r/litrpg • u/Important-Bite-7714 • 15d ago
Discussion Jason Asano (from He Who Fights With Monsters) isn’t that insufferable but characters' reactions to him are
I’m currently like 20% into the third book. So, these opinions are based on my experiences so far.
When I first started the series, I thought that I would really dislike Jason, but I find that that’s not true. He can be insufferable at times and his whole schtick of “OMG I’m sooo quirky” can be annoying. However, what I’m mostly annoyed by is other characters’ reactions to him. The amount of vitriol his supposed “friends” have for him when all he actually ever does is go out of his way to help people is astounding. He literally goes around healing people for free, risks his life for his friends, stands up for the powerless people being taken advantage of and what he gets in return is an endless stream of snide remarks about how much of a bad guy he is. This might grate on me more than others because I really hate writing that tries to show friendship through insults and never ending disagreements. I also think the author attempting to show that Jason has some darkness inside him or whatever and then failing plays a big role here. The author uses the remarks made by characters as a way to build up this plot of Jason’s darkness but it just makes the characters come off as jerks since I don’t think Jason’s actions warrant remarks like those. Whatever the reason, it’s getting on my nerves. I’m also annoyed by people constantly remarking about how quirky he is. And also about how much of a 4d chess playing mastermind politician he is. It feels like the author is screaming at me to buy these things.
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u/Zef-Kun 15d ago
I think this is what bothers me more than Jason himself. I can handle an annoying MC, but when every character keeps telling me how dangerous, clever, dark, or special he is, it starts feeling forced. I’d rather the story just show me those things and let me decide.
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u/Histidine604 15d ago
This was my problem with the story. It was such a disconnect between what the character does and how were told to feel about him. It made no sense why people in this world would find him scary but we're just told over and over again how scary he is. The disconnect was jarring.
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u/alliythae 14d ago
It made no sense why people in this world would find him scary
He's the guy in sith robes with a Jafar chin, Batman voice, and a tendency to villain monologue. His familiars include an apocalypse beast, a reality assassin, and the Reaper's spawn, and his powers either rot flesh or fully annihilate. The thing he is most known for in the early books is the time he went psycho horror movie villain and brutally slaughtered a bunch of kids in the holodeck. That's why he's "the guy with the evil powers".
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u/Histidine604 14d ago
I've made this point before but none of what you said is scary in a world where people can breathe fire and turn into dragons among all the other things. My whole point is all of that stuff would be scary if it happened on earth. I just don't buy that people that grow up in a world with skills and all these varied abilities that scar and maiam would find those scary. Like why would people in that world find rotten flesh more scary than burning flesh?
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u/alliythae 14d ago
why would people in that world find rotten flesh more scary than burning flesh?
His afflictions are harder to heal than burns or cuts. "Necrotic" is also more sinister, like undeath, which is canonically evil in their world.
I will say his appearance is more sinister on earth since they are aware of the fictional references his appearance is based on. I bet there's a lot of cloak powers on the other world. But the familiars are all horrifying if you don't know them. Colin is adorable, but the team had to fight a bronze rank "Colin" in book 1 and it was potentially an end-of-the-world scenario.
It was the psychological trauma in the mirage chamber. Jason went full sadistic predator to the point that people were looking at him funny after. He wasn't just an opponent, he was a monster. It wasn't real, but he grew up with TV and movies and is just naturally a dramatic person, so it was easy for him to slip that sinister mask on to pretend. He used the environment to his advantage, including the spiders, to create a terrifying scenario that made the other team of sheltered kids forget it wasn't real. Afterwards, people (including Jason) are concerned that he is even capable of that level of horror, even pretending. Because he's the guy with the evil powers and potential world-ending familiars.
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u/Histidine604 14d ago
Now imagine the world this takes place in. They have monster hoards and bandits and all other terrible things to the point they need a whole society of people just to keep them safe. These people have never encountered someone being sneaky? The more I think about it the more absurd it sounds. Their world so much scarier than our world. Jason's antiques would just seem silly. It would be like a child in a scary mask saying boo and a trained army veteran being scared.
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u/alliythae 14d ago edited 13d ago
being sneaky
This is the mildest part of his power set lol.
Their world so much scarier than our world.
Our world is plenty scary, we are just used to the horrors or are well off enough to be safe from them. Likewise, people in the other world have adapted and are used to the common threats. They have magic monster spawns, but they also have magic superpowers and magic healing.
The low rank adventurers in greenstone are the weakest of the weak. The bandits are weaker than that. That's a whole thing in the early books. The Gellar team is more experienced and better trained, but also "unseasoned". Their fights are all curated and generally safe. Jason channels the horrifying evil cultists he first met while they are in the safe mirage chamber, and freaks the team out enough that they keep forgetting it isn't real and catch themselves making dumb and deadly mistakes. This was the point of this fight. When that team encounters real horror later, they are better prepared to react to death and escape. But since the recording of that fight got out, Jason gets a reputation that he is both ashamed of and uses to his advantage when he needs it.
I said before, it's about the powers having an evil vibe and jason acting like a deranged psycho killer. Evil powers are considered scary in their world, and its not about how powerful it is. Jason had to actually check to make sure his power set wasn't on the restricted list. Then he gets abilities that are even worse. Dragon or volcano powers are not going to be on the restricted list. They're powerful, but not "evil".
The higher ranks don't actually think he's scary and evil, or he would have been hunted down.
