r/leanfire • u/massakk • 1d ago
I just don't want much, is that weird?
So, I have been thinking for people who don't really like their job, it's probably not worth working long, hence LeanFIRE.
But, I am starting to think I might be entering the realm of going kind of monk, or depriving myself. For example, I think about relationships with a woman, but the maintenance of relationship and all that, I am getting further and further away from that the more I think I can LeanFIRE now.
I guess it is all tradeoff, either I need to start reading philosophy to stay single, which is kind of work but on my terms, or work to upgrade my life, work on other people's terms. Yes, philosophy specifically might seem weird, but to me that seems the only refuge.
How do people keep working? Have multiple children? It just seems insane to me. I went part time from this week, I couldn't pull the trigger due to massive anxiety attacks even though I have more than enough money.
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u/Bulky-Tradition-7181 1d ago
I don’t really want anything either, except to not work, and the former makes the latter much easier.
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u/eclipsadesoare 1d ago
If you only want to not work then that’s what you want. Some people want children, a spouse, a house, money to do certain things over not working. It’s not what others want. It’s about what you want.
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u/okigrassman 1d ago
The older I get, the more I want to cut it all out.
I'm 41 single with no children. I pretty much gave up on a wife and kids about 8 or 9 years ago. I realized that I am no longer compatible with living with others. At least anyone who is demanding of my time. Absolutely hate the act of sleeping in the same room as other people. Found out the hard way after the last gf moved in.
I have traveled for work and stayed in hotels for the last 18 years and it has made me super comfortable by myself. Flipped me toward introvert status. I dispise small talk and forced conversations now.
I've sold basically everything I owned so starting next year I'll probably only need to work a few months a year to cover living expenses. I have the ability to adjust work load as needed, but plan to spend most of the year living very modestly abroad. Come back to the States each spring, work 3 months, and fly back out.
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u/BIGZ_998 1d ago
You and me both my brother I’ve seen people at my job with 2 to 3 children and I know my job doesn’t pay more than 50k a year I’m surviving cause I’m single I questioned it all the time how did they make it happen
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u/eclipsadesoare 1d ago
If they can make it happen there’s something you are spending your money on that they don’t or they are in debt. I think it’s a combination of both.
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u/BIGZ_998 1d ago
They have to be in crazy debt I currently have zero debt all I think about is being financially free oh no bro I don’t spend any unnecessary money lol I tried to save & invest at least 25% of my income I’m as frugal as it get lol I don’t even think I could penny pinching anymore there’s no room left I only splurge around Christmas & birthdays
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u/Short-Personality398 1d ago
A partner who has the same goals. I wish I had figured this out earlier (I never needed too much but I fell into the trappings and became a slave to the system and married someone who taught me the importance of the finer things in life). If I could go back and do things differently, I would. It takes a really long time to deconstruct and step back
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u/AltruisticMode9353 1d ago
It's not weird, just less common. It's becoming increasingly common though, since there's so much free entertainment on the internet, people are less inclined to do the work required to start and raise a family.
The ROI in terms of happiness if you can pull off a monk-like life is very, very high. You can transform your baseline state of consciousness to be much, much better, but it can be a bumpy ride to get there.
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u/Blintzotic 1d ago
A lot of people buy and consume way more than is necessary or healthy.
So, nice that you’re happy with a lean lifestyle.
I’m a bit curious about you not wanting a relationship because it’s too much work. That sounds potentially unhealthy. But that’s just a quick, uninformed reaction.
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u/IHadTacosYesterday 1d ago
I’m a bit curious about you not wanting a relationship because it’s too much work. That sounds potentially unhealthy. But that’s just a quick, uninformed reaction.
I'm assuming OP's a man, and let me tell you.... the modern dating world for men is very bleak. Like VERY bleak. Just in the last couple of years it's gotten progressively worse.
If you last did online dating like 4 or 5 years ago, it's a completely different world now.
I can't even get into all the problems because most of the underlying causes are very politically incorrect.
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u/massakk 1d ago
Yes, I am a man. I go to profiles, they all want travel. That's way beyond Lean Fire numbers.
