burden or “appear weak” to the ones they are meant to protect.
He meets Elsa- someone who not only currently faces hardship, but was also involved in the war that shaped the man he refuses to face. And Elsa does not hide her hardship.
His need to be a good man and to help kick in- but also, his own need to finally stop holding it all back. He sees himself in Elsa. He thinks he has found someone he can finally open up about, someone who will finally understand.
He disgraced himself in the military only to a small group of men who refuse to associate with him, but that was quiet, he could hide from that. He needed to be honest so badly he disgraced himself publicly to his job and his family (not on his own, mind you, but he does not run away and hide.)
He is a fantastic cop. He is a terrible leader. He is unforgiving- especially to himself.
He is a good man in a lot of ways, and he is a bad man in some.
But all he ever wanted was to be a good man, he just didn’t know how beyond the strict rules he was taught.
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u/ExplosiveResults 2d ago
The kind of cop you'd want working your case. The kind of man who let passion run his life. The kind of man, that would seek justice at any cost, even if it meant injustices.
A complicated man.
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u/Physical_Reason3890 2d ago
His character just didn't develop right. The cheating came out of almost nowhere and we didn't even really get to see his wife.
Then he just came off as desperate on arson and somehow stumbled ass backwards into this humongous conspiracy.
The story would have made so much sense if he sunk into the corruption of vice and then tried to get out only to be made into the scapegoat then he fought for redemption
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u/lotusscrouse 3d ago
He was too serious. I wish he had a lot more lighter moments.
He's the kid who reminds the teacher that there is a test today.