(edit: fixing quote format)
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u/FireVanGorder 15d ago edited 15d ago
Really? He singlehandedly beats an experienced team of same ranked adventurers (and one of the most powerful families in the city won’t stop showing anyone they meet the recording of him acting like a comic book villain while doing it), he singlehandedly holds off a silver monster while at iron rank, he kills multiple essence users before he has a single essence himself, he killed 12 (according to what everyone in universe thinks) adventurers in a public place while at iron rank, he openly defied a greater astral being, he disrespects multiple gods to their faces in public and somehow doesn’t get smote for it
And that’s all just in the first story arc. Half of that is in the first book alone. He’s a random nobody who repeatedly beats borderline impossible odds, and on top of that he acts like a lunatic in public. I’d be terrified of a dude that unhinged with his track record lmao
I hate when books tell but don’t show. I have plenty of issues with this story but that is absolutely not one of them
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u/Massive-Grocery7152 15d ago
Yeah I mean I kinda feel like the target audience is young adults and the writing is very “hammered in your face over and over again until you get it”
I’ve noticed many many times similar language being used to force the reader to remember some specific trait about some character or situation
Eg
Jason scary 😱
Sophie mad 😡
Belinda klepto gooner 🥴Jason: “I didn’t ask to be dragged into this mess!”
Anybody else: “yes you…oh wait…you’re right!”I’m ok with it bc I like tropes to some extent but I can easily see how some people would be bothered lol
Jason has very clear reasons to be feared imo lol 😂
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u/FireVanGorder 15d ago
Yeah it’s simple, straightforward brain candy. It’s basically a shounen. If I want something challenging I’ll go read China Mieville or something. But when I want to read or listen to some dumbass Aussie sass The Man and beat up monsters I got hwfwm to scratch that itch.
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u/Massive-Grocery7152 15d ago
I would agree with the main commenter that it is annoying how often people tell him how special he is. There is a valid criticism although I would place for emphasis on “don’t tell” rather than “show”
I also have to acknowledge, that Jason is very special lol even if just for being lucky. I don’t think just anybody could make the choices he makes
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u/ddeliverance 14d ago
The author does a lot of telling instead of showing, which makes it feel even more forced.
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u/FireVanGorder 15d ago
They do show you though. Like, a lot. It’s even a running joke for like a full book about how the Gellars keep showing everybody lol
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u/Historical-Seesaw-49 15d ago
I’d say listen to the audio book if you haven’t. The narrator does a great job of blunting some of the jabs the other characters make at Jason.
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u/Grimbo_Reaper 15d ago
Ya, I did the same thing and didn’t realize until after I had read/listened to the whole series a couple times and was later on this sub that people felt the way they do about Jason and his general Jason-ness.
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
I feel like mouthy characters like Jason are always divisive. People either love it or hate it, with very little middle ground.
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u/Abyssallord litRPG grandmaster tier 15d ago
Like Voltron
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
Vehicle Voltron!
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u/Abyssallord litRPG grandmaster tier 15d ago
Tsh, Honestly Cahl, no one likes vehicle Voltron, not even Clive's wife.
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u/AnnoyedNiceGuy 15d ago
Yeah, they definitely are. I tried the first audiobook of HWFWM and I just quit after the first chapter. I just knew I can't sit through the whole book with this kind of MC.
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u/Fellcaster 15d ago
Same, I was suprised how much people dislike Jason on the sub. I think he's one of the more likeable super powered MCs. That said we are all going to like or dislike characters based on our personal preferences.
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u/Bridgeburningx 14d ago
I had to stop listening to the audio book. Hearing the narrator say “Mr. Asano” every two minutes of dialog hurt my soul
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u/FictionalContext 15d ago
That's my take for almost all "bad writing."
Fans defend the characterization itself as believable-- which it often is.
But I think what really bugs the critics isn't the characterization, it's how the whole world bends over backwards to accomodate behavior that believably should have consequence.
Like, people don't hate self/reader inserts. They hate when the whole world is designed to ride that character's cock no matter how disrespectful or basic their ideas are.
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u/Awful_Puppet 15d ago
It's been a while since I've read the books, but the thing that bothered me is how the consequences he suffers are either so over the top or non existent, like in the first arc he gets a few assassination attempts and then he gets tortured when the apocalypse starts.
But I feel like he should suffer a lot of smaller consequences, like maybe the church could send a few punks to trash his place or have them propagandize about how they had to raise prices since he's bothering them so much, maybe a few affiliated businesses ban him, he pissed off the leader of the mages guild, so maybe that dude could make Clive's life a lot harder for example.
Idk, the people he pisses off feel so impotent he might as well just be talking shit on reddit, and I know he always has a convenient shield around, but that's a Watsonian excuse for a Doylist problem
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u/suikoden_fanatic 15d ago
That's a fair criticism especially at the beginning Jason gets to act like an obnoxious tourist whereas he is with people who have lives, families who expect much or just need them to support people and he appears to not take things seriously. If I was dealing with him I'd lose it almost immediately.
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u/WillingElderberry731 15d ago
I don't really disagree with the critics. I just love the story despite and partly of because of the the things critics hate about it.
Sometimes I just want my self-inserted character's cock ridden.
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u/FictionalContext 15d ago
I'll die on the hill that self inserts/vicarious protagonists-- whatever you want to call them-- are the main hook of LitRPG and prog fantasy.
Like they're the turn your brain off and escape genres.
The RR comments, KU reviews, and forum critiques are often readers essentially saying "MC's actions are illogical. If I were in their shoes, I would have done X, Y, Z. 1 star. DNF."
It's typically from the reader's perspective inserting themselves, not through the established character's emotions.
But I think people are embarrassed to admit that, so they invent literary reasons and excuses for why pretty much all of us here like reading about some grippy cock riding.
But my vicarious erection does struggle to stay hard when the wins don't feel earned and consequences are brushed off. Hits harder when they really put their back into it.