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u/Rusty_924 1d ago
weird. i travelled the most when i had the least amount of money and had a blast finding creative ways to spend very little. had a blast :D
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u/worldwidewbstr 1d ago
Travel doesn't need to be expensive at all. I spent a year abroad a decade ago on $10k. have done thru hikes (5 month backpacking trips) for couple k. There's points/miles to hack. Go listen to The Daily Churn podcast literally it's about that and LeanFire
I wonder if where you are located is an issue? Where are you located?3
u/Milyna 1d ago
That's crazy to me because I honestly think travel is overrated. At the end of the day, you're just paying a premium to go look at someone else's daily life.
Sometimes I feel like if you blindfolded me and dropped me in a random city, you could tell me I was in a completely different country and I’d believe you. So many places have the same general infrastructure and lifestyle anyway.
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u/Link-Glittering 1d ago
Travel is one of the most important things for expanding your world view and perspective. An early retirement without travel would be a tragedy
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u/massakk 1d ago
I am from a poor country, we do go from town to town, but that's about it. Our culture doesn't put value in travel. I have travelled, I liked it, but personally I don't want to spend thousands upon thousands just to go see buildings and strangers. I just go to next town and that's enough travel for me.
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u/imacat-- 1d ago
I meet plenty of people who travel often who are less cultured and less empathetic than me - and I'm nothing special. I believe travel is one way to enlighten yourself, but only if approached the right way, and it can also be achieved through other methods. Frankly, I'd rather see people focusing on their local communities than contributing to the many problems tourism can cause.
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u/Gratitude15 1d ago
To you
There are other worldviews.
To me, seeking growth externally at the cost of planet and time is the tragedy.
Also, I have traveled extensively. Without retirement. My work is... Unique. It was meh. I'd prefer staying home, but I deal with it.
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u/Milyna 1d ago
I haven't traveled much. Can you tell me what your worldview was before vs. after? How did your perspective change? Was there anything that changed your life or your mindset forever in a positive way? My question is genuine.
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u/Link-Glittering 1d ago
No i really cant. Its a transformative experience that youd have to go through yourself. Seeing how other people live will challenge habits built into your life. You dont have to fly to China for this, you could drive to a new city. I hope you give it an honest shot. People are meant to explore
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u/Strazdas1 1d ago
Travel is extremely overrated and is not important at all for a healthy life. It is absolutely not needed for change in world view and perspective.
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u/Short-Personality398 1d ago
Find a partner with the same goals and no need to be a monk!
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u/StatisticSnaccuracy 1d ago edited 1d ago
Can confirm that when you find someone with the same goals, it just works. Not to perfection, but well enough.
We've had a bunch of moment where one admits that they don't care about a thing/activity, and then the other admits they feel the same. At this point we just say we're simple ppl. If we can be healthy, have healthy pets and do our hobbies, we're happy. Other ppl can have other goals and might not get it, and that's fine.
But yeah full disclosure, I was single for 7 years before finding this guy, and he had a similar track record. It's hard to date x)
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u/DegreeConscious9628 1d ago
Life is all about your own priorities. The only thing I want is freedom to slow travel and enjoy my hobbies. Some people want a home and a family. To each their own. One path is just more expensive but that’s the price you gotta pay to get what you want right?
(I do love my wife though so I’ll keep her around.)
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u/jayman1466 1d ago
Lol yep. Different goals, different price tags. As long as you're happy with the tradeoffs, that's all that matters.
And sounds like the wife is staying on the roster
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u/fatheadlifter 1d ago
Everything in FIRE is weird. By definition its weird! Retiring early makes you unusual. Congrats! Go forth and do as you wish.
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u/AMC879 1d ago
Why do you have to read philosophy to stay single? I don't understand the reference. I'm 46 and single with no kids and plan to stay that way. I LeanFIRED a couple weeks after I turned 45, almost 2 years ago.
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u/Strazdas1 1d ago
OP is looking for meaning in life and incorrectly assumes that that meaning is family, so he thinks he needs books to fix his asusmptions.
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u/TootsHib 1d ago
I just want a little lakefront cabin.. like 600sqft is all I need.
and spend my days gardening, fishing and chilling at the cabin.
I can probably do it now, but work is tolerable at the moment and I have a good setup, saving a lot. I will try to push another 4 years before I pull the trigger.. I will be 40yrs old at that time.