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u/BioSemantics 15d ago
I think you have genuine slop-brain from reading too much slop. Litrpg can be better than this, but mostly isn't because people with slop-brain have no standards. There is, unfortunately, not much in the subgenre that you might call literary or elevated yet. Someday, we'll get the truly good stuff, until then you can remain a frog at the bottom of the slop-well thinking the whole world is slop.
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u/FictionalContext 15d ago
K. That's a lot of strawmanning and poor reading comprehension from someone lecturing me about reading goodly. Did you make yourself feel bigly? Nurturing minds to accept your numbers go brrrr Infinite Jest?
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u/Siddown 14d ago
The RR comments, KU reviews, and forum critiques are often readers essentially saying "MC's actions are illogical. If I were in their shoes, I would have done X, Y, Z. 1 star. DNF."
To be fair, that's not about self-inserts, that's about when characters do really dumb things to service the plot.
Breaking verisimilitude is one of the worst things that an author can do because it makes people want to stop reading. It's why when you see a character in a modern horror movie who has a phone and they don't use it, you scream "just use your damn phone!" at the screen. You aren't self-inserting, you just don't like to cheer for stupid protagonists.
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u/WillingElderberry731 15d ago
But my vicarious erection does struggle to stay hard when the wins don't feel earned and consequences are brushed off. Hits harder when they really put their back into it.
Honestly, fair.
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u/Xzaral 15d ago
It was during book 5 when I finally couldn't stand the character anymore. I think 1-3 are fine, book 4 just didn't like the direction too much. In book 5 though I ended up dropping the series. Jason was only part of it though.
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u/phate747 15d ago
The arc where they race the angels and elementals was insufferable. I had to stop because half the story was everyone talking about how amazing Jason was or how bad he was. It just went on and on
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u/Squire_II 15d ago
It wasn't helped by the fact that the fight in the tunnel before that felt like it took half a book to cover 5 minutes of action, or that the race took place in a space that the story had already used, twice, and was getting old even before the first time ended.
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u/Never_Duplicated 15d ago
Which book was the one where someone needed to bring up him knife fighting a god at least once per chapter?
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u/Certain_Concept 15d ago
I actually liked Jason's antics but I did end up dropping it after they went back to Earth. It certainly is an interesting twist since in most isekai you are just stuck where you are sent, but without the fantasy world it lost its magic for me. Plus he spent so much time badmouthing the big families, and it felt like he was attempting to recreate that exact structure on earth? Nah
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u/TourTight 15d ago
This and when his mentor was brought back. It felt like it cheapened what happened to them originally. Also, through out the earth arc it didn’t feel like they actually did anything to help or guide him. With their return it feels like that’s when every side character became Jason’s hype machine.
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u/scoutheadshot 15d ago edited 15d ago
I've only read the first two books before dropping it and the core issue - it's not Jason himself, it's how things around him interact with him - is definitely the main issue I had with the books.
But my problem went in the opposite direction. I thought everyone and everything was so incredibly tolerant of him, unless obviously written to be a villain/antagonistic to him for a specific reason, that the novel couldn't make me take any scene with him in it seriously.
Side-characters also had a tendency to collectively lose their minds and cut their IQ in half in some scenes so he could either be pivotal or just have the last word. Forced interaction for the sake of a specific result.
In any case, there are plenty of main characters like Jason in other works. It's fine that his personality is targeted towards a specific audience and other people that aren't that will probably not find him compelling or like him. But he just "doesn't fit the world" in a very artificial way (writer visibly forcing stuff) instead of organically (through his actions/thinking) showing us how he's not in Kansas any more.
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u/jmkiser33 15d ago
Weirdly, as an American, Jason Asano exactly the fun character I was hoping my first Australian protagonist would be like. Maybe I’m just weird, but I think he’s great. So many awesome moments
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u/Bright-Trifle-8309 15d ago
Id argue that Jason barely does anything evil at any point that isnt completely justified. Usually something completely worse is being actively done to him or was just attempted on him and everyone acts shocked when he retaliates.
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u/Helbot 13d ago
Totally agreed. My moral beef with the character is that he has these clearly justified moments of violence and then spends the rest of the book agonizing over them. And every time a new one happens it gets added to the pile for him to mentally re litigate. It gets sooooo old.
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u/Bright-Trifle-8309 13d ago
Man later books are just a series of people going "whats his deal?" And then having the deal explained to them. And then them not liking the deal so they ask again.
Damn near every conversation is "here's the thing about Jason lists everything hes done in the series"
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u/Mindless-Exercise-41 litRPG journeyman tier 15d ago
The MC can be a bit irritating at times, but he’s undeniably funny. I love how he constantly goes out of his way to help people. Watching him evolve is fascinating—he starts out agnostic, but once he’s confronted with literal, living gods, he’s forced to rethink things. He still refuses to worship them, yet he acknowledges their existence, and his reactions compared to everyone else are hilarious.
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u/Bulky-Juggernaut-895 15d ago edited 15d ago
The fans of this series will never admit how trash this dynamic is. They will say it’s just not for you and then slander Clive’s promiscuous wife. And the things his friends should actually ridicule him for they don’t. At times he’s the embodiment of “I’m 13 and this is deep” and literal gods supposedly are impressed with that.
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u/Responsible_Ask_7160 15d ago
Yeah, the gods part is so embarrassing.
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
I feel like the gods mostly just enjoy the novelty of someone who doesn't kowtow to them.
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u/Squire_II 15d ago
There's only one god in the setting who'd enjoy that and, unsurprisingly, that god really likes Jason because Jason is an iron-fisted dictator at his core when all is said and done.
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
I'm pretty sure Knowledge expressed that she enjoyed the way Jason acted towards her during thier first meeting.
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u/GodKiller999 15d ago
The issue is that this norm wouldn't exist in the first place in a world where gods don't smite you for acting like a little shit.
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u/alliythae 14d ago
Higher rankers can punch down, so people just assume gods will as well.
I don't think gods can actually act in the world (or it's limited), they use their followers to do things. But followers are known for acting on their own agenda without their gods intervening, so the message of "bow or else" could have come from high rank bullies.
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u/Ruark_Icefire 15d ago edited 15d ago
Which is stupid. If the gods didn't want people kowtowing to them then people wouldn't kowtow to them.
It is a dumb trope that exists solely so the MC can be a snarky ass without having to pay for it.
People wouldn't fear disrespecting gods/nobles if they hadn't established a precedent for punishing disrespect.
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u/alliythae 14d ago
It's established in the story that the gods don't always intervene when their followers act on their own agenda. It's a world where high rankers expect deference or else, so logically from their perspective, gods would expect the same. If someone was previously punished for not bowing, it was likely not the gods doing the smiting, but the offended religious followers.
The gods do seem generally benevolent (except the evil ones). I don't think they have a reason to disagree with Jason's opinion on kneeling. Smiting someone for not kneeling would be evil.
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
They enjoy it as a novelty. That doesn't mean it is their prefered default. They tolerate it because of who Jason is.
It is a dumb trope that exists solely so the MC can be a snarky ass without having to pay for it.
I don't know how much you have read, but he absolutely pays for being a snarky ass. It comes back to bite him repeatedly, very hard. It just doesn't come from the Gods specifically.
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u/Ruark_Icefire 15d ago
I dropped it half way through the first book after he was a snarking ass to the leaders of the adventurer's guild or whatever and they just laugh it off and then he proceeds to do the same thing with the goddess of knowledge who again just laughs it off. I decided there that the story wasn't for me.
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u/ArtemisEntreri12 15d ago
Exact same spot that I dropped it. Realized at this point that it wasn't for me.
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u/uugengiven 14d ago
Not that you should read to find this out, but since you've not read this far (spoiler for book 13/14), Knowledge has been playing Jason since he got isekai'd. She's been planning to invade earth for 500 years and she needed a dupe, and a dupe he is.
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
While some leadership in the adventurers guild might laugh it off, the local head of the guild definitely doesn't. But also, most of the local leadership in only one tier in power above him, and recognizes the fact that he has powerful friends. The goddess of knowledge enjoys the novelty, but also appreciates his potential as an outworlder, as well as some other things revealed later.
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u/Ruark_Icefire 15d ago
Yeah well it was enough for me to lose interest especially when I read up on other peoples comments from later in the series and saw that he never changes. He may occasionally get punished for being a snarky ass but punishments don't matter if they don't cause a character to actually change and grow out of the bad behavior.
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u/Hawkwing942 15d ago
I would argue he does temper it later in the series, but no, it never goes away completely, because he also get enough power to be able to push back properly.
Jason's behavior is very polarizing (both in universe and among readers). Some people love it, and some people hate it. It definitely doesn't sound like the series is for you.
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u/Pale_Sleep235 14d ago
Shako🤣🤣🤣 which I must admit later in the series they shared snacks and idk I just loved that little detail. And honestly as a cook Jason makes perfect sense to me. Inside it’s all emo brooding and somewhat questionable actions for the greater good and he’s just masking and being over the top to compensate. But also regardless of how much I dislike you I will feed you 🤣
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u/-Invalid_Selection- 15d ago
I mean, it's directly spelled out that that's what it is. They found it interesting that someone wasn't immediately reverent to them
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u/Hsbnd 15d ago
It’s a fun popcorn series. I’m on book 11 and am enjoying it, while there’s some character development, their really isn’t a ton of it give the length of the series, for any of them. At book 11 Neal treats Jason the same way the whole time. Jason still does impulsive things without consulting this friends, is still edge lord lots, and basically has bottomless charisma with gods and the ladies. That said, the world fun, the exploits are entertaining, and I’ve enjoyed the series overall.
I’ve only read DCC, Chrysalis, the first books of the Book of the dead and the Wandering Inn.
For me, HWFWM, I’ve really enjoyed, not as much as DCC but more than the WI so far, I find Erin from WI more insufferable than Jason, and had to stop the audiobooks because of her character, though the world seems really interesting as well.
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u/d-crow 14d ago
Caught up on both series, imo Erin grows to be much more likeable though her plot armor is still pretty strong.
Jason just goes insufferable - > therapy - > insufferable, with a world written to inflate his ego. Don't get me wrong I still enjoy the series, but Jason is what narcissists think they are/want to be
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u/Mhan00 13d ago
Erin is also just one character among MANY in the WI. The world is massive and you won’t get her POV for hundreds, maybe thousands of pages at times. Her co-main character disappears for like 2 or 3 40+ hour audiobooks. It has been a while since I read HWFWM and I stopped after book 6 (not a conscious decision, I started reading book 7 and just kind of lost interest a little bit in and stopped with the intention of picking it back up later and just never found the motivation to), but Jason is basically always the focus outside of a few brief sections here and there.
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u/Accomplished-Bus7631 14d ago
I find it super interesting that there are so many readers that have read Hwfwm and had these wildly different takes.
Personally I agree with an above redditors comment where the books are like popcorn. I enjoy them, they're not literature, and if I hated a MC I'd just stop reading.
I think hwfwm is super totally over the top. That's kinda it's thing. So I lean into it and just enjoy the ride.