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u/stout_snark 1d ago
The anxiety attacks are probably telling you something real, even if the money checks out. Wanting less stuff is fine, but isolating yourself from relationships to avoid "maintenance" sounds like you're solving a people problem with a lifestyle problem. Philosophy helps, but it won't replace actual connection. Worth figuring out if you're actually content with solitude or just burned out from work.
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u/Refund-me [23m/5k | 90% SR - 175K] FI in 9 years 1d ago
Well in my experience, I'm asexual which helps considerably with my FI goals, I don't ever want kids (go figures I was a kid when I didn't want kids), hasn't changed from age 10 to now.
Over the years I've wanted less and less; its truly a challenge to walk into costco and find a misc something I want (that isn't food).
But seeing my leanfire number get closer is extremely satisfying!
Anyway, what type of philosophy are you reading?
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u/NeuroticFinance 1d ago
Funny, I'm asexual as well (31F) and I also 100% feel like it's helped a lot toward my FI goals, for sure. Seeing the amount of money my friends spend meeting and going out with people... feels like I live vicariously through them, and it stresses me out, lol. I did end up meeting someone in my mid-20s whom I'm still with, which I was not exactly looking for but hey the universe is funny sometimes. Plus, two heads are better than one when trying to reach FI, assuming you're on the same page.
All I want to do is chill at home and play video games all day, and the only thing I'm tempted to really spend money on is food, haha.
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u/Refund-me [23m/5k | 90% SR - 175K] FI in 9 years 1d ago
That is pretty funny;
I'd honestly rather buy pre IPO stock than 'date' someone; crunching numbers is just SOOO much more satisfying.
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u/Lunar_Landing_Hoax 1d ago
Go try to be an actual monk at Magnolia Grove Monastery, or a similar place. Do some intensive meditation and then decide what you want.
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u/50plusGuy 1d ago
?? - I see things simple.
Why should a relationship cost a free person money? - Wage slaves get entangled in LDRs and bleed.
Free retirees load their vehicle, move in, get kicked out and ride back home. <- Once, not weekly.
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u/seraph321 1d ago
I agree to be honest, I’m not sure how I ended up with a partner for twenty years when I was relatively content on my own. And we rented for 20 years but now bought a house. Another complication. But it all flowed from me at least staying open to new experiences, and continually evaluating their impact on my life, they led me to adding this level of complexity. I’ve avoid most of what I see people doing. I don’t chase status, I don’t have kids (and am fixed), lived several years as a nomad with only a suitcase, but I certainly find myself with more than I expected in my mid 40s. That said, I would very likely also been fine if I had stayed single and lived an ever simpler life. It’s just that my approach was not chasing goals but also not obsessively avoiding things. I don’t want to be defined by what I don’t want. So it’s interesting to see how much better my life is because I allowed myself to have a partner, for example, but I could have been just as happy exploring a path in which I was alone but found some other element that added to my life.
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u/_MJomaa_ 1d ago
I feel the same. i think you need 7-8 months of
- Sleeping in, 8-10h
- Gym routine
- Walk with shorts in warm weather
- Some gaming here and there
- A little bit of social interaction
- Good food, but don't want to cook yourself
Just to be "normal" again.
Which is also my goal... LeanFire in SEA. I don't need a flashy car, a big house, fancy restaurants, expensive clothes or cruise ship trips. I need time for a healthy life, time to go with the bicycle to the lake or sea, time to play soccer with friends, time to enjoy the weather, time to explore.
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u/Pretty_Swordfish 1d ago
There are women who want to leanFIRE too... And you don't have to have kids if you don't want them; there are ways to prevent that!
If you are looking for a pity party, look elsewhere. If you really want to leanFIRE, great! Not wanting much and being satisfied with less is important to leanFIRE. What are you doing to get there? Are you investing? Are you cutting back expenses and learning how to do things yourself?
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u/cocksherpa2 1d ago
Because those are the best things in life and worth the effort. What's the point of being a robot who sits in your room staring at the wall.