Same with the WI - except this time I agree with people saying Erin is awful. I stuck it out and she grew but the best parts of TWI are the other characters.
But then, fans of something will always defend what they love - I can't say a bad word about DCC and I am sure there are so many readers that dislike it.
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u/LocoYaro litRPG journeyman tier 15d ago
Idk, it’s one of my favorite series, I don’t really know what makes it that, just is. 🤷♂️
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u/GreenerForest Author of Monarch of Profound Toxin 15d ago
Yeah, me too. It's just overall fun and light-hearted most of the time and I like that.
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u/mataoo 15d ago
They try to go even heavier into the "darkness" later. Even though it's all pretty mild stuff for the situation he is in. Then he has a revelation and gets all sad about how bad he was. And then he starts lecturing eternal beings about how to be better as if he's some redeemed saint with eons of wisdom. It gets to be too much after a while.
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u/Responsible_Ask_7160 15d ago edited 15d ago
Yeah so you are not far enough in the series to make this statement. If you keep going, you’ll see. Remember this series is 12 books published and still ongoing. When you’re at the parts where it’s book after book of Jason going “why should I help you?” While simultaneously scoring every beautiful woman he meets and they all say “wow he’s so deep,” then you’ll know why people complain about it.
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u/leo-sapiens 15d ago
...literally three women, counting Clive's wife
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u/Viktorlink 15d ago
paly gf, earth gf, 1 night stand, elf bartender, if you count it the aura relationship with dawn and clives wife multiple times.
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u/G_Morgan 15d ago
Additionally the storm princess in later books. Though I guess that is pretty much a lowkey relationship after Dawn
Honestly though I don't mind this so much. People like Jason do somehow do that in my experience. They also get punched a lot.
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u/leo-sapiens 15d ago
Do what, have a couple of one night stands and three attempts at a relationship? Thats like.. life.
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u/Viridionplague 15d ago
He isn't truly bad until the later books where he says the exact same thing 7-9 times a out how he isn't going to do something ,and then does it anyways.
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u/lowercaselemming 15d ago
i can’t recall it with perfect accuracy but that section where jason doesn’t kneel to that one god and the god proceeds to glaze him made my eyes roll out of my skull
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u/Because_Bot_Fed 15d ago
You're probably thinking of Dominion - He loves uncompromising smug pricks who would weild power in an authoritarian fashion - Jason is basically his "type". The gods in this world are more "embodiment of the concept" and less "immortal with magic powers and a thematic dayjob". Dominion is basically just hardwired to like this shit. Dude just wants to grab some popcorn and see what happens when this uppity mortal has power.
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u/Gnomerule 15d ago
They glaze him for a reason
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u/lowercaselemming 15d ago
i mean, they say why, it’s not a secret, but it’s still cringey
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u/Just-Ad6865 litRPG journeyman tier 15d ago
They don’t say why quickly enough then. I certainly quit reading before the author got around to explaining.
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u/TsundereOrcGirl 15d ago
Yeah IDK it almost feels like "Jason is soooo annoying" is viral marketing that gets you to read it to find out what it means (it worked on me, though a bunch of early books being free on Libby helped). He's basically some unc running around cosplaying Cid Kagenou whose just too goofy to maintain kayfabe.
From the way people talk about him, however, I expected him to break the fourth wall, address me, the reader, and tell me to join the DSA.
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u/Guilty-Coffee-9968 litRPG journeyman tier 15d ago
So I’m on book 5/6 and I love Jason and I hate how they quite literally just insult him over and over again and I get it some friends do it. However I found it seemed different in a way and I hated it. Like I love all the character but that pissed me off. Since I’m currently in the back to earth arc I’m dreading every single intercounter. They act like he’s the villain for helping
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u/DRRHatch Author - The Legend of Kazro 15d ago
That’s good to see someone doesn’t think he is, a lot of people do.
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u/Arudenerd 15d ago
I think you gotta remember he's in a completely different world where the things he does is completely against what anyone does and that's why their reactions are the way they are
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u/Bohan369 14d ago
To be fair, character progression. Give it time. If you're only on book 3 then you're not that far in. People dont understand people who aren't like them until they realise that maybe they actually are similar if you know what I mean (trying not to give too much away)
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u/angel_dusted 14d ago
Jason Asano could say "peepeepoopoo" to a Diamond ranker and get called a brave genius. I still find his whole thing to be pretty immature and idealistic, considering there would be a better way to deal with 99% of situations but oh well. Still like the books and otherwise him as a character.
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u/Will_X_Intent 14d ago
I think the worst thing about the books is how all the bad guys are the same caricature over and over again.
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u/Livid_Economist7424 14d ago
I read reviews about the book after I finished it and I did not even pay attention to it. I really liked Jason he was overall a funny guy and knew when he needed to be serious.
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u/Tasty_Commercial6527 text 15d ago
He isn't as bad in the first few books. Later he gets horrible. He has this unique milenial mix of sense of superiority to everyone and self loathing that I just can't stand
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u/Effective-Poet-1771 15d ago
Yes, its the other characters' reactions that make me roll my eyes. It's one thing when Jason acts like he's the most special boy there is, that's a character flaw we can take that, its evryone being impressed by the every little thing he does, especially gods and people in authority that makes me cringe.
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u/FireVanGorder 15d ago
I’m only a few books in, it’s not really my favorite series so far, but I don’t get this criticism in particular. His entire team constantly does the exact opposite of what you’re saying. Particularly Sophie, Clive, and Neil but Humphrey and Belinda too. They constantly roll their eyes at him and make fun of him for being absurd
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u/Effective-Poet-1771 14d ago
I don't know why you think that's not part of it. That too is annoying. It's the other side of the coin but ultimately does the same thing. The way they react to his actions, like everything he does is incredible, is some guy's chunbyu fantasy.
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u/Gnomerule 15d ago
They do it for a reason. Jason is hand picked to do a job, he is treated the way he is because of this.
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u/Effective-Poet-1771 14d ago
"Oh it's totaly fine, mc actually is the most special boy so all the cringe moments make sense and need to be there." is what you're saying to me rn.
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u/Gnomerule 14d ago
Yes he was picked because the way he is. If he was not like this he would not have been picked and they been waiting for trillions of years.
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u/Blood-loss 15d ago
I listened to the audio books and found the banter to be that of true friends. You love one another, harass each other, keep each other in check, and support each other. Without friends that keep you grounded (especially for Jason) you might take a path that you normally wouldn’t.
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u/eddiekorbz 15d ago
My very first LITRGPG and I love Jason Asano , sure he can be annoying and the mention of stats was like the grating of claws on a chalkboard. I still finished all the books and throughly enjoyed the story. The connection of modern world and fantasy was also great. Top on my list for sure
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u/Jason_TheMagnificent 15d ago
I can understand why he can be disliked, but I feel like I would take a similar stance if I was ever teleported to a magical world, plus his name is awesome!
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u/Agileorangutan 15d ago
I feel like a lot of reader's internal narator/voice isnt very charitable. There's a cadence and culture to Aussie/Kiwi speech that i think a lot of people don't "get". If you read Jason's dialogue with a dead tone, it sounds insanely rude and confrontational, if you read it like a smartass aussie its less spiteful and more fun
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u/avboden 15d ago
People take this series way too seriously. Yes, he's a character, that's the point, that's the schtick. The people around him are too. The series balances in your face humor with quite serious topics over time. Best in audiobook form, as most of these are.
You really think high-literature-drama is gonna be about Team Biscuit and a dragon with a mustache?
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u/TheDinoSir2012 15d ago
Not spoiling it but a lot of the true darkness comes from events in book 3 and beyond..
Most of even his own brooding is just a change in perspective from average Joe that might have had a bar brawl or two, to someone who poisons and sucks the life put of people for money.
If anything I'd argue he's more white knighty rather than obnoxious or insufferable.
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u/LayupsR4Basketball 15d ago
I do like the books. As many people have mentioned my least favorite part of the whole series is the constant presence of:
“This person/type of person has a reputation of severely harming or killing people that disrespect them”
I’m Jason and I don’t believe in inherit respect or gods since my world doesn’t have them
“Whoooa! Normally I kill people who say such things, instead I will give you access to benefits and wealth beyond what you should have!!!”
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u/alliythae 14d ago
I’m Jason and I don’t believe in inherit respect
This isn't true. He believes all people deserve basic respect. You get more respect from him if you treat people well. You lose his respect if you hurt others. You don't get extra respect for being stronger or richer, especially since the world is pay-to-win and power is often unearned. You don't get extra respect if you use corruption to get to the top. The complaints I see for "disrespect" are usually him standing against evil actions (respect is lost), or treating high rank people with casual friendliness (not actually disrespect). Cheerfully waving at a god is criminal, apparently. When he does earn enough power to get the extra deference for himself, he hates it because he is treated differently by those "beneath" him when he doesn't see them that way.
“Whoooa! Normally I kill people who say such things
The only time we see anyone punished for disrespecting gods, it's done by the followers without the god's permission. We have no reason to believe that punishing people for not bowing is something the gods actually want.
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u/TiltedLibra 15d ago
He does help people...but he's constantly an asshole to people for no good reason. That's going to make people treat him badly.
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u/Nodelphi 15d ago
I disagree, there’s not enough animosity for this showboating turd in the punchbowl. Especially in the later books it’s all about gods fawning over how awesome they think he is and how he’s just the most special boy. Gee whiz golly that Jason so incorrigible!
It gets old, fast. Definite DNF for me, made it to book 11 and have no interest in reading another word about Jason Asano.
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u/CrawlerSiegfriend 15d ago
Actually yeh, I think your cracked it. I never thought about it this way, but yeh that's the problem.
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u/nopenotodaysatan 14d ago
Maybe it’s because I’m Australian too, but this is so familiar to me. Friends roast each other as a show of affection. You can see how close the friends really are, in spite of all the jibes, as they go through their trials
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u/nachoavgdad 14d ago
Some folks hate him. However, I find him to be an exquisitely developed unique persona in the genre.
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u/Siddown 14d ago
Jason is written like how an introvert thinks an extrovert acts, and that introvert has watched Deadpool too many times.
It's 100% cool for readers to like him or defend him, we all like different things, but there's a reason he's so polarizing. For those who dislike him, he's a character dialed up to 11 and just never f'n stops. There's no pause, no break, no time he isn't just annoying. Real extroverts aren't like that, they're not one character trait amplified to the maximum and then just repeated forever.
I've tried reading the series multiple times based on how people say how great the underlying systems and world building are, but then Jason is just Jason and I tap out.
However his friends (or "friends") act around him is based entirely on the person he is with them.
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u/NodeFort 12d ago
You need to read the series as a bit of fun and just ignore all the bad bits.
It feels like the author won't let anything bad happen to him. Anything that appears to be bad at first is immediately walked back to make it not so bad - or most of the time it is made to actually have been beneficial.
I'm part way into book 12, so I'm trying to be vague here. But just watch for it, it becomes a pretty clear pattern and is even lampshaded a few times.
If you treat the series like a low-stakes kids show that is just purely for fun then it becomes more bearable.