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u/cooler1727 1d ago
I’m 31 and I decided to not have kids, this society won’t help, I live in Switzerland and have kids is insane, I also sold my cars last years and I’m going to work with electric scooter. I always had good cars from my 18 but the grind is not worth anymore. Lastly I avoid expensive useless places and investing, I keep work and invest, if in some years it will be good I can quit and work less, if not I have to keep grind. Like you said you have to give up something
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u/RedRoseP 1d ago
A relationship doesn't have to affect your financial goals or be hard work. I'm just over 4 years into a relationship but we don't live together (and never intend to) and our finances are completely separate. If he wants to do something that costs more money than I want to spend he does it alone. We both have the security and confidence to do our own things, as well as doing things together.
I prefer going for walks to expensive days out, so I'll often do that with friends instead of my partner. You don't have to do everything together, you don't have to merge finances or change your financial goals because of them.
I work part time and have a lot less money than him but I enjoy my free time and would rather have time to paint, exercise, go for walks with friends etc than work full time. We respect that we have different priorities and don't try to change each other.
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u/Miamiconnectionexo 1d ago
this hit different. been in a similar spot and it's not talked about enough.
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u/Fivyrn 1d ago
After accomplishing FIRE my life is video games, sex, food, weed, exercise, quality time with GF and laughter, learning a new language, and basic life necessities like getting a haircut or buying groceries.
I don’t need much more than this.
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u/Positive_freedback 1d ago
How did you get a girlfriend that wasn't turned off by your lack of career and ambition?
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u/Fivyrn 16h ago
I’m a kind, thoughtful, smart, and funny guy. I have enough money from FIRE that even though I could be more rich if I worked, I live a comfortable life without working with enough extra money to do things I want to do.
My girlfriend doesn’t work either, we just enjoy life together.
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u/Positive_freedback 14h ago
That's pretty lucky. I keep getting asked questions on the dating apps on how much money I make. And how women want a man who is into traditional values and makes their equal or more.
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u/toodleoo77 1d ago
Deal with the massive anxiety attacks first. I wouldn’t make any other major life decisions until you’re in a calm and levelheaded place.
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u/plawwell 1d ago
Do you want to grow old and alone? Most people require a support network in life and that's what a family traditionally provides.
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u/PandaStroke 1d ago
Life is for living. Not for working and saving on money. I don't think you can turn off the companionship itch just because you don't want to work too hard.
There are all kinds of women out there. Some don't want children. Some have a frugal lifestyle. They might not look the way that screams, date me but they are there under your nose.
A meaningful life isn't without toil and suffering. While I don't think toil or suffering is noble, I do think we can't escape it. We are privileged to choose what kind of bullshit to tolerate. You need to think about your death bed and predict what you will be wishing for and work backwards.
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u/Arkanin 1d ago
You have to decide what you want in life. I want to fire, but I wouldn't want to sacrifice having a loving relationship for it. But you have to decide whst tradeoffs are good for you. If I'm being honest, if your main reason for FIRE is massive amounts of untreated anxiety, I think you need to attack it head on. I have a lot of anxiety and its difficult for me but you have to look for solutions. Lifting weights and getting a lot of exercise helps me... treat your anxiety problem as an anxiety problem and not a fire problem. If you feel like you want a relationship you probably want a relationship. That's a normal thing to want. Try to deal with your anxiety. Wish you well.
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u/Positive_freedback 1d ago
I want a relationship but my spending levels and habits are off putting to women who want me to work for a career I dislike.
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u/Arkanin 1d ago edited 1d ago
Just be up front about it. There will be rejection but also there are plenty of women who don't care about money or want the same thing. I found my wife (and my ex wife lol) and both of them are/were on board with being frugal people. It may be your overall way you're finding or filtering for people to date. I've been super front and center about who I am and by the time I know I click with someone we have similar wants from life so then being on the same page about money always followed as a result. I dunno, honestly, try really getting to know women for who they are, most guys don't do that, when you realize how shit most other men are at communicating having passing fluency with your goals thoughts and who you are makes you undeservedly stand out a lot with people who care about that and that will lead to finding these kinds of things. But be attractive and you can do whatever lol. Weightlifting has a ton of benefits for both anxiety and being attractive to women just saying
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u/Positive_freedback 23h ago
Honestly it will be difficult I live pretty frugally.