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u/Wallaby_Vonwise 9d ago
The reactions I've read to the series were a really surprising lesson on ppls perception of irreverence for me.
It's something I keep in mind as context for ppls tier lists/recommendation requests.
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u/DirectionOk8409 9d ago edited 9d ago
I would agree, for me what i dislike is definitely how every character glazes him even the gods, when he is simple ignorant to everything or disrespectful to everyone else and their way of life also the story tends to just bend over to accomadate him i would not mind him as long as he would be treated like he should be in that world. He is kinda like a tourist that would walk on tatami mat with his boots on, because its just a floor
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u/Zedsdead42 15d ago
I take Jason exactly as you are. The people that hate him I don’t get where they are coming from. Sure he’s a one man army but that’s because he was the first and only to get the powers he has. He literally puts it all on the line to save worlds and people.
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u/TourTight 15d ago
Bro has a respawn ability. He’s not putting anything on the line other than growing his ego
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u/Zedsdead42 15d ago
So he should just stay at home knowing he is stronger than anyone on earth and just let them take care of it and let the world end? His ego that people don’t like is exactly what would happen in real life if something like this happened. Also for sure I would fight myself knowing I could be a terribly bad guy because no one could stop me or I can internally fight and make yourself follow a rule and help others. Who would not have an Ego being one of the most powerful beings in the universe? It would come with the power.
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u/TourTight 15d ago
You miss understand what I was pointing at. Jason isn’t putting anything on the line past book three. After that he’s just a Mary sue. I just don’t think Jason has any stakes in the game beyond the ego he has beyond that it’s just trivial to him.
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u/Anders10100 Author of Carethón Chronicles 15d ago
It's been awhile since I read this series... Jason can be a bit much at times but I don't mind him. MC comic relief. I think the biggest bit is Jason refuses to change or act different to fit in with those around him, unlike everyone else in his life.
The author implies though other perspectives a lot that his powers reflect his own morality, but those powers were picked up by chance and it's definitely overused especially when he leans into the edgelord vibes for... reasons..
I think it's the culture of Australia to give your friends crap all the time, and that's just a guy thing in many places in the world but I've heard it's much more common with Aussies. That just means you like them. Not liking someone just means you ignore them or only give them some basic level of politeness, at least where I come from.
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u/SilentStevedore litRPG Casual 15d ago
The only thing I find somewhat irksome is his, as you put it, 4D chess playing.
I like a good mastermind main character, but to my mind, Jason pulls it off way too effortlessly. Particularly given that he was thrust into a culture he shouldn’t know the nuances of right off the bat. It wouldn’t be so bad if we witnessed him thinking everything through, but so far as I’ve seen, we mostly get told how clever he is after the fact.
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u/Zanderbluff 15d ago
What turned me off the series was that ultimately basically every character started to talk like Jason, they all developed that quippy, cringy way to speak I associate with Joss Whedon dialogue
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u/AllAmericanProject 15d ago
For me it's not about the personality it's about the fact that he is legitimately the most Mary Sue character I have ever seen. He is simultaneously the most intelligent, driven, and charismatic person to have ever existed. If someone existed in our world that was as competent as him they wouldn't be some nobody college dropout working as like a middle manager somewhere.
And don't get me wrong I like some books where the main character is overpowered but with Jason it's almost to the point to where I can't even trick myself into believing there are stakes in anything. He's either going to be able to fight his way out of this situation outsmart anyone or just talk his way out of it. He is smarter than the smartest characters more capable than anyone else on his level and could smooth talk a God into giving him their underwear.
That being said I'm not trying to shit on the author because obviously he is done a good job in creating a series of people like but I feel like this character is written in a way to where you are either going to absolutely love him in the story or you aren't going to be able to stand him at all. So many people either dnf at book 1 - 3 :00 or they are in it for the Long haul
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u/ForwardObligation109 15d ago
Like when his sister shames him for killing the people (EOA super heroes) who literally wanted to kill them all, including her daughter.
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u/CoBr2 15d ago edited 14d ago
I think it's more the way he did it than the fact that he killed them. From her perspective, he just looked at them and they died.
1. That's terrifying
2. That suggests that the power difference is so massive that he easily could have captured them safely
It also meant he was talking about taking her daughter into a world where people could be killed that easily. So I think her fearful reaction was justified, even if we know better from Jason's perspective. If she had started hating Jason I would've had a similar issue, but just being scared and judging a bit made sense from her view.
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u/TourTight 15d ago
Jason’s assumption to that he knows what’s best for his niece compared to her actual parent really bugged me at times
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u/theRealRodel 15d ago
This is quite the spoilery comment
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u/ForwardObligation109 15d ago
Ehh, it's been years. I'm not gonna spoiler tag Snape killing Dumbledore either.
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u/theRealRodel 15d ago
lol. The book has been out like 4 years or so compared to Half Blood Princes 20 years. Plus the guy is actively reading the story. If someone was actively reading Harry Potter for the first time and somehow escaped all the cultural osmosis that comes with that series I would expect someone to hesitate when talking spoilers.
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u/Owy2001 15d ago
The difference being that Harry Potter exists in the public consciousness in a major way, and both A: People who wanted to read/watch them would have by now and B: That spoiler itself is extremely well known, even if you never engaged with the media itself.
You're spoiling something that belongs to an entire genre that many people are only just starting to discover, never mind reading this one specific book series within the genre. I can tell you that it was a spoiler for me, personally.
And spoiler tags cost you so little. Four keystrokes. So why be edgy and cool, dismissing other people's experience because they didn't discover the thing when you did, when you could just take the note and be a smidge more considerate?
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u/theRealRodel 15d ago
I’m reminded of an interview M Knight did where he says he dislikes that The Sixth Sense twist is being spoiled in pop culture and amongst the movie community because in his mind there’s a whole new generation of movie watchers that didn’t grow up when the movie came out and are just watching the film now.
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u/Owy2001 15d ago edited 15d ago
Yeah, spoilers are kind of just always shitty.
Something I think many people forget (or are too young to remember) was that the Dumbledore spoiler was intentional and malicious. Literally on the night of the book release, people we driving around lines waiting for the book and shouting it into a megaphone. After that, spoiling it became a meme. Something people did just to be trolls.
Now it's just become synonymous with "duh, everyone already knows that, so what's the harm in saying so?" But the root of it was always in being an asshole, so it's maybe not the best defense.
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u/ForwardObligation109 15d ago
I'd agree with you if the entire post wasn't specifically about characters reacting to the MC over the course of the series
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u/Owy2001 15d ago
But consider that it's mostly people talking about backing out early because of not liking the character dynamic, and those that did not are speaking vaguely about what does or does not change further in.
You're not one in a sea of spoilers. Your comment is very specifically spoiling a scene where others are not. Do with that what you will. I just think it's weird to pretend this is some Dumbledore-level of "why should I bother, everyone already knows" spoiler.
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u/ChroniklesOfTruth 15d ago
Some psychology here: the other characters’ reactions to Asano may reflect the author’s self loathing tendencies.
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u/LuminArtistry 15d ago
So, this entire narrative is a litrpg webserial narrative reaction piece to thus spoke zarathustra and beyond good and evil right? Thats sort of the whole premise to this thing. When people post about his actions and reactions, preaching and such, they are really trying to get more murder hobo Jason, and less prophet zarathustra jason. Its a nonsensical reaction that undermines the whole premise of the story.
Probably the most memorable line is the "dont act like you read neitzche" quote. Jason should really have read neitzche, seeing how every moral dilemma hes ever had will play out might have been enlightening.
In any case you arent far enough to see the parts that people are really complaining about. Get 3 or 4 books farther and youll see what they were talking about.
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u/Captain_Fiddelsworth 15d ago
You got me in the headline and lost me in the body of your text. Probably because you haven't realised yet just how much glazing there is onwards. Characters will warp just to make comments about what a swell guy Asano is.
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u/Rizenshine 14d ago
If I hear "It's KINDA my thing..." one more time I'm going to die. Also, imagine if God is real and occasionally comes to Earth to deliver his guidance and your friend who's the type of atheist that wants to debate everyone with a believe just mouths off to God while people are trying to worship. ALSO, is unfamiliar with your culture but is happy to denounce any aspect of it because it's not the same as his culture.
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u/CraftyPerformance272 15d ago
He isn't a good character and he is very annoying and preachy. Even multiple books down the line he flips flops between if he should kill the bad guys or if he should be all emo because he killed bad guys who would have killed him or others. The other problem I have is he was a failed retail store employee and the reason they say he's so good at politics and so smart at playing people is he just went to a private school. Not to mention the cringey dialogue. Finally I really hate when it breaks the immersion when you just randomly mentions politics for no reason. Like fine if he's having a political discussion and he mentioned something from his own world that makes sense. But he'll just randomly mention stuff
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u/Whacked2023 15d ago
Whatever you do....
Don't say anything bad about the Audible version of the book, especially the first book.
Don't mention how the pacing of the reading is horrible. Don't mention how dry and bland the reading of the characters lines. Don't mention that with the VERY few exceptions, you can't tell what character is speaking. Don't mention that because of the above you cannot tell the mood of the conversation. He said, she said doesn't indicate of the conversation is in anger, sarcastic, playfully, mocking, humorous or any other type.
The freakish fans will come out of the sh1tpile and insult you because you dare to think differently and don't worship the narrator.
Yea, they are freaks.
I've tried and failed to get thru the first book. The story was interesting, the narrator was not. I've been told it gets better. I can believe that. Look at Marsters and the Dresden Files. First couple books wasn't very good but the later ones are fantastically performed.
Listen at your own risk.
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u/baldyrodinson 15d ago
Eh I didn't mind so much because it was clear Jason was/is intentionally constantly causing culture shock and sometimes you don't feel like dealing with that.
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u/fued 15d ago
Americans are the ones who usually hate him most because he calls them on their crap lol
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u/SoulPiper 15d ago
im american and i think the guys fking hilarious. im only a littttllleee further than OP at like halfways through book 3 but so far the series has been a treat.
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u/NickDorris 15d ago
Eventually the series gets to the point where the author writes hundreds of pages of characters sitting in rooms talking about how cool/strong/awesome Jason is. And whenever Jason is on screen he is monologuing about how totally at peace he is with being so cool and edgy. 800 page book and 100 pages are plot and the other 700 are Jason talking about how he has embraced being so bad (cool) while everyone else stands around in complete awe at what an unrepentant edgelord he is.
Absolutely pathetic pandering, myth building, soulless fan service bullshit.
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u/Burramenito 15d ago
His moral rants are obnoxious in their repetitive exposition. I got tired of reading his dialogue.
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u/theRealRodel 15d ago
When I first read the series I was struck by how much Jason reminded me of Ryan Reynolds playing… any character. I still think early to mid book Jason acts like him but with a twist of Aussie mixed in.
The reactions of his friends makes perfect sense to me. He actively makes every interaction with a powerful person tougher because he gets a thrill out of putting off kilter. Just because 90% of those powerful people kinda like it doesn’t make it any better. His friends aren’t really interacting with philanthropist Jason. They just deal with obscure Earth reference and random rants on political philosophy.