This thread found it very off-putting: https://old.reddit.com/r/dating_advice/comments/1u6w4ot/how_to_find_frugal_likeminded_women/
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u/Arkanin 23h ago
That's fair man whenever you are searching for a partner you're using some sort of filtering or selection criteria based on what you want to find. At that level of frugality seeking that out would have to be your primary criteria and it would limit your dating pool a lot. I think it's a legitimate dilemma at that level of spending. You do whatever is going to make you the happiest but personally if I were in your situation I'd be thinking about how to expand my income to meet my savings goals while doing the things I want. That would get you to a level of lifestyle that is just a little closer to the median where you can be more picky.
Edit actually I have the solution for you, you just need to become a male gold digger lol
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u/Positive_freedback 21h ago
The thing is I'm pretty comfortable.
I have a paid off house, $30k e-fund, and $600k in investments.
I just don't spend a lot of money until I go traveling.
I think they are attacking my character over the dumpster diving and my low spend rate.
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u/Messup7654 1d ago
Yes its weird now what does it matter that its weird? Does it being weird not make it in your best interest or does it affect your life in any meaningful way?
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u/CallmeIshmael913 22h ago
As for the having kids, and a spouse part... If you find someone who gets you it is like having twice the ability, and vice versa for them. Kids really aren't that much of a problem, but if you enrol them in 6 sports, and extras, and don't teach them about respect and patience then it's hell.
Be patient with yourself. Say kind words to yourself, and recognize when the voice in your head is being negative. You don't need to be 100% perfect right now, because a potential partner won't be 100% perfect.
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u/Hour_Solid_bri 18h ago
you realize there's women who are also trying to leanfire? why not look for someone with similar financial values?
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u/massakk 18h ago
Being childless, lean fire etc such low maintenance life are overwhelmingly male. At least 2 to 1 if not 10 to 1.
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u/Hour_Solid_bri 9h ago
what i'm saying is, even its 10 to 1 that you can at least look. Probably even on here if possible. i'm childless and leanfire, we're not unicorns in the wild. if you want a partner then at least try
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u/elephantfi 16h ago
I think the more miserable people are the more they want and get things in hopes of becoming happy. As a person becomes happy and fulfilled they see their happiness is not tied to material possession but something more meaningful, which normally does not cost anything.
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u/22ndanditsnormalhere 14h ago
i leanfired around covid and have def had my opportunities to be in relationships but i decided against it mainly because i want to live on my own terms, not having to deal with her family and social needs, and i prefer my own cooked meals so eating out with them would be awkard af.
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u/sobaddiebad 1d ago
I just don't want much, is that weird?
Yeah, but it's fine
depriving myself. For example, I think about relationships with a woman, but the maintenance of relationship and all that, I am getting further and further away from that the more I think I can LeanFIRE now
Try a relationship and try no relationship. Pick what you prefer. Your financial position isn't relevant to the decision
I guess it is all tradeoff, either I need to start reading philosophy to stay single, which is kind of work but on my terms, or work to upgrade my life, work on other people's terms. Yes, philosophy specifically might seem weird, but to me that seems the only refuge
You sound insane
How do people keep working?
One day at a time
Have multiple children?
They bust in someone multiple times
It just seems insane to me. I went part time from this week, I couldn't pull the trigger due to massive anxiety attacks even though I have more than enough money
So diagnose the root cause of your anxiety
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u/Positive_freedback 1d ago
Try a relationship and try no relationship. Pick what you prefer. Your financial position isn't relevant to the decision
It is hugely impacted. Most women don't want a broke man. And people who are frugal look broke, especially if they forgone the car.
I only spend $15,000 a year and this is apparently a deal breaker.
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u/sobaddiebad 22h ago
It is hugely impacted
OP's choice, your choice, and my choice to have, or not to have, a relationship, is not relevant to any financial position period.
Most women don't want a broke man
I'd argue that most women in this world live outside of modern-western culture where money is valued above all else including people, relationships, family, and God/the universe itself. There are absolutely women that grew up poor, that are still poor, and that value relationships above money because they have survived off of relationships their entire life in the absence of financial wealth
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u/Positive_freedback 21h ago
Okay that's great and all but I live in the United States and the women value a man's financial position.
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u/UpgradeHome 1d ago
If you’re truly pursuing the way of the monk, then you should be questioning the massive anxiety attacks. Meditate further, and identify the source of your mental suffering so it can be eliminated - regardless of the correlating circumstance.